VAR and the handball rule

[horsefly 4,298]

Given that we want to see goals in the game, why not alter the rule to say that if a part of the goal-scorer's body is on-side then the goal stands. 

[Fiery Zac 1,066]

49 minutes ago, Indy said:

The offside rule has such a discrepancy as it really depends when the VAR judges the ball to have left the players foot making the pass, a half second either way could make him onside or off! Definitely agree on the lines having to be clear once the ball is moving forwards!

Using VAR for offside has always been a joke (well for tight decisions) as shown in the pic below.

I hate it when you start to see all the lines being drawn and someone’s beard being offside. As shown, the technology isn’t good enough so why are we continually told that offside isn’t subjective, you either are or you aren’t offside and that VAR will tell you definitively one way or the other. NO IT WONT!

[Haus 259]

Im a big fan of making only the feet count for Offside purposes, could put a chip in the boot too and have it accurately done. 

 

If we insist on using technology then we need to adapt the game to use it well rather than trying to make it do a job it can never do. 

 

The other thing we can do is look at what a clear and obvious error is, if in doubt go with what the linesman ruled. 

Edited March 5, 2021 by Haus

[Indy 3,298]

To be honest the pitch is about 100 yards long so let them use it, just do away with offside! If players goal hang you have to defend it! Done!

[Graham Paddons Beard 2,431]

1 hour ago, Fiery Zac said:

Using VAR for offside has always been a joke (well for tight decisions) as shown in the pic below.

I hate it when you start to see all the lines being drawn and someone’s beard being offside. As shown, the technology isn’t good enough so why are we continually told that offside isn’t subjective, you either are or you aren’t offside and that VAR will tell you definitively one way or the other. NO IT WONT!

Spot on 

If you can be bothered to trawl back - you will see that I have made this point before .

The technology is not there . It is a linear decision - and the technology is based accordingly . Looking for one line out of an infinite number of lines  , by triangulating various cameras , over a large area is simply not possible .
 

Compare it to goal line technology - a line that never moves - or a line in tennis. Even Cricket , where the stumps don’t move makes more sense . 
 

And throw in the “when the ball was played” issue and it gets worse . The infamous Pukki goal against Spurs was never conclusive - and should have stood. The still used by VAR was a nonsense . 

[Haus 259]

32 minutes ago, Indy said:

To be honest the pitch is about 100 yards long so let them use it, just do away with offside! If players goal hang you have to defend it! Done!

That just results in a crap game with 3 people hanging around the goal and the teams just kicking long balls all game

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

Football doesn't need any more technology than the goal line one. That is brilliant in virtually every case and there is no stoppage to the game.

The rest is just a waste. It hasn't solved controversy and is used in just one "important" league.

So we get promoted and return to the farce. Yet there has been little or no controversy in the Championship.

[Petriix 2,835]

1 hour ago, Graham Paddons Beard said:

Spot on 

If you can be bothered to trawl back - you will see that I have made this point before .

The technology is not there . It is a linear decision - and the technology is based accordingly . Looking for one line out of an infinite number of lines  , by triangulating various cameras , over a large area is simply not possible .
 

Compare it to goal line technology - a line that never moves - or a line in tennis. Even Cricket , where the stumps don’t move makes more sense . 
 

And throw in the “when the ball was played” issue and it gets worse . The infamous Pukki goal against Spurs was never conclusive - and should have stood. The still used by VAR was a nonsense . 

It would be a simple change to make them measure it in both frames with you only being ruled offside if you were ahead in both.

Ultimately there needs to be new technology with a series of cameras running at 100fps+, mounted directly above the pitch looking down from above. Then the system can become more accurate. But the benefit of any doubt at all should go to the attackers.

Until the technology improves, we need an equivalent of 'umpire's call' in cricket where, if it's at all close, it's given onside.

[Indy 3,298]

1 hour ago, Haus said:

That just results in a crap game with 3 people hanging around the goal and the teams just kicking long balls all game

Nah make it better, opens the pitch up.......stops all these daft point costing decisions! 😉

[Fiery Zac 1,066]

48 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Yet there has been little or no controversy in the Championship.

Don’t agree with that. We’ve had some blatant fouls missed in the area and gotten away with a few too (Krul last week was one VAR probably would’ve given, quite rightly). Also have you seen the Swansea penalty from Wednesday? Laughably bad decision that surely would’ve been overturned with VAR.

My issue is simply those using it, not VAR itself. It can be (and often is) a great tool for the officials to use and we need to continue with it. But the muppets who make the rules and then the officials on the pitch and watching on their monitors - they’re the ones that need sorting out

[Yellow Wal 314]

or we could simply:

LAW 5: THE REFEREE

IFAB Laws of the Game 2020-21

 

The authority of the referee

Each match is controlled by a referee who has full authority to enforce the Laws of the Game in connection with the match.

Decisions of the referee

Decisions will be made to the best of the referee`s ability according to the Laws of the Game and the spirit of the game and will be based on the opinion of the referee who has the discretion to take appropriate action within the framework of the Laws of the Game.

The decisions of the referee regarding facts connected with play, including whether or not a goal is scored and the result of the match, are final. The decisions of the referee, and all other match officials, must always be respected.

 

And scrap VAR and do what we always did, namely, accept the referee's decision.

Yes, some referees make mistakes, but players make even more. As long as they are honest it should not be a problem.

[Indy 3,298]

Or do as other sports and give three VAR challenges to the manager to use at his discretion!

[horsefly 4,298]

On 05/03/2021 at 10:03, horsefly said:

Given that we want to see goals in the game, why not alter the rule to say that if a part of the goal-scorer's body is on-side then the goal stands. 

Seems Wenger has stolen my idea:

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/football/arsene-wenger-presents-new-offside-rule-to-football-lawmakers-and-it-s-game-changing/ar-BB1ehUxN?ocid=msedgdhp

[WD40 720]

2 hours ago, horsefly said:

Seems Wenger has stolen my idea:

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/football/arsene-wenger-presents-new-offside-rule-to-football-lawmakers-and-it-s-game-changing/ar-BB1ehUxN?ocid=msedgdhp

I mean Souness suggested the same thing last year, I believe after the shocking offside given on Pukki against spurs. So the idea has been around for some time.

Would that just move the lines they draw to the back of the players bode rather than the front though?

[Yellow and Green 334]

On 05/03/2021 at 05:24, hogesar said:

I know this is a rule problem not a VAR problem but I'm really not looking forward to VAR again,  should we get promoted.

I agree.

We have been on the end of a number of poor refereeing performances this season but there's an element of understanding when it the decision has been made live. Everything happens so quickly, bodies are in the way and people make mistakes. There's an element of tradition to it too; it's just part of the game.

VAR is infuriating because they have the time, resources and expertise (don't laugh) to make consistent decisions. Yet seemingly every week there seems to be a controversy that VAR was supposed to eliminate. 

If the Refereeing Association were confident in their abilities to provide consistent officiating every week then they would be more transparent - turning the microphones on to explain their decisions. The only valid reason not to is the amount of abuse refs would get if there was a clear error.

[Yellow Wal 314]

The game should not be about the referees but about the players.

But there would be a massive outrage if the performances of the players was scrutinised as deeply as the performance of the officials.