Brentfords ambitions? To win the league

[cambridgeshire canary 5,820]

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12374009/ivan-toney-on-brentfords-premier-league-title-target-not-taking-a-knee-and-being-your-fantasy-football-captain

 

Rather bold of them I must say. 

[lake district canary 4,274]

Kind of backs up my view that you should always aim for the top. Being happy with 17th is not an aim I would adhere to - BUT - having said that, at the end of the season if 17th is our position it will have been a successful season.

Aim for the top of the mountain and you'll be mentally prepared if you actually get in the position to challenge for it.   

 

[RobNewman'sblisteringpace 25]

I used to love football more when you could genuinely think that there was a chance that with a good season you could challenge for the title.  It's utterly depressing when the existing champions and their ilk are able to fly in the face of financial fair play to such an extent.

[Ward 3 337]

Toney is a k n o b

[GenerationA47 690]

22 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Kind of backs up my view that you should always aim for the top. Being happy with 17th is not an aim I would adhere to - BUT - having said that, at the end of the season if 17th is our position it will have been a successful season.

Aim for the top of the mountain and you'll be mentally prepared if you actually get in the position to challenge for it.   

 

I know you’re Lakes based ‘n’ all so given your analogy, ever done any mountaineering yourself?

If you established serious expedition plans including the mental preparation  required to reach the top of ‘Mount Premier’, having only funding and equipment suited to reaching base camp ‘17’ & certain intermediate goals… you’d be wasting planning resources, critically risking yourself & your team - at least its morale and confidence in you - and all for what.

[hogesar 8,598]

They couldn't even win the Championship. 

[Branston Pickle 3,263]

9 minutes ago, hogesar said:

They couldn't even win the Championship. 

That can’t be right - surely they were by far the best team and were crowned champions in March?

[lake district canary 4,274]

14 minutes ago, GenerationA47 said:

I know you’re Lakes based ‘n’ all so given your analogy, ever done any mountaineering yourself?

If you established serious expedition plans including the mental preparation  required to reach the top of ‘Mount Premier’, having only funding and equipment suited to reaching base camp ‘17’ & certain intermediate goals… you’d be wasting planning resources, critically risking yourself & your team - at least its morale and confidence in you - and all for what.

If you are climbing a mountain, the idea is to reach the top. Yes, Everest has a base camp and stops on the way up, but the ultimate aim is to get to the top - that is why people climb mountains.  The analogy goes no further than that. If you want to introduce all sorts of other parameters, that is up to you, but if a moutain is there to be climbed - the aim is to climb it to the top. 

 

[Capt. Pants 3,537]

58 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Kind of backs up my view that you should always aim for the top. Being happy with 17th is not an aim I would adhere to - BUT - having said that, at the end of the season if 17th is our position it will have been a successful season.

Aim for the top of the mountain and you'll be mentally prepared if you actually get in the position to challenge for it.   

 

Must admit with the money we're spending and the squad we're building, with potentially more to come, we're running out of excuses to not achieve 17th at the very least.

[GenerationA47 690]

6 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

If you are climbing a mountain, the idea is to reach the top. Yes, Everest has a base camp and stops on the way up, but the ultimate aim is to get to the top - that is why people climb mountains.  The analogy goes no further than that. If you want to introduce all sorts of other parameters, that is up to you, but if a moutain is there to be climbed - the aim is to climb it to the top. 

 

Incorrect. Most people who go to Everest since you raise it are aiming to get to base camp only as their sensible and rational target. That is the trekkers’ version of climbing Everest and no shame in it, it suits their budgets, experience, skills and equipment.
For many who are more ambitious and aiming to be better resourced and experienced for the future, it will give them the confidence to try expedition mountaineering with the aim of going further than base camp.

[Midlands Yellow 3,513]

1 minute ago, GenerationA47 said:

Incorrect. Most people who go to Everest since you raise it are aiming to get to base camp only as their sensible and rational target. That is the trekkers’ version of climbing Everest and no shame in it, it suits their budgets, experience, skills and equipment.
For many who are more ambitious and aiming to be better resourced and experienced for the future, it will give them the confidence to try expedition mountaineering with the aim of going further than base camp.

At least we’ve bought some boots and a warm jacket this time. 2 years ago we tried to climb it wearing slippers and a T shirt. 

[cornish sam 849]

33 minutes ago, hogesar said:

They couldn't even win the Championship. 

They only just managed to win the playoffs!

[lake district canary 4,274]

12 minutes ago, GenerationA47 said:

Incorrect. Most people who go to Everest since you raise it are aiming to get to base camp only as their sensible and rational target. That is the trekkers’ version of climbing Everest and no shame in it, it suits their budgets, experience, skills and equipment.
For many who are more ambitious and aiming to be better resourced and experienced for the future, it will give them the confidence to try expedition mountaineering with the aim of going further than base camp.

I think you are dissecting this too much!  If people just want to get to base camp as part of a development plan, then that is their summit and good luck to them.  We had our visit tio base camp two years ago and now are equipping ourselves to make a determined challenge to take the next step - going higher.  And if you are going higher and not knowing how high you can get, then the best way is to be mentally prepared for ny eventuality - including getting to the top. That is all Toney is talking about - being mentally prepared.

[FenwayFrank 2,316]

What about if you climb Beeston bump first ?

[hogesar 8,598]

34 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

Must admit with the money we're spending and the squad we're building, with potentially more to come, we're running out of excuses to not achieve 17th at the very least.

We will still have a comparatively struggling squad compared to the majority of the league.

