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Norwich- Better off as a yoyo club than certain others?

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Now don't get me wrong- What I would love to see our club become is a midtable top divison club who goes on fun cup runs and sometimes sneaks into a top ten finish- Boring? Not very 'ambitious' sure.

 

But what else is there? Because sure we might be going up then going down, going up going down time and again.. But would you rather we go the way of Leeds? Spend 17 years before going up? Nottingham forest? Fulham? Sunderland? Ipswich? Portsmouth who only just over a decade ago were playing Milan in the Euro leauge at home? 

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not all too happy at being a yoyo club- But I much prefer it to stagnating in the lower leauges while stressing about our finances while being diddled by shady businessman after shady businessman like so many other former 'big clubs' are being done right now.

20200720_071612.jpg

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Posted (edited)

Fair enough, but that yo-yo seems to have gone up and down so many times now that the string is getting frayed.

 

Edited by BroadstairsR

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In the absence of rich benefactors every club has a rough place in the footballing food chain. Ours seems to be top half of the championship with odd forays into the PL resulting in a rapid return to the championship. If something goes exceptionally right or wrong the PL stay may be a bit longer or we can fall into League 1. I would take that , most seasons there is something interesting going on. When relatives were still around i used to go and see Carlisle their place in the said chain is league 1 if things are going well, league 2 most of the time, Conference when the wheels come off. Be happy with our lot, it could be better but also a lot worse and the main thing is we have a club

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1 hour ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Now don't get me wrong- What I would love to see our club become is a midtable top divison club who goes on fun cup runs and sometimes sneaks into a top ten finish- Boring? Not very 'ambitious' sure.

 

But what else is there? Because sure we might be going up then going down, going up going down time and again.. But would you rather we go the way of Leeds? Spend 17 years before going up? Nottingham forest? Fulham? Sunderland? Ipswich? Portsmouth who only just over a decade ago were playing Milan in the Euro leauge at home? 

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not all too happy at being a yoyo club- But I much prefer it to stagnating in the lower leauges while stressing about our finances while being diddled by shady businessman after shady businessman like so many other former 'big clubs' are being done right now.

20200720_071612.jpg

There are no clubs that can maintain this stable premier league club fantasy some have.

The ones that are there now are just biding their time. Remember when Stoke and Swansea and Sunderland and all sorts where nice and stable and we’re prepping for long term futures in the top flight. Even money doesn’t seem to matter. The sainted Bournemouth, who seem to have hidden the fact they are backed by a billionaire, are going down with us.

If you are a Wolves or a Burnley you may think you are safe and sound but you are just renting your position in this league.

Take Sheffield United, Excellent season and fair play to them, but it’s going to go wrong, probably sooner rather than later.

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Posted (edited)

I wouldn't mind being a yo-yo team if we could just pinch a league cup now and again and have the associated brief foray into the UEFA cup. 

35 years since we won that League Cup. 

Edited by TeemuVanBasten

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13 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

There are no clubs that can maintain this stable premier league club fantasy some have.

The ones that are there now are just biding their time. Remember when Stoke and Swansea and Sunderland and all sorts where nice and stable and we’re prepping for long term futures in the top flight. Even money doesn’t seem to matter. The sainted Bournemouth, who seem to have hidden the fact they are backed by a billionaire, are going down with us.

If you are a Wolves or a Burnley you may think you are safe and sound but you are just renting your position in this league.

Take Sheffield United, Excellent season and fair play to them, but it’s going to go wrong, probably sooner rather than later.

Much as I like Bournmouth and admire Eddie- It is amusing how every one ignores that they bought their way to success. Honestly, the money they have splashed for the players they have is laughable.

 

Either way, they are just a small league two club and I do feel this relegation will harm them badly, even more so if they hound Eddie out.

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15 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Much as I like Bournmouth and admire Eddie- It is amusing how every one ignores that they bought their way to success. Honestly, the money they have splashed for the players they have is laughable.

 

Either way, they are just a small league two club and I do feel this relegation will harm them badly, even more so if they hound Eddie out.

