So, Good or bad Window....?

[Mello Yello 2,289]

....opaque....

[CDMullins 436]

16 hours ago, YellaYellowYella said:

Oh come on.

If any of you lot would have been told we'd keep Aarons, Cantwell and Emi, make enough money not to have to worry about the COVID losses and told we would sign 13 (isn't it?) players including Ben Gibson and Oli Skipp not a single one of you would have turned that down.

We were one centre half away from a 10/10 window.

Let's just hope the signings prove decidedly more effective than last season.

Is that you Stuart?

[Cantiaci Canary 556]

I very much think the 'proof will be in the pudding'. I know that us footy fans hate the word 'patience' but that's what's needed now!

Once they fully integrate, gell, absorb Farke's processes and start ticking we may well be left drewling.

The CB situation is a toughie ... they wouldn't have chosen to have lost Timm but he couldn't be anything other than 4th choice and it was reasonable to listen to him and let him exit. Personally, at that point I would've liked us to have invested in a starting RCB to partner Gibson but evidently Zimmers and Hanley are being trusted. If injuries / suspensions hit us in that position we could always use Sorensen (who plays CB for Denmark U21s I believe). If he gad been advertised as a CB then few fans would be grumbling.

[Capt. Pants 4,224]

Farke wanted a new CB in the window, which to me means he doesn't rate what we have got.

[PurpleCanary 5,556]

17 hours ago, YellaYellowYella said:

Oh come on.

If any of you lot would have been told we'd keep Aarons, Cantwell and Emi, make enough money not to have to worry about the COVID losses and told we would sign 13 (isn't it?) players including Ben Gibson and Oli Skipp not a single one of you would have turned that down.

We were one centre half away from a 10/10 window.

Let's just hope the signings prove decidedly more effective than last season.

One centre-back away from a 9.5 window but otherwise I agree, and it may be Sorensen for one can play there. Some posters seem still not to understand the hit the finances are taking from covid.

[Nuff Said 5,117]

48 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

Farke wanted a new CB in the window, which to me means he doesn't rate what we have got.

Honestly, this thread is a feast of people seeing and saying what they want in blatant contradiction of reality.

 

Farke is quoted as saying “To bring a proper option to improve us was too expensive.” This means that he believes anyone better than what we currently have would be very expensive - which is the opposite of not rating what we have.

And to say we didn’t bring in any defenders, which a couple of posters have done, is bizarre.

[Number9 272]

14 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

Honestly, this thread is a feast of people seeing and saying what they want in blatant contradiction of reality.

 

Farke is quoted as saying “To bring a proper option to improve us was too expensive.” This means that he believes anyone better than what we currently have would be very expensive - which is the opposite of not rating what we have.

And to say we didn’t bring in any defenders, which a couple of posters have done, is bizarre.

Reality is we have signed a plethora of players this year, majority of which are not good enough for the first team at the moment. 

 

[Jerrykerry 223]

1 hour ago, Capt. Pants said:

Farke wanted a new CB in the window, which to me means he doesn't rate what we have got.

Wanting more cover does not mean you don't rate what's there. 

If he wanted another attacking midfielder that would mean he doesn't rate buendia with your logic. 

[Branston Pickle 3,651]

15 minutes ago, Number9 said:

Reality is we have signed a plethora of players this year, majority of which are not good enough for the first team at the moment. 

 

Tbh that’s the way it is and always will be - you have to get players for the future as well as the present.  In terms of that mix I think we are about right - we’re starting with 3/4 different players and you’d not really want too many more.  It was the positional mix that was the problem.

[Number9 272]

1 minute ago, Branston Pickle said:

Tbh that’s the way it is and always will be - you have to get players for the future as well as the present.  In terms of that mix I think we are about right - we’re starting with 3/4 different players and you’d not really want too many more.  It was the positional mix that was the problem.

Which players have we signed who have improved the first team, better than we had?

Skipp seems to have potential but obv he's not a long term player for us.

Hugill seems to have potential but Farke won't play him.

Gibson is an unknown quantity, Farke didn't play him.

 

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

We have bought a lot of players in, time will tell whether it has been a good window. We bought in a lot of players in the last two windows and they proved to be mostly ineffective. The lack of cover in defence is plainly stupid and if Farke has said he wanted a centre back, that is as close to him showing his disappointment as it gets.

