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cambridgeshire canary

Hernandez on one wing and Placheta on the other next season- Thoughts?

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Beacause I have a feeling both Cantwell and Buendia are eyeing up moves, and I feel with the pacy Cuban Pete and the Polish Flash up top they should tear the Championship up

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Happy with That or Either of them playing upfront i think they would both worry Defenders to Death through the Middle 

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It’s got the point where I really don’t mind if Max, Jamal, Ben, Todd, Emi and evening Pukki leave. This team together aren’t capable of pushing the club any further. We had bad luck with injuries which might have changed the dynamic but we’ve seen the ceiling of what these players together can do - rock bottom of premier league. 

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Add to that Idah, who’s size and pace will only scare most championship sides daft.

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Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, vlad666 said:

Wonder if sinani makes an impact next season. 

I get the impression Sinani might take that no. 10 role, if both Cantwell & Steipermann go.

Edited by Indy
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16 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Beacause I have a feeling both Cantwell and Buendia are eyeing up moves, and I feel with the pacy Cuban Pete and the Polish Flash up top they should tear the Championship up

They have both played on the left wing for the vast majority of their careers....and tbh I can't see Farke playing two dedicated wingers in a match day 11 anyway. 

Having two excellent left wingers pushing each other on to greater heights can only be a good thing though.

Just need a right winger now so we can truly mix it up, when needed.

OTBC

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3 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

They have both played on the left wing for the vast majority of their careers....and tbh I can't see Farke playing two dedicated wingers in a match day 11 anyway. 

Having two excellent left wingers pushing each other on to greater heights can only be a good thing though.

Just need a right winger now so we can truly mix it up, when needed.

OTBC

To be fair, two dedicated wingers would probably mean the full-backs don't have to push so much and there's always room for a deep-lying playmaker (or indeed Godfrey or Zimmermann) to hit a diagonal ball for them to run onto. On top of that, it should widen out the pitch when in possession so make it easier to get the passes off.

As ever, a lot will depend on how good these new players are off the ball and when we're not in possession.

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

To be fair, two dedicated wingers would probably mean the full-backs don't have to push so much and there's always room for a deep-lying playmaker (or indeed Godfrey or Zimmermann) to hit a diagonal ball for them to run onto. On top of that, it should widen out the pitch when in possession so make it easier to get the passes off.

As ever, a lot will depend on how good these new players are off the ball and when we're not in possession.

Hello TheGunnShow,

I'd quite like to see us have two proper wingers tearing up the Championship. We have badly missed both pace and physical power this year so it's possible Farke will re-invent us to ensure these areas become strengths rather than weaknesses.

OTBC

Edited by Disco Dales Jockstrap
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Reading DF's post I think he is hoping either Emi or Todd will stay and play through the middle. And Billy Whizz out wide. I think Onel will have to take his chances.

If we play two wingers then we would need two up front and have to revert to 4-4-2 which I doubt DF will want to do. We haven't the personnel that Sheff U have so will play a more possession based game once again. But I think we may well have better players to do it next season. He mentioned a physical DM which we have in Ben anyway.

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3 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Hello TheGunnShow,

I'd quite like to see us have two proper wingers tearing up the Championship. We have badly missed both pace and physical power this year so it's possible Farke will re-invent us to ensure these areas become strengths rather than weaknesses.

OTBC

I'm wondering - but it's a very loose hypothesis, if two wingers rejuvenates Leitner (or even Vrancic). We know he can pick passes from deep. A fast winger haring into space looks like a target he'd fancy hitting time after time.

Agree that we've lacked some raw physicality. I'd also argue that if we go with two proper wingers, we don't need one in the hole so much. At that point I'd be looking for a more box-to-box midfielder with a couple of more defensive ones behind him. A few could do that. McLean's got that engine, Rupp looks like he's got it, Stiepi could with a bit of fine tuning as well, I reckon.

I'm actually wondering where Sinani's going to fit in all this. It does look like Farke's planning a somewhat different plan B.