“Plucky little Bournemouth”

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17 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

“Plucky little Bournemouth”

I mean we might have made some bad signings and all, but just look at Bournemouth's record

 

Lerma for 25 million, solanke for 19 million, Danjuma for 16 million, Afobe for 11 million, Mings for 10 million, and of course Grabben for 8 million..

 

If they didn't have such rich owners they would be in serious trouble for those alone

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Posted (edited)
56 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

There are no clubs that can maintain this stable premier league club fantasy some have.

The ones that are there now are just biding their time. Remember when Stoke and Swansea and Sunderland and all sorts where nice and stable and we’re prepping for long term futures in the top flight. Even money doesn’t seem to matter. The sainted Bournemouth, who seem to have hidden the fact they are backed by a billionaire, are going down with us.

If you are a Wolves or a Burnley you may think you are safe and sound but you are just renting your position in this league.

Take Sheffield United, Excellent season and fair play to them, but it’s going to go wrong, probably sooner rather than later.

If you go back further Bolton where the role model club. Look at them now, league 2. Realistically, there will only ever be 5 or 6 clubs in the premiership who will challenge for the title. The rest are just treading water all the time. 

Edited by City fan
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2 hours ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

20200720_071612.jpg

Fulham's problem has been that despite Shad Khan being a very rich man, and pumping huge sums into the club, their performance has been dismal since he took over at the end of the 2013 season. El Fayed picked a good time to get out.

image.png.0a866fcfab974ca32c8a5835f09cbe05.png

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25 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

I mean we might have made some bad signings and all, but just look at Bournemouth's record

 

Lerma for 25 million, solanke for 19 million, Danjuma for 16 million, Afobe for 11 million, Mings for 10 million, and of course Grabben for 8 million..

 

If they didn't have such rich owners they would be in serious trouble for those alone

They also paid £15m for Jordan Ibe four years ago and they've just released him. He's only 24.

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51 minutes ago, City fan said:

If you go back further Bolton where the role model club. Look at them now, league 2. Realistically, there will only ever be 5 or 6 clubs in the premiership who will challenge for the title. The rest are just treading water all the time. 

Or Charlton ... or Ipswich ... Middlesborough etc etc

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Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, Badger said:

Or Charlton ... or Ipswich ... Middlesborough etc etc

When you realise that a lot of Leicester fans want Brendan Rodgers sacked with them in 4th, you realise that football fans will never be satisfied and will always be fickle. 

Edited by TeemuVanBasten

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1 minute ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

When you realise that a lot of Leicester fans want Brendan Rodgers sacked with them in 4th, you realise that football fans will never be satisfied and will always be fickle. 

There are probably 30 or 40 teams that think that they should be mid or top half premier league. Simple maths suggests that most will be disappointing. When they get to top half, they expect to go to "the next level."

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1 hour ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Grabben for 8 million..

Forgot about that absolute insanity! Didn't they ever watch him play for us in the PL? He couldn't find his ar5e with both hands.

OTBC

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1 hour ago, City fan said:

If you go back further Bolton where the role model club. Look at them now, league 2. Realistically, there will only ever be 5 or 6 clubs in the premiership who will challenge for the title. The rest are just treading water all the time. 

“The Charlton Model”

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1 hour ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

I mean we might have made some bad signings and all, but just look at Bournemouth's record

 

Lerma for 25 million, solanke for 19 million, Danjuma for 16 million, Afobe for 11 million, Mings for 10 million, and of course Grabben for 8 million..

 

If they didn't have such rich owners they would be in serious trouble for those alone

 

Sold Mings for £26m though, and Afobe for £12m, and got £6m back for Grabban. 

Liverpool pretty much mugged them for Solanke and Ibe though! 

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56 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

When you realise that a lot of Leicester fans want Brendan Rodgers sacked with them in 4th, you realise that football fans will never be satisfied and will always be fickle. 

Makes me laugh. I still see leicster as a lower midtable team at best.

 

Reminds me of when I saw the blue van mans match review when hes beloved Leicester lost to us.. The way he went on about it was like they had just lost to Forest Green Rovers, never seen such entitled delusions of grandeur coming from football fans since anytime Ipswich fans open thier mouths

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Makes me laugh. I still see leicster as a lower midtable team at best.

Reminds me of when I saw the blue van mans match review when hes beloved Leicester lost to us.. The way he went on about it was like they had just lost to Forest Green Rovers, never seen such entitled delusions of grandeur coming from football fans since anytime Ipswich fans open thier mouths

The thing is though, look at all the people on here saying that we're a special club embarking on a "project", throwing around the word 'Barcelona', calling Stuart Webber and Daniel Farke geniuses, claiming that we've got about 6 players worth £30m to £50m, some saying that we've got our best ever team, calling last season our best ever season. One even saying that we could finish 4th.

We've got no real right to criticise other teams fans for being delusional. The stuff we saw Norwich fans saying last summer, all the way up to December really, was by far the most delusional and cringeworthy I've ever seen from Norwich fans, it was cult-like. Daring to be realistic was treated like they were guilty of perjury or heresy.   

One benefit to this post-lockdown complete humiliation is that it seems to have brought most back down to earth, although a handful were clinging on to fantasy la la land until very recently.

Edited by TeemuVanBasten
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Be careful what you wish for, City's status as a yoyo club could end dramatically.  After this seasons disaster a severe shortage of goals, little creativity from a poor midfield and too many goals conceded by a poor defence even when injuries permitted.  Top 26 might become top 36 or even 46 unless the above problems can be sorted.  Solidity in defence should be easier to rectify although Farke hasn't taken action in last 3 seasons do you have the trust he can solve this?

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Posted (edited)
55 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

The thing is though, look at all the people on here saying that we're a special club embarking on a "project", throwing around the word 'Barcelona', calling Stuart Webber and Daniel Farke geniuses, claiming that we've got about 6 players worth £30m to £50m, some saying that we've got our best ever team, calling last season our best ever season. One even saying that we could finish 4th.

We've got no real right to criticise other teams fans for being delusional. The stuff we saw Norwich fans saying last summer, all the way up to December really, was by far the most delusional and cringeworthy I've ever seen from Norwich fans, it was cult-like. Daring to be realistic was treated like they were guilty of perjury or heresy.   

One benefit to this post-lockdown complete humiliation is that it seems to have brought most back down to earth, although a handful were clinging on to fantasy la la land until very recently.

Taking football forums far to seriously fella

some people post optimistic and in some cases almost fantastical stuff because Norwich are the team we love and it’s good to get excited about what could possibly happen

at the opposite end of the spectrum you get those glass half empty types bemoaning poor results, giving opinions on how the club should be run and what stupid mistakes were made

ive no problem with either, at the end of the day most of us are here as Norwich fans spending additional time discussing the club we love, what we post here has no impact on decisions made by the club and rightly so, otherwise just about every club in the country would be sacking its manager every 3 months! 
 

Norwich fans are no worse or better than any other, quite why this bothers you so much I have no idea. Many of us here are in mundane jobs and forums like this are a good way of turning off from all that, lets be honest, you and a few others are proberbly spending considerable amount of hours of your life viewing and posting on this site all day about a club which you ultimately have no say in making the running decisions of - but I wouldn’t for a minute call it cringy or delusional - you’re simply a football fan. 🙂

Edited by Matte-nr4
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3 hours ago, City fan said:

If you go back further Bolton where the role model club. Look at them now, league 2. Realistically, there will only ever be 5 or 6 clubs in the premiership who will challenge for the title. The rest are just treading water all the time. 

Finally...a thread with a few posters on this forum who see how it really is...ive been banging this drum for a long time. This is the true reality..other than Everton every  club in the Prem outside the big 5 or 6 are on borrowed time. Many these days also yo yo spending vast more amounts of money than City...take Villa as example.

We are undoubtedly the Premier top two divisions yo yo club, but we do it with a financial model thats unlike most other clubs, its had a wobble or two in the last decade but we now have, in DF and SW, a partnership that gets what NCFC are about, making good financial gain from getting in and blooding, then selling, good young players. Some may think we should change, spend a enormous amount of money from a rich benefactor...but there is hardly a single proven case that this route can buy you into a long term stay in the Premiership, never mind  being on a par with the Manchesters or Chelsea's..

This is why i believe Farke and Webber should stay as long as they want..time itself will  move them and bring others in anyway...as it will with Delia and Michael..but NCFC should always be here, run in a way that keeps it alive and in its current form its being run in a positive way.

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For me the clubs strategy is clear- use the carrot of potential premier football to lure top young European talent. Young players will move for big money but the idea is to have at least two in the wings to take their place. If it works the squad gradually gets stronger. The more young players you have, the greater the chance one will suddenly blossom a la Aarons.

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On 20/07/2020 at 13:45, Essjayess said:

Finally...a thread with a few posters on this forum who see how it really is...ive been banging this drum for a long time. This is the true reality..other than Everton every  club in the Prem outside the big 5 or 6 are on borrowed time. Many these days also yo yo spending vast more amounts of money than City...take Villa as example.

We are undoubtedly the Premier top two divisions yo yo club, but we do it with a financial model thats unlike most other clubs, its had a wobble or two in the last decade but we now have, in DF and SW, a partnership that gets what NCFC are about, making good financial gain from getting in and blooding, then selling, good young players. Some may think we should change, spend a enormous amount of money from a rich benefactor...but there is hardly a single proven case that this route can buy you into a long term stay in the Premiership, never mind  being on a par with the Manchesters or Chelsea's..

This is why i believe Farke and Webber should stay as long as they want..time itself will  move them and bring others in anyway...as it will with Delia and Michael..but NCFC should always be here, run in a way that keeps it alive and in its current form its being run in a positive way.

Good post. A little bit more perspective here too...

 

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There was a time before the playoffs were introduced - 1987! - that you went to a match hoping for a good game with a few goals. We didn't think we would win anything but hoped for a good run in the cup competitions which every club took seriously. One Saturday recently ITV4 showed an old big match from 1977 where we beat Leicester 3-2 on Boxing Day, it was a good watch!

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On 20/07/2020 at 08:13, Yorkshire Canary said:

In the absence of rich benefactors every club has a rough place in the footballing food chain. Ours seems to be top half of the championship with odd forays into the PL resulting in a rapid return to the championship. If something goes exceptionally right or wrong the PL stay may be a bit longer or we can fall into League 1. I would take that , most seasons there is something interesting going on. When relatives were still around i used to go and see Carlisle their place in the said chain is league 1 if things are going well, league 2 most of the time, Conference when the wheels come off. Be happy with our lot, it could be better but also a lot worse and the main thing is we have a club

Yep it makes for an interesting ride, mixing up promotion between automatic and play off final adds another nice little twist. How can people moan, we always have something to be interested in.

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On 20/07/2020 at 08:50, cambridgeshire canary said:

Much as I like Bournmouth and admire Eddie- It is amusing how every one ignores that they bought their way to success. Honestly, the money they have splashed for the players they have is laughable.

 

Either way, they are just a small league two club and I do feel this relegation will harm them badly, even more so if they hound Eddie out.

No way should there be a Premier League club with a ground that only holds 12,000

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Posted (edited)
On 20/07/2020 at 05:45, Essjayess said:

We are undoubtedly the Premier top two divisions yo yo club, but we do it with a financial model thats unlike most other clubs, its had a wobble or two in the last decade but we now have, in DF and SW, a partnership that gets what NCFC are about, making good financial gain from getting in and blooding, then selling, good young players. Some may think we should change, spend a enormous amount of money from a rich benefactor...but there is hardly a single proven case that this route can buy you into a long term stay in the Premiership, never mind  being on a par with the Manchesters or Chelsea's..

And this model is why we will continue to be a yo yo club, as our success relies on selling on the young players once developed in order to a) finance the club and b) create space for the next round of young players to take the place of those we sold. We almost certainly will not have a moment where we can say - OK hold onto all our players we are going for Europe / the Title / FA Cup or whatever.... so be it. As long as we are entertained.

Edited by Surfer

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