From EDP 24 - this is a good read

[BroadstairsR 2,163]

2 hours ago, Capt. Pants said:

A post-mortem of this terrible season is inevitable but the only one that matters is the one held within the club. 

For me player retention and recruitment is key for next season. We must get better at that.

True and I think that I have already had my fill of them. The club, Webber, Delia, the coach and the players all seem to have come under attack from left right and centre. In the press, television pundits, from ex-players from wherever they originate, on social media, on TWTD and, of course on here. Suddenly from being the "best team at the foot of the PL" there has come about a cascade of criticism, and even ridicule, from here there and everywhere.

Leave the post- mortems to those working at the club, in their varying capacities.

 

We know the score, we know what went awfully wrong to the nth degree,  but would many of us want to drastically change anything at the club going forward? Not me, for sure.

 

As you say, let's  concentrate upon and prepare for next season so that we can all have the collective 'last laugh.'  There remain many positives, let's concentrate upon those, count the dosh and get it right the next time the opportunity arrives; which could be sooner rather than later. 

Edited July 16, 2020 by BroadstairsR

[Canary Wundaboy 1,359]

14 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

The one thing I can’t quite tally is that last August just about everyone bought into the ‘we will be relegated’ thing.   I didn’t agree with our no spending policy, but most did.  
The upshot/reality seems to be somewhat different - we are seeing a pretty weird level of blame/navel-gazing to a degree that I find rather bemusing to say the least given it was expected. 

I was prepared to be relegated because we weren't good enough, but I at least expected us to show some fight for it. That was evident at the beginning of the season (Liverpool, Newcastle, Man City) but somewhere around Christmas we just seemed to go lifeless, resulting in a frankly appalling end to the campaign where we've never looked like competing. I can handle us falling short, what I'm struggling to understand is how so many things have gone so wrong, the recruitment has been awful, the tactics have been wrong, the players haven't shown enough fight or endeavour and we're going down on a record-breaking bad season. That's why so many people are questioning what's going on, as last summer we were convinced this was a great side that would be able to compete and that it was Sheff U that would struggle, how did we get it so badly wrong?

[Badger 2,405]

2 hours ago, yellow_belly said:

I respectfully disagree with your love letter Lakey.

Both Darren Eadie and Jamie Cureton are correct with their analysis and we have no right to get out of the league again. I do not think we will with our squad, but we may get lucky again?!

You can't argue that luck exists when good things happen but then say that no such thing exists when bad things happen!

FWIW, I think that we did have some good luck last season, but equally we have had some bad luck this season (although I would prefer to describe it as random variation around the norm 😃).

[lake district canary 4,531]

14 minutes ago, Canary Wundaboy said:

I was prepared to be relegated because we weren't good enough, but I at least expected us to show some fight for it. That was evident at the beginning of the season (Liverpool, Newcastle, Man City) but somewhere around Christmas we just seemed to go lifeless, resulting in a frankly appalling end to the campaign where we've never looked like competing.

 Have you actually really thought that through? After Christmas, was it so bad? Was the 2-2 Spurs game so bad? The home wins over Bn'mth and Leicester win and ther draw with Crystal Palace? The away draw with Newcastle where we totally outplayed them.....the performance at Spurs where we narrowly lost, the only two poor performances were at Man U and Wolves....we even managed to give Liverpool a really good game at home.   So it is a bit harsh to say we had no fight since Christmas.  What has been really dire is the effect of the break in the season and the results since then - and yes, it's been hard to watch since then.

I get the emotions and disappointment of it all, but it has not been all bad this season and up to the break we were still in with a chance. The break, for whatever reasons people want to find has not been kind to us and it has been dire, but there have been high spots up to that break.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,023]

Not arguing with the article, just arguing with the "get lucky again" comment, if any of you have a reasonable answer to how only losing 6 games in a season and winning 27, drawing 13 and amassing 94 points is "lucky" I am happy to listen, I will not be waiting around for a reasonable response, indeed any kind of response to what is a reasonable question........

