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Buendia is a very fine player, and certainly one of our best ever, but whether he is THE best ever is just a debate; we've had some very, very good players over the years - World Cup winners among them. Lot of emotion coming from supporters who are understandably disappointed but some of us have seen this many times before. He's not even currently our most important player - Oliver Skipp is, and getting him back is much more crucial.

I also think the fee is a good one when compared to other valuations being put out there, remembering that he hasn't yet proved himself either in the PL or internationally. We will come out of this with a better chance of staying up.

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14 minutes ago, sgncfc said:

Buendia is a very fine player, and certainly one of our best ever, but whether he is THE best ever is just a debate; we've had some very, very good players over the years - World Cup winners among them. Lot of emotion coming from supporters who are understandably disappointed but some of us have seen this many times before. He's not even currently our most important player - Oliver Skipp is, and getting him back is much more crucial.

I also think the fee is a good one when compared to other valuations being put out there, remembering that he hasn't yet proved himself either in the PL or internationally. We will come out of this with a better chance of staying up.

I disagree players like buendia can create and score with a high work ethic , absolutely valuable in staying in prem , but yeah Skipp is mega important if we can get him for another season , it would soften the blow .

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@AstonVilla You have made some good points on this thread.

This transfer has really changed my perception of Villa. The initial shock of the announcement was tough, my immediate thought was that it wouldn’t be the right move for Buendia. I respected you guys were somewhat in a higher place than us in the footballing pyramid, but I wasn’t sure if it was a high enough place to accommodate Buendia. 

On reflection, however, Villa are a club clearly in the ascendancy at the minute, with aims for the top 6 and plenty of money behind them to accelerate the process. Sadly their current trajectory massively eclipses anything we can hope for.

It’s really starting to feel like there’s been a blurring of the lines between the top prem sides and the rest of the league, with Leicester and West Ham competing in a footballing sense, and clubs like Villa also competing - financially at least - and probably in a footballing sense too soon enough.

Last season Emi Martinez left Arsenal for Villa and described it as a ‘step up’. This season Villa outbid Arsenal to land Buendia. It honestly feels like Arsenal are going to be way off the pace for some time now. No wonder they wanted to bail for the super league…

So what initially felt like a really disappointing and humbling move from our point of view (and for Buendia himself), is now looking more like a credit to the path Villa are on and an equally damning reflection of the state of Arsenal.

Fair play you should be absolutely beaming with this transfer 👍

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Some good points Hank but I still think Emi is good enough for champions league football, but at the end of the day it's up to him if he wants to sign for them

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2 hours ago, Canary dwarf said:

can create and score with a high work ethic

He hasn't proved that in the PL yet though. He scored one goal in the season when we were already down and took part in the 10 match surrender without much of a whimper other than his red mist. 

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30 minutes ago, sgncfc said:

He hasn't proved that in the PL yet though. He scored one goal in the season when we were already down and took part in the 10 match surrender without much of a whimper other than his red mist. 

He’ll do a damn sight better than that this time round though. I have no doubt  

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Wish Emi the best at Villa. As for Villa fans coming on to this board and trying to discuss with City fans about Emi, maybe not a bright idea. Dont understand why a Villa fan is so derogatory toward the big 6, when they and their near neighbours Wolves are  just treading the same path, getting in mega rich owners and throwing  huge money out for the players they think will make their club one of the big 6. Even our nearest neighbours, East Anglia's 3rd team now think that putting golden flaps on their bins will somehow make them one of England's elite just because they suddenly  have richer owners from across the pond.

Not for us, we do it the way all football clubs should honestly go about things, by not living a dream based on money coming in from  the mega rich. I only really appreciate those clubs who have somewhat tried to go with our type of set up such as Burnley and maybe Southampton to a lesser extent. Brentford  to, coming up with us this year, deserve their chance in the Prem, theyve spent  many seasons bringing in unknown and untested players then selling at a good price, just as we invariably do, because our survival is based on that.

