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Bovril

Quintilla - Why he is not playing despite being on the bench

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For those wondering why Quintilla is not starting / coming on the pitch. As part of the loan deal, Norwich have an obligatory £2.7m purchase fee if Quintilla makes a certain amount of appearances. Therefore Farke is more than likely under instructions only to play him if absolutely necessary. Farke/Webber obviously don't see Quintilla as a significant enough upgrade on Sorenson, or rather not £2.7m worth of upgrade. 

I imagine therefore we will continue to see Sorenson play and only see Quintilla if Sorenson get's injured/absolutely necessary and also hence why we strangely didn't see him come on in the last 10 minutes against Watford when it seemed bizarre to see Skipp play left-wingback rather than bring in Quintilla and play to his number one strength. 

With the above in mind it's likely Farke and Webber haven't seen enough of him to make them think he'll be good enough in the Premiership if we get promoted and instead looking at different options.  

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Farke changes a starting line-up with reluctance.

Two changes is a big deal for him....... Fortunately he has embraced the availability of substitutes more readily this season.

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We tend to ease our injured players back slowly, so I expect to see him next Saturday in the cup, no pressure on the player and a possible 90 minutes, makes sense to me.

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The reason Quintilla isn't playing at the moment is because Sorenson has done superbly at left back and is fully deserving of his place in the side. 

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3 hours ago, Bovril said:

For those wondering why Quintilla is not starting / coming on the pitch. As part of the loan deal, Norwich have an obligatory £2.7m purchase fee if Quintilla makes a certain amount of appearances. Therefore Farke is more than likely under instructions only to play him if absolutely necessary. Farke/Webber obviously don't see Quintilla as a significant enough upgrade on Sorenson, or rather not £2.7m worth of upgrade. 

I imagine therefore we will continue to see Sorenson play and only see Quintilla if Sorenson get's injured/absolutely necessary and also hence why we strangely didn't see him come on in the last 10 minutes against Watford when it seemed bizarre to see Skipp play left-wingback rather than bring in Quintilla and play to his number one strength. 

With the above in mind it's likely Farke and Webber haven't seen enough of him to make them think he'll be good enough in the Premiership if we get promoted and instead looking at different options.  

How sure are you of this information? It certainly raised an eyebrow seeing Skipp at LWB. If this theory is true, it'd explain why he went back to Spain for 'treatment' on a mysterious injury that didn't clear up. Maybe they think McCallum is a better bet and we're going to see him come back from his loan spell...?

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This is just a theory as to why he is not playing, so no inside information, although the obligation to pay £2.7m after making so many appearances is fact, as reported by Pink'Un when he signed. 

It was just so odd how he didn't come on against Watford when that was the perfect scenario for him, even more so when Martin come on right at the end, something definitely didn't add up that night. He's now been back on the bench for two weeks (three games) and all the other injured players that have been eased back in, had at least a few minutes on the pitch if not in their first game back then their second. 

I don't think Quintilla covered himself in glory defensively, he was good going forward, and so lived up to the reports about his strengths and weaknesses when he signed. I think Farke/Webber, like majority of us, have also been pleasantly surprised at just what a good job Sorenson has been able to do at this level. 

I think they are stalling time with him, hoping they have enough to go the whole season with Sorenson as Number One there and then re-assess in the summer depending what league we are in. 

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In Michael Bailey's recent interview with our head of recruitment ,Quintilla's  signing was described as our having the best left back in the league.

Theres a lot of the season left to be playing games about appearance fees etc.

Sorenson is adequate but not much more....just thankful that not too many in the league have the players  to really target him in the way that Watford did with Sarr

We definitely miss an attacking threat down the left without Quintilla.

....regardless of Quintilla's situation , I would find it hard to understand why we wouldnt be recalling McCallum in January esp. in the light of Byram still being some way off and Mumba also being out.

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I'd think it's more likely that they'd bring McCallum back to be honest. Not convinced playing LB - out of position - is ideal for Sørensen's long-term development. Thoroughly doubt they'd planned for Sørensen to be a number one left-back.

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To be honest, this theory does make sense because we do have an option to sign him. Maybe that becomes an obligation if certain clauses are met, such as promotion with a set number of games.

However, considering he's the only left back at the club (excluding those away on loan), surely the €3m obligation isn't a bad deal, even if we use him as a backup or want to loan him out or sell him on?

But I really wish people would stop saying that he's competing with Sorensen for anything other than the short term. Sorensen is clearly not seen as a long term option at left back.

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2 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

 Thoroughly doubt they'd planned for Sørensen to be a number one left-back.

