Squad Clearout

[shefcanary 2,377]

I think most people on this thread are starting from the wrong position.  For any player to be moved on he either has to be in demand or his contract has run out.  From my understanding virtually none of our squad have a contract that ends this summer, so you have to look at either buying out their contract or find a willing buyer.  This all has to be done within a budget as well.  

So whose contract would you buy out is the start point?  Because very few of our players are going to attract any real money post Covid and our recent performances, well any decent money that would perceivably make things worthwhile budget wise.   

I think actually very little is going to happen, its all talk currently, unless Webber and his team are prepared to gamble on the money side which they say they are not prepared to do.  This transfer window will be underwhelming, as usual.

[Wardogz 72]

5 hours ago, TheGoogler said:

Definition of race according to Google is a group of people who share the same culture. 

Being from Germany is being a part of the German race. 

 

Edited July 19, 2020 by Wardogz

[Capt. Pants 4,194]

After the performances we've seen since the restart I don't think there is a single player in the squad who we would decline an offer for without first giving careful consideration. We need strengthening and change right across the squad and if we received a silly offer for the likes of Krul, Buendia, Pukki, Idah even Zimbo I think we would consider them. I think there could be a few surprises.

[TheGoogler 324]

23 minutes ago, Wardogz said:

Germans are not a race of people.

[Wardogz 72]

7 minutes ago, TheGoogler said:

You need to look up the differences between race, ethnicity and nationality. You'll be shocked to learn that 195 countries doesn't mean 195 races. Anyway, I can't be bothered any more. The guy you originally replied to had said nothing bigoted at all. 

[TheGoogler 324]

 

5 minutes ago, Wardogz said:

You need to look up the differences between race, ethnicity and nationality. You'll be shocked to learn that 195 countries doesn't mean 195 races. Anyway, I can't be bothered any more. The guy you originally replied to had said nothing bigoted at all. 

No, I really don't. Race can be used to describe people defined as coming from a country. Nationality is the nation you identify as coming from (ie as an immigrant you might come from Hong Kong but your nationality might be British). Ethnicity relates to a social group you identify yourself from, usually due to a shared characteristic, culture, religion etc.

Let's get back to talking football, shall we?

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

3 hours ago, TheGoogler said:

 Race can be used to describe people defined as coming from a country.

That's 'nationality' fella. 

If you are against somebody based on their nationality you are xenophobic, not racist.

Edited July 19, 2020 by TeemuVanBasten

[TheGoogler 324]

10 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

That's 'nationality' fella. 

If you are against somebody based on their nationality you are xenophobic, not racist.

No, because in the bit you cut off, I explain the difference between nationality and race.

Racism can be based on specific nationality. Xenophobia is a discrimination against all foreign countries.

[Duncan Edwards 2,216]

20 hours ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

'Rupp- Can't understand why we bought him'

 

Because  he's German, it really is that simple

😂 So is Boris Becker and we haven’t signed him! 

[Tommo 51]

Players Most likely to leave (permanent) 

Trybull - Germany or similar 

Leitner - Germany or similar

Heise - Germany or similar

Thompson - MK Dons 

Raggett - Portsmouth 

Cantwell - Newcastle 

Lewis - Crystal Palace

Aarons - multiple PL clubs interested 

Buendia - Spanish La Liga team 
 

Drmic - Germany or similar European comp 

 

less likely moves

Byram - are Leeds going to fancy taking him back?

Godfrey - PL club interest but price tag is hefty

Pukki - if PL club wants to take gamble 

 

 

[Number9 272]

1 minute ago, Tommo said:

Players Most likely to leave (permanent) 

Trybull - Germany or similar 

Leitner - Germany or similar

Heise - Germany or similar

Thompson - MK Dons 

Raggett - Portsmouth 

Cantwell - Newcastle 

Lewis - Crystal Palace

Aarons - multiple PL clubs interested 

Buendia - Spanish La Liga team 
 

Drmic - Germany or similar European comp 

 

less likely moves

Byram - are Leeds going to fancy taking him back?

Godfrey - PL club interest but price tag is hefty

Pukki - if PL club wants to take gamble 

 

 

Leitner has only just started walking again after his operation, he ain't going anywhere soon. 

[A Load of Squit 5,111]

25 minutes ago, Duncan Edwards said:

😂 So is Boris Becker and we haven’t signed him! 

He looks like the type of player we need.