[Yorkshire Canary 118]

It was inevitable that we were going to lose some of the crown jewels and i thought 3 or 4 may have gone, so nice to see the others on board for the immediate future in any event. I have  been impressed  with most of the signings that have made it as far as the first team, i would like to see much much more of Hugill though i really think he is a big threat at this level but not if he is only getting 10 minutes at the end of games. We are now a bit thin in Defense and i do not buy into the debate that Tettey can do a job there,we are winging it a bit a couple of injuries and we could be creaking in that area. Now that the transfer speculation has died down we want to see some good match winning performances from Buendia and Cantwell, they are over due this season. I am not unhappy with any of the departures, with the exception of Trybull who i think could have done a job for us at this level. I would like to see more of the new young blood that we have signed one of the great things about the promotion season was seeing young lads bursting upon the scene. I do not need to remind people that we have got off to a bang ordinary start and already 8 points behind the top 2, that can change quickly but i am now looking for us to kick on as the squad settles and get more points on  the board.

Edited October 17, 2020 by Yorkshire Canary

[TheGunnShow 5,937]

3 hours ago, Il Pirata said:

I'm not sure how anyone can reflect and say it was anything but a bad window, for the here and now at least.

We've lost Dowell, Hernandez and Byram to long term injuries. Placheta has potential, but totally unproven and has also had an injury.

Gibson is a an improvement,  but as played next to no football for the last 18 months. Hanley and Zimm are proven to be injury prone. 

Cantwell and Buendia could find form, but given the events of the last few weeks, could also flop. And let's be honest they've both had no form for months. 

Hugill was a decent signing and offers something different. 

Ultimately, the squad feels unbalanced and injury prone. No where near good enough currently to threaten the top six. And that's not really good enough. 

Can't really legislate for the injuries. Gibson's looked promising but then again, we thought Duda looked good after his first game so we'd better wait and see. I'd agree that Cantwell and Buendia need to find form, but they should find it easier in the Championship - especially Buendia. What we're seeing is a somewhat remodelled team trying to play its way back into form, and there are definite signs that it's slowly coming to.

Much to our surprise, we've kept Buendia and Aarons as well. That's a big partnership down the right. I really need to see more of a couple of the others, namely Hugill and Sorensen, assuming Gibson keeps his form. On top of that, there's also the matter of what form some of the loanees bring. I have said before as it's a strong suspicion of mine, that one of Famewo or Bushiri may get brought back if playing fairly well and if we have injury issues. Or indeed McCallum. If some of the loanees come back in great shape, it will also be a good reflection of this window's activity.

I'd be more disappointed that we've not got rid of Drmic or Leitner. We know those two can't make the step up, but no-one wanted to give them their next shot.

[Jerrykerry 223]

It's almost as if every other team in the division has a full squad and never had injuries or has to play cover players. 

Just Norwich apparently. 

Get real and grow up. This constant whining about luxuries is pathetic. 

 

[TIL 1010 4,737]

36 minutes ago, Jerrykerry said:

It's almost as if every other team in the division has a full squad and never had injuries or has to play cover players. 

Just Norwich apparently. 

Get real and grow up. This constant whining about luxuries is pathetic. 

 

I don't call having three CB's including two who are injury prone a luxury. Maybe you could name a club in this division who have that stat on their books ?

[Capt. Pants 4,224]

22 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

I don't call having three CB's including two who are injury prone a luxury. Maybe you could name a club in this division who have that stat on their books ?

Swansea signed two centre backs yesterday.

The games (at last) now start to come thick and fast. We will see who has the best balanced squad.

2 hours ago, Jerrykerry said:

Wanting more cover does not mean you don't rate what's there. 

If he wanted another attacking midfielder that would mean he doesn't rate buendia with your logic. 

So Farke had all transfer window to sort out the defence yet we find ourselves with 3 centre halfs and one left back. To me, with Farke blabbing to the media (again) that he wanted another centre half suggests that he does not have confidence in what we have left the club in terms of specialist in that position or square pegs. The proof will be in the pudding and our league position at the end of the season.

[chicken 2,624]

At the start of the window I think people, if honest, would have been happy with keeping hold of 3 out of 6 players in Pukki, Aarons, Godfrey, Lewis, Buendia and Cantwell.

Sadly we lost Godfrey and Lewis. And we also lost Klose.

The positive to that is we brought in the best part of £50million for the pair of them. We also brought in Dowell who looked really promising before his injury, Placheta who has already hit the ground running, literally, Mumba who also looks promising, Hugill who adds real threat to our forward line, Gibson who mitigates somewhat the loss of Godfrey as well as others for the future and yet to play in Sorenson, Sinani, Siti, Matthews and Soto.

The only area we genuinely in need of a player is CB. The others are covered for the most part. 

[rock bus 851]

12 minutes ago, chicken said:

At the start of the window I think people, if honest, would have been happy with keeping hold of 3 out of 6 players in Pukki, Aarons, Godfrey, Lewis, Buendia and Cantwell.

Sadly we lost Godfrey and Lewis. And we also lost Klose.

