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From EDP 24 - this is a good read

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On the point the article makes about losing mentality, that was something Webber was very clear he didn’t want to bring into the club by recruiting relegated players. So if he believes that some players can infect the whole mentality does it stand to reason that he feels a wholesale clear out is needed to sweep the losing mentality away?

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A post-mortem of this terrible season is inevitable but the only one that matters is the one held within the club. 

For me player retention and recruitment is key for next season. We must get better at that.

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Webber was perfectly clear. The club COULD NOT bring in the kinds of players it wanted. They may have tried to get a defender but anyone that fitted the bill was either too expensive or not available.  It was also perfectly clear that the club would not spend that much and we were told so at the beginning. The club in the previous season did not have money to buy itself out of the chamionship - we were in the early stages of rebuilding the finances of the club after getting rid of all the big wage contracts. That we got out of that league was remarkable, given the circumstances.

He confirmed that this season we were STILL rebuilding the finances and were NEVER going to spend a large amount.  Because of that rebuilding we NOW have money to spend next season which will help build the squad to a better strength. It is the plan, it has been since the start and it will be the same next season - a gradual build.

On to this season and we all know what happened, but some people are fixated by the Southampton match, yet that was the first of the unknown - NO-ONE knew how the lockdown restart behind closed doors would affect the players, yet it has been clear in hindsight that particularly in those first few games at the restart,  teams were doing better away from home and that the bottom teams were struggling to get anywhere.  It was the first match and we learned the hard way.

Whatever chance we had for staying up went with the lockdown, that should be clear to anyone now we have all seen how it has transpired.  I was hopeful that we could come back and make the lockdown work in our favour somehow, but it is clear the opposite happened. 

So we are down, but recriminations should be minimal imo - the break in the season and the way we have had to cram games in with 5 subs possible and our inexperienced squad and lack of fit defenders, has done for us.  I've seen people say we were "unprepared" "unfit" "not trying hard enough"...........that is total b*ll*x. 

People will spin it in different ways and I suppose that is up to them, but the underlying truth is plain to see. We are rebuilding the club, this was always going to be a hard season and whatever we had going for us in terms of momentum disappeared with the defensive injuries and then the lockdown...and more defensive injuries.  The 5 sub rule was just the final factor - same for all clubs? My ar$e. 

Edited by lake district canary
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Melissa is usually a bit of a refreshing read- I don't always agree with her but I think her and Gary Gowers on MFW are generally a bit more willing to be critical than some.

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7 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Webber was perfectly clear. The club COULD NOT bring in the kinds of players it wanted. They may have tried to get a defender but anyone that fitted the bill was either too expensive or not available.  It was also perfectly clear that the club would not spend that much and we were told so at the beginning. The club in the previous season did not have money to buy itself out of the chamionship - we were in the early stages of rebuilding the finances of the club after getting rid of all the big wage contracts. That we got out of that league was remarkable, given the circumstances.

He confirmed that this season we were STILL rebuilding the finances and were NEVER going to spend a large amount.  Because of that rebuilding we NOW have money to spend next season which will help build the squad to a better strength. It is the plan, it has been since the start and it will be the same next season - a gradual build.

On to this season and we all know what happened, but some people are fixated by the Southampton match, yet that was the first of the unknown - NO-ONE knew how the lockdown restart behind closed doors would affect the players, yet it has been clear in hindsight that particularly in those first few games at the restart,  teams were doing better away from home and that the bottom teams were struggling to get anywhere.  It was the first match and we learned the hard way.

Whatever chance we had for staying up went with the lockdown, that should be clear to anyone now we have all seen how it has transpired.  I was hopeful that we could come back and make the lockdown work in our favour somehow, but it is clear the opposite happened. 

So we are down, but recriminations should be minimal imo - the break in the season and the way we have had to cram games in with 5 subs possible and our inexperienced squad and lack of fit defenders, has done for us.  I've seen people say we were "unprepared" "unfit" "not trying hard enough"...........that is total b*ll*x. 