[Feedthewolf 4,846]

A pretty fair article, I reckon. Even as a firm believer in the long-term model the club are trying to use, I am mindful that the sheer capitulation towards the end of the season has put a much greater premium on starting next season well. If we fail to win promotion next season, there will be a lot more questions asked of the structure and future of the club from the top down.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,023]

Now we have history being rewritten, apparently it all went wrong round about Christmas, yet I thought we started to pick up a little, do not get me wrong, we were not still good enough to stay up. I doubted my memory, which given my age I need to do so I thought I would have a quick look - From the start of the season to 14th December 12 points from 18 games (and a defeat at Crawley in the League Cup), from 14th December to lockdown 9 points from 11 games and three wins in the FA Cup, so if anything a slight improvement from Christmas onwards, but as I said still not good enough. Like everybody else I am at a loss to understand how poor and disinterested we have looked since the restart and that really should be the main area of concern......

[nutty nigel 7,531]

SOB and Lakey are right about the games between Christmas and lockdown. But if last season is seen as luck what hope is there of ever getting anything right.

Since lockdown the results speak for themselves. No getting away from that. But when folk say its the same for every team I think that's being a bit unfair. Norwich are the only team for whom everything had to go right to succeed. Anyway, they're my team and I wasn't there to help them. 

[yellow_belly 226]

1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

 Have you actually really thought that through? After Christmas, was it so bad? Was the 2-2 Spurs game so bad? The home wins over Bn'mth and Leicester win and ther draw with Crystal Palace? The away draw with Newcastle where we totally outplayed them.....the performance at Spurs where we narrowly lost, the only two poor performances were at Man U and Wolves....we even managed to give Liverpool a really good game at home.   So it is a bit harsh to say we had no fight since Christmas.  What has been really dire is the effect of the break in the season and the results since then - and yes, it's been hard to watch since then.

I get the emotions and disappointment of it all, but it has not been all bad this season and up to the break we were still in with a chance. The break, for whatever reasons people want to find has not been kind to us and it has been dire, but there have been high spots up to that break.

Lakey old chap... we were bottom of the league at Christmas... stayed there exclusively until Lockdown and will be relegated in the bottom place. Please get a reality check.

YOU are the reason I put up the alternative argument / facts. 

[king canary 7,604]

56 minutes ago, Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB said:

Now we have history being rewritten, apparently it all went wrong round about Christmas, yet I thought we started to pick up a little, do not get me wrong, we were not still good enough to stay up. I doubted my memory, which given my age I need to do so I thought I would have a quick look - From the start of the season to 14th December 12 points from 18 games (and a defeat at Crawley in the League Cup), from 14th December to lockdown 9 points from 11 games and three wins in the FA Cup, so if anything a slight improvement from Christmas onwards, but as I said still not good enough. Like everybody else I am at a loss to understand how poor and disinterested we have looked since the restart and that really should be the main area of concern......

I think the post Christmas 'bounce' gets rewritten in both ways- I saw plenty as we approach the restart claiming our form pre lockdown suggested us staying up which I don't think it was- as you say we were  still collecting less than a point a game which just wouldn't have been enough. 

To say last season was lucky is clearly nonsense though- how anyone can claim it with a straight face is beyond me. There is a certain element of 'stars aligning' last season but that is very different to being lucky.

[yellow_belly 226]

7 minutes ago, king canary said:

I think the post Christmas 'bounce' gets rewritten in both ways- I saw plenty as we approach the restart claiming our form pre lockdown suggested us staying up which I don't think it was- as you say we were  still collecting less than a point a game which just wouldn't have been enough. 

To say last season was lucky is clearly nonsense though- how anyone can claim it with a straight face is beyond me. There is a certain element of 'stars aligning' last season but that is very different to being lucky.

Ok. Good post. I will happily state that we were not lucky last season... but things went better than planned. This season has been a shambles. Fair enough?

[nutty nigel 7,531]

All the stars didn't align this season. We needed them to.

[lake district canary 4,531]

42 minutes ago, yellow_belly said:

Lakey old chap... we were bottom of the league at Christmas... stayed there exclusively until Lockdown and will be relegated in the bottom place. Please get a reality check.

YOU are the reason I put up the alternative argument / facts. 

Then you are stupid. There are a lot of factors involved and simplistic "we were bottom and stayed there" type comments just demean the team and the efforts they put in and ignore the factors that affected the situation.

[king canary 7,604]

6 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Then you are stupid. There are a lot of factors involved and simplistic "we were bottom and stayed there" type comments just demean the team and the efforts they put in and ignore the factors that affected the situation.

Like haircuts?

[Highland Canary 76]

We didn’t invest. The outcome was predictable. Maybe those content with such failure will understand the need for investment. Or maybe this season’s disaster is the limit of their ambition.