The positive to that is we brought in the best part of £50million for the pair of them. We also brought in Dowell who looked really promising before his injury, Placheta who has already hit the ground running, literally, Mumba who also looks promising, Hugill who adds real threat to our forward line, Gibson who mitigates somewhat the loss of Godfrey as well as others for the future and yet to play in Sorenson, Sinani, Siti, Matthews and Soto.

The only area we genuinely in need of a player is CB. The others are covered for the most part. 

I agree and out of the 6 Lewis and Godfrey are the two I am least concerned about losing (although I would’ve liked to see us sign another back up cb).

if the players we’ve bought can hit a bit of form and confidence can grow throughout the team we can definitely make the top 2.

it’d be nice to have an exciting season after last years disappointment 

[chicken 2,624]

1 hour ago, TIL 1010 said:

I don't call having three CB's including two who are injury prone a luxury. Maybe you could name a club in this division who have that stat on their books ?

Two injury prone CB's?

Can we please just stop with this rediculous myth.

This is Zimmermanns 4th season with us.

2017-18: 45 appearances.
2018-19: 45 appearances.
2019-20: 20 appearances.

Lets not forget, last season wasn't an injury related to something like a persistant problem. It was due to a very harsh challenge from Haller which could/should have seen red.

Saying he is injury prone is just plain ridiculous. I used to rate you Til, but coming back on here recently and seeing this sort of thing... I didn't have you down as someone who just joined in with the baying without thought.

[TIL 1010 4,737]

6 minutes ago, chicken said:

Two injury prone CB's?

Can we please just stop with this rediculous myth.

This is Zimmermanns 4th season with us.

2017-18: 45 appearances.
2018-19: 45 appearances.
2019-20: 20 appearances.

Lets not forget, last season wasn't an injury related to something like a persistant problem. It was due to a very harsh challenge from Haller which could/should have seen red.

Saying he is injury prone is just plain ridiculous. I used to rate you Til, but coming back on here recently and seeing this sort of thing... I didn't have you down as someone who just joined in with the baying without thought.

Last season he played 17 Premier games so less than 50% and here he is out through injury again within a handfull of games this season so i will stick with him being injury prone.

Edited October 17, 2020 by TIL 1010

[Il Pirata 249]

5 hours ago, TheGunnShow said:

Can't really legislate for the injuries. Gibson's looked promising but then again, we thought Duda looked good after his first game so we'd better wait and see. I'd agree that Cantwell and Buendia need to find form, but they should find it easier in the Championship - especially Buendia. What we're seeing is a somewhat remodelled team trying to play its way back into form, and there are definite signs that it's slowly coming to.

Much to our surprise, we've kept Buendia and Aarons as well. That's a big partnership down the right. I really need to see more of a couple of the others, namely Hugill and Sorensen, assuming Gibson keeps his form. On top of that, there's also the matter of what form some of the loanees bring. I have said before as it's a strong suspicion of mine, that one of Famewo or Bushiri may get brought back if playing fairly well and if we have injury issues. Or indeed McCallum. If some of the loanees come back in great shape, it will also be a good reflection of this window's activity.

I'd be more disappointed that we've not got rid of Drmic or Leitner. We know those two can't make the step up, but no-one wanted to give them their next shot.

Do we? I think Leitner has proven is more than good enough to be starting. Good post though. 

I had, and still have, high hopes for McCallum. Very surprised we let him go on loan. Quintilla seems to be another Pinto for me, decent going forward but weak defensively. I think from what I've seen so far, I'd have preferred McCallum to be playing instead. 

[chicken 2,624]

2 hours ago, TIL 1010 said:

Last season he played 17 Premier games so less than 50% and here he is out through injury again within a handfull of games this season so i will stick with him being injury prone.

Out for a week. And like I said, had a serious injury caused by an awful tackle from Haller last season. And then being rushed back due to having no other fit CB's. 

I do wonder how you would look on some of the bobbies out there today comparing someone struggling with an injury received on the front line but referring to them as a sicknote.

Your judgement is pretty poor on this one Til it really is. He's had one season of bad injury. Two solid seasons before that and misses one game and all of a sudden he is injury prone. Doesn't even meet the criteria. 

[TheGunnShow 5,937]

19 minutes ago, Il Pirata said:

Do we? I think Leitner has proven is more than good enough to be starting. Good post though. 

I had, and still have, high hopes for McCallum. Very surprised we let him go on loan. Quintilla seems to be another Pinto for me, decent going forward but weak defensively. I think from what I've seen so far, I'd have preferred McCallum to be playing instead. 

I don't think Leitner stepped up too well in the Premiership, although he had a couple of decent shows before it. Agree re. Quintilla. Hits a tasty line in set pieces and crosses when forward, but can see why they let him out on loan. 

[aquilesopkarg 0]

On 16/10/2020 at 15:40, Branston Pickle said:

Given that we have pretty much been told we are ‘going with what we’ve got’, how do people feel the transfer window went - particularly given the poor Windows of last season?