People will spin it in different ways and I suppose that is up to them, but the underlying truth is plain to see. We are rebuilding the club, this was always going to be a hard season and whatever we had going for us in terms of momentum disappeared with the defensive injuries and then the lockdown...and more defensive injuries.  The 5 sub rule was just the final factor - same for all clubs? My ar$e. 

I respectfully disagree with your love letter Lakey.

Both Darren Eadie and Jamie Cureton are correct with their analysis and we have no right to get out of the league again. I do not think we will with our squad, but we may get lucky again?!

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Yes, a decent read. Opinions vary as to our demise but as kc says it’s good to see a bit of healthy criticism from Archant’s contributors. 

The really shocking reveal for me was that we’ve had just 10 shots on target in those 7 League matches.

Pitiful, truly pitiful.

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When Webber turned up we had a year of parachute payments left and two years left of liabilities on expensive contracts Naismith, Jarvis, Klose and Pinto amongst others. With a large squad earning on average £28k each the wage bill wasn't sustainable. With a target of £10k-£15k the whole squad needed to be replaced and slimmed down.

So Webber set about transitioning the squad. Zimmermann arrived as a free transfer from the German fourth tier, Farke remembered the initial promise of the nomadic Tom Trybull at Werder Bremen and he came in on a free. Moritz Leitner, who had sat on the bench in a Champions League final, was another whose career had stalled. Tim Krul and Teemu Pukki were also added on free transfers. Young players James Maddison, Jamal Lewis, Max Aarons, Ben Godfrey, Josh Murphy and Todd Cantwell were give opportunties and developed. Bundesliga 2 was trawled for talent, adding Marco Stiepermann, Mario Vrancic (and duds like Philip Heise and Marcel Franke)

We've seen before in the Championship that some quality is needed, but that teamwork and fitness can beat teams with more ability. Lambert's Norwich quality wise weren't as talented as Swansea or Cardiff, but they ran harder, faster and for longer than any team in that division.

Once you get to the Premiership though, hard work can't bridge the gap. Each squad on average was bigger and quicker than others.

The problem was that Norwich got promoted too soon, but you're always going to take the promotion and the finances that go with in. The players deserved the opportunity, even if it had been constructed on a limited budget.

The hope now (even with COVID losses) is that there is now some serious working capital to overhaul the squad. Dave Freezer had said on deadline day that the club had £10m-£15m in transfer surplus (which The Sun recently said was £20m), and that's not considering any sales of our young talent. The parachute payments are far larger than our Championship wage bill. Even the broadcasters rebate is going to be deducted out of our Year 2 parachute payment (if we haven't gone back up)

Edited by Icecream Snow
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5 minutes ago, Icecream Snow said:

When Webber turned up we had a year of parachute payments left and two years left of liabilities on expensive contracts Naismith, Jarvis, Klose and Pinto amongst others. With a large squad earning on average £28k each the wage bill wasn't sustainable. With a target of £10k-£15k the whole squad needed to be replaced and slimmed down.

So Webber set about transitioning the squad. Zimmermann arrived as a free transfer from the German fourth tier, Farke remembered the initial promise of the nomadic Tom Trybull at Werder Bremen and he came in on a free. Moritz Leitner, who had sat on the bench in a Champions League final, was another whose career had stalled. Tim Krul and Teemu Pukki were also added on free transfers. Young players James Maddison, Jamal Lewis, Max Aarons, Ben Godfrey, Josh Murphy and Todd Cantwell were give opportunties and developed. Bundesliga 2 was trawled for talent, adding Marco Stiepermann, Mario Vrancic (and duds like Philip Heise and Marcel Franke)

We've seen before in the Championship that some quality is needed, but that teamwork and fitness can beat teams with more ability. Lambert's Norwich quality wise weren't as talented as Swansea or Cardiff, but they ran harder, faster and for longer than any team in that division.