[TheGunnShow 5,908]

Personally, I'd be happy clearing Drmic, McGovern, Vrancic, and Leitner (more for Oliviera-esque attitude problems rather than talent). I suspect Rupp will do a Stiepermann and look pretty good next season - he's more diligent in his off-the-ball defensive duties than many and has played his part in some of our defensively more responsible performances this season (Liverpool at home, Newcastle away).

I wonder with signing Placheta if there's going to be a change of shape/attack? Placheta down one flank, Hernandez down the other would probably be too damned fast for most Championship defences, but you'd think there's less need for Lewis and Aarons (assuming both stay, which with Max is quite the 'if') to pile it on down the field. A lot will depend on if Sitti and Sorensen are the defensive midfielders we need as Tettey's not getting any younger.

[Mr.Carrow 376]

Famewo was ineligible to play for us having been out on loan, but we got special permission to include him and he came straight in on the bench Vs Burnley. That would indicate that we rate him imo. Apparently they loved him at Motherwell.

[Bill 1,788]

So, much to look forward to

Plenty of emerging talent, and any sales will definitely be on our terms - with my thought being good luck to them

the squad that took us from L1 to the PL continuously changed, and so it will be this time

better to be filling your belly in the staff mess, than starving at the Captains table

.... and perhaps we would do better to play 9 mean instead of 11 next season 😄

[Desert_Fox_2 6]

36 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

Famewo was ineligible to play for us having been out on loan, but we got special permission to include him and he came straight in on the bench Vs Burnley. That would indicate that we rate him imo. Apparently they loved him at Motherwell.

Why would Motherwell have loved him? He played for St.Mirren

[norfolkngood 1,086]

3 minutes ago, Desert_Fox_2 said:

Why would Motherwell have loved him? He played for St.Mirren

Maybe he scored 2 own goals everytime he played Motherwell 

[Dr Greenthumb 746]

2 hours ago, Tommo said:

Players Most likely to leave (permanent) 

Trybull - Germany or similar 

Leitner - Germany or similar

Heise - Germany or similar

Thompson - MK Dons 

Raggett - Portsmouth 

Cantwell - Newcastle 

Lewis - Crystal Palace

Aarons - multiple PL clubs interested 

Buendia - Spanish La Liga team 
 

Drmic - Germany or similar European comp 

 

less likely moves

Byram - are Leeds going to fancy taking him back?

Godfrey - PL club interest but price tag is hefty

Pukki - if PL club wants to take gamble 

 

 

I’d sell all of your main list, just to keep Buendia

[Move Klose 303]

Keep:

Krul Oxborough Byram Hanley Zimmerman Famewo McCallum McLean Siti Gilmour Jorgensen Placheta Hernandez Martin Sinani Idah.

Let's get some youthful energy, some pace, and some physicality in the side.

 

 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

20 hours ago, shefcanary said:

I think most people on this thread are starting from the wrong position.  For any player to be moved on he either has to be in demand or his contract has run out.  From my understanding virtually none of our squad have a contract that ends this summer, so you have to look at either buying out their contract or find a willing buyer.  This all has to be done within a budget as well.  

So whose contract would you buy out is the start point?  Because very few of our players are going to attract any real money post Covid and our recent performances, well any decent money that would perceivably make things worthwhile budget wise.   

I think actually very little is going to happen, its all talk currently, unless Webber and his team are prepared to gamble on the money side which they say they are not prepared to do.  This transfer window will be underwhelming, as usual.

I always wonder this when people talk about getting rid of McGovern or whoever, they don't seem to understand reality.

Only way we'd be able to get rid of McGovern is to pay off his contract or subsidise his wages for a loan.

The reason he is here is because we offered him the most money, he pretty much said as such, he had offers of first team football.

Lets say for arguments sake that he's on £6k a week, and in reality the most he'd get in Scotland is £1k a week. 

He's going to want the other £5k a week from us in some form, either a lot of it in a mutually agreed lump sum or just £5k paid into his bank account every week.

We could loan him out but we'd still end up paying the majority of his wages. 

People in a dream world when they talk about selling Timm Klose. Sell to who? 

Its expensive to tear up contracts, I wonder how much we agreed with Ben Marshall to end his! 

Wages in England are high, that's why many of these players come here. I'm sure there are plenty of people willing to take Moritz Leitner, but there probably aren't any or many prepared to match his wages. We might find somebody willing to take him with no transfer fee perhaps, in order for them to match his wages.

Unless of course he is desperate to leave, in which case he may just take the pay cut and let us off the rest.

