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I genuinely don't get the logic that we have two (decent, if not amazing) backups (when Hanley is fit) for central defence but we MUST get a central defender and we have one (poor) backup for Goalkeeper, but very few are bothered.

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51 minutes ago, Indy_Bones said:

That's the point with regards to injury problems with Hanley though BYG, if we don't sign anyone AND Hanley is unavailable, then Klose will be on the Bench, and if Godfrey or Zimm also then get injured, he'll likely be starting in that situation.

I have no problem with Klose for 1 more season, as I think he'll help our younger players and whilst not at his previous ability levels, isn't awful either.

We do need to source at least 1 replacement though, particularly if an offer for Godfrey is accepted (then 2 may be needed), but as it stands at this point, we may need to rely on Klose at times this season, and let's hope that he's still got enough left in the tank for a final season swansong with us, rather than a sad decline with fans getting on his back forgetting many of the excellent games he's played for us.

I definitely would like to see another centre back come in and would like that player to be of an obvious pedigree that they are unquestionably a first team player (obvious a difficult ask). I look at the 4 centrebacks at Norwich and see 1 young player with obvious potential and a great amount of current ability but maybe needs an steady hand next to him. Zimmermann and Hanley are much of a muchness and Klose is a bit of an unknown due to injuries. 

If Norwich end the window with that, I’m not tearing my hair out but I see it as a missed opportunity. 

Ideally a left footed centreback arrives and allows Godfrey to move to the right side and they are the first choice pairing and they play 46 league games. I’m not a huge fan of the spectre of doubt that hangs over the position about who is best and what is the best partnership. 
 

I think Ben Gibson could be the player to come in and allow this to happen - hopefully the club can come to an arrangement with Burnley soon and end the doubt and speculation. 

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I think the issue is that we let in something like 58 goals in 2018/19 and 75 (I think) last season.  Something needs to improve, having the same old options/tactics doesn’t seem to work.  It’s certainly good that we have addressed CDM, but surely we could do with looking at CB too.

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17 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

I think the issue is that we let in something like 58 goals in 2018/19 and 75 (I think) last season.  Something needs to improve, having the same old options/tactics doesn’t seem to work.  It’s certainly good that we have addressed CDM, but surely we could do with looking at CB too.

I don’t think you can draw much in the way of conclusions from last season. 1) We’re in the Championship now and 2), we had the unluckiest injury record in that position of any club in the PL. If we knew they were going to stay fit, I’d be happy with Hanley and Zimbo at the back. Grant was our best CB once he was back to match fitness last season, even Indy agreed he was playing well! I don’t know what we’d do with Godfrey then - CDM perhaps? 😉😂

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15 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

I think the issue is that we let in something like 58 goals in 2018/19 and 75 (I think) last season.  Something needs to improve, having the same old options/tactics doesn’t seem to work.  It’s certainly good that we have addressed CDM, but surely we could do with looking at CB too.

True, but I think it goes beyond a simple ‘the centrebacks aren’t good enough’ solution. I think the problems of 19/20 are different to the problems of 18/19 - and not entirely centre back related. 19/20’s main issue being the lack of fit centre backs and any consistency in that position. 
 

In 18/19 Norwich had a very inexperienced back line. Lewis, Aarons and Godfrey were all learning on the job and they had a keeper who - by his own admission - wasn’t at his best for the first half of the season. 

If Norwich could put out a settled back line - especially with players now having a years more experience - then there should be improvements without needing personnel change. 

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3 hours ago, Kenny Foggo said:

Need to strengthen the centre backs and move on Klose in my opinion... Even more so if Godfrey goes... Really hope Emi stays, would be mightly peeved if he was allowed to leave.

Werent you one who was going on at the end of the season about how our board was going to sell ALL our good young players? And now you're going to be kicking off if one of them does?

