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duke63

2 jabs to attend matches?

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1918 Pandemic (H1N1 virus) | Pandemic Influenza (Flu) | CDC

As someone who used to work in the International Health sector, I thoroughly recommend a couple of hours on this site. The current pandemic is following roughly the same developmental path and timeline as several other previous pandemics, albeit interrupted by a bigger population, worldwide movement and of course, effective vaccinations. In some areas, vaccinations have shortened the variant timeline (UK, USA etc). In others, it hasn't (Australia etc).

There is most definitely every chance that this one will follow the ultimate path and burn itself out. Note though that about 10,000 a year still die from H1N1 - mostly those with underlying problems but not always. 

We have been living with pandemics for over 500 years as a society; this is just the latest and at the moment there is nothing statistically which seems to indicate it is any different to others.

All nothing to do with football, other than to attempt to reassure those of you out there who think that society will never get back to normal. It will.

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7 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

There’s ample evidence from a number of studies (and no, I’m not going to spend ages finding links to them) which show clearly that the chance of the virus causing disease is significantly reduced if you’ve been double-vaccinated, and that even if you do catch it your chances of being able to transmit it to others is very much lower than if you were unvaccinated.  And of course if you do get Covid despite having been vaccinated it’s extremely likely that it will be much milder with a much reduced likelihood of it hospitalising or killing you.  

 

As JVT said yesterday, if he crammed 20 unvaccinated people in his shed the transmission of infection would almost certainly be very much higher than if they were all vaccinated.  He used this as an analogy for night clubs but the same argument would apply to attending football matches.
 

Yes, it should be up to the individual whether or not they have the vaccination but in terms of public health it’s up to employers and legislators to decide what the consequences might have to be in terms of being able to attend or do certain things.  That may well mean the unvaccinated will no longer be legally allowed to use public transport, travel to other countries or attend football matches.  As they say, choices have consequences.

 

JVT also said the presence of ultra violet light outside reduces the virus, however not sure this applies to concourse, toilets, stairwells, bars etc

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The Club has a responsibility for the “ safety “ of supporters in the ground, can the Club require that only double jabbed and recent negative test fans are allowed in ?

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9 minutes ago, CANARYKING said:

The Club has a responsibility for the “ safety “ of supporters in the ground, can the Club require that only double jabbed and recent negative test fans are allowed in ?

If government decrees two jabs and/or negative test then that is what they will have to comply with, but that doesn't seem likely before the end of September. Until then it will be a free for all relying on the goodwill and competence of supporters, there is no onus on the club to control a virus outbreak as it's impossible to comply with as you can still catch Covid even if vaccinated. Your choice basically. 

 

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27 minutes ago, CANARYKING said:

The Club has a responsibility for the “ safety “ of supporters in the ground, can the Club require that only double jabbed and recent negative test fans are allowed in ?

They have a responsibility to their staff and contractors too, more importantly. The government have supported research and manufacture of vaccines with tax payers money. Everyone, barring Piers corbyn, wants to return to some sort of 'normality' so I'd be quite comfortable visiting ANY  football ground that imposes this restriction, in fact I might just avoid any football ground that doesn't. Why? Because research shows that whilst vaccinated people are still technically able to spread the virus, the viral load delivered by them is minimal.

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Posted (edited)

I’ve had my jabs but this is wrong, it’s utterly disgraceful. I’m not particularly interested in debating these passports with people, many have been so blinded by the fear campaign that they will back any policy now that makes them feel safer, policies that before this they would have been furious over. But I’ll leave this quote here from lord Jonathan Sumption. It isn’t about the current covid passport, it’s a quote from earlier in the covid crisis.But I’d say it sums up the situation now. Those of you who are in favour of pushing for the passports should be very careful what you’re pushing for, it won’t just end at nightclubs and pubs, and may not even end with just being for covid

 

5AC2785A-F93D-45D8-9CA4-AD2F3746B78F.png
 

This government should be called the Johnson Regime. 
 

 

Edited by Virtual reality

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The majority of the posts in this thread from Government/MSM brainwashing is very worrying indeed.

Right know the UK is under a full on Psychological attack and the majority of you cant see it.

This is nothing to what is coming down the line and the compliant are the problem. 

The easiest way to control someone is through fear and the Government/MSM are doing a good job of it unfortunately.

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Just now, HairyTeeth said:

The majority of the posts in this thread from Government/MSM brainwashing is very worrying indeed.

Right know the UK is under a full on Psychological attack and the majority of you cant see it.

This is nothing to what is coming down the line and the compliant are the problem. 

The easiest way to control someone is through fear and the Government/MSM are doing a good job of it unfortunately.