Its us and these kind of clubs who have to fight tooth and nail against the  majority  these days who have mega bucks to throw around, its a very un level playing field of course, but its that what gives our club kudos for finding and bringing on talent such as James Maddison, Ben Godfrey and Emi Buendia that makes it worthwhile.

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6 minutes ago, Essjayess said:

Wish Emi the best at Villa. As for Villa fans coming on to this board and trying to discuss with City fans about Emi, maybe not a bright idea. Dont understand why a Villa fan is so derogatory toward the big 6, when they and their near neighbours Wolves are  just treading the same path, getting in mega rich owners and throwing  huge money out for the players they think will make their club one of the big 6. Even our nearest neighbours, East Anglia's 3rd team now think that putting golden flaps on their bins will somehow make them one of England's elite just because they suddenly  have richer owners from across the pond.

Not for us, we do it the way all football clubs should honestly go about things, by not living a dream based on money coming in from  the mega rich. I only really appreciate those clubs who have somewhat tried to go with our type of set up such as Burnley and maybe Southampton to a lesser extent. Brentford  to, coming up with us this year, deserve their chance in the Prem, theyve spent  many seasons bringing in unknown and untested players then selling at a good price, just as we invariably do, because our survival is based on that.

Its us and these kind of clubs who have to fight tooth and nail against the  majority  these days who have mega bucks to throw around, its a very un level playing field of course, but its that what gives our club kudos for finding and bringing on talent such as James Maddison, Ben Godfrey and Emi Buendia that makes it worthwhile.


No doubt I will be accused of being patronising once again, but your comment doesn’t even make any sense.

There is a HUGE difference between spending a lot of money in order to COMPETE, and trying to create a situation where nobody else CAN compete, ever again.

I think you need someone to explain to you what the plan was, because it clearly flew right over your head.

These 6 clubs were about to join an elite competition where there was NO RELEGATION. Ever. So all these wonderful footballing teams that ‘do things the right way’ would NEVER, EVER be playing in their elite competition. 
 

How on earth you can say the Villa and their neighbours Wolves are treading ‘the same path’?

Are they starting a closed competition where there is no promotion or relegation?  
 

Imagine if the remaining 14 premier league teams decided that they too would have a closed competition.  Invite Celtic and Rangers and have a 16 team competition with no relegation.  And said ‘ok Norwich, we know you got promoted, but sorry, you’re staying in the Championship.  You’re not allowed into the premier league, because we decided that this is how it shall be.’

How on earth is spending money the same as that??

And as for your whole ‘holier than thou’ attitude - did Norwich City bring Buendia through from their youth ranks? No.  You went with your £1.5m to Getafe, and took him from them with your big money.  Just like you’re going to take our £40m and buy yourselves some other teams prize assets.

The way you’re talking you’d think your squad was full of academy graduates! 

Cantwell, Aarons, any more?

Even we had 5 players from our academy get premier league minutes - 2 very regularly.

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, AstonVilla said:

The way you’re talking you’d think your squad was full of academy graduates! 

Cantwell, Aarons, any more?

 

Errr yes. Cantwell and Aarons… also Adam Idah, Josh Martin, Andrew Omobamidele, plus 2 x goalkeepers coming through.

We’ve also sold academy products in Ben Godfrey, Jamal Lewis, James Maddison, Josh Murphy and Jacob Murphy in recent seasons for big money moves.

Careful now!

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4 hours ago, AstonVilla said:


No doubt I will be accused of being patronising once again, but your comment doesn’t even make any sense.

There is a HUGE difference between spending a lot of money in order to COMPETE, and trying to create a situation where nobody else CAN compete, ever again.

I think you need someone to explain to you what the plan was, because it clearly flew right over your head.

These 6 clubs were about to join an elite competition where there was NO RELEGATION. Ever. So all these wonderful footballing teams that ‘do things the right way’ would NEVER, EVER be playing in their elite competition. 
 

How on earth you can say the Villa and their neighbours Wolves are treading ‘the same path’?

Are they starting a closed competition where there is no promotion or relegation?  
 

