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cambridgeshire canary

Millwall fans boo thier own players taking the knee

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57 minutes ago, horsefly said:

Sadly you are of course right. I guess as an old -fashioned adherent to the liberal values of the Enlightenment I find myself addicted to promoting the value of reason over superstition, bigotry and irrationality.

You proved that you are bigoted over the course of this thread. Reasonable people know that racism is not just whites against blacks.

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12 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Pretty sure he's on about the 'aims' section of the the original black lives matter orginization.. Which is admittedly run by quite a few nutjobs, as you can see below.

 

black-lives.jpg

 

Very much worth noting however that there is a difference between the GROUP and the message that the vast majority of people carry with them and the players in the stadiums are kneeling for.

 

There is a difference between the two.

Is there a link?

Much of this is consistent with the Kibbutz movement in Israel - quite interesting

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12 minutes ago, paul moy said:

You proved that you are bigoted over the course of this thread. Reasonable people know that racism is not just whites against blacks.

And please do explain how this is relevant to the topic of this thread which is about players taking the knee to express racial solidarity. 

And BTW please do quote me where I make any comment on the issue of whether or not people of colour can be racist against white people.

But just to clarify my position on this for you (since you won't find anything):

Do I think there are incidences where a person of colour might lash out with a reference to a white person's colour? Yes

Do I think white people suffer systematic disadvantage, injustice, and abuse in every area of their daily lives because of the colour of their skin? No

Now please do tell me how that might constitute bigotry

Edited by horsefly

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1 minute ago, horsefly said:

And please do explain how this is relevant to the topic of this thread which is about players taking the knee to express racial solidarity. 

Explain to all of us what this is doing on the Norwich discussion board at all.

Go back to your containment board. Shoo.

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13 minutes ago, horsefly said:

And please do explain how this is relevant to the topic of this thread which is about players taking the knee to express racial solidarity. 

That is irrelevant.  Look up what bigot means and you will realise that you are being a hypocrite by accusing others that are trying to debate reasonably of being bigots.

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1 hour ago, Taylor324 said:

As a mixed race person - I would like you to explain to me how abolishing the police will help give me racial equality?

Here goes.... In the states policing is very "militaristic" and not community based.it consumes vast amounts of money but crime stats don't change that much. As crime and poverty are clearly linked (countless studies have show this) the argument to defund the police (only an idiot would ask for abolishing the police and I don't believe that is even an argument) in the US, is that the money you save goes on providing better education, health and community resources such as community centres, sports facilities, theatre, music venues etc. This in turn improves people's chances of better jobs, starting businesses and are less likely to commit crimes as they have a community to be proud of and more to do, porter areas are rejuvenated. You then need less police and less is spent on incarceration of criminals. It's a sensible and valid independent argument as the current system is not working.

In the Uk the argument is not so strong as our policing is more community based and in fact, you could argue we need to spend more to get back to that community approach (20k less police in London now I think, since Cameron and co where elected). The bobby that lives in the community serves the community and is seen as an asset. Austerity measures in the UK have, IMO, led to a huge jump in crime (particularly knife crime in big cities) as facilities in the poorest areas all shut giving kids nothing to do..

Hope that helps.

Ps. Those at Millwall ... 100% racist in their actions.... Zero doubt in my mind.

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6 minutes ago, horsefly said:

What is your valid question? It can't be about abolishing the police because as has been answered many, many times NO ONE HAS ARGUED FOR ABOLISHING THE POLICE. 

 

But you are supporting an organisation which aims to abolish the police and by their own admission two of it's three founding members boasted of being "trained Marxists" You seem happy to disassociate yourself from what the organisation actually stands for but at the same time wish to be seen to support the movement

No doubt, if you had been around in the 1930's you would have been happy to give the Sieg Heil because you thought it looked cool and had nothing to do with the **** party 

 

 

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1 minute ago, paul moy said:

That is irrelevant.  Look up what bigot means and you will realise that you are being a hypocrite by accusing others that are trying to debate reasonably of being bigots.

I think you might want to look up the meanings of the words "reasonable" and "debate"

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1 minute ago, Taylor324 said:

 

Oh Dear! I'll leave you to your own thoughts as you clearly have no interest at all in answering any of the points that have been put to you.