I’m afraid so. 

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I've now had both jabs....2nd one last Friday.....If we're allowed to return to Carrow Road I certainly don't have a problem sitting amongst anyone who hasn't had the covid 19 jabs.....

I can then show them my new party trick sticking x2 post September 1992 20 pence pieces on each of my fluorescent glowing magnetised ear lobes.....and I'll maybe pull my hair fringe back to show my little devil horns......Although I do have to continually shave my hairy palms....I find my hairy palms most irritating.....

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59 minutes ago, HairyTeeth said:

The majority of the posts in this thread from Government/MSM brainwashing is very worrying indeed.

Right know the UK is under a full on Psychological attack and the majority of you cant see it.

This is nothing to what is coming down the line and the compliant are the problem. 

The easiest way to control someone is through fear and the Government/MSM are doing a good job of it unfortunately.

I guess you either put your trust in Chris Whitty and Patrick Valance, or you believe the likes of Piers Corbyn and David Icke.  Your choice.

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1 hour ago, HairyTeeth said:

The majority of the posts in this thread from Government/MSM brainwashing is very worrying indeed.

Right know the UK is under a full on Psychological attack and the majority of you cant see it.

This is nothing to what is coming down the line and the compliant are the problem. 

The easiest way to control someone is through fear and the Government/MSM are doing a good job of it unfortunately.

How are you allowed to walk the streets without supervision?

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3 minutes ago, Virtual reality said:

 

Or perhaps it’s  just because it’s a highly infectious and evolving virus that’s already killed thousands and left millions with long-term incapacity.

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Covid is less dangerous than Julia Hartley Brewer. Stop listening to gob****es like her and you may understand more. 

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4 hours ago, Matt Juler said:

Forty percent of people currently in hospital with COVID related illness have been fully double jabbed.  This isn't knocking the vaccine, the numbers in hospital and dying would be far, far higher without it, but it's not the wonder than many people seem to think it is. 
 

That means that 60% of people in hospital with COVID haven’t been double jabbed. The latest figures show that 67% of the population have had both vaccines.
 

So 60% of of hospitalisations are coming from just 33% of the people, i.e those who haven’t been double jabbed. 
 

Take into account that the numbers of people getting two jabs is still increasing and that there are millions who’s second jab has yet to take full effect because it was only recently administered, then we can only expect to see those figures improve. It’s not a cure all but it sure makes it worth having.

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35 minutes ago, Herman said:

Covid is less dangerous than Julia Hartley Brewer. Stop listening to gob****es like her and you may understand more. 

I don’t know or care who she is, it was the video, but I understand perfectly well thank you. I understand that I had an option to take the vaccine that I chose to take. I don’t expect other people to make that choice to protect me, That’s why I’ve had the vaccine. I understand that it’s their body and they should be free to choose without this coercion that is now happening. 

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3 minutes ago, Virtual reality said:

I don’t know or care who she is, it was the video, but I understand perfectly well thank you. I understand that I had an option to take the vaccine that I chose to take. I don’t expect other people to make that choice to protect me, That’s why I’ve had the vaccine. I understand that it’s their body and they should be free to choose without this coercion that is now happening. 

People’s choices and actions (or inactions) carry consequences for the wider population.  Given that fact, those who refuse the offer of vaccination are likely to face certain restrictions on what they can and can’t do, and rightly so.

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46 minutes ago, Herman said:

Covid is less dangerous than Julia Hartley Brewer. Stop listening to gob****es like her and you may understand more. 

JHB used (and I stress used) to be one of my 'strange crushes' on a long forgotten non-football thread 😕

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Posted (edited)
22 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

People’s choices and actions (or inactions) carry consequences for the wider population.  Given that fact, those who refuse the offer of vaccination are likely to face certain restrictions on what they can and can’t do, and rightly so.

I presume you fully support restrictions on those who are offered but don’t take the option on this years flu vaccine? 

Edited by Virtual reality

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My two cents are….

1. After the Second World War, citizens had to endure rationing, devastating destruction to property, broken economy, mentally broken former soldiers and they  rolled their sleeves up and got on with it. After this pandemic all we have to do is have two jabs to get on with it, is it too much to ask?

2. For those saying we are living under a totalitarian regime. The quicker we get jabbed and restrictions fully end, the quicker their pandemic bypass of normal procedures will be revoked by parliament, preventing them from the very authoritarian measures you complain about.

3. There is a difference between mandatory injections and requiring one to enter certain events. It’s still a choice, but your choice not to protect yourself and others comes with social penalties.

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46 minutes ago, hertfordyellow said:

My two cents are….