Sorensen was brought in as a central midfielder; initially to play as the box-to-box midfielder with a view to becoming the anchorman. This was what Sorensen himself said in an interview after his signing.

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Posted (edited)

Its an interesting idea but I’d be astonished if it were correct - Xavi has only played 7 times, surely any appearance fee would only kick in after a lot more games than that...and the fact that he was actually set to start at Brentford when he got his injury suggests that it doesn’t quite stack up. 

Edited by Branston Pickle

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Agreed, it's an entertaining conspiracy theory, but it feels wrong. On top of the good reasons why that others have given above, it would also imply Farke doesn't think our coaching team couldn't improve him. He's only 24, we can still get more out of him.

 

@Bovril can you link to the Pink Un article that describes the arrangement? It seems odd to me to call it an option, when actually it's an obligation.

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9 minutes ago, Bovril said:

This is just a theory as to why he is not playing, so no inside information, although the obligation to pay £2.7m after making so many appearances is fact, as reported by Pink'Un when he signed. 

It was just so odd how he didn't come on against Watford when that was the perfect scenario for him, even more so when Martin come on right at the end, something definitely didn't add up that night. He's now been back on the bench for two weeks (three games) and all the other injured players that have been eased back in, had at least a few minutes on the pitch if not in their first game back then their second. 

I don't think Quintilla covered himself in glory defensively, he was good going forward, and so lived up to the reports about his strengths and weaknesses when he signed. I think Farke/Webber, like majority of us, have also been pleasantly surprised at just what a good job Sorenson has been able to do at this level. 

I think they are stalling time with him, hoping they have enough to go the whole season with Sorenson as Number One there and then re-assess in the summer depending what league we are in. 

Ah fair enough... did the article say how many appearances trigger the clause, or did it just say 'after a certain number of appearances'?

Either way, I can't imagine that we would shirk at paying £2.7m for a talented La Liga left-back. I think it's more likely that they wanted to give him as long as possible to ensure the injury has cleared up (it was a bit of an odd one that was difficult to diagnose, if I remember correctly). Either that or he's having personal problems/homesickness, hence him being sent back to Villarreal for treatment? 

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It's about as correct as saying that Sorensen is a left back and McCallum is being recalled. 

 

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Sounds like a load of nonsense. If we aren't intending to use him we wouldn't have him on the bench. We can use Gibson at left back if there's an in game injury to Sorensen etc. 

What is happening with Xavi is no different to what is happening with Gibson. Or Todd. Or Dowell. Or Placheta. Farke eases players back in after injury and clearly likes them to have 2-3 weeks of full training before he considers them to start. 

Plus with Sorensen in the side we've had a superb run of results. 

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Norwich would not have signed Quintilla if they were unhappy about the terms, and he was enjoying a run in the team as first choice before the injury so I wouldn't expect there was any issues surrounding his performance.

 

Had we been 2-0 up today I think Quintilla would have come on for a few minutes at the end. But at 1-0 and with Barnsley pressing for an equaliser it is too risky an option to bring him on after a long layoff. Especially when you can stick Alex Tettey in the middle of the defence to see out the game.

 

Fully expect Quintilla to get some minutes in the Cup game though.

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I believe Farke has said for the last couple of weeks he will get to the FA cup game and use that to help get players such as Quintilla, Dowell and Krul get fit, Krul was of course needed today.

This is not meant as criticism as Sorensen has been amazing covering at left back, but in the Premiership I would fear for him. That does not mean for 1 second he may not be a top class central midfielder in the PL

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The other point to make is Xavi has only played 7 games so far. The idea that there is a clause that means he's already close to the threshold for a compulsory £2.7m purchase seems rather unlikely. 

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4 minutes ago, Well b back said:

I believe Farke has said for the last couple of weeks he will get to the FA cup game and use that to help get players such as Quintilla, Dowell and Krul get fit, Krul was of course needed today.

This is not meant as criticism as Sorensen has been amazing covering at left back, but in the Premiership I would fear for him. That does not mean for 1 second he may not be a top class central midfielder in the PL

Plus we bought Sorensen as that creative/box to box midfielder! We're yet to see him there, and if we can't get Skipp back next season, we need to start bedding Sorensen into his preferred position. To that end we need Xavi playing, or McCullam back as back up (with Gibson) to maybe allow Rupp & Sorensen a chance (yes McClean is playing well but I'd hate to get promoted and face another season in Premiership with McClean as our primary midfielder!)

I also think we'll be more creative once Sorensen gets his chance in the middle 

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1 hour ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Sorensen was brought in as a central midfielder; initially to play as the box-to-box midfielder with a view to becoming the anchorman. This was what Sorensen himself said in an interview after his signing.