[HazzaJet 240]

Their target is to win the PL? I reckon they’ll be spending about £500m this summer then. To be honest I can only see them fighting for PL survival like us

[GenerationA47 690]

26 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

If you are climbing a mountain, the idea is to reach the top. Yes, Everest has a base camp and stops on the way up, but the ultimate aim is to get to the top - that is why people climb mountains.  The analogy goes no further than that. If you want to introduce all sorts of other parameters, that is up to you, but if a moutain is there to be climbed - the aim is to climb it to the top

Also incorrect… these soecific extra parameters - as you should recognise unless you are deliberately being facetious or genuinely cannot grasp  - apply to both climbing and competitive football. Hence my raising them. You have ignored them before and still do.

It’s obvious there is an ultimate driving aspiration to ‘reach the top’ in organised sport & business. But since  you constantly suggest setting the summit  as the actual main goal of the organisation,  every PL season , I’m pointing out using your own analogy, that this would only be destructive to the leaders’ credibility and the team members’ morale . 

I know who the top people at the club , the people who actually matter in the goal setting , resourcing and performance , would agree with more. Put simply they don’t pose as fantasists or game-players who counter-factually confuse long term aspirations with smart, useful, resourceable seasonal goal-setting .

 

Same goes for most other PL clubs’ leaderships. Otherwise they would be forced to admit they were  failing season after season… when staying, securing, thriving and building in the league is a considerable achievement (more so for the relative paupers).

 

Note: Webber and Farke won’t be talking about winning the league. The closest choice of analogy last time was that surviving would be like climbing Everest . This may have erred too much on the side of public pessimism for many. But look who  was closer to the truth out of the two of you. We probably have a better chance this time , again as planned… but it won’t be helped by fans clamouring for frankly joke statements.

[Midlands Yellow 3,513]

19 minutes ago, hogesar said:

We will still have a comparatively struggling squad compared to the majority of the league.

Speak for yourself, we are ready. 

[GenerationA47 690]

Just now, GenerationA47 said:

Also incorrect… these soecific extra parameters - as you should recognise unless you are deliberately being facetious or genuinely cannot grasp  - apply to both climbing and competitive football. Hence my raising them. You have ignored them before and still do.

It’s obvious there is an ultimate driving aspiration to ‘reach the top’ in organised sport & business. But since  you constantly suggest setting the summit  as the actual main goal of the organisation,  every PL season , I’m pointing out using your own analogy, that this would only be destructive to the leaders’ credibility and the team members’ morale . 

I know who the top people at the club , the people who actually matter in the goal setting , resourcing and performance , would agree with more. Put simply they don’t pose as fantasists or game-players who counter-factually confuse long term aspirations with smart, useful, resourceable seasonal goal-setting .

 

Same goes for most other PL clubs’ leaderships. Otherwise they would be forced to admit they were  failing season after season… when staying, securing, thriving and building in the league is a considerable achievement (more so for the relative paupers).

 

Note: Webber and Farke won’t be talking about winning the league. The closest choice of analogy last time was that surviving would be like climbing Everest . This may have erred too much on the side of public pessimism for many. But look who  was closer to the truth out of the two of you. We probably have a better chance this time , again as planned… but it won’t be helped by fans clamouring for frankly joke statements.

Or players either for that matter, since you’re right to draw it back to the article and Toney’s comments. Athletes might over-aim deliberately in certain respects, but it should be in a controlled way and doesn’t  have to be made public.

 Perhaps  it’s  really the case that you are interested only in the WWE /boxing style, razzmatazz macho entertainment  element of sporting endeavours, not what actually happens in the contest. Fine, that’s part of it too but can sometimes  be an irritating distraction for some like me, especially if masquerading as out-of-context pop psych relating to actual performance.*

Especially if it helps encourage the overpsyched , hyped-up section of fans who then attack the club and remove their support from the team, when their unrealistic goals inevitably  aren’t touched

*This is such an occasion.

[lake district canary 4,274]

@GenerationA47 Still think you're taking this way too seriously and it is getting out of hand and away from my original point.  My analogy was originally about mental preparation, not physical preparation, which is largely what you are talking about.  If we go on a good run and start getting higher in the table, the last thing we want is to start getting vertigo and feeling like we are in a false position or somesuch. Mentally a sportsman needs to be ready for any eventuality - including being very successful. That is all I am going to say on the subject before getting further dragged into a direction which was not the meaning of the original analogy.

[GenerationA47 690]

1 hour ago, Midlands Yellow said:

At least we’ve bought some boots and a warm jacket this time. 2 years ago we tried to climb it wearing slippers and a T shirt. 

Oh true !
Well of course as we know that was purely because they simply couldn’t be bothered / Delia was busy defrauding the club / Webber and co are champion village idiots*
(*delete your 1 or 2 least favourite theories. Or help yourselves to all three for the win!). 

[Midlands Yellow 3,513]

4 minutes ago, GenerationA47 said:

Oh true !
Well of course as we know that was purely because they simply couldn’t be bothered / Delia was busy defrauding the club / Webber and co are champion village idiots*
(*delete your 1 or 2 least favourite theories. Or help yourselves to all three for the win!). 

Chill out Tom. 

[GenerationA47 690]

7 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Chill out Tom. 

Nerve hit?

[Mello Yello 2,139]

I did Ben Nevis once with an ex missus......No it wasn't a sordid session of troilism, we just both went up and down.....fnaar fnaar.....

[Midlands Yellow 3,513]

42 minutes ago, Mello Yello said:

I did Ben Nevis once with an ex missus......No it wasn't a sordid session of troilism, we just both went up and down.....fnaar fnaar.....

Did you see him again? 

[Mello Yello 2,139]

6 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Did you see him again? 

Nah.....rocky relationship.....

[Uncle Fred 526]

Non of this finish in the top 26 nonsense we hear spouted