Edited July 20, 2020 by TeemuVanBasten

[shefcanary 2,377]

32 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

I always wonder this when people talk about getting rid of McGovern or whoever, they don't seem to understand reality.

Only way we'd be able to get rid of McGovern is to pay off his contract or subsidise his wages for a loan.

The reason he is here is because we offered him the most money, he pretty much said as such, he had offers of first team football.

Lets say for arguments sake that he's on £6k a week, and in reality the most he'd get in Scotland is £1k a week. 

He's going to want the other £5k a week from us in some form, either a lot of it in a mutually agreed lump sum or just £5k paid into his bank account every week.

We could loan him out but we'd still end up paying the majority of his wages. 

People in a dream world when they talk about selling Timm Klose. Sell to who? 

Its expensive to tear up contracts, I wonder how much we agreed with Ben Marshall to end his! 

Wages in England are high, that's why many of these players come here. I'm sure there are plenty of people willing to take Moritz Leitner, but there probably aren't any or many prepared to match his wages. We might find somebody willing to take him with no transfer fee perhaps, in order for them to match his wages.

Unless of course he is desperate to leave, in which case he may just take the pay cut and let us off the rest.

@TVB: thanks for spelling out the contractual constraints in detail.  Moving our "failures and aging players" on is going to cost more than getting new, younger and hungrier players in.  Let's hope that there is a market for them and our view is pessimistic, but post Covid I doubt it.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

2 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

@TVB: thanks for spelling out the contractual constraints in detail.  Moving our "failures and aging players" on is going to cost more than getting new, younger and hungrier players in.  Let's hope that there is a market for them and our view is pessimistic, but post Covid I doubt it.

Personally I think people are calling for too much change anyway. If you completely overhaul a squad you'd end up writing a season off waiting for them all to gel, like our first Farke season. 

Probably a few toxic people to move out (Leitner possibly?) and need a few fresh faces.... but its a short window, clubs are going to show financially constraint etc.

Wouldn't surprise me if January is busier than August.

Some of the players we're stuck with may come good anyway, Klose probably not a bad squad player at that level (look how many times we're written off Tettey!), Rupp may come good. 

Drmic the one who looks like a probably very expensive disaster, hope I'm wrong but he looks and feels a bit like this regimes Steven Naismith. Its as if we're playing him just in the hope that he'll do something to justify his signing. 

[Bonzo 198]

At a guess we may lose both Lewis and Aarons if we can get a good price for them. 

Both have been good for us and are excellent young players however we can live without them. For me the return in an attacking sense hasn't been worth the risk of playing them so high up the pitch.

Neither have made any real contribution in terms of goals or assists in the Prem and neither made a huge or at least irreplaceable contribution in the Championship last season. 

Most of the time Lewis checks back inside or stops after making a break and Aarons is the same. Neither regularly get behind their opposing fullback and neither is noted for delivering a useful cross as an end product.

If we can pick up £40m for the pair it would be good business. Both are quick, useful defenders who have good pass completion stats but neither have much of an end product for all the song and dance we hear about them as an attacking force. 

Their goals and assists can easily be replaced because neither has great numbers in this area. 

[TheGoogler 324]

1 hour ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Wouldn't surprise me if January is busier than August.

I'm not sure that'll be the case. After all, this window is open until October and then a further three weeks for the domestic window. 

I can see those three weeks being very busy for our young players going out on loan.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

Just now, TheGoogler said:

I'm not sure that'll be the case. After all, this window is open until October and then a further three weeks for the domestic window. 

I can see those three weeks being very busy for our young players going out on loan.

Didn't realise that. 

[TheGoogler 324]

1 minute ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Didn't realise that. 

There's a really interesting Ornstein and Chapman podcast about it, if you're interested. Well worth a listen. They say this domestic window was the compromise as the football league sides wanted the window to remain open until March. 

[komakino 272]

I can't see many players wanting to stay and I'm sure their agents have been doing plenty of phone calls. The best players will be gone, whether the club wants them to stay or not. 

What often doesn't get mentioned is that the club are so unambitious, that it clearly does rub off on the players. 

Why should Vrancic, for example, bust a gut for a club that a) won't play him if they go up and b) won't spend to stay there because c) they don't want to be there. 

You only want players who want to play for the club, as The Championship is not a league for half hearted players, but how many will that be? 

Given that this will almost certainly be Farke & Webber's last season - regardless of how the season goes - maybe it is a good idea to replace Farke now as the respect seems to evaporated from much of the side.