Cantwell

[Alex Moss 2,165]

1 hour ago, Capt. Pants said:

I'm not sure it was particularly smart. I did say at the time I didn't agree with Farke going public and I still don't. The 'best price' window for Todd (and Emi) has now closed and if we do now sell it will be at lower numbers than we were originally getting excited about. If we don't sell at all then we could have one or two disruptive influence players on the books.

Interesting item on 5 Live this morning with Chris Latchem saying how clubs are using social media to check out how supporters feel about their own players so they can suss out what they are actually buying. Jesse Lingaad was the example used but I wouldn't have thought the backlash against Cantwell on here helped, or being slagged off by your own manager!! 

Farke was just trying to slap down a bit of player power and so far it's back-fired.

Don’t think the ‘best price window’ actually has closed for Todd. Reason being there has been nothing to say there has been any interest from abroad - everything points to the interest being solely from domestic clubs. If worst comes to the worst, then he will be an elite player in a small pool available for any Premier League club that become desperate. So I think it’s worked very much in our favour to be honest.

Personally I would love to see Todd stay here, and sign a new contract. A quick goal and assist for instance against Rotherham would soon see the vast majority of fans swing back in his direction. It’d all be history, just like when another number 14 had a moment here several years back.

I hope he stays.

[ged in the onion bag 855]

14 minutes ago, Yorkshire Canary said:

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, the people who have been far from impressed by his attitude are entitled to theirs, that he has talent is not in dispute, He is a valuable asset and if he/we are not careful he will become a depreciating asset, Godfrey and Aarons have been prime examples of dignified respectful professionals, Cantwell has not. Farke is not the type of manager to criticize players without good cause, indeed he is brilliant at developing and nurturing younger players. Cantwell would do well to copy the respected professionals at the club rather than trying to emulate Oliveira

Must admit I tend to base my opinions on facts.     It is my view, that people who base opinions on hearsay are fools.... only my opinion.    

[Mello Yello 2,289]

Why give Todd an improved contract and extra money?....He'll only waste it on Haribo, ice-cream and panda pops......

[lake district canary 4,531]

Todd needs to keep his feet on the ground, listen to the right people - because rightly or wrongly I feel his agent is not helping him. He needs mentoring - and I think that in both Emi and Todd's cases, this is what Daniel is doing - being the tough cop when he needs to be and spelling it out to them.  Emi has been mentioned two or three times over his time here as being not quite focussed and each time Emi has responded - now it is Cantwell's turn to show that.  He needs to listen to his manager and think less about himself, his looks and his image - that isn't old fartism to say so, or just targeted at Todd - it could apply to everyone growing up - but for a footballer, to be great, you have to put your football first - the rest is just frippery.

[PurpleCanary 5,557]

42 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

There is no suggestion that anyone has 'kicked off' or 'throwing their toys out of the pram'. Farke has just stated that Cantwell and Buendia dropped in their training levels and had lost focus. While Farke has been very public in explaining why Cantwell missed two games, he has also been very clear that there is no blame on the player and that this is something to be expected when there is intense transfer speculation.

You can understand Cantwell being the most keen to get a move as he is probably on the worst contract out of all the 'crown jewels' - he is probably on a lower contract than many of the new signings also when you consider he signed his contract before he had his major breakthrough into the starting XI. 

There is still a good chance he does leave Norwich before the 16th as when Premier League clubs look at the Championship for potential signings Cantwell will stand out for his ability and the fact he would be significantly cheaper than players like Sarr, Cook, Brooks and even Buendia.

Not sure about this, Bethnal. In practical terms, whatever the precise reason for the poor performance in training, there was no difference to the action Farke felt he had to take. And with Cantwell he had not got over it in the way presumably Buendia had, so that he was missing for a second game.

With the window being open for nearly two weeks there is a fair chance he is still not gong to have his mind focused enough to be selected. To an amateur outsider this so far just looks like a lack of professionalism. It is not as if he is 18 or 19.

