Sheffield Wednesday docked 12 points

[FenwayFrank 2,457]

1 hour ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

their wage budget 167% of their turnover

Wow, didn’t know that

[Well b back 3,190]

1 hour ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

It is the EFL following their own rules. Nothing ‘poor’ about it.

If Wigan didn’t want a 12 point deduction they shouldn’t have gone into administration. Don’t let the strange circumstances of their ownership cover up the fact their wage budget 167% of their turnover. 
 

Premier League teams get a 9 point points deduction if they go into administration (well, that is the amount Portsmouth got in 2010, not sure if it has gone up since). 

 

Villa FFP investigation was concluded earlier this year and they were found to be compliant with the rules so no punishment will he handed out to them. 

I will happily stand corrected but as I understand it Sheffield Wednesday had their ground bought at an inflated price by their owners and then bought back by a holding company for next to nothing that was owned by the club. I also understood Derby and Villa did exactly the same. As I understood it Derby were still awaiting their hearing and Villa were told nothing could be done until they were relegated. 

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557]

6 minutes ago, Well b back said:

I will happily stand corrected but as I understand it Sheffield Wednesday had their ground bought at an inflated price by their owners and then bought back by a holding company for next to nothing that was owned by the club. I also understood Derby and Villa did exactly the same. As I understood it Derby were still awaiting their hearing and Villa were told nothing could be done until they were relegated. 

Derby are still await verdict I think.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/insidersport.com/2020/02/28/aston-villa-announces-70m-loss-however-passes-ffp-investigation/amp/

Villa’s was concluded back in Feb 2020 - both the EFL and EPL said that have complied with the rules. (See above link) 

 

[Badger 2,405]

2 hours ago, FenwayFrank said:

Wow, didn’t know that

Wages as a percentage of turnover 2018. It's why the championship is such a basket case financially.

 

https://financialfootballnews.com/championship-2018-finances-wages/

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

Once again, the real sufferers are the supporters however few of them there may be.

Maybe some of ours will see why it is wise to keep your finances as healthy as you possibly can when the windfall comes along. And we were gifted that windfall when we won the Championship against all odds.

[Icecream Snow 761]

7 hours ago, Well b back said:

I will happily stand corrected but as I understand it Sheffield Wednesday had their ground bought at an inflated price by their owners and then bought back by a holding company for next to nothing that was owned by the club. I also understood Derby and Villa did exactly the same. As I understood it Derby were still awaiting their hearing and Villa were told nothing could be done until they were relegated. 

Under FFP a Championship club can post losses of up to £39 million over a three year period. Sheffield Wednesday had posted losses of £10m in 2015/16 and £20m in 2016/17 meaning that they had to post less than £9m in the 2017/18 accounts.

I believe the specific issue is that the company created to process the sale of the ground wasn't created until June 2019, and the sale followed later that month. Sheffield Wednesday however filed their 2017/18 accounts late in June 2019, and included the sale. So whilst the EFL was also questioning the value, the independent commission agreed that the ground sale shouldn't have been included in the 2017/18 accounts, which was the easier charge to get them on.

[Bonzo 198]

Reading look like another candidate for the cold hard reality of FFP with losses of £30m and £21m for the last two years.

Selling the ground and calling it revenue as Wednesday and Derby have done is a bit sketchy no matter when you do it -it's really nothing more than financial gerrymandering although it's a smart move if you do eventually go bust because at least the ground isn't subject to the winding up order (although the insolvency practitioners might wish to argue otherwise). 

The point of FFP is to ensure financially healthy clubs not to prove how clever your accountants are.

Derby don't seem to have filed any accounts since June 2018 when they put through the ground sale at nearly £40m. Usually a late filing is a sign of bad news. They deny that they have breached FFP rules.

No doubt many clubs will suffer hardship this year due to Covid 19 hitting revenues however with Wednesday already having been called on this the commission will be hard pressed not to rule on a consistent basis for other potential offenders. 

[Bill 1,788]

Being penalised for having 'hambition'

" it h'aint right, nor saw it h'aint"

it's bad enough getting into a financial mess without having points deducted

 

ps I wonder whose next 🙃

[essex canary 492]

What a complete shambles this is. I have every sympathy for Charlton's appeal. 

The practice is dubious whatever way it is looked at ie. breaking the spirit of the rule. However surely the difference between Wednesday and Derby is that Wednesday would appear to have also broken the letter of the rule in applying the entry to the Accounts one year before the ground sale took place. On that basis why should they not face the same penalty as Wigan and be relegated immediately?

It is looking almost as big a shambles as the Spanish Second tier.

 

 

[chicken 2,605]

@Bathnal: Re Villa, I could be wrong but had they had been relegated they would have been investigated again as it was dependent upon their ground being bought back? I'm not up to speed with all the finer detail of it all but I thought there are rules around selling grounds to owners to bypass FFP which included the ground returning to the club or some-such. 

I was under the impression that if Villa failed to stay up, they wouldn't have the money to resolve said issue and either the owner would be forced to take a huge hit or the club would be in a spot of trouble? 

Could well be wrong. As for Wolves, I believe they sailed very close to the wind, very, very close. The bigger gripe that many seem to have had is that they effectively employed a "super agent" who was essentially recruiting his players for the club. I have no idea how this isn't tapping up...

[shefcanary 2,389]

13 hours ago, essex canary said:

What a complete shambles this is. I have every sympathy for Charlton's appeal. 

The practice is dubious whatever way it is looked at ie. breaking the spirit of the rule. However surely the difference between Wednesday and Derby is that Wednesday would appear to have also broken the letter of the rule in applying the entry to the Accounts one year before the ground sale took place. On that basis why should they not face the same penalty as Wigan and be relegated immediately?

It is looking almost as big a shambles as the Spanish Second tier.

 

 

Looks like plenty of other championship clubs feel aggrieved with this one!  BBC reporting at least 8 other clubs will support Charlton.  What gets me is apart from the Hospitality block behind the South Stand the rest of Hillsborough is a disaster and worthless as its ages old and based on a flood plain so land can't be built on without huge groundwork cost (given Covid even the Hospitality block is worthless at the moment) - the EFL should really have convicted them for the value of the transaction,  not just the timing.  If it goes to a judicial review I think both EFL and Wednesday will lose.

Edited August 4, 2020 by shefcanary
more info

[NWC 239]

Does anyone know if Bournemouth (who broke FFP rules last time in the championship) will be deducted points??

[Badger 2,405]

Wigan lose their appeal

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11682/12042391/wigan-relegation-to-league-one-confirmed-after-losing-appeal-against-12-point-deduction

[Badger 2,405]

3 hours ago, shefcanary said:

If it goes to a judicial review I think both EFL and Wednesday will lose.

Why? I thought that the rules were different for FFP and administration and that's why the deductions are at different times? If the rules have been correctly applied...

Not saying I'm definitely right, but that's my understanding.

[shefcanary 2,389]

@badger it boils down to when the decision was made, which according to whispers here in Sheff was as far back as pre-lockdown.  Only a judicial review could unpick that, an appeal wouldn't.  However have Charlton got the cash to force one?  Their informal approach to EFL is a case of who blinks first.