hampton canary 24 Posted February 8, 2021 I think it is fair to say that most opposition managers know exactly how we are going to play, and can plan accordingly. I would like to see our coach tweak our tactics so as to give the opposition something to think about. My suggestions would be to possibly start with 2 strikers, as playing just Pukki makes it easy for their centre backs. I would like him to change the zonal marking for corners and leave our quickest player on the halfway line so we have an outlet when we win a header or Krul catches the ball. Finally, cut back on the insistence of Krul to give the ball to either central defender every time, invariably those defenders are pressed and we end up giving the ball away. These are not major points but it would at least be worth trying occasionally. When we move the ball quickly going forward no side can handle us, unfortunately we spend more time passing sideways and backwards and we become predictable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thirsty Lizard 3,163 Posted February 8, 2021 13 minutes ago, hampton canary said: I think it is fair to say that most opposition managers know exactly how we are going to play, and can plan accordingly. I would like to see our coach tweak our tactics so as to give the opposition something to think about. My suggestions would be to possibly start with 2 strikers, as playing just Pukki makes it easy for their centre backs. I would like him to change the zonal marking for corners and leave our quickest player on the halfway line so we have an outlet when we win a header or Krul catches the ball. Finally, cut back on the insistence of Krul to give the ball to either central defender every time, invariably those defenders are pressed and we end up giving the ball away. These are not major points but it would at least be worth trying occasionally. When we move the ball quickly going forward no side can handle us, unfortunately we spend more time passing sideways and backwards and we become predictable. Which midfield or wide player would you drop to play 2 strikers? Why would you change zonal marking at corners when we haven't conceded from a corner for a long time? Why do you think that if we leave a player up for opposition corners that that player will actually get the ball if we do clear the corner? Why do you think that we end up giving the ball away when Krul gives it to one of our central defenders? You do realise that this actually hardly ever happens don't you? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hampton canary 24 Posted February 8, 2021 15 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said: Which midfield or wide player would you drop to play 2 strikers? Rupp or Plachetta Why would you change zonal marking at corners when we haven't conceded from a corner for a long time? Swansea Why do you think that if we leave a player up for opposition corners that that player will actually get the ball if we do clear the corner? I said you would have an outlet, at the moment if we win the header it goes straight to the opposition. Why do you think that we end up giving the ball away when Krul gives it to one of our central defenders? You do realise that this actually hardly ever happens don't you? You must be watching different game to me as it regularly happens. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ridgeman 131 Posted February 8, 2021 38 minutes ago, hampton canary said: I think it is fair to say that most opposition managers know exactly how we are going to play, and can plan accordingly. I would like to see our coach tweak our tactics so as to give the opposition something to think about. My suggestions would be to possibly start with 2 strikers, as playing just Pukki makes it easy for their centre backs. I would like him to change the zonal marking for corners and leave our quickest player on the halfway line so we have an outlet when we win a header or Krul catches the ball. Finally, cut back on the insistence of Krul to give the ball to either central defender every time, invariably those defenders are pressed and we end up giving the ball away. These are not major points but it would at least be worth trying occasionally. When we move the ball quickly going forward no side can handle us, unfortunately we spend more time passing sideways and backwards and we become predictable. I would also like to see our fastest player on or near the halfway line because it normally takes two players out of the opposition attack. I would also like to see us attack much quicker, at present we rely on the possession based game where we string together far too many passes to get to the oppositions penalty area this gives the opposition time to organise their defence to nullify any threat. I feel that when we are playing packed defences we must shoot from distance more. Having watched Brentford a couple of times I noticed how quick they can get the ball forward I would like us todo the same whether its more direct passing or using the speedof Placheta and Hernandez. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Number9 272 Posted February 8, 2021 50 minutes ago, hampton canary said: I think it is fair to say that most opposition managers know exactly how we are going to play, and can plan accordingly. I would like to see our coach tweak our tactics so as to give the opposition something to think about. My suggestions would be to possibly start with 2 strikers, as playing just Pukki makes it easy for their centre backs. I would like him to change the zonal marking for corners and leave our quickest player on the halfway line so we have an outlet when we win a header or Krul catches the ball. Finally, cut back on the insistence of Krul to give the ball to either central defender every time, invariably those defenders are pressed and we end up giving the ball away. These are not major points but it would at least be worth trying occasionally. When we move the ball quickly going forward no side can handle us, unfortunately we spend more time passing sideways and backwards and we become predictable. You're two or three years late in your observations. Farke says 'we must try harder at Plan A' 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hank shoots Skyler 2,094 Posted February 8, 2021 34 minutes ago, hampton canary said: Why would you change zonal marking at corners when we haven't conceded from a corner for a long time? Swansea Yes if only we weren't zonal marking then Krul would've caught that cross! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thirsty Lizard 3,163 Posted February 8, 2021 23 minutes ago, Number9 said: You're two or three years late in your observations. Farke says 'we must try harder at Plan A' He doesn't of course - he says 'we must get better at Plan A'. This season we do have a Plan B also - he just happens to be injured at the moment. But do carry on attacking our team at every opportunity - we expect nothing less from you. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HazzaJet 252 Posted February 8, 2021 2 hours ago, hampton canary said: I think it is fair to say that most opposition managers know exactly how we are going to play, and can plan accordingly. I would like to see our coach tweak our tactics so as to give the opposition something to think about. My suggestions would be to possibly start with 2 strikers, as playing just Pukki makes it easy for their centre backs. I would like him to change the zonal marking for corners and leave our quickest player on the halfway line so we have an outlet when we win a header or Krul catches the ball. Finally, cut back on the insistence of Krul to give the ball to either central defender every time, invariably those defenders are pressed and we end up giving the ball away. These are not major points but it would at least be worth trying occasionally. When we move the ball quickly going forward no side can handle us, unfortunately we spend more time passing sideways and backwards and we become predictable. Totally agree with you. Farke did brilliantly in the Championship 2 years ago but I think now his style of play has been found out, as we are yet to score more than 3 goals or win by more than a 2 goal margin so far this season. Like loads of people have said, he needs to come up a new style of play Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jaberry2 550 Posted February 8, 2021 But we do have back up tactics of 3 at the back with wingbacks, its just not utilised too much. If we produce a decent display soon, this minor blip will just be forgotten about. Most teams at the top often go through them. The worry obviously is, that we start spiralling a little, but hopefully we have enough mature / seasoned players to prevent that from happening. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hogesar 9,661 Posted February 8, 2021 If we were so easy to work out and counter then I doubt we'd have ever got near top of the table in the first place. You have 4 or 5 matches to support your claim, I have 3 or 4 x the amount you do to support mine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lake district canary 4,531 Posted February 8, 2021 (edited) "Found out" is not correct. It's not rocket science - everyone knows how we play and always have done. They then try and counter it and if we are not at our best they might get something from the game. In this league when we are at our best we are nigh unplayable - it's just that we have gone off the boil a bit. That does not mean change anything much, it just means returning to our best form. I broke a habit of the last few years and watched a PL game not involving us yesterday - Liverpool v Man City and I was struck about how similar to us both teams looked to how we play. Yes, the players may be better, but overall, the similarities were clear (imo). At it's best the two teams are unplayable, but for long periods they cancelled each other out, until Man City got the breaks. Simply speaking, we don't need to change anything, we just need to do what we are doing, but do it better. Edited February 8, 2021 by lake district canary 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Midlands Yellow 3,980 Posted February 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, lake district canary said: "Found out" is not correct. It's not rocket science - everyone knows how we play and always have done. They then try and counter it and if we are not at our best they might get something from the game. In this league when we are at our best we are nigh unplayable - it's just that we have gone off the boil a bit. That does not mean change anything much, it just means returning to our best form. I broke a habit of the last few years and watched a PL game not involving us yesterday - Liverpool v Man City and I was struck about how similar to us both teams looked to how we play. Yes, the players may be better, but overall, the similarities were clear (imo). At it's best the two teams are unplayable, but for long periods they cancelled each other out, until Man City got the breaks. Simply speaking, we don't need to change anything, we just need to do what we are doing, but do it better. Excellent news, top 4 next season is back on if City gain promotion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hampton canary 24 Posted February 8, 2021 20 minutes ago, hogesar said: If we were so easy to work out and counter then I doubt we'd have ever got near top of the table in the first place. You have 4 or 5 matches to support your claim, I have 3 or 4 x the amount you do to support mine. I think we have been quite lucky in a number of games, but I am not complaining that we are still top. I have lost count of how many times in matches either Aarons or Sorenson have received the ball in space, but their first instinct is not to go forward, but stop and pass it back to either Hanley or Gibson. The opposition know that if you close those players down they are unlikely to try and go past you. I hope I am wrong and this is just a blip, but we have some winnable games coming up now so let's see how many we win. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hogesar 9,661 Posted February 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, hampton canary said: I think we have been quite lucky in a number of games, but I am not complaining that we are still top. I have lost count of how many times in matches either Aarons or Sorenson have received the ball in space, but their first instinct is not to go forward, but stop and pass it back to either Hanley or Gibson. The opposition know that if you close those players down they are unlikely to try and go past you. I hope I am wrong and this is just a blip, but we have some winnable games coming up now so let's see how many we win. I dont really agree. Aarons is great at dribbling past opponents but he's football intelligent and knows when to do it and when not to. Sorensen on the other hand will always struggle as hes on the left side and will only feel comfortable cutting inside. The players are well versed in risk vs reward and make the right decision more often than not. We just don't see it because the mistake never happens. Its one of many reasons why we are top. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hampton canary 24 Posted February 8, 2021 7 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said: Excellent news, top 4 next season is back on if City gain promotion. It is often the way you approach the game that will determine the outcome. When we played Boro at home we didn't get a shot on goal and played our usual slow game. When I watched the highlights of Brentford away to Boro it was attack from the beginning from Brentford. Over the years I have watched Norwich teams play the Brentford way and I prefer that to our current tactics. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Number9 272 Posted February 8, 2021 2 hours ago, Thirsty Lizard said: He doesn't of course - he says 'we must get better at Plan A'. This season we do have a Plan B also - he just happens to be injured at the moment. But do carry on attacking our team at every opportunity - we expect nothing less from you. I'm assuming you mean Hugill. Is it really a Plan B? Do you notice our style of play changing much when Hugill plays? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Number9 272 Posted February 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, hogesar said: I dont really agree. Aarons is great at dribbling past opponents but he's football intelligent and knows when to do it and when not to. Sorensen on the other hand will always struggle as hes on the left side and will only feel comfortable cutting inside. The players are well versed in risk vs reward and make the right decision more often than not. We just don't see it because the mistake never happens. Its one of many reasons why we are top. Realistically Hogesar, do you think that if our wide players stayed wide, the central area would be less congested and therefore more space for Pukki and the central midfielders? Our players tend to turn inside more often than not and the defenders go with them, it gets very busy in the middle, surely that's to the advantage of the defending team, not the attackers? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hampton canary 24 Posted February 8, 2021 1 minute ago, hogesar said: I dont really agree. Aarons is great at dribbling past opponents but he's football intelligent and knows when to do it and when not to. Sorensen on the other hand will always struggle as hes on the left side and will only feel comfortable cutting inside. The players are well versed in risk vs reward and make the right decision more often than not. We just don't see it because the mistake never happens. Its one of many reasons why we are top. We can agree to differ. I have watched Norwich teams play for over 50 years and given the choice I will always go for those managers who are positive from the outset. If we are lucky enough to get promoted, and Farke goes for the same tactics as he did last time, we will be straight back down. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hogesar 9,661 Posted February 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, Number9 said: Realistically Hogesar, do you think that if our wide players stayed wide, the central area would be less congested and therefore more space for Pukki and the central midfielders? Our players tend to turn inside more often than not and the defenders go with them, it gets very busy in the middle, surely that's to the advantage of the defending team, not the attackers? Yeah, potentially. Although most of our best games involve Buendia Cantwell Pukki etc being close and creating chances via passing triangles and inventive football. Equally if your attacking 3 come central you create space for the likes of Aarons to get wide and into space - we've seen that countless times already this season. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kingston Yellow 220 Posted February 8, 2021 26 minutes ago, lake district canary said: "Found out" is not correct. It's not rocket science - everyone knows how we play and always have done. They then try and counter it and if we are not at our best they might get something from the game. In this league when we are at our best we are nigh unplayable - it's just that we have gone off the boil a bit. That does not mean change anything much, it just means returning to our best form. I broke a habit of the last few years and watched a PL game not involving us yesterday - Liverpool v Man City and I was struck about how similar to us both teams looked to how we play. Yes, the players may be better, but overall, the similarities were clear (imo). At it's best the two teams are unplayable, but for long periods they cancelled each other out, until Man City got the breaks. Simply speaking, we don't need to change anything, we just need to do what we are doing, but do it better. Ignore this bit. Poster doesn’t understand football. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Number9 272 Posted February 8, 2021 2 hours ago, Thirsty Lizard said: He doesn't of course - he says 'we must get better at Plan A'. This season we do have a Plan B also - he just happens to be injured at the moment. But do carry on attacking our team at every opportunity - we expect nothing less from you. Being realistic about our team and thinking about how the players can reach their potential? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hogesar 9,661 Posted February 8, 2021 1 minute ago, hampton canary said: We can agree to differ. I have watched Norwich teams play for over 50 years and given the choice I will always go for those managers who are positive from the outset. If we are lucky enough to get promoted, and Farke goes for the same tactics as he did last time, we will be straight back down. You don't think we are a positive team from the outset? I've not seen us sit back against one team this season and in almost every game this season we've started significantly on the front foot as evidenced by possession, created chances, shots, goals and ultimately results. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hampton canary 24 Posted February 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, Number9 said: I'm assuming you mean Hugill. Is it really a Plan B? Do you notice our style of play changing much when Hugill plays? Hugill only plays when Pukki is injured, that is not a plan B. From what I have seen so far this season Farke will go to a back 3 and bring on all the attacking players, often late on e.g. when we were 2 down to Swansea, that isn't a plan B either. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Number9 272 Posted February 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, hogesar said: Yeah, potentially. Although most of our best games involve Buendia Cantwell Pukki etc being close and creating chances via passing triangles and inventive football. Equally if your attacking 3 come central you create space for the likes of Aarons to get wide and into space - we've seen that countless times already this season. Arrons and whoever's wide on the left will 'get wide' until they pass the halfway line, at which point they either pass backwards to the defender or run inside to central areas. That happens most of each game, it's the way they predominantly play. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Number9 272 Posted February 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, hampton canary said: Hugill only plays when Pukki is injured, that is not a plan B. From what I have seen so far this season Farke will go to a back 3 and bring on all the attacking players, often late on e.g. when we were 2 down to Swansea, that isn't a plan B either. Tell that to the Lizard. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hampton canary 24 Posted February 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, hogesar said: You don't think we are a positive team from the outset? I've not seen us sit back against one team this season and in almost every game this season we've started significantly on the front foot as evidenced by possession, created chances, shots, goals and ultimately results. That front foot approach doesn't happen enough for me. We pass sideways and backwards more than any other team in this division. The opposition allow us to bring it into their half and then challenge us to get past a well organised defence. It is not surprising that we don't have too many shots on goal as we continually pass it and get nowhere. This is the way Farke plays. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Number9 272 Posted February 8, 2021 46 minutes ago, lake district canary said: "Found out" is not correct. It's not rocket science - everyone knows how we play and always have done. They then try and counter it and if we are not at our best they might get something from the game. In this league when we are at our best we are nigh unplayable - it's just that we have gone off the boil a bit. That does not mean change anything much, it just means returning to our best form. I broke a habit of the last few years and watched a PL game not involving us yesterday - Liverpool v Man City and I was struck about how similar to us both teams looked to how we play. Yes, the players may be better, but overall, the similarities were clear (imo). At it's best the two teams are unplayable, but for long periods they cancelled each other out, until Man City got the breaks. Simply speaking, we don't need to change anything, we just need to do what we are doing, but do it better. The obvious difference between us & Liverpool / ManC being the ££. There players are the best in the world and cost money, plus when the first 11 are injured, others come into the team of similar quality. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hogesar 9,661 Posted February 8, 2021 42 minutes ago, hampton canary said: That front foot approach doesn't happen enough for me. We pass sideways and backwards more than any other team in this division. The opposition allow us to bring it into their half and then challenge us to get past a well organised defence. It is not surprising that we don't have too many shots on goal as we continually pass it and get nowhere. This is the way Farke plays. It may have changed but we had created more chances and played more forward passes than anyone else in the division only a few games ago so that doesn't really add up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hampton canary 24 Posted February 8, 2021 4 minutes ago, hogesar said: It may have changed but we had created more chances and played more forward passes than anyone else in the division only a few games ago so that doesn't really add up. We are lucky if we create 3 or 4 chances a game. We can often play 20 sideways, backwards and forwards passes in our own half and as soon as we get into the opposition half it breaks down. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nutty nigel 7,533 Posted February 8, 2021 Still got the luck then. 2018/19 Farke got lucky, the stars all aligned and we won the league. 2020/21 been lucky all season and fluked our way to the top once again with 55 points from 28 games. True level is tippy tappy negative rubbish of 2017/18 and if it wasn't for luck we'd be below the binners now... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites