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Canary Jedi

“Farke has lost the players” - Robbie Earl

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4 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

Turgid football is season one, good football in season two, a complete disaster in season three with unwanted records littering our history but you have faith in both of them for season four. Whatever do you base that on ?

Season one was a transition season, good football in season two, poor recruitment in season three. You can put whatever spin on it you want but I'd prefer to support the team.

Webber in particular, aside from getting the recruitment wrong this season, has done an excellent job - transforming our club - and they both deserve our trust.

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8 minutes ago, Yellow and Green said:

Season one was a transition season, good football in season two, poor recruitment in season three. You can put whatever spin on it you want but I'd prefer to support the team.

Webber in particular, aside from getting the recruitment wrong this season, has done an excellent job - transforming our club - and they both deserve our trust.

Please don't take criticism of this current shambles by many as an angle to suggest they do not support the team/club. As for Webber deserving our trust he is losing a lot of goodwill built up for what he has done surely ?

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There’s plenty of ‘supporters’ on here who don’t show a great deal support for the team/club, behaving worse than spoilt children when things don’t go their way.

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For me the difference between Season 1 and 2 was the pace of play. After the M'Boro game we gained confidence and generally played more quickly and with more movement off the ball, with some directness. This time we've been too slow, completely nullifying any attacking threat.

We have weirdly persisted with an utterly naive formation with no real full backs allowing the opposition acres of space. Last season we conceded loads of silly goals at crucial times before and after half time. The defence is just as bad as then, but even with Zimmerman and Hanly fit I am not sure  it would have made much difference. Having to play 20 passes to and from the goalie just to hope to get half way is not really a recipe for great success. 

I was desperate for Farke to do well but IMO he has lost it.

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30 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

I don't think the football was much different between season one and two. We just scored some goals. Apart from that what was different?

Confidence. Players looked like they were playing well and getting the results. Gets the crowd onside and it repeats and repeats.

And a full season of Emi who I believe is still our most valuable outfield player.

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17 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

As for Webber deserving our trust he is losing a lot of goodwill built up for what he has done surely ?

It would be great to hear from Webber. I'm only guessing, I don't have inside info, but I believe they were publically managing expectations from the start of the season while privately hoping they could have a good first season in the prem. Certainly after the first few games (performances 2nd half liverpool, newcastle, chelsea, [ignore wet spam], man city) there was every reason to believe we could hold our own.

So I can imagine to go out with such a whimper is below expectations, and frankly not good enough.

By the way, back to Robbie Earle the way he said it was almost reluctantly, it wasn't just a sound bite.

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1 hour ago, TIL 1010 said:

Please don't take criticism of this current shambles by many as an angle to suggest they do not support the team/club. As for Webber deserving our trust he is losing a lot of goodwill built up for what he has done surely ?

They have been completely honest and transparent since they joined.

- The club was in a financial mess

- We were going to buy cheap players across Europe and promote youth

- We have a plan, which involved getting promoted within 3 years

- We would stick to the plan and our playing philosophy

- We wouldn't gamble the future of the club by spending loads

- We would be favourite to finish 20th

- If we get relegated, we won't panic. We will regroup and have another go

They said all of that before a ball was kicked this season.

They also have 'ignore the noise' written in the training ground.

What frustrates me is that fans are so fickle. Last season, this team were the best in the club's history. Now we want to dismantle it and hope to find a better solution.

Webber got the recruitment wrong, which hampered Farke (and the players) this season. We have a decent squad of players and I have full faith that they will learn their lessons and get our mojo back next year.

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3 minutes ago, Yellow and Green said:

They have been completely honest and transparent since they joined.

- The club was in a financial mess

- We were going to buy cheap players across Europe and promote youth

- We have a plan, which involved getting promoted within 3 years

- We would stick to the plan and our playing philosophy

- We wouldn't gamble the future of the club by spending loads

- We would be favourite to finish 20th

- If we get relegated, we won't panic. We will regroup and have another go

They said all of that before a ball was kicked this season.

They also have 'ignore the noise' written in the training ground.

What frustrates me is that fans are so fickle. Last season, this team were the best in the club's history. Now we want to dismantle it and hope to find a better solution.