Imagine if the remaining 14 premier league teams decided that they too would have a closed competition.  Invite Celtic and Rangers and have a 16 team competition with no relegation.  And said ‘ok Norwich, we know you got promoted, but sorry, you’re staying in the Championship.  You’re not allowed into the premier league, because we decided that this is how it shall be.’

How on earth is spending money the same as that??

And as for your whole ‘holier than thou’ attitude - did Norwich City bring Buendia through from their youth ranks? No.  You went with your £1.5m to Getafe, and took him from them with your big money.  Just like you’re going to take our £40m and buy yourselves some other teams prize assets.

The way you’re talking you’d think your squad was full of academy graduates! 

Cantwell, Aarons, any more?

Even we had 5 players from our academy get premier league minutes - 2 very regularly.

 

 

 

If there were no clubs spending huge sums trying to compete with Man City etc then football might still be the competitive sport it always used to be.

If the powers that be wanted a competitive sport they would have stopped wealthy foreign owners with zero links to a club, buying into them for a bit of money laundering.

At some point the financial bubble WILL burst, then those who have spent the most and have huge debt will be the first to fall.

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3 hours ago, duke63 said:

If there were no clubs spending huge sums trying to compete with Man City etc then football might still be the competitive sport it always used to be.

If the powers that be wanted a competitive sport they would have stopped wealthy foreign owners with zero links to a club, buying into them for a bit of money laundering.

At some point the financial bubble WILL burst, then those who have spent the most and have huge debt will be the first to fall.

You’re absolutely right.

But how do you fix it?  This FFP is a farce, No one pays any attention to it, and when fines/sanctions are put in place, clubs just go to court and get them overturned.

The real way to fix it is to have a spending cap which is the same for every team, not based on anything other than a set number. No books to fiddle, no stadiums to sell to yourself, etc.

But the problem then is the top players will just move to where there is more money - Spain, Italy, Germany... and suddenly the English game loses its reign.

Its an unsolvable situation. And until something changes, it’s obvious to compete you HAVE to spend big.

And if you’re not going to compete, then why bother at all?

 

 

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2 minutes ago, AstonVilla said:

You’re absolutely right.

But how do you fix it?  This FFP is a farce, No one pays any attention to it, and when fines/sanctions are put in place, clubs just go to court and get them overturned.

The real way to fix it is to have a spending cap which is the same for every team, not based on anything other than a set number. No books to fiddle, no stadiums to sell to yourself, etc.

But the problem then is the top players will just move to where there is more money - Spain, Italy, Germany... and suddenly the English game loses its reign.

Its an unsolvable situation. And until something changes, it’s obvious to compete you HAVE to spend big.

And if you’re not going to compete, then why bother at all?

 

 

Just a query re. the bit in bold, who says throwing money at it all the time is the only definition of competing? I fundamentally agree that top players will move to where there is more money, indeed the world of rugby union and the exodus of many players to France is a fine example of that.

But considering we stormed through the Championship twice in three years having spent relatively little, I'd say what we do is clearly working well, especially as it's also financed improved facilities for the club and seriously improved our financial position. Not that we're wealthy as we're not, but as we don't have anyone cats-cradling the purse strings progress is inevitably going to be more incremental.

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11 hours ago, AJ said:

Some good points Hank but I still think Emi is good enough for champions league football, but at the end of the day it's up to him if he wants to sign for them

So do I! Unfortunately we wanted to get the sale done so this is where its taken him, perhaps later in the window it could've been a CL club but I am sure he will be playing there within the next few seasons in any case. 

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4 hours ago, Hank shoots Skyler said:

Errr yes. Cantwell and Aarons… also Adam Idah, Josh Martin, Andrew Omobamidele, plus 2 x goalkeepers coming through.

We’ve also sold academy products in Ben Godfrey, Jamal Lewis, James Maddison, Josh Murphy and Jacob Murphy in recent seasons for big money moves.

Careful now!

Sorry, my response was to that chap in particular and laced with frustration.

You guys have done brilliantly with your academy recently and kudos for that.

we’re now trying the same, and have started recruiting the best young talent around the country.

 

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2 minutes ago, AstonVilla said:

Sorry, my response was to that chap in particular and laced with frustration.