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20 minutes ago, Badger said:

Is there a link?

Much of this is consistent with the Kibbutz movement in Israel - quite interesting

Given both groups were founded by self described marxists is it really that surprising? Although thankfuly most of it has long since been scrubbed from the internet beacause the sensible people running the group came to the obvious realization that you're not going to be winning a lot of hearts and minds of the public by demanding Marxism for all and 'an end to the nuclear family' etc etc 🙃

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8 minutes ago, Kenny Foggo said:

 the argument to defund the police (only an idiot would ask for abolishing the police and I don't believe that is even an argument) 

YahNé Ndgo a Black Lives Matter Philadelphia representative outlined a five-year plan for the “complete abolition” of the city’s police department

 

That argument aged well 

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9 minutes ago, Taylor324 said:

 

A picture of me from 1940 (well ok it's Charlie Chaplin, but hopefully you might get the point)

 

The-Great-Dictator.jpg

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1 minute ago, horsefly said:

A picture of me from 1940 (well ok it's Charlie Chaplin, but hopefully you might get the point)

 

The-Great-Dictator.jpg

Here’s how you think you look in 2020...

Now get back on your containment board

E8CA6EFD-C17F-463A-855D-29A8B9FC4ADC.png

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3 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

an end to the nuclear family

...of course, the nuclear family is quite modern innovation (the clue is in the name) and is probably a minority type of family organisation (I don't have the figures). There are many other types of family organisation - adults/ no kids; kids flown the nest; single parent families; extended families.

My own preference is extended families which are still quite prevalent in areas like Norfolk, where extended families still quite frequently support each other. The nuclear family is the child of Norman Tebbit style capitalism "on yer bike" to encourage geographical mobility by leaving behind family members and migrating elsewhere. Ironically, many complain about the social impact of migration to the new areas without considering the impact on those left behind.

Personally, I believe that the extended family is a better way of organising society than a nuclear family - so perhaps not as unpopular as you might suppose?

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2 minutes ago, Taylor324 said:

YahNé Ndgo a Black Lives Matter Philadelphia representative outlined a five-year plan for the “complete abolition” of the city’s police department

 

That argument aged well 

Yep! there are idiots in every organisation and one hopes their idiocy soon gets exposed and overruled as it did in this case. . If only that were the case with our present government. But i do get the feeling you're not really talking about the issue of this thread any more.

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8 minutes ago, horsefly said:

Yep! there are idiots in every organisation and one hopes their idiocy soon gets exposed and overruled as it did in this case. . If only that were the case with our present government. But i do get the feeling you're not really talking about the issue of this thread any more.

Completely ignored all of my arguments despite his pleading for the arguments on refunding the police. I wouldn't waste your time as it's pointless unfortunately. 

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1 minute ago, Kenny Foggo said:

Completely ignored all of my arguments despite his pleading for the arguments on refunding the police. I wouldn't waste your time as it's pointless unfortunately. 

Yep! it's clearly pointless so I shall leave the poor benighted souls to dwell in their own ignorance.

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3 minutes ago, horsefly said:

Yep! it's clearly pointless so I shall leave the poor benighted souls to dwell in their own ignorance.

 

8EA3428B-31F1-4874-9CBA-9B2178B6DFDF.jpeg

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24 minutes ago, Kenny Foggo said:

Completely ignored all of my arguments despite his pleading for the arguments on refunding the police. I wouldn't waste your time as it's pointless unfortunately. 

But if you look up the page you will see I knocked your argument clean out of the stadium - BLM's aim is clearly to defund the police leading to abolition 

Your second sentence rambles on about giving the police in the UK more money - If I lived in the UK I would agree with that statement but it goes against the aims of BLM movement which you support 

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33 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

 

8EA3428B-31F1-4874-9CBA-9B2178B6DFDF.jpeg

I've often considered  'flouncing', but have ended up remembering that a flounce is a tough position to recover from. How does one unflounce/deflounce? I realise that toys can be replaced back into the pram, but as there are no hypothetical toys thrown when flouncing, what is the hypothetical version of replacing those non existent toys.