[Mr.Carrow 376]

Two of those touted to leave (Cantwell and Godfrey) were not even key players last season. Most of the players that carved up the championship will still be here. Exciting youngsters have been blooded and already look comfortable at premier level (Idah and Martin). Loads of new signings some of whom are extremely highly rated. Anybody who thinks things don't look positive for next season are either delusional or trolls.

[Mello Yello 2,289]

Well I've twice reread the column written by Melissa and I can't for the life of me see where she mentions the words luck or lucky?....

I thought the debate and discussion on this thread was to be about Melissa's current opinion and thoughts about our brief and unsuccessful dalliance in the Premiership, including our pathetic poor show and capitulation in the Prem's post lock-down resumption?....But then along came that word 'lucky'.....Whoosh!.....In like Flint they came, ignore the writer's musings let's get our 'gummy bear' jaws around it and focus on that word 'lucky'.....and off they went....

But then I suppose elements of her column are slightly negative and somewhat an ickle bit critique towards the current team's futile efforts and maybe a tad negative toward our hierarchy at the club.....Dare do that on this 'ere forum...an' yer on a hiding to nothin'....

Forget 'lucky' we shouldn't be talking about the past, we should be discussing the present and the future of the club..... 

There are those who stand for nothing fall for anything.... 

    

 

[Canary Wundaboy 1,359]

2 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

Two of those touted to leave (Cantwell and Godfrey) were not even key players last season. Most of the players that carved up the championship will still be here. Exciting youngsters have been blooded and already look comfortable at premier level (Idah and Martin). Loads of new signings some of whom are extremely highly rated. Anybody who thinks things don't look positive for next season are either delusional or trolls.

Let's break that down quickly. Yes, a lot of the players that formed part of the Championship-winning first 11 will probably still be here next season. However, while it would be fair to assume some will have learned and improved from playing against in the higher tier, it's also probable that some of the older players will be a little slower, a little more injury-prone and perhaps less effective, and that's before we get into the psychological impact of having such a godawful season just gone. I agree that Idah and Martin look positive, but short cameo appearances do not mean they can perform at that level twice a week every week in the Chaps, it's a totally different beast. A lot of the new signings are promising, but so were some of the signings in the summer (not so much January) and I think we can all agree they've been very disappointing.

I still think we have the core of a promotion-contending team, but I do worry the damage that has been done and who we'll lose this coming window.

[lake district canary 4,531]

42 minutes ago, king canary said:

Like haircuts?

Everything happens for a reason.

[king canary 7,604]

11 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

Two of those touted to leave (Cantwell and Godfrey) were not even key players last season. Most of the players that carved up the championship will still be here. Exciting youngsters have been blooded and already look comfortable at premier level (Idah and Martin). Loads of new signings some of whom are extremely highly rated. Anybody who thinks things don't look positive for next season are either delusional or trolls.

I don't think that is a fair assessment at all.

The Championship is littered with clubs who come down with the strongest squads 'on paper' but can't bounce back up. Momentum, confidence, form are all important and all hugely difficult to recapture when you lose them. It is deeply naive to think those who carved up the league last year but struggled this time around will just revert to what they were before. We saw it under Worthington, we saw it under Neil and it isn't delusional or trolling to be concerned we might see it under Farke.

I looked yesterday at an article about the 6 teams with the lowest points totals to be relegated from the Premier League- we'll be in that group after this season and of those 6 only 1 bounced back at the first attempt and that was Sunderland who basically bought an entire new squad in the summer.

[WD40 720]

4 minutes ago, king canary said:

I looked yesterday at an article about the 6 teams with the lowest points totals to be relegated from the Premier League- we'll be in that group after this season and of those 6 only 1 bounced back at the first attempt and that was Sunderland who basically bought an entire new squad in the summer.

I expect buying an entire new squad is what Webber would like to do.

[Mr.Carrow 376]

24 minutes ago, king canary said:

I don't think that is a fair assessment at all.

The Championship is littered with clubs who come down with the strongest squads 'on paper' but can't bounce back up. Momentum, confidence, form are all important and all hugely difficult to recapture when you lose them. It is deeply naive to think those who carved up the league last year but struggled this time around will just revert to what they were before. We saw it under Worthington, we saw it under Neil and it isn't delusional or trolling to be concerned we might see it under Farke.