You guys have done brilliantly with your academy recently and kudos for that.

we’re now trying the same, and have started recruiting the best young talent around the country.

 

Fair play there, I'd pose the question - is Dean Smith really the trainer to have as much faith with young talent in an environment like the Premier League. We definitely know Farke will let them have a go, but that's also due to the owners here being a bit more relaxed so he's not under hyper pressure for results.

Essentially, I'm asking, considering the financial support your owners now provide, if they don't up the ante somewhat.

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2 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Just a query re. the bit in bold, who says throwing money at it all the time is the only definition of competing? I fundamentally agree that top players will move to where there is more money, indeed the world of rugby union and the exodus of many players to France is a fine example of that.

But considering we stormed through the Championship twice in three years having spent relatively little, I'd say what we do is clearly working well, especially as it's also financed improved facilities for the club and seriously improved our financial position. Not that we're wealthy as we're not, but as we don't have anyone cats-cradling the purse strings progress is inevitably going to be more incremental.

We came up together.

You were MILES better than us.  You stormed the championship, playing beautiful football.

We needed a record breaking winning streak to finish 5th and get into the play offs.

We spent £140m and stayed up by the skin of our teeth.  You went down with a whimper (although I understand that was a calculated decision by the club)

If you can bring equivalent amount of investment through your academy then I will applaud you loudly.

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4 minutes ago, AstonVilla said:

We came up together.

You were MILES better than us.  You stormed the championship, playing beautiful football.

We needed a record breaking winning streak to finish 5th and get into the play offs.

We spent £140m and stayed up by the skin of our teeth.  You went down with a whimper (although I understand that was a calculated decision by the club)

If you can bring equivalent amount of investment through your academy then I will applaud you loudly.

We won't. We don't have the financial clout you have with your relatively new owners. When we tried spending to stay up before and it failed, we nearly lost the club. Also, it wasn't a completely calculated decision to go down, but it sure didn't help losing three centre-halves (or at least two and a third being in various stages of recovery/injury) for at least half the season. Even Liverpool were far worse last time out when losing so many at once.

Our unwillingness to spend was the calculated decision, but if we'd not had so many centre-halves out, we'd have certainly put up much more of a fight. This is why the improvement of facilities, particularly in terms of strength/conditioning as well as hydrotherapy strikes me as a very wise move.

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7 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Fair play there, I'd pose the question - is Dean Smith really the trainer to have as much faith with young talent in an environment like the Premier League. We definitely know Farke will let them have a go, but that's also due to the owners here being a bit more relaxed so he's not under hyper pressure for results.

Essentially, I'm asking, considering the financial support your owners now provide, if they don't up the ante somewhat.

I have to admit I was disappointed at the end of the season with his lack of willingness to let the kids have a go,

it was clear a few weeks from the end that we we safe from relegation, but Europe was out of reach. It was a perfect opportunity to let some of our youth have a run.  He continued to play a failed ross Barkley, and a couple of pros who were clearly going to leave at the end of the season.

We brought on a couple of teenagers from our youth cup winning side in the last game of the season, and one looks the real deal at 17years old. 

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6 minutes ago, AstonVilla said:

I have to admit I was disappointed at the end of the season with his lack of willingness to let the kids have a go,

it was clear a few weeks from the end that we we safe from relegation, but Europe was out of reach. It was a perfect opportunity to let some of our youth have a run.  He continued to play a failed ross Barkley, and a couple of pros who were clearly going to leave at the end of the season.

We brought on a couple of teenagers from our youth cup winning side in the last game of the season, and one looks the real deal at 17years old. 

That's a fundamental difference between the two. In our case, when we lost two centre-halves late on last season during the key phase of whether we'd go up or even as champions, we essentially had two options in the form of defensive midfielders going to centre-half (although one of them, Jacob Sorensen, has played centre-half for Denmark U21s so not exactly clueless), or let a young Academy centre-half in Andrew Omobamidele get a crack. In the end, Omobamidele got the run and took his chance so well he was on Ireland's bench last night for their friendly against Hungary on the back of the run of games he had with us.