[ged in the onion bag 855]

1 minute ago, PurpleCanary said:

Not sure about this, Bethnal. In practical terms, whatever the precise reason for the poor performance in training, there was no difference to the action Farke felt he had to take. And with Cantwell he had not got over it in the way presumably Buendia had, so that he was missing for a second game.

With the window being open for nearly two weeks there is a fair chance he is still not gong to have his mind focused enough to be selected. To an amateur outsider this so far just looks like a lack of professionalism. It is not as if he is 18 or 19.

but we don't know the full story so why not stay positive and give him the benefit of any doubt until we know otherwise.......

[Mello Yello 2,289]

12 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

I'm sorry Yorkshire but this is pie in the sky stuff. Nobody on here knows anything about his attitude other than what we have read in the media. As Bethnal has said above Farke has just said that he hasn't been as focussed as he should have been in training and that that's understandable given the circumstances. Cantwell played the first two games of the season - and whilst he wasn't brilliant, he wasn't terrible either and nobody with any common sense claimed he wasn't putting in the effort in those games.

It seems to me that what it boils down to is that a handful of loud mouthed morons and reactionary old farts don't like his hair, the fact he sometimes wears gloves and that he posts the same sort of things on social media that a huge number of other youngsters his age do nowadays. 

 

I admire Todd as a player but to call him a youngster? He's 23 in five months and hardly a confused Kevin & Perry type acne addled teenager..... 

[The Real Buh 3,432]

It’s up to him. Simple choice really. Do you want to play football or not?

[Thirsty Lizard 3,161]

9 minutes ago, Mello Yello said:

I admire Todd as a player but to call him a youngster? He's 23 in five months and hardly a confused Kevin & Perry type acne addled teenager..... 

Good grief it's all relative........... I'm 56 so he's very much a youngster in my eyes. I was referring to the stuff that 'youngsters' of his age post on social media. There's tens of millions of people in their early 20s around the world who post this sort of stuff on social media. 

[hogesar 9,658]

14 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Not sure about this, Bethnal. In practical terms, whatever the precise reason for the poor performance in training, there was no difference to the action Farke felt he had to take. And with Cantwell he had not got over it in the way presumably Buendia had, so that he was missing for a second game.

With the window being open for nearly two weeks there is a fair chance he is still not gong to have his mind focused enough to be selected. To an amateur outsider this so far just looks like a lack of professionalism. It is not as if he is 18 or 19.

It's hard to read too much into it. Farke has very high standards - and he isn't shy from being openly critical. He was similar with Josh Murphy, who came in from the cold eventually.

[lake district canary 4,531]

1 minute ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

8 minutes ago, Mello Yello said:

I admire Todd as a player but to call him a youngster? He's 23 in five months and hardly a confused Kevin & Perry type acne addled teenager..... 

Good grief it's all relative........... I'm 56 so he's very much a youngster in my eyes. I was referring to the stuff that 'youngsters' of his age post on social media. There's tens of millions of people in their early 20s around the world who post this sort of stuff on social media. 

Sad isn't it. The facebook/social media generation, I mean. Trying to present their lives to look wonderful to everyone else, falsely in many cases - and having the effect of making some others feel inadequate because they don't think they are having as great a time.

[Alex Moss 2,165]

What Todd did or didn’t do, I guess we’ll never know. All we really know is he didn’t apply himself correctly in order to wear the yellow shirt at that particular moment in time. But Farke’s been quite balanced about the situation I feel, and was very quick to point out that he loves Todd and knows this transfer game is enough to mess with anyone’s head. I still think, sadly in my opinion, he will be sold, but I live in hope that this isn’t the case and he can get back to putting in some of the kind of performances that most of us with good eyesight are aware he’s very very capable of. A bit of support wouldn’t go amiss, he clearly wears his heart on his sleeve, and what haircut he’s exhibiting really shouldn’t matter one jot.

From what I hear, it was Todd that instigated phonecalls from the players to some of the older and more vulnerable supporters during lockdown. If that’s the case, it speaks volumes.

[Mello Yello 2,289]

3 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

Good grief it's all relative........... I'm 56 so he's very much a youngster in my eyes. I was referring to the stuff that 'youngsters' of his age post on social media. There's tens of millions of people in their early 20s around the world who post this sort of stuff on social media. 

I disagree that he's a youngster....I think (like me) he'd also probably disagree with you calling him a youngster.....Why not contact him on social media and call him a 'youngster'? I wonder what his reply would be?....Although maybe to some of our more mature support, they seem to think he may be behaving like one.....on occasion.....

[BroadstairsR 2,163]

True, AM, he is being rather over-vilified, and most of it seems to be concerned with bands and haircuts.

What else do we know about the situation apart from DF's comments concerning application in training? This could mean anything.

A bout of hiccups may be under the circumstances, but it need not necessarily be turned into the full St. Vitus dance by us keyboard warriers. 

Edited October 6, 2020 by BroadstairsR

[ged in the onion bag 855]

 

25 minutes ago, Bonzo said:

Any Manager or Sporting Director viewing his latest social media message with the "positive movements" quote would have to conclude;

1. The guy needs to grow up.

2. He needs to put a shirt on.

3. The "positive movements" might refer to an offer.Or.... 

4. Perhaps he's just got over a nasty bout of constipation and he needs to up his fibre intake.

5. He's not playing on Saturday because he's still got his head is stuck up his own rear end.

I'm not sure the posting was well judged at all. We could have done with him playing on Saturday.

Why not just train hard and be the model pro? Surely that would be the better way to get a move if he really wants one. 

Perhaps he did train hard, was a model pro, but so were 20 others and perhaps Farke having criticised his lack of goals and assists recently is just giving Todd a bit more time to rest and dwell on things before bringing him back in.    Perhaps Cantwell's ommission against Derby was entirely down to Farke and nothing to do with Cantwells efforts.    Of course this is hearsay but very possibly the case.     So is the rest of your comment fair?     

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557]

28 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Not sure about this, Bethnal. In practical terms, whatever the precise reason for the poor performance in training, there was no difference to the action Farke felt he had to take. And with Cantwell he had not got over it in the way presumably Buendia had, so that he was missing for a second game.

With the window being open for nearly two weeks there is a fair chance he is still not gong to have his mind focused enough to be selected. To an amateur outsider this so far just looks like a lack of professionalism. It is not as if he is 18 or 19.

Farke's comments after the Derby game suggested Buendia was only back in the team as he was needed to try and win the game, rather than because he'd shown any great improvements in training. Buendia has always been slightly exempt from the rules Farke seems to hold others by (which is probably rightly so when he is so clearly talented and delivered regularly)

Farke has always been a bit hardline about giving players time and shutting down young players. Todd's behaviour probably isn't perfect, but the noise from media around the club isn't one of Todd downing tools or refusing to play but more one of Farke sending a message that he wants fully focused players. There are no more games while the window is open so hopefully from the Rotherham game onwards there is a nice clean sheet for everyone.

[Uncle Fred 526]

Leeds have spent a heck of an amount of money not sure how much there is left in the kitty for them to be able to afford our valuation of cantwell

i see the likes of palace etc the more likely destination 

[Mello Yello 2,289]

Southampton, Palace, Burnley, West Brom, Fulham and maybe Sheff Utd....Does anyone think that they would be interested or have the necessary finance to purchase Todd?....

[king canary 7,604]

18 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

Farke's comments after the Derby game suggested Buendia was only back in the team as he was needed to try and win the game, rather than because he'd shown any great improvements in training. Buendia has always been slightly exempt from the rules Farke seems to hold others by (which is probably rightly so when he is so clearly talented and delivered regularly)

Farke has always been a bit hardline about giving players time and shutting down young players. Todd's behaviour probably isn't perfect, but the noise from media around the club isn't one of Todd downing tools or refusing to play but more one of Farke sending a message that he wants fully focused players. There are no more games while the window is open so hopefully from the Rotherham game onwards there is a nice clean sheet for everyone.