Webber got the recruitment wrong, which hampered Farke (and the players) this season. We have a decent squad of players and I have full faith that they will learn their lessons and get our mojo back next year.

They also have 'ignore the noise' written in the training ground.”

 

Well, there’s been precious little noise over the last few weeks but the performances have been absolutely dreadful.

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3 hours ago, Don’t be Krul said:

Agreed, there is something that has gone on during lockdown. My guess is Farke has told the club he’s off and it has been filtered down to the players.

As he spent most of his lockdown period in his homeland with his wife and children, and only coming back when restart was agreed and just before any traveler isolation started, you could well be right. A taste of home and family life might have persuaded him City is not the be all and end all, however much he lives the club. Certainly something is amiss.

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18 minutes ago, Yellow and Green said:

They have been completely honest and transparent since they joined.

- The club was in a financial mess

- We were going to buy cheap players across Europe and promote youth

- We have a plan, which involved getting promoted within 3 years

- We would stick to the plan and our playing philosophy

- We wouldn't gamble the future of the club by spending loads

- We would be favourite to finish 20th

- If we get relegated, we won't panic. We will regroup and have another go

They said all of that before a ball was kicked this season.

They also have 'ignore the noise' written in the training ground.

What frustrates me is that fans are so fickle. Last season, this team were the best in the club's history. Now we want to dismantle it and hope to find a better solution.

Webber got the recruitment wrong, which hampered Farke (and the players) this season. We have a decent squad of players and I have full faith that they will learn their lessons and get our mojo back next year.

I don’t think fans want to dismantle the side. It is a natural progression particularly as NCFC are a self financing club these days. And tbh, any side playing as badly as city are has to be dismantled.

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1 hour ago, Canary Jedi said:

It would be great to hear from Webber.

To be fair he was in Romania Wednesday/Thursday discussing a deal for Dennis Man and sorting out a deal for Jacob Sorensen later in the week. Paddy Davitt says four signings coming in over the next few days (though God knows how many of those are for the first team)

Webbers' phone must be ringing off the hook at the moment.

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45 minutes ago, Yellow and Green said:

They have been completely honest and transparent since they joined.

- The club was in a financial mess

- We were going to buy cheap players across Europe and promote youth

- We have a plan, which involved getting promoted within 3 years

- We would stick to the plan and our playing philosophy

- We wouldn't gamble the future of the club by spending loads

- We would be favourite to finish 20th

- If we get relegated, we won't panic. We will regroup and have another go

They said all of that before a ball was kicked this season.

They also have 'ignore the noise' written in the training ground.

What frustrates me is that fans are so fickle. Last season, this team were the best in the club's history. Now we want to dismantle it and hope to find a better solution.

Webber got the recruitment wrong, which hampered Farke (and the players) this season. We have a decent squad of players and I have full faith that they will learn their lessons and get our mojo back next year.

Best post ever. All of it, but particularly the part in bold. I got carried away with how amazing last season was and naively thought we would survive this year. However, it is infuriating that so many fans see us lose a game and suddenly every player is terrible, see us lose a lot of games and get relegated - knowing full well that it was likely - and we should change the manager, clear out the squad, sack the sporting director etc.

We all (most of us) want what's best for the club but I do not believe that having this throw away ethos, where we take a manager who does well, but the second it goes badly we want him gone, is the correct approach. I hope people are not this fickle in real life, otherwise they'll probably be on their 10th spouse...

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3 hours ago, Rolf Harris said:

The players are lightweight. Are unable to play his football. And clearly the footballing board like his brand. So to play it we need better footballers. 

Jesus christ, after we beat man City everyone was saying this is the best squad we've had for a long time. Now it's the worst. FML

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4 minutes ago, Ward 3 said:

Jesus christ, after we beat man City everyone was saying this is the best squad we've had for a long time. Now it's the worst. FML

You are only as good as your last game.

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2 hours ago, Canary Jedi said:

It would be great to hear from Webber. I'm only guessing, I don't have inside info, but I believe they were publically managing expectations from the start of the season while privately hoping they could have a good first season in the prem. Certainly after the first few games (performances 2nd half liverpool, newcastle, chelsea, [ignore wet spam], man city) there was every reason to believe we could hold our own.