We basically had faith in an 18 y/o centre-half during the most pressurised phase of the season in a notoriously competitive and attritional league such as the Championship, and he came up trumps.

Edited by TheGunnShow
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6 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

We won't. We don't have the financial clout you have with your relatively new owners. When we tried spending to stay up before and it failed, we nearly lost the club. Also, it wasn't a completely calculated decision to go down, but it sure didn't help losing three centre-halves (or at least two and a third being in various stages of recovery/injury) for at least half the season. Even Liverpool were far worse last time out when losing so many at once.

Our unwillingness to spend was the calculated decision, but if we'd not had so many centre-halves out, we'd have certainly put up much more of a fight. This is why the improvement of facilities, particularly in terms of strength/conditioning as well as hydrotherapy strikes me as a very wise move.

That’s the biggest problem with trying to compete.  People forget that if you don’t have the depth in your squad, it only takes a single injury to lead to disaster.

We lost Grealish for 11 games, and we went from quite honestly believing we’d crack the top 4, to relegation form.  That’s ONE player in that position.  We supposedly had a superstar on loan to cover the creative role - but he was rubbish.

The Buendia purchase was partly to mitigate against that loss again. (I hope to god he’s not the permanent replacement and that Grealish is being sold)

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Just now, AstonVilla said:

That’s the biggest problem with trying to compete.  People forget that if you don’t have the depth in your squad, it only takes a single injury to lead to disaster.

We lost Grealish for 11 games, and we went from quite honestly believing we’d crack the top 4, to relegation form.  That’s ONE player in that position.  We supposedly had a superstar on loan to cover the creative role - but he was rubbish.

The Buendia purchase was partly to mitigate against that loss again. (I hope to god he’s not the permanent replacement and that Grealish is being sold)

Totally agree, I'd just say that in our case, we had three out at once in the same position at the heart of defence. Hard-pushed to think of anything more discombobulating as invariably midfielders start playing in defence or the whole team is pushed back ten yards to compensate for the resulting weakness.

Then the attack gets weakened as nowhere near enough bodies are getting up to cause problems. Doesn't matter how much depth you have there, if you lose three at once in the same place, there's no way you'll be at the same standard as a team.

Buendia and Grealish together is a prospect. I think you're a tackle merchant in the middle light, and might need a more ball-playing centre-half, but find those two whilst keeping the rest of the squad and I'd say you'd have a chance for the Champions League spots if they gel quickly. Unlike some, I don't see you remotely as rivals for us next season.

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17 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Totally agree, I'd just say that in our case, we had three out at once in the same position at the heart of defence. Hard-pushed to think of anything more discombobulating as invariably midfielders start playing in defence or the whole team is pushed back ten yards to compensate for the resulting weakness.

Then the attack gets weakened as nowhere near enough bodies are getting up to cause problems. Doesn't matter how much depth you have there, if you lose three at once in the same place, there's no way you'll be at the same standard as a team.

Buendia and Grealish together is a prospect. I think you're a tackle merchant in the middle light, and might need a more ball-playing centre-half, but find those two whilst keeping the rest of the squad and I'd say you'd have a chance for the Champions League spots if they gel quickly. Unlike some, I don't see you remotely as rivals for us next season.

Despite having some very good players there in McGinn, Luiz, Sanson, and Ramsey, you’re absolutely right.  Our midfield gets bundled over game after game.  We have Nakamba, who’s very good at what he does, but poor at everything else.  That’s where the Ward Prowse links are coming in, but personally I think we need someone stronger and bigger.  Our attack will be very very good, our defence is very very good, just need some depth in both.  
 

Our midfield is a problem.   Good players, but lightweight.  We need a hard tackling DCM that can play, but they’re like hens teeth.

 

 

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It seems this argument about money is always the same - only two alternatives; mega bucks owners or poverty. In reality there are millions of in-between stages and we are, as a club, slowly climbing up them in our own way, whereas Villa and Wolves went the quicker route, following the likes of Leicester, Brighton and others.

The route doesn't always lead to success - ask Bournemouth. Or Forest. Or Derby.