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The trouble is it sounds highly unlikely Hanley would stay fit for a whole season, and with both Klose and Zimm in the same category (I'm not sure how close Akim is) and with so many goals shipped the last two season I feel we need to look to improve and bring in fresh blood to our centre back positions 

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Things have gotten fairly quiet for Norwich now. I suspect that we are more or less finished though hoping to ride out the Gibson deal to get more favorable terms. I would also think that we believe the replacements for Buendia, Cantwell, Lewis, and Aarons are already considered to be in the building, though if we suddenly find ourselves flush with case there are a few names on a list we might go at.

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I’m not too sure why people have been getting so excited about Gibson anyway, a player that hasn’t played a competitive game in nearly 2 years now. Perhaps because it’s the desperation for a new CB signing as evidenced by every other post on the board. 

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14 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

The Northern Echo are reporting that Norwich have moved onto other targets from Ben Gibson. https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/sport/18686337.middlesbroughs-hopes-re-signing-ben-gibson-increase/

......or at least Norwich are indicating they are moving on. Piece seems to indicate that Boro will struggle to fund this to Burnley's satisfaction

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35 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

The Northern Echo are reporting that Norwich have moved onto other targets from Ben Gibson. https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/sport/18686337.middlesbroughs-hopes-re-signing-ben-gibson-increase/

 

 

Interesting! Webber seems to go quiet but hard with transfer business. There haven't been many instances where we're had prolonged discussions over multiple weeks. It's either something out of the blue (e.g., Dowell), or we get an inkling and then with a week it's official (e.g., Hugill). So, perhaps, we've genuinely moved on to other targets and can't be bothered with Burnley's feet dragging.

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Burnley appear desperate to get rid of Gibson, Gibson wants to return to Boro yet Boro can't afford him, and we got stuck in the middle of being able to afford him if wanted but wanting Burnley to be reasonable with their asking price and then being held up with him clearly preferring a move elsewhere.

Seems like a no-win situation for all involved, and if I wasn't particularly impressed with him as a player before any transfer interest from us was made, I'm certainly not going to be convinced when he's clearly so disinterested in coming here anyway.

I want players who actually want to wear our shirt and give 100%, even if it's just to use us as a stepping stone on their way up to the very top, what I don't want is a guy who failed miserably to make an impact at Burnley, who has now been totally frozen out, yet still doesn't see us as a fantastic option even if as nothing more to proven Burnley wrong and get himself a move back into the prem either with us or by getting someone else re-interested.

Move on please Webber, as I'd rather take the gamble on finding another player like Zimmermann instead of us blowing a huge chunk of cash on Gibson.

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15 minutes ago, WD40 said:

I’m not too sure why people have been getting so excited about Gibson anyway, a player that hasn’t played a competitive game in nearly 2 years now. Perhaps because it’s the desperation for a new CB signing as evidenced by every other post on the board. 

Or the fact that Gibson was called up to the England squad not too long ago and is a top quality Championship defender who is left footed and good at playing the ball out from the back. I struggle to think of another player with those mix of attributes who is available for Norwich to sign (and wouldn’t cost north of £10m). 

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1 minute ago, Indy_Bones said:

Burnley appear desperate to get rid of Gibson, Gibson wants to return to Boro yet Boro can't afford him, and we got stuck in the middle of being able to afford him if wanted but wanting Burnley to be reasonable with their asking price and then being held up with him clearly preferring a move elsewhere.

Seems like a no-win situation for all involved, and if I wasn't particularly impressed with him as a player before any transfer interest from us was made, I'm certainly not going to be convinced when he's clearly so disinterested in coming here anyway.

I want players who actually want to wear our shirt and give 100%, even if it's just to use us as a stepping stone on their way up to the very top, what I don't want is a guy who failed miserably to make an impact at Burnley, who has now been totally frozen out, yet still doesn't see us as a fantastic option even if as nothing more to proven Burnley wrong and get himself a move back into the prem either with us or by getting someone else re-interested.

Move on please Webber, as I'd rather take the gamble on finding another player like Zimmermann instead of us blowing a huge chunk of cash on Gibson.