So I can imagine to go out with such a whimper is below expectations, and frankly not good enough.

By the way, back to Robbie Earle the way he said it was almost reluctantly, it wasn't just a sound bite.

Did you not consider the poor performances/results would eventually come? The way we were totally rolled at places like Burnley, Palace, West Ham, Brighton, Southampton and at home against Villa, Watford surely gave some clues that we were out of our depth in this league? We didn't compete in any of those games.

Not for a single minute this season did I believe we would survive. We were incredibly lucky to beat both Newcastle and City - though the football we played at times going forward was fabulous, we were still disastrous defensively and both missed easy chances to score at 0-0. We still gifted Newcastle a goal and two to City. Every coach watching us knew that all they had to do was stay tight, pressure the ball and we would make the errors - nothing has changed. 

If we worked really, really hard and got a bit lucky we scraped an occasional result against the odds - we even almost stopped Liverpool. We HAVE played some great football this season - apart from those early games, against Sheffield Utd and Wolves at home; even Arsenal and Spurs, we more than matched them for long periods before we made the errors they were waiting for.

Of course we're not good enough for the EPL - no one who knows anything about football ever said we were and anyone who seriously thought we were has just ignored the evidence in front of them. Almost every pundit predicted we would finish in the bottom 3. We conceded 58 goals in the Championship and didn't have the money to improve it - that was quite a big clue.

I know everyone is disappointed, but honestly if you expected anything more from a squad assembled for a total of about £10m you don't know much about the EPL.

Farke hasn't lost the players; Robbie Earle knows nothing and is paid to say something interesting - he's talking cobblers. The players aren't good enough for this level; that probably hurts them more than it hurts us but the gap is too big to breach without adding more quality - and that costs money. It pains me to say it again but as I said at the time - Karen Brady was completely right.

We will lick our wounds, freshen the squad and get ready to compete for the top 6 again next season. Which we will.

 

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6 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

You are only as good as your last game.

Hmm true I guess in some ways. Today was so bad though. 1 0, no effort put in for a fight

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19 minutes ago, All the Germans said:

Best post ever. All of it, but particularly the part in bold. I got carried away with how amazing last season was and naively thought we would survive this year. However, it is infuriating that so many fans see us lose a game and suddenly every player is terrible, see us lose a lot of games and get relegated - knowing full well that it was likely - and we should change the manager, clear out the squad, sack the sporting director etc.

We all (most of us) want what's best for the club but I do not believe that having this throw away ethos, where we take a manager who does well, but the second it goes badly we want him gone, is the correct approach. I hope people are not this fickle in real life, otherwise they'll probably be on their 10th spouse...

Agree with both of you @All the Germans@Yellow and Green it's easy to over-react. And it's been such a disappointing end to the season. It is no normal end of a season either. 

SW HAS been clear and reading DFs comments post match he will be here next season. It's natural we need a refresh and I'm sure they'll be analysing how some players have  been affected, their motivation level, their propensity towards having a losing mentality. The learning will be huge.

The next 3 games are important too.

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3 hours ago, Branston Pickle said:

There’s plenty of ‘supporters’ on here who don’t show a great deal support for the team/club, behaving worse than spoilt children when things don’t go their way.

There are plenty who also seem to think any criticism of a team finishing rock bottom or of a manager who fails to learn from the same mistakes that have been happening for three years (set pieces in particular)  is some form of heresy. Spoilt children tend not to deal well with justified criticism either.

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“I said from day one maybe we had a 5pc chance of staying up without spending money. Look at the team sheet for this game and it was more or less our Championship line up without some key players like Christoph Zimmermann and Grant Hanley. 

“To be able to be successful it is not realistic. I was fully committed to this way because it was important for the mid to long term. 

 

“With all respect to my players on this level, this season, at times it has looked like men against boys. We needed to be at our best to get results. We tried to over-achieve in enough games but the odds were against us.”

