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essex canary

Norwich City Appeal Fund Trust

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An article in today's EDP refers to the above in connection with the passing of a Mr. Peter Sharman.

I suspect that there could be a link between this and the ownership of 10,000 plus of the Clubs Shares.

Does anybody know the history of this Trust and/or, assuming the shares were bought by the clubs supporters in the past, how they will be used for the general benefit of supporters in future particularly bearing in mind it significantly exceeds the Canaries Trust share ownership?

 

 

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The Norwich City Trust was formed in 1957 at a time of financial crisis for the club. Those were the days when fans carried blankets around the ground for the supporters to throw coins in. My good friend the late Roy Blower and Arthur South and many others helped Geoffrey Watling stave off ruin.

That Trust still holds 10,250 shares and at the time of his death Peter Sharman was the trustee and had been for many years i suspect because of his position within Norwich Union. Could there be something in his will to hand over the baton ?

That Trust has no connection with the Canaries Trust formed on 2002.

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9 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

The Norwich City Trust was formed in 1957 at a time of financial crisis for the club. Those were the days when fans carried blankets around the ground for the supporters to throw coins in. My good friend the late Roy Blower and Arthur South and many others helped Geoffrey Watling stave off ruin.

That Trust still holds 10,250 shares and at the time of his death Peter Sharman was the trustee and had been for many years i suspect because of his position within Norwich Union. Could there be something in his will to hand over the baton ?

That Trust has no connection with the Canaries Trust formed on 2002.

Yes, that was one of the two times the club really has come close to administration. The other being 1996, of course.🤓🤩🤓

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Thanks TIL for the informative response. Perhaps it is an issue for the AGM as to how these shares can be assigned to a supporters framework that is known and operative in the modern set up. I think that is quite important in recognition of the excellent efforts of Roy and others back in 1957. 

In a sense perhaps a kind of umbrella supporters setup of the type Cambridge United have would be a good idea. I struggle with the entries on the Canaries website that lists the Canaries Trust next to Canaries in Argentina.

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51 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Yes, that was one of the two times the club really has come close to administration. The other being 1996, of course.🤓🤩🤓

Perhaps you should have a word with the Club and get them to update the Club history section of their website, as they’re mentioning facing the prospect of administration in 2009 following demotion to the third tier 😉

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2 minutes ago, GMF said:

Perhaps you should have a word with the Club and get them to update the Club history section of their website, as they’re mentioning facing the prospect of administration in 2009 following demotion to the third tier 😉

Now you have put the cat among the pigeons .

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10 minutes ago, essex canary said:

Thanks TIL for the informative response. Perhaps it is an issue for the AGM as to how these shares can be assigned to a supporters framework that is known and operative in the modern set up. I think that is quite important in recognition of the excellent efforts of Roy and others back in 1957. 

In a sense perhaps a kind of umbrella supporters setup of the type Cambridge United have would be a good idea. I struggle with the entries on the Canaries website that lists the Canaries Trust next to Canaries in Argentina.

Trust law is highly complex and the operation of a Trust is governed by its Trust Deed and, unless it’s a life Trust, is highly unlikely to be affected by the sad passing of a Trustee. As such, it’s likely to continue with another trustee appointed.

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30 minutes ago, GMF said:

Perhaps you should have a word with the Club and get them to update the Club history section of their website, as they’re mentioning facing the prospect of administration in 2009 following demotion to the third tier 😉

Oh I doubt any poster here would take the club's official-history version over mine...🤓

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Just a point of interest on Trusts as i am involved in one. A Trustee does not own the shares but acts for the beneficiaries. Normally there has to be a minimum of two trustees, so it will be interesting to see who the others are and who the new one/s will be

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1 hour ago, essex canary said:

Thanks TIL for the informative response. Perhaps it is an issue for the AGM as to how these shares can be assigned to a supporters framework that is known and operative in the modern set up. I think that is quite important in recognition of the excellent efforts of Roy and others back in 1957. 

In a sense perhaps a kind of umbrella supporters setup of the type Cambridge United have would be a good idea. I struggle with the entries on the Canaries website that lists the Canaries Trust next to Canaries in Argentina.