Where have you got that from? There is literally no evidence or reason to think that. 

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5 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

Where have you got that from? There is literally no evidence or reason to think that. 

Probably because I would have expected a deal to already have been completed if he was.

It's blindingly obvious his career at Burnely is done, it's also clear that despite Boro being his first choice that they simply don't have the money to make it happen and if they are relying on Burnley to sell him AND pay most of his wages that's highly unlikely as well.

So why would it be a tough call to come here for regular first team football when it's on the table? Reports apparently claim that we were happy to come to a deal, but that he and his agent were supposedly being quite difficult about it all, none of which suggests that he's really wanting to join us.

I admit there's a degree of conjecture here as none us know exactly what's going on, but the limited evidence we do have does point towards him not really being bothered about joining us, and if he thinks Boro are both a better team AND will somehow come up with magic money, then good luck to him and goodbye.

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Agreed. I don't read the situation at all like Indy outlines it. Here's how it looks to me ... Burnley very much want to offload him + Gibson wants away ... all things being equal he'd like Boro BUT Boro can't afford him ... he'd be very happy with a move to Norwich but Burnley want more than Norwich are willing to spend. For now. That's it. In the name of prudence as well as bargaining, Norwich will be looking at other targets. If they find one they like and can come to a deal, they'll do it. If not, Gibson might pop back up on the radar later in the window if better terms can be agreed. Really, it's in the hands of Burnley right now. They might find a club that is willing to pay a price Norwich aren't.

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2 minutes ago, Indy_Bones said:

Probably because I would have expected a deal to already have been completed if he was.

It's blindingly obvious his career at Burnely is done, it's also clear that despite Boro being his first choice that they simply don't have the money to make it happen and if they are relying on Burnley to sell him AND pay most of his wages that's highly unlikely as well.

So why would it be a tough call to come here for regular first team football when it's on the table? Reports apparently claim that we were happy to come to a deal, but that he and his agent were supposedly being quite difficult about it all, none of which suggests that he's really wanting to join us.

I admit there's a degree of conjecture here as none us know exactly what's going on, but the limited evidence we do have does point towards him not really being bothered about joining us, and if he thinks Boro are both a better team AND will somehow come up with magic money, then good luck to him and goodbye.

Well, all reports and evidence that is available suggests that Norwich are an option Gibson would take but Burnley are holding out for a permanent deal and Norwich only want a loan. 

Burnley are notoriously stubborn and a large part of the falling out between them and Gibson came about when Burnley suddenly changed the deal they wanted for Watford to loan Gibson in January. Everything was agreed, only for Burnley to at the last minute ask for a bigger loan fee and a bigger fee should Watford stay up. Gibson felt this last minute change, and the collapse of the deal, was a shoddy move seeing as Burnley had promised to let him go and play first team football. 

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I imagine we couldn’t afford Gibson’s current wages and have offered a loan with option to buy if we get promoted. 

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6 hours ago, All the Germans said:

I genuinely don't get the logic that we have two (decent, if not amazing) backups (when Hanley is fit) for central defence but we MUST get a central defender and we have one (poor) backup for Goalkeeper, but very few are bothered.

Because everyone forgets backup goalkeepers until you need them to play 18 games straight and because it wasn't the exact problem we had last season. Just like generals, football fans on forums are always fighting the last war.

Also because our transfer business is in the main done and we need reserve topics for if we do sign a centre back, otherwise we may  not have anything to bridge the gap with until the start of the Championship season.

Having said that, we probably need a fifth CB and a decent back up keeper but we currently have about 98 players on the books so that's probably not happening without some movement in the other direction. 

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1 minute ago, 1902 said:

Because everyone forgets backup goalkeepers until you need them to play 18 games straight and because it wasn't the exact problem we had last season. Just like generals, football fans on forums are always fighting the last war.

Also because our transfer business is in the main done and we need reserve topics for if we do sign a centre back, otherwise we may  not have anything to bridge the gap with until the start of the Championship season.