I'm probably alone but if Cantwell is keen to move I wouldn't hugely blame him.

Webber clearly took a bit of a dig at the end of last season about 'staying on the pitch for the cameras.'

Farke has now singled him out publicly and obviously made his attitude the big story for two weeks in a row.

This, combined with the often OTT criticism from fans via social media, probably doesn't make him feel the most welcome or valued at this point.

[Block Y Seat 176 80]

1 hour ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

Maybe this saga will end with him signing a new improved contract...................................

I was thinking exactly the same thing👍

[nutty nigel 7,531]

That would be a great result.👍

[Alex Moss 2,165]

Would be a great result if he signed a new contract!

But totally agree with @king canary - I think he’d have to feel the love a bit more from some sections of the support in order for that to happen. As I said before, balanced criticism aimed at him is one thing, and I have no doubt that Todd has no problem with that either - every supporter is entitled to their thoughts. Childish abuse* is another, and I wouldn’t blame him at all if he thought enough was enough. Let’s hope he can rise above that.

 

*waits for somebody to tell me that’s ok because he’s a public figure and has a social media account

[Bonzo 198]

46 minutes ago, ged in the onion bag said:

 

Perhaps he did train hard, was a model pro, but so were 20 others and perhaps Farke having criticised his lack of goals and assists recently is just giving Todd a bit more time to rest and dwell on things before bringing him back in.    Perhaps Cantwell's ommission against Derby was entirely down to Farke and nothing to do with Cantwells efforts.    Of course this is hearsay but very possibly the case.     So is the rest of your comment fair?     

Farke is on record as saying Cantwell wasn't selected at Bournemouth because his head wasn't in the right place. Cantwell is one of our best players and a senior squad member. My assumption is that he'd be in the match day squad for Derby barring injury or a continuation of the previous issues, particularly with Dowell and Placheta out.

I might be wrong but Farke hasn't said he's injured and he is unlikely to have dropped him due to his ability.  So a reasonable conclusion is that for whatever reason Cantwell still wasn't in the right frame of mind to be selected for the Derby game.

I just though his social media post was foolish. Maybe it wasn't. Maybe it was a work of great philosophical depth that went right over my head. 

 

[PurpleCanary 5,557]

59 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

Farke's comments after the Derby game suggested Buendia was only back in the team as he was needed to try and win the game, rather than because he'd shown any great improvements in training. Buendia has always been slightly exempt from the rules Farke seems to hold others by (which is probably rightly so when he is so clearly talented and delivered regularly)

Farke has always been a bit hardline about giving players time and shutting down young players. Todd's behaviour probably isn't perfect, but the noise from media around the club isn't one of Todd downing tools or refusing to play but more one of Farke sending a message that he wants fully focused players. There are no more games while the window is open so hopefully from the Rotherham game onwards there is a nice clean sheet for everyone.

Bethnal, not sure that reassures me much!😜

[Nuff Said 5,129]

1 hour ago, Mello Yello said:

Why give Todd an improved contract and extra money?....He'll only waste it on Haribo, ice-cream and panda pops......

First thing he should do with it is buy a shirt! Then a haircut. 😉

[ged in the onion bag 855]

36 minutes ago, Bonzo said:

Farke is on record as saying Cantwell wasn't selected at Bournemouth because his head wasn't in the right place. Cantwell is one of our best players and a senior squad member. My assumption is that he'd be in the match day squad for Derby barring injury or a continuation of the previous issues, particularly with Dowell and Placheta out.

I might be wrong but Farke hasn't said he's injured and he is unlikely to have dropped him due to his ability.  So a reasonable conclusion is that for whatever reason Cantwell still wasn't in the right frame of mind to be selected for the Derby game.