Once you get to the Premiership though, hard work can't bridge the gap. Each squad on average was bigger and quicker than others.

The problem was that Norwich got promoted too soon, but you're always going to take the promotion and the finances that go with in. The players deserved the opportunity, even if it had been constructed on a limited budget.

The hope now (even with COVID losses) is that there is now some serious working capital to overhaul the squad. Dave Freezer had said on deadline day that the club had £10m-£15m in transfer surplus (which The Sun recently said was £20m), and that's not considering any sales of our young talent. The parachute payments are far larger than our Championship wage bill. Even the broadcasters rebate is going to be deducted out of our Year 2 parachute payment (if we haven't gone back up)

Shame that we didn’t spend the £10-20M on some decent players rather than **** all on **** ones like Duda and Rupp!

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17 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

 

The really shocking reveal for me was that we’ve had just 10 shots on target in those 7 League matches.

Pitiful, truly pitiful.

I'm shocked too, didn't think it was anywhere near double figures......

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Personally I dont buy into the not spending argument. We were shopping in a different market and on paper these signings should've worked. They didnt.

Fahrmann, nearly 200 games in the bundesliga/champions league for Shalke.

Amadou, a captain of Lille who earned a £12m move to Sevilla.

Roberts, a player who joined man city as a teenager for £7m, who enjoyed successful spells on loan at celtic.

Duda, 11 assists and 6 goals the season before for H.Berlin in the Bundesliga.

On paper these looked good signings, they didnt work out. 4 successful loan signings couldve been enough for us to have been more than safe this season.

 

 

 

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So 27 wins, 13 draws and only 6 defeats culminating in 94 points is the new lucky!!. I get the disappointment and of course there needs to be criticism and a review of what went wrong.........but lucky?.......really. That just shows the OP is after a response and I know I have given them one but I just felt the need to start shouting back at these trolls........

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It’s a good article, well written I think she brutally exposes the sheer incompetence of the leadership at the club this season

this really can’t go on for another season it’s soul destroying to watch them systematically destroy our once great club 

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So what part of Melissa's thoughts, opinions and observations coupled with her constructive criticism are incorrect and wide of the mark?....Melissa is a Norwich City fan, she is probably just as frustrated, annoyed, embarrassed and truly concerned....and is most likely hurting as much as I and thousands of others are.... 

In my personal opinion, I wholly concur with her comments and opinions and she's just saying how it is....at this moment in time....

For some 'others' to continually say that the 'questionable support' and those 'alleged' club critical 'usual suspects' and them so called 'NCFC pariahs' are probably now gleefully gloating, guffawing and are thoroughly enjoying and revelling in the moment at our free fall and the present predicament that our club sadly finds itself in.....Is just quite frankly totally incorrect....pathetic, puerile and downright absolute crass....

Anyway...."The Table Don't Lie".....

 

  

 

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23 minutes ago, Uncle Fred said:

It’s a good article, well written I think she brutally exposes the sheer incompetence of the leadership at the club this season

this really can’t go on for another season it’s soul destroying to watch them systematically destroy our once great club 

This was my point. It is not trolling to say this was not good enough.

We can’t continue to foster a culture of blaming the past... it was Chase’s fault, it was McNally’s fault, it was Alex Neil’s fault, it was Naismith’s fault. Etc.

This season was simply:

Board’s fault for not allowing a little more money to be sensibly spent...

Webber’s fault for not bringing in players / players of any quality, believing his hype...

Farke’s fault for not learning from his mistakes, believing his hype, having a different plan, zonal marking, not getting the players up for the challenge (consistently)...

The players fault for believing their hype stupid decisions, mistakes and not ‘showing’ their all to ‘try’ and stay in the league. (Eadie was spot on when he said, 

“ I would have hated to be called the best team at the bottom of the league. Don’t patronize me!”