Having said that, we probably need a fifth CB and a decent back up keeper but we currently have about 98 players on the books so that's probably not happening without some movement in the other direction. 

Bryan Gunn's injury!

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2 minutes ago, 1902 said:

Because everyone forgets backup goalkeepers until you need them to play 18 games straight and because it wasn't the exact problem we had last season. Just like generals, football fans on forums are always fighting the last war.

Also because our transfer business is in the main done and we need reserve topics for if we do sign a centre back, otherwise we may  not have anything to bridge the gap with until the start of the Championship season.

Having said that, we probably need a fifth CB and a decent back up keeper but we currently have about 98 players on the books so that's probably not happening without some movement in the other direction. 

Not entirely sure but can’t you loan goalkeepers outside of the window in an emergency. 

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For cb's, if we keep Zimmermann and Godfrey and they are both fit, then Gibson would find it hard to get a game here too.

As for goalie, Barden is there in the background. I know he's only 19, but if he shows he has what it takes and he does well against Luton (Krul and McGovern both likely to be away that day) then he could be a good option too.

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1 minute ago, vlad666 said:

Not entirely sure but can’t you loan goalkeepers outside of the window in an emergency. 

I believe so,  unless the rules have changed?

However that doesn't guarantee you can find anyone good and I dont think having a rubbish no.2 counts as an emergency.

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9 minutes ago, 1902 said:

I believe so,  unless the rules have changed?

However that doesn't guarantee you can find anyone good and I dont think having a rubbish no.2 counts as an emergency.

Yeah, I think the emergency goalkeeper loan rule only applies if you have no available senior goalkeepers on the books. It's the reliance on McGovern as a number two that concerns me; if Krul did get a long-term injury, we would be weakening the side massively by relying on McGovern.

Having an old and experienced number three is very common, but unless the powers-that-be rate Barden highly enough to be a number two, I'd be a bit concerned if we didn't bring another keeper in. And I doubt Barden can be held in that high regard, as he's not really been mentioned at all before this season, he was on loan at Bury Town in the eighth tier or whatever last season, and we've also had McCracken, Mair, Johnson, Oxborough and Hayes around the place.

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3 hours ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

Or the fact that Gibson was called up to the England squad not too long ago and is a top quality Championship defender who is left footed and good at playing the ball out from the back. I struggle to think of another player with those mix of attributes who is available for Norwich to sign (and wouldn’t cost north of £10m). 

The salient point there is the price a homegrown defender in the current market costs and where we’re typically shopping. We could see the use of the loan market (dare I say) yet again. It is a risk signing a player that hasn’t played for nearly two years (and three years from that England call up). It’s also pretty clear from what’s coming out he would prefer to go to Boro. So if it’s not meant to be I’m not losing sleep, let’s move swiftly on to next target. 

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Norwich Evening News are saying that Tom Trybull is wanted by Besiktas, also Moritz Leitner is interesting clubs in the championsip & clubs in Germany 

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We signed an expensive alternative GK last season and still had to rely on McGovern! 

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To be fair last season I thought the midfield was equally culpable as the  defenders. The amount of times McLean, Trybull, Leitner or Vrancic were out muscled, weak in the tackle and bypassed like a knife through butter was unreal. Add in the silly square passes etc and that’s where a good proportion of our goals came from. So to get back to transfers, I wouldn’t be too unhappy if we went with the CB’s we’ve got. If Godfrey goes then I’d dip into the transfer market at that point.  I’m not convinced with Gibson. I don’t see him being much better than Hanley and I certainly wouldn’t pay him £35k pw neither. 

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3 hours ago, Top corner said:

Norwich Evening News are saying that Tom Trybull is wanted by Besiktas, also Moritz Leitner is interesting clubs in the championsip & clubs in Germany 

I would much rather see Leitner in Germany , have a big soft spot for that guy.  I think he would upgrade most championship teams and certainly dont want to see him play against us.

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