.....and he will be,eventually. And,given his performances at left back,I feel that he will translate that to his proper position. Anybody can see that he is a really good footballer.

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I mean, I get its just a theory but its incredibly unlikely.

Your first post sort of stated it as fact.

If we were that sure he wasn't good enough and didn't want to pay for him we wouldn't have him on the bench.

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4 hours ago, Bovril said:

For those wondering why Quintilla is not starting / coming on the pitch. As part of the loan deal, Norwich have an obligatory £2.7m purchase fee if Quintilla makes a certain amount of appearances. Therefore Farke is more than likely under instructions only to play him if absolutely necessary. Farke/Webber obviously don't see Quintilla as a significant enough upgrade on Sorenson, or rather not £2.7m worth of upgrade. 

I imagine therefore we will continue to see Sorenson play and only see Quintilla if Sorenson get's injured/absolutely necessary and also hence why we strangely didn't see him come on in the last 10 minutes against Watford when it seemed bizarre to see Skipp play left-wingback rather than bring in Quintilla and play to his number one strength. 

With the above in mind it's likely Farke and Webber haven't seen enough of him to make them think he'll be good enough in the Premiership if we get promoted and instead looking at different options.  

Interesting theory whether true or not and there could be something in it since Farke did get to see what Quintilla offers before the injury.   

As good a job as Sorensen is doing, probable most fans accept its only a stop gap and we do have less balance going forward down the left.    That's natural as he's right-footed.   

From what I have seen, Quintilla hasnt got the defensive qualities for the EPL (he doesn't seem either quick enough or strong enough)....  if the club feel that way and there is something in the contract then it would make sense to leave him out.    

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Would put money on it McCallum isn’t being recalled this window.

He’d have been back here yesterday.

Looks fairly clear that Farke and Webber want him to get weekly starting first team football at this level, so he can actually develop rather than have him here just rotting on the bench.

Sorensen has exceeded expectations at LB. Not surprised he hasn’t lost his place. Why should he? With Quintilla just back from injury then you’d expect him to get the minutes next week in the cup and then it comes down to fitness, form, suspensions, training etc who starts.

No way after just 7 games or so can we be on the cusp of triggering any sort of clause for Xavi with his parent club! No one really believes that do they?!

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Posted (edited)

@Nuff Said Here is the article noting the obligation to buy due to appearances made. Article from Sky Sports also states it, but presume they took the info from one another.

https://www.pinkun.com/sport/norwich-city/norwich-hoping-to-avoid-january-transfer-window-dramas-6878626

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11709/12166395/xavi-qunitilla-fitness-concerns-may-see-norwich-sign-january-replacement

"His situation is complicated further by an obligation to buy - reportedly for a fee of £2.7m - if he has made a significant amount of appearances in a promotion season and by both Sam Byram and Bali Mumba hoping to return to fitness this month.

Spanish left-back Xavi Quintilla made his Norwich City debut at Huddersfield Picture: Paul Chester

Left-back Xavi Quintilla has returned to City's matchday squads recently - Credit: Paul Chesterton/Focus Images Ltd

Sam McCallum could return from Coventry if needed but it's understood sporting director Stuart Webber and Farke would prefer the 20-year-old to keep developing as he is playing regularly, so a Premier League loan could be considered if things don't work out with Quintilla, Byram and Mumba."

Edited by Bovril

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It's Skysports. Skysports know absolutely jack sh*t about what's going on in football. If they don't know they just make it up. 

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2 hours ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Sorensen was brought in as a central midfielder; initially to play as the box-to-box midfielder with a view to becoming the anchorman. This was what Sorensen himself said in an interview after his signing.

He describes his best position as a 6, strong in the duels and capable of breaking the lines. 

He sees himself more as a cdm than a box to box. But obviously a talented, willing and adaptable lad. 

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1 hour ago, Beefy is a legend said:

The other point to make is Xavi has only played 7 games so far. The idea that there is a clause that means he's already close to the threshold for a compulsory £2.7m purchase seems rather unlikely. 

I thought the compulsory purchase was based on us gaining promotion? 

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Sorenson, for the commitment and fine work he has put into a position he had never played deserves plaudits. But (yeah that was telegraphed), to say he has done brilliantly for a left back I am not so sure. He definitely has done brilliantly for a square peg, but Sarr showed how easily he can be beaten time and again against Watford.

Reality is we need Quintilla back asap. Watford was probably too soon and in the last couple of games we had a 19 year old keeper, so probably not a great game to introduce him, and a question mark over Krul who had only just returned to fitness himself. I guess farke just didn't think these were suitable conditions to risk Xavi.

As mentioned the cup tie will tell us more as will any transfer activity in the next few weeks.

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