Provacative comments🤩 about administrations aside, is this trust with 10,000 shares the same trust as that supposedly charged with keeping an eye on Tom Smith when he takes over, or possibly acting in an interregnum between Smith and Jones departing and him taking over, or is it something else?

As I recall when the handover plan was announced some kind of trust - unspecified - was mentioned as having some kind of roler - also unspecified -  in the process. 

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2 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

Yes, that was one of the two times the club really has come close to administration. The other being 1996, of course.🤓🤩🤓

Pretty close in the 1956/57 when we were close to being kicked out of league through financial difficulties 

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51 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Provacative comments🤩 about administrations aside, is this trust with 10,000 shares the same trust as that supposedly charged with keeping an eye on Tom Smith when he takes over, or possibly acting in an interregnum between Smith and Jones departing and him taking over, or is it something else?

As I recall when the handover plan was announced some kind of trust - unspecified - was mentioned as having some kind of roler - also unspecified -  in the process. 

Totally unrelated Purple as i am sure any Trust related to Tom Smith and his inheritance is nothing more than talk as yet.

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1 hour ago, daly said:

Pretty close in the 1956/57 when we were close to being kicked out of league through financial difficulties 

We also finished bottom around that time and had to seek re-election, and I remember at the time it was said (how true I don’t know) that if we finished bottom again we would have been kicked out. As it happens our on-field performances were about to improve dramatically.

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3 hours ago, GMF said:

Perhaps you should have a word with the Club and get them to update the Club history section of their website, as they’re mentioning facing the prospect of administration in 2009 following demotion to the third tier 😉

Does it say who put up the money in 2009?

We know the blankets and local businesses started the recovery in 1957. And that Geoffrey Watling put up seven figure guarantees to the bank in 1996.

Who was our 2009 saviour?

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4 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

Yes, that was one of the two times the club really has come close to administration. The other being 1996, of course.🤓🤩🤓

Purple . You really should know better at your age. 👴🏻

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1 minute ago, Graham Paddons Beard said:

Purple . You really should know better at your age. 👴🏻

How old is he?🙃

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31 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

 

Who was our 2009 saviour?

Alan Bowkett.

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10 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

But who put up the wonga?

He renegotiated the debts and got a payment holiday agreed for the South Stand.

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, TIL 1010 said:

Totally unrelated Purple as i am sure any Trust related to Tom Smith and his inheritance is nothing more than talk as yet.

So let me get this straight. There is Comrade Sainty's Canaries Trust. Then there is this shadowy 10,000-share Norwich City Football Club Appeal Fund Trust. Then there is this nameless but even more shadowy trust charged with overseeing Tom Smith and making sure he never sells to anyone born outside Norfolk. Or inside, come to that. And then there is the ultra-shadowy Illuminati-style PurpleCanary Trust that actually controls the club through a maze of offshore companies linked to that pesky hotel development. No wonder fans get confused...

Edited by PurpleCanary

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21 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

So let me get this straight. There is Comrade Sainty's Canaries Trust. Then there is this shadowy 10,000-share Norwich City Football Club Appeal Fund Trust. Then there is this nameless but even more shadowy trust charged with overseeing Tom Smith and making sure he never sells to anyone born outside Norfolk. Or inside, some to that. And then there is the ultra-shadowy Illuminati-style PurpleCanary Trust that actually controls the club through a maze of offshore companies linked to that pesky hotel development. No wonder fans get confused...

No confusion at all if you absorb facts over the years and have a grasp of NCFC history Purple. It is what is read and posted by some on here as fact when it is not so that causes the problem.  😜

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12 hours ago, TIL 1010 said:
13 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

Who was our 2009 saviour?

Alan Bowkett.

 

1 hour ago, TIL 1010 said:

He renegotiated the debts and got a payment holiday agreed for the South Stand.

Not so much saviour, more like just a negotiator, surely?    Unless he used his own assets to act as guarantee for the continued overdraft, which I have never seen anywhere. My impression at the time was that the club - or as you say Bowkett - went cap in hand and begged the banks to give us a few more months grace.  Luckily it went well on the pitch so it was never again a problem, but then that was down to Delia and MJW appointing McNally.