I looked yesterday at an article about the 6 teams with the lowest points totals to be relegated from the Premier League- we'll be in that group after this season and of those 6 only 1 bounced back at the first attempt and that was Sunderland who basically bought an entire new squad in the summer.

We will almost certainly have, on paper, a stronger squad than when we were champions so I think my comment that it is delusional not to be positive is accurate. Many of the clubs that have come down and struggled have had squads full of established premier players who just don't seem up for the grind of the championship. I don't think we will have that problem. 

Do you really think it's unlikely that we will be challenging for promotion next season? If not then you are positive just like me.

[king canary 7,604]

5 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

We will almost certainly have, on paper, a stronger squad than when we were champions so I think my comment that it is delusional not to be positive is accurate. Many of the clubs that have come down and struggled have had squads full of established premier players who just don't seem up for the grind of the championship. I don't think we will have that problem. 

Do you really think it's unlikely that we will be challenging for promotion next season? If not then you are positive just like me.

I have no idea where we'll be next season to be honest- I'm neither positive or negative on our chances because there are far too many unknowns.

Nothing wrong with being positive about our chances but I certainly don't view those thing we might struggle to go straight back up as delusional. 

[nutty nigel 7,531]

28 minutes ago, king canary said:

I have no idea where we'll be next season to be honest- I'm neither positive or negative on our chances because there are far too many unknowns.

Nothing wrong with being positive about our chances but I certainly don't view those thing we might struggle to go straight back up as delusional. 

I haven't got a Scooby either. Who could have predicted the events of this season. It's quite possible there will be more non football influences next season. 

Tell you what though, if it was a choice between a season of struggle where we could go to games and winning the league behind closed doors I'd take the season of struggle without a second thought.

[wcorkcanary 4,334]

8 hours ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

Yes, a decent read. Opinions vary as to our demise but as kc says it’s good to see a bit of healthy criticism from Archant’s contributors. 

The really shocking reveal for me was that we’ve had just 10 shots on target in those 7 League matches.

Pitiful, truly pitiful.

Half of them were probably from Idah. ... and he only gets 10-15 mins a game.

[wcorkcanary 4,334]

5 hours ago, Feedthewolf said:

A pretty fair article, I reckon. Even as a firm believer in the long-term model the club are trying to use, I am mindful that the sheer capitulation towards the end of the season has put a much greater premium on starting next season well. If we fail to win promotion next season, there will be a lot more questions asked of the structure and future of the club from the top down.

I get what you are saying Wolfo and largely agree, except I would easily be prepared to use the two seasons of parachute money to consolidate and improve all round, in depth and across the squad.  I'm no happy Clapper but have been  involved in footy admin, therefore am very patient and know that the best laid plans can mess up.  I still expect improvements, big ones, mostly on the physical side as technically we arent bad  We just arent big, strongo or quick   enough for the prem yet. I wont panic  if we dont bounce straight back as  nothing is certain, I do however expect big changes in personel in next 2 years. 

[yellow_belly 226]

5 hours ago, lake district canary said:

Then you are stupid. There are a lot of factors involved and simplistic "we were bottom and stayed there" type comments just demean the team and the efforts they put in and ignore the factors that affected the situation.

I am afraid old chap, it is you that is stupid. 
 

as long as they played well!

[nutty nigel 7,531]

Is poor old Lakey only stupid as long as we played well? Or is it they played well...

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,023]

7 hours ago, yellow_belly said:

Ok. Good post. I will happily state that we were not lucky last season... but things went better than planned. This season has been a shambles. Fair enough?

Thanks for that yellow belly. Personally I do not see our season as a shambles, disappointing, but not a shambles........

[Mr.Carrow 376]

5 hours ago, king canary said:

I have no idea where we'll be next season to be honest- I'm neither positive or negative on our chances because there are far too many unknowns.

Nothing wrong with being positive about our chances but I certainly don't view those thing we might struggle to go straight back up as delusional. 

Fair enough, perhaps the word is inappropriate. From my perspective the positives are concrete- Webber, Farke and the recruitment team who got us up last season will still be here, as will most of our best performers from last year. We have money to spend and already have some exciting additions. The negatives are mostly speculative though of course there are plenty of things that theoretically can go wrong. One thing that is patently obvious however is that realistic positivity from the fanbase can only help matters.