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3 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Reading DF's post I think he is hoping either Emi or Todd will stay and play through the middle. And Billy Whizz out wide. I think Onel will have to take his chances.

If we play two wingers then we would need two up front and have to revert to 4-4-2 which I doubt DF will want to do. We haven't the personnel that Sheff U have so will play a more possession based game once again. But I think we may well have better players to do it next season. He mentioned a physical DM which we have in Ben anyway.

Ben will not be here next season...Sorensen is who he must have been talking about. 

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Reading DF's post I think he is hoping either Emi or Todd will stay and play through the middle. And Billy Whizz out wide. I think Onel will have to take his chances.

If we play two wingers then we would need two up front and have to revert to 4-4-2 which I doubt DF will want to do. We haven't the personnel that Sheff U have so will play a more possession based game once again. But I think we may well have better players to do it next season. He mentioned a physical DM which we have in Ben anyway.

Why not Stiepermann then (in terms of playing through the middle)? He did it to great effect in the Championship last time.

Edited by TheGunnShow

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18 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Why not Stiepermann then (in terms of playing through the middle)? He did it to great effect in the Championship last time.

I am not arguing against that, I am repeating what DF said. I agree with him though. Emi or Todd have close clontrol and can damage teams in and around the box.

But I doubt DF will change the system. Only the personnel.

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Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

I am not arguing against that, I am repeating what DF said. I agree with him though. Emi or Todd have close clontrol and can damage teams in and around the box.

But I doubt DF will change the system. Only the personnel.

I think he’s already in the process of that, we’ve made four signings, two holding midfielders and two attacking wingers.

Two things to consider, they’re just not good enough for the next step, so if we keep Steipermann, Vrancic etc. We’d be looking to replace then if we go up.
Secondly we’ve signed four foreign players who will no doubt e replacing four of our current foreign players to fall into the home grown rules in the EFL. I’m not sure what these are exactly.

 

Edited by Indy

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Onel was excellent today but needs to improve consistency of performance. We have to hope the flying Pole isn’t a flying plank.

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33 minutes ago, Indy said:


Secondly we’ve signed four foreign players who will no doubt e replacing four of our current foreign players to fall into the home grown rules in the EFL. I’m not sure what these are exactly.

 

if we need to release/sell 4 foreign players i not see Leitner and Vrancic to stay  also Trybull never played more than 2 years in same club  and missed a  lot of games last weeks and for four spot Klose or Drmic is favorites...

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Yours assuming hernandez will be here. 

I suspect he's on more radars than people realise. 

He certainly hist as effective as powder puff cantwell at half the price. 

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3 minutes ago, Jerrykerry said:

Yours assuming hernandez will be here. 

I suspect he's on more radars than people realise. 

He certainly hist as effective as powder puff cantwell at half the price. 

He has nowhere near the footballing intelligence or end product of Cantwell. If he was consistent and productive he'd be in the team every week like Cantwell, because he has a great deal of talent, but Todd's a far better all-round footballer.

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Hernandez has blown hot and cold his entire career, it is why he never made it out of 2. Bundesliga despite a lot of Bundesliga clubs scouting him. I feel we won't often see them both on the pitch together, but could see them as impact subs or rotated in what is going to be a condensed season. Feel you need someone who is a bit calmer on the ball to get the most out of these players.

Farke may be planning a tactical shift from his current possession heavy low block, to a more Klopp style of a high press and counter. Hernandez/Placheta could be Norwich's Salah and Mane. Would be hard to see Pukki fitting into that forward line though.

Good to have options and I doubt Hernandez will be one of the players leaving.

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4 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

Hernandez has blown hot and cold his entire career, it is why he never made it out of 2. Bundesliga despite a lot of Bundesliga clubs scouting him. I feel we won't often see them both on the pitch together, but could see them as impact subs or rotated in what is going to be a condensed season. Feel you need someone who is a bit calmer on the ball to get the most out of these players.