 

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7 hours ago, TIL 1010 said:

He renegotiated the debts and got a payment holiday agreed for the South Stand.

What did he take with him to get a holiday to stave off this imminent administration?

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1 hour ago, nutty nigel said:

What did he take with him to get a holiday to stave off this imminent administration?

He took his financial and business nous with him, something that was sadly lacking on the board at that time.

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1 hour ago, TIL 1010 said:

He took his financial and business nous with him, something that was sadly lacking on the board at that time.

No Wonga then?

How come Martin Armstrong had to take Watling's wallet with him. Perhaps he had no nous.

Bet all these other clubs that went into administration wish they'd got hold of this magic nous....

Do you have any to spare?

 

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On 10/08/2020 at 18:23, GMF said:

Perhaps you should have a word with the Club and get them to update the Club history section of their website, as they’re mentioning facing the prospect of administration in 2009 following demotion to the third tier 😉

That's a great find, several members on here recently claimed that we weren't and that Alan Bowkett and David McNally made this up 😉

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Posted (edited)
On 11/08/2020 at 11:00, lake district canary said:

Not so much saviour, more like just a negotiator, surely?    Unless he used his own assets to act as guarantee for the continued overdraft, which I have never seen anywhere. My impression at the time was that the club - or as you say Bowkett - went cap in hand and begged the banks to give us a few more months grace.  Luckily it went well on the pitch so it was never again a problem, but then that was down to Delia and MJW appointing McNally.

It was Alan Bowkett and Nigel Bertram who put the club under pressure to sack Roger Munby and Neil Doncaster to avert us from disaster, prior to his appointment as Chairman.

If he hadn't, the banks wouldn't have given us 'grace', although not sure where you get "a few months" from, it was a complete suspension of payments for a much more substantial period of time. 

Alan Bowkett and Nigel Bertram saved this club. 

 

Dear Roger,

As you know we are respectively the chairman and deputy chairman of NCFC''s Associate Directors Group which is a team of local businessmen and supporters who collectively own approximately 5pc of the equity in NCFC plus substantial sums in the preference shares. Please note the views in this letter are our own.

Over the past five years we have met with you and Neil Doncaster on a number of occasions to see how the skills of our group can be utilised for the greater good of the NCFC family.

Sadly, our advice has been dismissed the majority of the time.

Perhaps our only success has been the introduction and financing of the Employee of the Year Awards for non-footballing colleagues at the club, an event you have now decided to abandon.

You are aware that we have been dissatisfied with the executive management of the club for a number of years, culminating in our preparation of a financial analysis of the situation and strategic options open to us in December 2007.

To the board''s continuing shame you categorically refused to meet your own shareholders to discuss the proposals; proposals that were developed with the sole aim of improving the situation.

We now know that you believed we were in concert with Peter Cullum as you were then in negotiations with him in complete secrecy.

Ironically, no member of our group knows this man and it was only through logic and financial analysis that we concluded that some £25m needed to be invested, a similar sum to that calculated by Mr Cullum''s advisors.

We are acutely conscious that all the directors love the club and have taken decisions that they felt were the correct ones at the time.

However, good intent is not the only skill required to manage an enterprise: skill, leadership, vision and empathy with all stakeholders are essential.

The board does not have these attributes.

The mistakes during your stewardship are legion and well documented in correspondence and internet postings throughout the county and beyond.

Suffice to say we are now in the third tier of English football, our financial situation is dire, we

do not have a team, the loyal supporters are distressed but we do have the best ground in the third division.

Under your chairmanship and Neil Doncaster''s executive leadership the quality of our product has deteriorated every year since 2004, losses have continued to mount and debt piled up.

The only honourable course open to you both is to resign forthwith without compensation, the board to search for a new chief executive, appoint a new chairman from the local business community and work with the current majority shareholders to get us out of this mess.

For the avoidance of doubt, neither of us seeks to join the board.

Unfortunately, we do not expect you to listen to our arguments alone and therefore we will be consulting with various stakeholder groups to ensure that we create a sufficient groundswell of public opinion that will be resolute, indefatigable and irresistible.

We must end this uncertainty now

Edited by TeemuVanBasten
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