New Tory Leader

[Pyro Pete 1,891]

 

[Big Vince 318]

8 hours ago, sonyc said:

Looks like you're right. And maybe I'm wrong. His odds were 8.6 yesterday and are now around 2.4 (decimals rather than old-fashioned odds). Sunak is only just around evens (2.0) as the slight favourite.

Would Tory MPs actually decide to vote for him? He has lied and has broken rules and over 50 of his own party resigned over his handling of a sexual assault. Do they actually think he is good for the country or good for their electoral chances? Or both? Do they want him to win so that he then has to resign again and go to a GE and lose leaving the mess to Labour? Or do you think MPs only think of their seats?

 

It's like a bad dream for me. Waking up to this story is so depressing. I've wondered whether I am simply out of step with the country because I cannot fathom why any party would even contemplate having someone like him back.

 

That's why I may simply don't fit in to what the country thinks. I realise there are a few on this thread who feel like me - thank god. But I'm worried this cohort make up a tiny minority. It's a comfort to post views amongst like-minded people after all.

 

I'm asking you Ricardo because you've found him amusing in the past and secondly, you're squarely behind the Brexit that Conservative voters tell TV interviewers Johnson delivered (so-called 'getting it done'). Am I so out of kilter with public opinion? So many TV box pops keep talking about "Boris" as if he is their friend. Whatever he has done doesn't feel to me important to them. Trump said he could shoot someone on fifth avenue and get voted in. Johnson seems the same? Are there ANY circumstances where you'd turn against him? Is my moral compass out of kilter? 

 

Watching QT last night I felt there was a lot of people who were like me though. But it's a rare experience. Maybe I need to leave the country and find somewhere that feels more sympathetic to the needs of the majority of people!

 

Lots of questions - maybe you've not got the answers either - but I'm genuinely confused and dispirited actually. Has the country moved so far to the right in the last few years? I want to ask right of centre people like you to try and understand rather than get agreement from an echo chamber of my own views.

The trouble is we are governed by a generation of political pygmies. No one has any stature or the complete skill set to be PM.  

The political class has acted like a circus troupe for some years now and it would therefore be fitting if they all gathered in Downing Street for a self-immolation contest.

If Mr Fawkes had succeeded we wouldn't have had all this.

[Well b back 3,201]

BBC trying to big Boris up, ITV trying to destroy him.

[Well b back 3,201]

British politics rarely troubles the front pages of international media.

But in the last few days, all eyes have turned towards Liz Truss's short tenure in Number 10.

"A textbook example of what happens when political ideologues are let off the leash, allowed to shut out anyone with opposing views and given the keys to the kingdom," argues Rob Harris in Australia's Sydney Morning Herald.

"Britain ruled India for 200 years, but see the twist of fate," says an anchor on India's Aaj Tak TV channel. 

Closer to home, France's Le Monde points the finger at Brexit, asking:

Quote Message: What happened to British politics, to its reputation of stability and moderation, its venerable parliament, buffeted by accelerated convulsions since Brexit?" 

What happened to British politics, to its reputation of stability and moderation, its venerable parliament, buffeted by accelerated convulsions since Brexit?"

 

 

The UK and its institutions have traditionally been revered on the continent. But its parliament has been a "madhouse" since the Brexit vote, says German paper, Die Welt.

 

 

[sonyc 5,511]

16 minutes ago, Well b back said:

British politics rarely troubles the front pages of international media.

But in the last few days, all eyes have turned towards Liz Truss's short tenure in Number 10.

"A textbook example of what happens when political ideologues are let off the leash, allowed to shut out anyone with opposing views and given the keys to the kingdom," argues Rob Harris in Australia's Sydney Morning Herald.

"Britain ruled India for 200 years, but see the twist of fate," says an anchor on India's Aaj Tak TV channel. 

Closer to home, France's Le Monde points the finger at Brexit, asking:

Quote Message: What happened to British politics, to its reputation of stability and moderation, its venerable parliament, buffeted by accelerated convulsions since Brexit?" 

What happened to British politics, to its reputation of stability and moderation, its venerable parliament, buffeted by accelerated convulsions since Brexit?"

 

 

The UK and its institutions have traditionally been revered on the continent. But its parliament has been a "madhouse" since the Brexit vote, says German paper, Die Welt.

 

 

The Dutch view today...

 

 

[Icecream Snow 761]

 

[Wings of a Sparrow 1,414]

I wonder what today will bring. Apart from Boris on his white steed, flying in to save the day.

[kick it off 1,948]

1 hour ago, Wings of a Sparrow said:

I wonder what today will bring. Apart from Boris on his white steed, flying in to save the day.

Bbc news had this picture of him on holiday (whilst parliament are sitting, clearly they dont have enough paid holidays). Most notable thing about it is he has combed his hair. Almost as if that messy, ruffled look is something that is cultivated and coiffured as part of some public image related nonsense. How do people buy into this when he's so transparent?

There is little that is more on brand for that ****, than dereliction of duty as an mp to **** off to the Caribbean, 2 months after ****ing off on holiday whilst PM, followed by a mad dash back when he has a whiff of a power grab.

[Yellow Fever 3,767]

18 hours ago, ricardo said:

 

You can't label Boris as either left or right of the party, Boris is just Boris and he will do whatever works for him and whatever is to his personal advantage. The average man in the sreet would rather have a pint in the pub with him than with SKS but that doesn't  make him suited to be PM.  Women seem appalled by his lax sexual morals yet seem strangely attracted to him.

Boris is a complex character but when surrounded by competent people he got things done as mayor of London. He was instrumental in breaking the Brexit  log-jam and seeing off Corbyn but his laziness and inattention to detail made him unsuited for the PM job. 

As I commented upthread, my advice to the 1922 Committee would be to give him the Luca Brasi treatment. "Sorry Boris, nothing personal, but these men are now going to take you for a little drive."

There is absolutely  nothing wrong with your moral compass SONYC although it is arguably of limited use in the dirty game of politics. As you will note from the previous paragraph there are just some situations where it doesn't  apply.

I have lived long enough to see the political pendulum swing between left and right several times. I expect it will always do so. This is just another swing.

I think, indeed I'm certain, that Johnson suffers from a form of Anti-Social Personality Disorder (ASPD) - he's clearly got socio or psychopathic traits plus narcissism - the lying to all and sundry without a care for the consequences, all about himself and so on. A lack of empathy (yes he's clever and can fool you). All of this can observed both in his chaotic personal and public life - most notably of course when he weighed up what would be to his best personal advantage (in/out) vs Brexit without a care in the world as to the real eventual consequences. Tomorrow is another day.

He is of course now at it again - taking the Tory party for a ride again to suit his, and only his, agenda. More fool them. Mugs.

As to the left/right pendulum swing - the 'time for a change' argument, this time I don't think that's what we are seeing. Simply Johnson's Brexit promises (tell the people what they want to hear & not the reality) are coming undone at the seams. Truss in many ways was right - for 'hard' Brexit to be a success we actually obviously now need much more relaxed immigration (300,000 vacancies now in Care is it) and of course a smaller state, less benefits and less regulation. Most of these are an anathema to the average Brexiter. Given the above fundamental conflict between what is necessary and what is politically possible, most acutely and painfully seen within the Tory party, it's no wonder they are in trouble. Even if Johnson comes back he can't pour his blarney any further over the economic market realities. You break it you own it.

So no, this is not the left /right pendulum swing but a fundamental realignment of British (possibly just English) politics. The real hard consequences of Johnson's Brexit.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Yellow Fever

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

54 minutes ago, kick it off said:

Bbc news had this picture of him on holiday (whilst parliament are sitting, clearly they dont have enough paid holidays). Most notable thing about it is he has combed his hair. Almost as if that messy, ruffled look is something that is cultivated and coiffured as part of some public image related nonsense. How do people buy into this when he's so transparent?

There is little that is more on brand for that ****, than dereliction of duty as an mp to **** off to the Caribbean, 2 months after ****ing off on holiday whilst PM, followed by a mad dash back when he has a whiff of a power grab.

Boris is where the expression "selfie" comes from.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

Sunak needs 73 more to keep that bizarre, egocentric, incapable, backdated, scruffy cnut from being PM again.

[ricardo 7,384]

42 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

I think, indeed I'm certain, that Johnson suffers from a form of Anti-Social Personality Disorder (ASPD) - he's clearly got socio or psychopathic traits plus narcissism - the lying to all and sundry without a care for the consequences, all about himself and so on. A lack of empathy (yes he's clever and can fool you). All of this can observed both in his chaotic personal and public life - most notably of course when he weighed up what would be to his best personal advantage (in/out) vs Brexit without a care in the world as to the real eventual consequences. Tomorrow is another day.

He is of course now at it again 

So no, this is not the left /right pendulum swing but a fundamental realignment of British (possibly just English) politics. The real hard consequences of Johnson's Brexit.

I've seen it so many times I think I've even got the T shirt somewhere. Labour finished, Tories finished, Libs finished etc. No, there will always be a left and a right.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,043]

12 hours ago, Well b back said:

BBC trying to big Boris up, ITV trying to destroy him.

The BBC have a lot to answer for over the past five or so years.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

3 minutes ago, ricardo said:

I've seen it so many times I think I've even got the T shirt somewhere. Labour finished, Tories finished, Libs finished etc. No, there will always be a left and a right.

Thats at least 3 t-shirts. Some wardrobe mate.

[Yellow Fever 3,767]

2 minutes ago, ricardo said:

I've seen it so many times I think I've even got the T shirt somewhere. Labour finished, Tories finished, Libs finished etc. No, there will always be a left and a right.

Yes but this is different - it's between realists and dreamers (or fibbers - the cake an eat it crowd). The realists will always win out in the end because they deal with realities as Truss found out. The argument in the Tory party is between realists and dreamers too!