I just though his social media post was foolish. Maybe it wasn't. Maybe it was a work of great philosophical depth that went right over my head. 

 

But that’s exactly the point.... your assumption was.....!     Doesn’t mean you are right but it’s what far to many on here use to form their ‘opinion’ rather than to use facts, e.g the quote ‘he’s downed tools’.    Point being, why be critical at all in the absence of facts.    If people who make comments on here don’t know for sure best not be so critical.   Especially when it concerns our own players who (in the absence of the truth (facts), we as fans should be more loyal too.   

[BroadstairsR 2,163]

1 hour ago, Alex Moss said:

Would be a great result if he signed a new contract!

But totally agree with @king canary - I think he’d have to feel the love a bit more from some sections of the support in order for that to happen. As I said before, balanced criticism aimed at him is one thing, and I have no doubt that Todd has no problem with that either - every supporter is entitled to their thoughts. Childish abuse* is another, and I wouldn’t blame him at all if he thought enough was enough. Let’s hope he can rise above that.

 

*waits for somebody to tell me that’s ok because he’s a public figure and has a social media account

I keep agreeing with you AM.

Todd Cantwell has been slaughtered on this forum by some people. I don't do Twitter, but get the impression that it has been even worse.

A successful young man with a prosperous career ahead of him who often exhibits the traits associated with his age range. That these are often silly and trite  should be irrelevant eg. Alice band, expansive hairstyles, because at the end of the day he is a footballer who plays for NCFC.

Criticism of him should be confined to his performances on the field of play, within reason. 

Edited October 6, 2020 by BroadstairsR

[hogesar 9,658]

1 hour ago, king canary said:

I'm probably alone but if Cantwell is keen to move I wouldn't hugely blame him.

Webber clearly took a bit of a dig at the end of last season about 'staying on the pitch for the cameras.'

Farke has now singled him out publicly and obviously made his attitude the big story for two weeks in a row.

This, combined with the often OTT criticism from fans via social media, probably doesn't make him feel the most welcome or valued at this point.

To be fair yeah, from his viewpoint you couldn't blame him, especially if despite all the things listed above you're wanted by a club in a league above.

[king canary 7,604]

1 hour ago, Alex Moss said:

Would be a great result if he signed a new contract!

But totally agree with @king canary - I think he’d have to feel the love a bit more from some sections of the support in order for that to happen. As I said before, balanced criticism aimed at him is one thing, and I have no doubt that Todd has no problem with that either - every supporter is entitled to their thoughts. Childish abuse* is another, and I wouldn’t blame him at all if he thought enough was enough. Let’s hope he can rise above that.

 

*waits for somebody to tell me that’s ok because he’s a public figure and has a social media account

I think it would be easier to take the fan criticism if you feel like your club is backing you.

Instead he's getting it a bit from both sides. I can imagine him thinking 'hang on, I've been here since I was a kid, I've worked my way up to being one of the best performers in the team last season yet I'm getting constant stick, why should I stay?'

[Bonzo 198]

18 minutes ago, ged in the onion bag said:

But that’s exactly the point.... your assumption was.....!     Doesn’t mean you are right but it’s what far to many on here use to form their ‘opinion’ rather than to use facts, e.g the quote ‘he’s downed tools’.    Point being, why be critical at all in the absence of facts.    If people who make comments on here don’t know for sure best not be so critical.   Especially when it concerns our own players who (in the absence of the truth (facts), we as fans should be more loyal too.   

This entire forum is based on speculation and opinion. 

I have at no point suggested that Cantwell has downed tools. I have simply stated what the known facts are (statements by the manager, team selection and social media posts made by the player) and used these as the basis for my comments. 

Why do you think Cantwell wasn't selected for the Derby game? Personally I don't think it was because he's not good enough to make the side.

This leads to an obvious conclusion given the manager's recent comments. 

We don't know it's a duck for sure. But if it's got webbed feet and goes quack, it probably is.

Edited October 6, 2020 by Bonzo