 

This season the football has been awful to watch. We have been bottom of the league since Christmas- so don’t say that the coronavirus got us relegated! (Obviously it didn’t help). The records do speak volumes about this team and club at the moment. It time to see if the Club, Webber, Farke and players are as good as ‘the hype’ ... time will tell.

But we must do better, and the fact that NCFC keep getting linked with every third rate player in Europe doesn’t fill me with Much confidence. Granted we got Pukki and Buendia... but we also got a lot more duds! (Or Duda’s!!) 

Am I wrong?

 

 

Edited by yellow_belly

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7 minutes ago, yellow_belly said:

This was my point. It is not trolling to say this was not good enough.

We can’t continue to foster a culture of blaming the past... it was Chase’s fault, it was McNally’s fault, it was Alex Neil’s fault, it was Naismith’s fault. Etc.

This season was simply:

Board’s fault for not allowing a little more money to be sensibly spent...

Webber’s fault for not bringing in players / players of any quality, believing his hype...

Farke’s fault for not learning from his mistakes, believing his hype, having a different plan, zonal marking, not getting the players up for the challenge (consistently)...

The players fault for believing their hype stupid decisions, mistakes and not ‘showing’ their all to ‘try’ and stay in the league. (Eadie was spot on when he said, 

“ I would have hated to be called the best team at the bottom of the league. Don’t patronize me!”

 

This season the football has been awful to watch. We have been bottom of the league since Christmas- so don’t say that the coronavirus got us relegated! (Obviously it didn’t help). The records do speak volumes about this team and club at the moment. It time to see if the Club, Webber, Farke and players are as good as ‘the hype’ ... time will tell.

But we must do better, and the fact that NCFC keep getting linked with every third rate player in Europe doesn’t fill me with Much confidence. Granted we got Pukki and Buendia... but we also got a lot more duds! (Or Duda’s!!) 

Am I wrong?

 

 

Wise words Mr Belly, I like the cut of your jib 

I think you have clinically analysed the situation and it’s almost impossible to argue with your logic 

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1 minute ago, Uncle Fred said:

Wise words Mr Belly, I like the cut of your jib 

I think you have clinically analysed the situation and it’s almost impossible to argue with your logic 

Thank you. 👍

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Lakey will 

20 minutes ago, Uncle Fred said:

Wise words Mr Belly, I like the cut of your jib 

I think you have clinically analysed the situation and it’s almost impossible to argue with your logic 

Lakey will cut your argument to ribbons around 14.20hrs. Get ready and please read it properly as he doesn’t want to keep repeating himself.

Edited by Midlands Yellow

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4 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said:
18 minutes ago, Uncle Fred said:

Wise words Mr Belly, I like the cut of your jib 

I think you have clinically analysed the situation and it’s almost impossible to argue with your logic 

Lakey will cut your argument to ribbons around 14.20hrs. Get ready and please read it properly as he doesn’t to keep repeating what he has written. 

I'll do it earlier to save you waiting.

I'll sum it up in three words -

It's all rubbish.

Edited by lake district canary

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3 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

I'll do it earlier to save you waiting.

I'll sum it up in three words -

It's all rubbish.

ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME!

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7 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

I'll do it earlier to save you waiting.

I'll sum it up in three words -

It's all rubbish.

I agree Lakey. This season was, in your words... “it’s all rubbish.”

Straight to the point Mr Lakey. The club, Webber, Farke and players must do better.

 

well said.

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11 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

I'll do it earlier to save you waiting.

I'll sum it up in three words -

It's all rubbish.

Please explain, (sensibly) line by line where I am wrong? You can’t, because I am not wrong. 
 

1/ We can’t continue to foster a culture of blaming the past... it was Chase’s fault, it was McNally’s fault, it was Alex Neil’s fault, it was Naismith’s fault. Etc.

- Lakey Etc. Do you think it is correct to live in the past and blame everyone else? If so why?