Nothing to do with the old left/right at present. 

[benchwarmer 625]

Two bits of news:

1.  It is reported that knuckle-dragging Tory grassroots members are threatening to deselect their MPs if they don't back Boris.  These are the same people who chose Liz Truss.  If I was their MP I'd say "Go on then".

2.  The Spanish charter airline the Home Office was going to use to deport refugees to Rwanda has pulled out of the deal.  Sue-Ellen also recorded as saying that her dream was to see a picture on the front of the Telegraph of a full plane taking off from Gatwick.  Repulsive woman.

Edited October 22, 2022 by benchwarmer

[Yellow Fever 3,767]

1 minute ago, benchwarmer said:

Two bits of news:

1.  It is reported that knuckle-dragging Tory grassroots members are threatening to deselect their MPs if they don't back Boris.  These are the same people who chose Liz Truss.  If I was their MP I'd say "Go on then".

I was musing on Rishi - if he loses again despite clearly being the best candidate in the MPs and most independent peoples views (twice) I would be very tempted to resign the whip and make it clear to sit as an independent until the next election however quickly (hint to SKS) that may arrive. After-all how could he (and many others)  possibly remain in a Tory party that voted back in the disgraced Johnson?     

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

14 minutes ago, benchwarmer said:

Two bits of news:

1.  It is reported that knuckle-dragging Tory grassroots members are threatening to deselect their MPs if they don't back Boris.  These are the same people who chose Liz Truss.  If I was their MP I'd say "Go on then".

2.  The Spanish charter airline the Home Office was going to use to deport refugees to Rwanda has pulled out of the deal.  Sue-Ellen also recorded as saying that her dream was to see a picture on the front of the Telegraph of a full plane taking off from Gatwick.  Repulsive woman.

If she has a big enough family, they can all get on the plane and go and live there if its so marvellous.

[ricardo 7,384]

23 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Thats at least 3 t-shirts. Some wardrobe mate.

I've still got a Beatles and Crosby, Stills and Nash T shirt.😉

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

Watching the news this morning had me screaming. Tory idiots saying that Boris is brilliant, he is like one of us, he gives the country a lift and he wants to level up (something I doubt the blue rinse and twin set brigade want).

So they want someone who:

Said he got Brexit done but he hasn't

Said he did marvellous during the pandemic and the first to a vaccine. Sorry Boris, it was our great scientists that did that and you have many thousand extra deaths on your hands for not locking down early enough and moving people from hospital to care homes. And paid millions for an app that never worked properly until they provided a much cheaper one. Ignored the advice for a half term circuit breaker. Didn't quarantine overseas arrivals until June 2020. Too many misappropriations of PPE to list.

Protected Cummings who completely ignored lockdown rules. But sacked him because of his nickname for Carrie. Cummings subsequently, we assume, told us the facts of what went on in Downing Street.

Hardly ever attended COBRA meetings because you were either holidaying in Chequers or writing your book.

Holidayed in Chequers while thousands of people were flooded victims. Didn't even bother to visit the stricken areas.

Attended or allowed parties to take place in his home and then lied that they had taken place and when found out said they had followed the protocols. Fined by the Police.

Kept Nazanin Zaghari Ratcliife in an Iranian Prison for several years more because of your blunder.

Misled the Queen about suspending Parliament.

Lied about who paid for the No10 flat decorations.

Chose a company affiliated to the Conservative Party to administer free school meals. Which they wouldn't have done if it wasn't for a footballer.

Used an algorithm that was completely biased towards private schools for A level students

Promised to build 40 new hospitals but only 3 were brand new builds. The rest were extensions and refurbs.

 

And people think we were better off under this landslide of lies, mistakes and incompetency.

 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

19 minutes ago, ricardo said:

I've still got a Beatles and Crosby, Stills and Nash T shirt.😉

Do they still fit?

[benchwarmer 625]

The Tory membership is full of racists.  That's why Sunak didn't get the job last time despite being the best candidate by a mile.

[Yellow Fever 3,767]

26 minutes ago, benchwarmer said:

The Tory membership is full of racists.  That's why Sunak didn't get the job last time despite being the best candidate by a mile.

I've heard it said (2nd hand to be frank) by a Tory MP ! 

[ricardo 7,384]

54 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Do they still fit?

Fit for dusters according to Mrs R.

[Barry Brockes 147]

Sunak now hardened to 3/10 on Betfair and the fat oaf out to 7/2. Long may that trend continue.

[kick it off 1,948]

[Herman 9,754]

Jesus H Christ.

[Yellow Fever 3,767]

6 minutes ago, kick it off said:

Everybody skeptical. Most know by now never to trust what Johnson or his camp says.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Yellow Fever

[kick it off 1,948]

If he gets in, it will surely be an immediate GE when he cant command a govt?

[Wings of a Sparrow 1,414]

I feeI so helpless about this shtistorm, the only thing I can really do is put my X in the right box when the time comes, and try and not get so angry about it all.