But we do at least have a plan and that plan is on track and working. We are now shopping for £10m players. Four years ago it was freebies; two years ago it was £3m; one year ago it was £5m+. That's progress. We are improving our squad. Whether it is enough to survive this time I have no idea.

The main issue with the route one approach of the mega owner is that there is still a risk of failure. The £140m Villa spent after a fortunate promotion didn't succeed - they bought badly and they were reliant on a technological failure to stay up. (I appreciate that they don't like to be reminded of that). But what Villa have done since then using that stroke of luck is pretty impressive and they certainly now have the squad to challenge at least the top 8, if not the top 6. God help them if they fail though because relegation will potentially destroy a club which doesn't yet have the turnover potential to justify its' spending.

And that's the crucial point about the big 6. They're not there because of current on field success, but because of supporter base, turnover size and worldwide marketing potential, all of which is based on historical performance. It takes years to establish that - ask Leicester, who are struggling to even generate turnover from Thailand, the home of their owners. Villa have a shot at that, but failure could lead to the Forest route rather than a challenge for Europe.

And money men (and they are, to date, all men) tend to get bored. They don't do failure; and subsidising a non-performing football club is failure. If they don't succeed, they move on to other projects. Ipswich, Sunderland, Birmingham, Derby (again) have all suffered as a result.

And because only a few clubs can ever have what is called a successful season  there are always several clubs at a crossroads with their money men in charge - at the moment Portsmouth, Fulham, West Brom, Sheff Utd, Palace, Everton, Southampton, Newcastle even Wolves have some decisions to make. Do we spend? Do we push to finish two or three places higher? Those decisions are being made by individuals on a whim. If they decide to withdraw their money, or even just stop covering losses, those clubs are doomed to short and medium term failure. Is that any worse than the ESL proposed by the Big 6? Is there any better certainty for supporters by having that moneyman in charge?

Norwich are climbing a ladder at the moment. We might fall down the snake again, but it wont be as far down as the last snake we fell down, or the one before. Eventually, we might get to shop in the £20m+ bracket.

Edited by sgncfc
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55 minutes ago, sgncfc said:

The £140m Villa spent after a fortunate promotion didn't succeed - they bought badly and they were reliant on a technological failure to stay up.

Wesley £22m. Slow start, but was picked for Brazil squad and was starting to pick up form before that thug Mee snapped his knee ligaments. 6 premier league goals before his season was ended. Not too bad, and a relative bargain compared to a £45m Joelinton. 

Tyrone Mings £20m - England international and part of a very good Villa defence. Maguire cost £80m and Stones £50m.  Not bad business. First team player.

Douglas Luiz - £15m. Brazil international. Good player. First team player.

Matt Target £14m - An absolutely brilliant signing, and he’s been brilliant.  Should be at the euros. Absolute bargain. First team player.

Ezri Konsa £12m - utterly brilliant signing. He’s better than Mings, and will get even better.  First team player.

Nakamba - £10m. Has played well whenever called upon.  Good at breaking things up, but little else.  We needed squad depth, and he provided it.  I appreciate he cost more than your record signing, but certainly not a poor signing.

Trezeguet - £9m.  6 goals, plenty of assists, and an engine that goes on forever.  Whilst not a runaway success of a signing, certainly not a failure. Also take into account he has 4m Instagram followers, he raises the profile of the club on the international scene. Still involved in the first team until his recent injury

Samatta - £9m. Yes. Horrible signing. Done at a time where we had our only recognised strikers knee smashed up and desperately needed to buy when no one wanted to sell. After a promising start, was obviously out of his depth. Has been sold since, likely at a heavy loss.

Anwar El Ghazi - £8m.  Just scored 11 premier league goals, at a strike rate better than Mo salah, Rahim Sterling and Marcus Rashford. Bargain, would double his fee if sold. First team player.

Tom Heaton - £8m. Was brilliant until he tore his ACL. We needed to buy, and we bought superbly with Martinez.  Would still be first choice were it not for Martinez. Has just been signed by Man Utd as back up keeper. Bargain.