Farke may be planning a tactical shift from his current possession heavy low block, to a more Klopp style of a high press and counter. Hernandez/Placheta could be Norwich's Salah and Mane. Would be hard to see Pukki fitting into that forward line though.

Good to have options and I doubt Hernandez will be one of the players leaving.

Is that based purely on a hunch? The low block was the only way to operate in the PL, but I'd love us to get on the front foot next season and adopt more of a gegenpressing style. Ironically, I think that additional pace might have worked a lot better with the low block this season, as we were often ponderous when trying to counter-attack and ended up taking too long and playing backwards.

Do you think Idah would work with that system? I'd imagine we'd still not be looking to whip balls into the head of an old-school centre forward as such, but Idah certainly has a bit more physical hustle about him.

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2 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

Is that based purely on a hunch? The low block was the only way to operate in the PL, but I'd love us to get on the front foot next season and adopt more of a gegenpressing style. Ironically, I think that additional pace might have worked a lot better with the low block this season, as we were often ponderous when trying to counter-attack and ended up taking too long and playing backwards.

Do you think Idah would work with that system? I'd imagine we'd still not be looking to whip balls into the head of an old-school centre forward as such, but Idah certainly has a bit more physical hustle about him.

It is the only way I can see two pacy wingers working in a Farke team. He isn't going to go 4-4-2 suddenly, but might think about if a high press is a better way to go. Norwich also deployed a low/mid block in the Championship winning season so it is his current preferred system.

Things can evolve over time so will be interesting to see if he changes tactic. I think he has often been guided by the players he has - in the first season it was clear that Maddison was a cut above and the whole team was based around him - in the second season Buendia was that player so he made a system to fit his strengths. The first game of the Championship winning season had Pukki playing right wing and Rhodes up top.

10 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

Would Pukki not be the Firmino in that scenario? 

Pukki can not play the way Firmino does - very different players.

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28 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Actually, Sinani seems to be a left-footed winger too - but he seems to cut in off the right a fair bit. I'm leery of the source to be honest, but we could be making a mistake if we just think pace.

https://totalfootballanalysis.com/player-analysis/danel-sinani-201920-scout-report-tactical-analysis-tactics

I know its not real but I had Sinani on FM and he was very much a right sided inside forward type with a knack of scoring goals. Presumably the guy who scouted him knew enough to suggest that would be accurate in reality.

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The thing is with the Liverpool system, he’s playing three up top with narrow wingers who cut in across the box and both wingbacks press up high both whip the ball into the box early, neither really drive to the byline. This gives them three attackers in the box when these crosses come in. Also it means they have a high press and quick breaks. 
Personally I like this system as we do have the personnel to do it.

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34 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

It is the only way I can see two pacy wingers working in a Farke team. He isn't going to go 4-4-2 suddenly, but might think about if a high press is a better way to go. Norwich also deployed a low/mid block in the Championship winning season so it is his current preferred system.

Things can evolve over time so will be interesting to see if he changes tactic. I think he has often been guided by the players he has - in the first season it was clear that Maddison was a cut above and the whole team was based around him - in the second season Buendia was that player so he made a system to fit his strengths. The first game of the Championship winning season had Pukki playing right wing and Rhodes up top.

Pukki can not play the way Firmino does - very different players.

Really good insight here. The block was definitely higher in the Championship-winning season, but still wasn't as high as you'd expect for a team that was all over opponents most of the time.

I do think it's strange how defensively vulnerable we are even using a low block; Man City use a high block and often get caught out on the counter through overcommitting in trying to regain possession (and just committing everyone forward to try to break down the opponent's block), whereas we've been really vulnerable from set pieces and open play. Our low block and lack of pace on the counter was a recipe for disaster, really.

Rather than trying to fix all the defensive frailties in a low block, I'd prefer us to try a higher block; a different set of variables, definitely, but if it works you're preventing pressure before it even starts building. I'd love to see us try this next season, and I think it could be sensational if it works.

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