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1 minute ago, Taylor324 said:

But if you look up the page you will see I knocked your argument clean out of the stadium - BLM's aim is clearly to defund the police leading to abolition 

Your second sentence rambles on about giving the police in the UK more money - If I lived in the UK I would agree with that statement but it goes against the aims of BLM movement which you support 

As has been pointed out, the aim of the BLM movement is equality for all people, a few individuals within the organisation, may have argued for abolition of the police (just think if we needed no police it would mean no crime was being committed.. never happen but a nice idea) but it's not a stated aim of their organisation. Lots of organisations have members that have aims not aligned to the organisational aims, so not sure why you need to single out this particular one.

You have also not even addressed the argument of defunding in the US to use the funds to improve education, business, quality of life in those poor areas of the states, of which most are non white areas. Therefore, you either disagree with the idea of helping black areas in America improve, in which case why is that? Or you believe there is a better way than defunding the massive police budget to redistribute to health, education etc. So what is that idea? Or you don't understand the concept.

My comments on policing in the UK was to highlight the very little appetite for defunding here as policing is and has always been different in the UK to the US? Do you not agree? I have never once stated I support BLM movement, I have stated I support the taking of the knee to highlight the ongoing racism with in society... Which was what the thread was about.

I look forward to your rational response.

Ps. Knocked clean out of the stadium 🤣 that cheered me up so thanks x

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19 minutes ago, Taylor324 said:

But if you look up the page you will see I knocked your argument clean out of the stadium - BLM's aim is clearly to defund the police leading to abolition 

Your second sentence rambles on about giving the police in the UK more money - If I lived in the UK I would agree with that statement but it goes against the aims of BLM movement which you support 

Nobody can be this dense. You're just trolling.

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At last someone trying to put a stop to all this boll.cks! This take a knee and black lives matter has gone beyond a joke. Cut it our now! Think we get the point dont ram it down our throats!! White lives matter aswell

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1 hour ago, Taylor324 said:

YahNé Ndgo a Black Lives Matter Philadelphia representative outlined a five-year plan for the “complete abolition” of the city’s police department

 

That argument aged well 

I'd be surprised if you can be bothered but here is what "defunding the police really means" as explained on their website, rather than from a far right website:

https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-defunding-the-police-really-means/

Assuming that you can be bothered to watch it, what points do you disagree with?

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4 minutes ago, bringbackchippy said:

At last someone trying to put a stop to all this boll.cks! This take a knee and black lives matter has gone beyond a joke. Cut it our now! Think we get the point dont ram it down our throats!! White lives matter aswell

The highlighted sentence is the most stupid of all arguments on the matter - who says that they don't?

When you hear people say "Save the whale" do you automatically think that this means that advocates of this are suggesting that "we don't give a sh1t about dolphins though?"

Of course you don't because nobody has tried to brainwash you into that, like they have over the BLM movement.

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30 minutes ago, kirku said:

Nobody can be this dense. You're just trolling.

I'm afraid that there are many even worse - some of whom have posted on this thread!

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45 minutes ago, bringbackchippy said:

At last someone trying to put a stop to all this boll.cks! This take a knee and black lives matter has gone beyond a joke. Cut it our now! Think we get the point dont ram it down our throats!! White lives matter aswell

I'm so, so shocked our resident racist has popped onto this thread.

@Alex Moss - did you see this coming? 😅

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52 minutes ago, Badger said:

The highlighted sentence is the most stupid of all arguments on the matter - who says that they don't?

When you hear people say "Save the whale" do you automatically think that this means that advocates of this are suggesting that "we don't give a sh1t about dolphins though?"

Of course you don't because nobody has tried to brainwash you into that, like they have over the BLM movement.

They're beyond help I'm afraid. Absolutely no interest in considering the arguments just happy to regurgitate uneducated right wing bile. But then we millions of Kneeling Marxist revolutionaries would say that wouldn't we. 

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6 minutes ago, horsefly said:

They're beyond help I'm afraid. Absolutely no interest in considering the arguments just happy to regurgitate uneducated right wing bile. But then we millions of Kneeling Marxist revolutionaries would say that wouldn't we. 

Yes along with all the multi-millionaire players taking the knee - they are all secretly crypto-marxists trying to undermine the state.

I mean several of them come from Eastern Europe, so obviously KGB plants - and our own Onel Hernandez is Cuban! This must be 110% proof in their world and more than definite evidence. 

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