1. After the Second World War, citizens had to endure rationing, devastating destruction to property, broken economy, mentally broken former soldiers and they  rolled their sleeves up and got on with it. After this pandemic all we have to do is have two jabs to get on with it, is it too much to ask?

2. For those saying we are living under a totalitarian regime. The quicker we get jabbed and restrictions fully end, the quicker their pandemic bypass of normal procedures will be revoked by parliament, preventing them from the very authoritarian measures you complain about.

3. There is a difference between mandatory injections and requiring one to enter certain events. It’s still a choice, but your choice not to protect yourself and others comes with social penalties.

All of that is true, and clearly expressed. What baffles and worries me is that something so obvious has to be explained.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, hertfordyellow said:

My two cents are….

1. After the Second World War, citizens had to endure rationing, devastating destruction to property, broken economy, mentally broken former soldiers and they  rolled their sleeves up and got on with it. After this pandemic all we have to do is have two jabs to get on with it, is it too much to ask?

2. For those saying we are living under a totalitarian regime. The quicker we get jabbed and restrictions fully end, the quicker their pandemic bypass of normal procedures will be revoked by parliament, preventing them from the very authoritarian measures you complain about.

3. There is a difference between mandatory injections and requiring one to enter certain events. It’s still a choice, but your choice not to protect yourself and others comes with social penalties.

Hopefully number 2 will be the case but we will see. As for number 3 would you support those social penalties for those that are offered but refuse to take this winters flu vaccine? 
 

it seems some politicians also share the view that this is wrong

And this from an ex director of the who cancer programme 

 

Edited by Virtual reality

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36 minutes ago, Virtual reality said:

Hopefully number 2 will be the case but we will see. As for number 3 would you support those social penalties for those that are offered but refuse to take this winters flu vaccine? 
 

it seems some politicians also share the view that this is wrong

 

To your point about flu. The dangers are different. We can only control COVID through basically staying in our houses for months on end and it still killed 1.5% of the population. Without lockdown the figure would have been more like Influenza, biblical. While winter flu is dangerous to the vulnerable, you can’t compare them.

to your point about politicians being against this. It is partly because they ruled it out in January and they see it as another promise to constituents that they have to break. 

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12 hours ago, CANARYKING said:

So it could be that the small percentage of unfixed fans will stop everybody else from attending CR ?

Can you explain your previous comments about where I live and me not living much longer?

Gentlemen's discussion at this point.

 

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Posted (edited)
44 minutes ago, hertfordyellow said:

To your point about flu. The dangers are different. We can only control COVID through basically staying in our houses for months on end and it still killed 1.5% of the population. Without lockdown the figure would have been more like Influenza, biblical. While winter flu is dangerous to the vulnerable, you can’t compare them.

to your point about politicians being against this. It is partly because they ruled it out in January and they see it as another promise to constituents that they have to break. 

The U.K. population is over 68 million people. 128,000 have died with covid not directly from. That’s not 1.5% of the population. As for the flu it kills thousands every year and this winter  we are being told that up to 60,000 could die from it. Hence why I asked if those that support covid passports also support flu passports given those high predictions from the same people that are giving the covid predictions

Edited by Virtual reality

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The old adage "You'll never see a poor farmer"......In the future "You'll never see a poor Pharma".......

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Virtual reality said:

The U.K. population is over 68 million people. 128,000 have died with covid not directly from. That’s not 1.5% of the population. As for the flu it kills thousands every year and this winter  we are being told that up to 60,000 could die from it. Hence why I asked if those that support covid passports also support flu passports given those high predictions from the same people that are giving the covid predictions

This is with two severe lockdowns. Without that suppression it would have been millions. Like Influenza this is an infection that can be eradicated through suppression then immunity. That is not the case for winter flu.

Edited by hertfordyellow

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23 hours ago, Hairy Canary said:

Nobody is impacted any more than someone who dies of the disease.

That is true, and really sad for families or friends who have been affected that way.  I would certainly not disagree. 

My point was we should appreciate those in the younger people in society who have, on the whole, been amazingly supportive.  The fact that they can’t do things we did at the same age or go on holiday yet whilst they watch people who they were protecting able to start living their life again must be frustrating.

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4 minutes ago, Newtopia said:

That is true, and really sad for families or friends who have been affected that way.  I would certainly not disagree. 

My point was we should appreciate those in the younger people in society who have, on the whole, been amazingly supportive.  The fact that they can’t do things we did at the same age or go on holiday yet whilst they watch people who they were protecting able to start living their life again must be frustrating.

How long are you expecting their second jab to arrive? The 25s in my team have theirs August 2nd/3rd

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