This season was simply:

Board’s fault for not allowing a little more money to be sensibly spent...

- Lakey Etc. Please clarify why / how they did well? Why should they not learn from this mistake? What should they do going forward?

Webber’s fault for not bringing in players / players of any quality, believing his hype...


- Lakey Etc. Please clarify why / how they did well? Why should they not learn from this mistake? What should they do going forward?

Farke’s fault for not learning from his mistakes, believing his hype, having a different plan, zonal marking, not getting the players up for the challenge (consistently)...

- Lakey Etc. Please clarify why / how they did well? Why should they not learn from this mistake? What should they do going forward?

The players fault for believing their hype stupid decisions, mistakes and not ‘showing’ their all to ‘try’ and stay in the league. (Eadie was spot on when he said, 

“ I would have hated to be called the best team at the bottom of the league. Don’t patronize me!”

 

- Lakey Etc. Please clarify why / how they did well? Why should they not learn from this mistake? What should they do going forward?

 

This season the football has been awful to watch. We have been bottom of the league since Christmas- so don’t say that the coronavirus got us relegated! (Obviously it didn’t help). The records do speak volumes about this team and club at the moment. It time to see if the Club, Webber, Farke and players are as good as ‘the hype’ ... time will tell.

- Lakey Etc. Please clarify why / how they did well? Why should they not learn from this mistake? What should they do going forward?

But we must do better, and the fact that NCFC keep getting linked with every third rate player in Europe doesn’t fill me with Much confidence. Granted we got Pukki and Buendia... but we also got a lot more duds! (Or Duda’s!!) 

- Lakey Etc. Please clarify why / how they did well? Why should they not learn from this mistake? What should they do going forward?

Am I wrong?

- Lakey Etc. Please clarify why I am wrong?

Edited by yellow_belly

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35 minutes ago, Uncle Fred said:

Wise words Mr Belly, I like the cut of your jib 

I think you have clinically analysed the situation and it’s almost impossible to argue with your logic 

Aren't you talking to yourself here?

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The one thing I can’t quite tally is that last August just about everyone bought into the ‘we will be relegated’ thing.   I didn’t agree with our no spending policy, but most did.  
The upshot/reality seems to be somewhat different - we are seeing a pretty weird level of blame/navel-gazing to a degree that I find rather bemusing to say the least given it was expected. 

Edited by Branston Pickle
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2 hours ago, yellow_belly said:

I respectfully disagree with your love letter Lakey.

Both Darren Eadie and Jamie Cureton are correct with their analysis and we have no right to get out of the league again. I do not think we will with our squad, but we may get lucky again?!

We didn't get "lucky" last season.

"Lucky" teams don't score nearly 100 goals and finish top of the league over the entirety of a season.

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6 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

The one thing I can’t quite tally is that last August just about everyone bought into the ‘we will be relegated’ thing.   I didn’t agree with our no spending policy, but most did.  
The upshot/reality seems to be somewhat different - we are seeing a pretty weird level of blame/navel-gazing to a degree that I find rather bemusing to say the least given it was expected. 

There is a right way to get relegated. The way Webber talked about this at the time was along the lines “we will give it a right good go, but still might fall short”. And it just looks and feels like we haven’t really given it as good a go as we could have, from top to bottom.

It is revisionism to say that this was expected. Effort was expected.

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My issue is that people’s opinions are getting skewed by what’s happened since the restart, rather than the season as a whole.  If we’d completed the kseason as at lockdown I think everyone would have been quite upbeat.  Ultimately, the results and performances since restart have been lacklustre, and we do have to look at that, but we’ve not been helped by injuries in defence (a separate issue) and loss of form of our main striker.

Edited by Branston Pickle
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2 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

My issue is that people’s opinions are getting skewed by what’s happened since the restart, rather than the season as a whole.  If we’d completed the season as at lockdown I think everyone would have been quite upbeat.  
 

Do you mean staying up by default? 

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