Although I’m asking the question, I can’t help but be a bit on the fence on it.  There’s certainly good points in that we’ve brought in a number of players, some of whom are good enough to press for a first-team start, and we got them in good and early: that was a fantastic start.  Since then we’ve done the inevitable and sold a couple of our better players - fewer than many thought we’d do, so far so very good.  Nox Vidmate VLC

The problem is that for me we have also made what seems to be some strange decisions in letting players go on loan leaving our defence undoubtedly weakened/low on numbers.  Injuries are inevitable, and we have a long slog of 18 games before the window opens again, so I can’t help but think we need to rely on dropping lucky more than we should.  Hopefully we can keep players fit and start to kick-on.   If we can, we will be well set, but there is that niggly feeling that our Achilles heel, defence/conceding too many goals, will continue to be an issue.

What sort of quality of player would you get under that criteria?  It's either a player past their best who is prepared to just be backup or an up and coming player who is prepared to bide their time.  Maybe the club feel they have the latter in the u23s already, I don't know.

Edited October 26, 2020 by aquilesopkarg

[Haus 259]

On 17/10/2020 at 14:45, chicken said:

At the start of the window I think people, if honest, would have been happy with keeping hold of 3 out of 6 players in Pukki, Aarons, Godfrey, Lewis, Buendia and Cantwell.

Sadly we lost Godfrey and Lewis. And we also lost Klose.

The positive to that is we brought in the best part of £50million for the pair of them. We also brought in Dowell who looked really promising before his injury, Placheta who has already hit the ground running, literally, Mumba who also looks promising, Hugill who adds real threat to our forward line, Gibson who mitigates somewhat the loss of Godfrey as well as others for the future and yet to play in Sorenson, Sinani, Siti, Matthews and Soto.

The only area we genuinely in need of a player is CB. The others are covered for the most part. 

Id like a bit more cover at LB too. 

[Trevor Hockey's Beard 526]

I think they were a bit caught between a rock and a hard place where Cbs were concerned : we have an immediate need for cover, but they would be championship standard ( Would a higher standard player agree to come and be a cover player?), but were we to get promoted we would need a higher standard of player. There was probably a reluctance to risk having another championship standard player on our books in the Prem. 

[Tetteys Jig 830]

On 17/10/2020 at 10:35, PurpleCanary said:

One centre-back away from a 9.5 window but otherwise I agree, and it may be Sorensen for one can play there. Some posters seem still not to understand the hit the finances are taking from covid.

when it is hitting every other club then its all relative though. Perhaps we have benefitted from our rivals not being able to strengthen as much as they'd like as well?

Until we properly see Sorenson its hard to fully judge but we do feel light at centre back, especially after last season and Zimmermann and Hanleys known struggles. I get why we haven't gone out and spent big on someone who in all likelihood wouldn't have been needed that much though, just surprised we sent out both Famewo and McCallum. Perhaps this Irish fella with the long name is good enough to be considered back up... be good to see him make the bench as I don't think Tettey is ever the answer at CB as much as I love him

[daly 501]

Poor

Centre backs ???

Strikers ???

Full back cover. ??? 

[PurpleCanary 5,556]

15 minutes ago, Tetteys Jig said:

when it is hitting every other club then its all relative though. Perhaps we have benefitted from our rivals not being able to strengthen as much as they'd like as well?

Until we properly see Sorenson its hard to fully judge but we do feel light at centre back, especially after last season and Zimmermann and Hanleys known struggles. I get why we haven't gone out and spent big on someone who in all likelihood wouldn't have been needed that much though, just surprised we sent out both Famewo and McCallum. Perhaps this Irish fella with the long name is good enough to be considered back up... be good to see him make the bench as I don't think Tettey is ever the answer at CB as much as I love him

A fair point, but we don't have a mega-rich owner to bail us out in an emergency. We always have to err financially on the side of caution.

[sgncfc 1,227]

To go back to the OP. We had a fantastic window. Of course the overall squad is weaker - coming down from a higher quality league means that is pretty obviously going to apply if we sell anyone - but only slightly. Lewis is a better fullback than Quintilla but whilst Godfrey is a better footballer than Gibson, Gibson is a much better centre back. We've really only lost those two from our first choice 11.

Getting £25m+ for Godfrey was an absolute master stroke and more than pays Everton back for the Naismith deal. £15m for Lewis was about right, but I still think he'll struggle to adjust. If we could have got £20m plus for either Buendia or Cantwell I'd have bitten their hand off, so it could have been a slightly better window in that respect.

Glad we kept Aarons. The acquisitions of Mumba, Dowell and Hugill as well as Gibson mean that the squad is more Championship focussed and we will have too much quality for most teams.