Bjorn Engels - £8m. Was first choice, then he disappeared. Injured? Falling out? Not clear. But was brilliant, then got shown up for a lack of pace, and then he was out in the cold. Poor signing? I guess so.

Jota - £4m. Not really £4m, more like a swap.  We gave them a player that never played and was always injured, and we took a player that hardly played. Was released after one year.

Kortney Hause £3m.  Is he a brilliant player? No.  Is he worth £3m? My god yes. He’s been very good when he’s needed to fill in. First choice backup DC.
 

so £140m badly spent? I think we got a lot for our money. I’d say £80m was brilliantly spent. And £17m was wasted (Samatta and Engels).

The remaining £48m was ok in terms of value for money. 

Our squad was by far the weakest of the 3 that came up, but we were the only ones that did stay up.  

As for the dodgy goal that kept us up - you’re right. A huge stroke of luck. But there were some really bad VAR decisions that cost us points.  Nothing quite as bad as that though, but it is what the footballing Gods willed. 😉

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Well, I'm not qualified to argue the toss over most of those as I haven't seen enough of them, but collectively £140m wasn't enough to keep you up without the technological error and that was the point I made about how successful spending money is. I'm not suggesting they are bad players, just that they weren't good enough to do what they were bought for.

We all had VAR issues that season - none worse than Pukki's disallowed goal against Spurs.

Your opinion of Mings (and probably of several of the others) is somewhat biased by being a supporter of his club. Most others think he's a very limited centre back who resorts to thuggery when he gets into trouble quite a lot. The fact that he cost you £26m (not £20m) and that Maguire was £80m just emphasises how poor our centre back resources are at the moment. White and Godfrey are better than both of them and even they aren't very good....

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12 hours ago, AstonVilla said:


No doubt I will be accused of being patronising once again, but your comment doesn’t even make any sense.

There is a HUGE difference between spending a lot of money in order to COMPETE, and trying to create a situation where nobody else CAN compete, ever again.

I think you need someone to explain to you what the plan was, because it clearly flew right over your head.

These 6 clubs were about to join an elite competition where there was NO RELEGATION. Ever. So all these wonderful footballing teams that ‘do things the right way’ would NEVER, EVER be playing in their elite competition. 
 

How on earth you can say the Villa and their neighbours Wolves are treading ‘the same path’?

Are they starting a closed competition where there is no promotion or relegation?  
 

Imagine if the remaining 14 premier league teams decided that they too would have a closed competition.  Invite Celtic and Rangers and have a 16 team competition with no relegation.  And said ‘ok Norwich, we know you got promoted, but sorry, you’re staying in the Championship.  You’re not allowed into the premier league, because we decided that this is how it shall be.’

How on earth is spending money the same as that??

And as for your whole ‘holier than thou’ attitude - did Norwich City bring Buendia through from their youth ranks? No.  You went with your £1.5m to Getafe, and took him from them with your big money.  Just like you’re going to take our £40m and buy yourselves some other teams prize assets.

The way you’re talking you’d think your squad was full of academy graduates! 

Cantwell, Aarons, any more?

Even we had 5 players from our academy get premier league minutes - 2 very regularly.

 

 

 

Not once in my post did i even  mention about the big 6 and what they tried to do a few months back...i was talking as if that  stunt never existed...it did not exist in my mind when i wrote my post..my thoughts were based purely on how the Prem has worked these past couple of decades  and how its even filtered down to L1 clubs such as our bin adorning nighbours down the road.

I did not even mention about where our players originally started...be it thru the academy or buying unknowns from wherever and bringing them on..my point was that is our SOLE WAY OF EXISTENCE .

Yes we got Emi from Getafe...you call 1.5 mill big money?..again my point..we bought Ben Godfrey from York for a few hundred thou and he matured into what he is now.

You say the 40 mill we get from the Emi sale will be spent to buy ourselves other teams prize assets?..oh my goodness..we will never be in such a position.

Me having a holier than thou attitude?..look..i applaud Villa if they can and have brought  academy products thru and that theyve done well..bravo..but that was not my point at all. My entire point is that as a club ...for decades...we have not had a single penny invested from any rich owner who can just  throw money into the club and say...heres X amount of millions go buy an Emi or whatever it is you need. Im just stating where we are as a club..where we always  have been..any monies we have to spend on new players..or on improving facilities..have been solely down to the buying  / selling of our players...or some occasional  small  much needed loan...that, by the way...is always paid back.

So, compare City to what your clubs doing..Villa have the finacial clout of wealthy ownership who can buy a Buendia for 30-40 mill...to me all your club is doing is what the top 6 have been doing for these past decades...or what Wolves   did..or many others..and hoping that those finances will somehow  break the top 6 ...its possible to get into the top 6  short term...Leicester  have been the closest so far. I talk from a humble viewpoint my friend, the club i love gets any success it gets...or failures..from what it earns, not from what its given.

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22 minutes ago, sgncfc said:

Well, I'm not qualified to argue the toss over most of those as I haven't seen enough of them, but collectively £140m wasn't enough to keep you up without the technological error and that was the point I made about how successful spending money is.

In your opinion, where do you think we would’ve finished if we spent £8m?

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 What I wrote:

 

On 06/06/2021 at 02:50, AstonVilla said:

You would have rather sold him to a club that are a part of an American led group of greedy bastards that tried to ruin the game by starting a members only club?

Whose owner is an advocate of big game hunting?

A club who sacked loyal staff due to ‘covid cost cutting’ while signing Willian on a bumper pay packet?

What you wrote:

 

15 hours ago, Essjayess said:

Dont understand why a Villa fan is so derogatory toward the big 6, when they and their near neighbours Wolves are  just treading the same path, getting in mega rich owners and throwing  huge money out for the players they think will make their club one of the big 6.

What I wrote:

13 hours ago, AstonVilla said:

There is a HUGE difference between spending a lot of money in order to COMPETE, and trying to create a situation where nobody else CAN compete, ever again.

What you wrote:

29 minutes ago, Essjayess said:

Not once in my post did i even  mention about the big 6 and what they tried to do a few months back...i was talking as if that  stunt never existed...it did not exist in my mind when i wrote my post..my thoughts were based purely on how the Prem has worked these past couple of decades  and how its even filtered down to L1 clubs such as our bin adorning nighbours down the road.

 

You didn't need to mention in your post regarding what the Big 6 were trying to do.  You were responding to my post about it, wondering why I was being derogatory about them.

 

The rest of your post I agree with.  Go read my original post.  It is not about Aston Villa vs Norwich.  In fact, I clearly state that I wish for you to do well.  I like the way you operate.  I love the way you pick up these obscure players and turn them into brilliant players.

My entire post was about WHY Norwich fans would rather sell to Arsenal (especially considering what they had just tried to do) than sell to Villa who are comparatively the devil?  That was it.  Nothing more.  

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1 hour ago, sgncfc said:

Well, I'm not qualified to argue the toss over most of those as I haven't seen enough of them, but collectively £140m wasn't enough to keep you up without the technological error and that was the point I made about how successful spending money is. I'm not suggesting they are bad players, just that they weren't good enough to do what they were bought for.

We all had VAR issues that season - none worse than Pukki's disallowed goal against Spurs.

Your opinion of Mings (and probably of several of the others) is somewhat biased by being a supporter of his club. Most others think he's a very limited centre back who resorts to thuggery when he gets into trouble quite a lot. The fact that he cost you £26m (not £20m) and that Maguire was £80m just emphasises how poor our centre back resources are at the moment. White and Godfrey are better than both of them and even they aren't very good....

You're right.

He certainly has an error, and a a bit of nastiness in him.  But he does a lot of really great stuff.  He was still a part of one of the best defences in the Premier league though.

And he brings something to our club that goes above and beyond just what is out on the playing field.  He's a leader, and we desperately needed one of those.  And that makes us forgive a lot of his short-comings.  I can see why other teams supporters wouldn't rate him though, because defence is the kind of position where it's hard to have a good highlights real.

For us, £26m (including add-ons, which you quite rightly point out is the more accurate fee) is an absolute bargain.

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