This seems like a pretty honest assessment from Farke. I don’t think he’s lost the players, I just think a long moral busting season has taken its toll. He’s basically been put in the firing line and been asked to do an impossible job for the sake of securing the future of the club, his career has probably suffered a set back as a result of this. 

 

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1 minute ago, JF said:

“I said from day one maybe we had a 5pc chance of staying up without spending money. Look at the team sheet for this game and it was more or less our Championship line up without some key players like Christoph Zimmermann and Grant Hanley. 

“To be able to be successful it is not realistic. I was fully committed to this way because it was important for the mid to long term. 

 

“With all respect to my players on this level, this season, at times it has looked like men against boys. We needed to be at our best to get results. We tried to over-achieve in enough games but the odds were against us.”

This seems like a pretty honest assessment from Farke. I don’t think he’s lost the players, I just think a long moral busting season has taken its toll. He’s basically been put in the firing line and been asked to do an impossible job for the sake of securing the future of the club, his career has probably suffered a set back as a result of this. 

 

Strange comments imo. Telling the players they aren’t good enough for this level is hardly great for regrouping next season. I also do wonder just how much this idea of us being favourites for relegation has hampered us this season. I know people say different things in public than they do in the dressing rooms, but seems to me that it might have been a bit too cosy - if we go down so what, it’s expected. You can do that but foster an underdog mentality “everyone’s writing us off let’s prove them wrong”, which I’m not sure we’ve seen. 

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3 hours ago, TIL 1010 said:

Turgid football is season one, good football in season two, a complete disaster in season three with unwanted records littering our history but you have faith in both of them for season four. Whatever do you base that on ?

That's not even true.

First season our football improved and after Christmas we were actually pretty decent at home.

Second season was some of the best football the championship has ever seen and one of the highest goal scoring seasons. So a little better than just 'good'.

But I understand that emotionally you need to vent and blame something or someone and have a target so crack on 

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4 minutes ago, hogesar said:

 

But I understand that emotionally you need to vent and blame something or someone and have a target so crack on 

You really cannot help yourself now can you ?

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10 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

You really cannot help yourself now can you ?

Hey, I've tried several times with you. I've seen @Feedthewolf have way more patience than me and try to discuss things with you like an adult and you still wouldn't treat him with the same respect. So nah, cant help myself and dont see the point in it.

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19 minutes ago, Aggy said:

Telling the players they aren’t good enough for this level is hardly great for regrouping next season.

The players he thinks aren’t good enough won’t be here next season 

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44 minutes ago, Ward 3 said:

Jesus christ, after we beat man City everyone was saying this is the best squad we've had for a long time. Now it's the worst. FML

Clearly they were wrong.

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3 minutes ago, FenwayFrank said:

The players he thinks aren’t good enough won’t be here next season 

(1) Depends how many there are and how many we can ford to replace. (2) He’s said it’s been boys vs men throughout the season, which suggests to me most of the first tea, he must think aren’t good enough?

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No idea if he's correct or not, but tad surprising that the US-based Robbie Earle has this insight about the dressing room and not any of the journos/pundits over here.

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Posted (edited)
46 minutes ago, Aggy said:

There are plenty who also seem to think any criticism of a team finishing rock bottom or of a manager who fails to learn from the same mistakes that have been happening for three years (set pieces in particular)  is some form of heresy. Spoilt children tend not to deal well with justified criticism either.

It depends how it’s done - it is certainly hard not to be critical of our summer transfer activity and our set pieces (for and against) have been bog-average for a while. 

Edited by Branston Pickle

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The big problem this season is at the beginning we attacked with pace and one touch football. As soon as we slowed the game down we were then mirroring Farke’s first season in The Championship. 

Mitigating circumstances; injuries to CB’s at the beginning of the season ruined our momentum from last season. The pace of Hernandez was a big miss as was someone who can take a set piece (a fit Vrancic maybe)? Poor recruitment, Duda was awful, Rupp the jury is still out.  Amadou has one decent game. Drmic has been awful but the jury (for me) is still out as to whether he can make it in The Championship next season. 

Non of the fringe players stepped up. Leitner, Trybull, Klose. 

We’ll have too see what next year brings. I’m curious what these new players plus Gilmore will bring to the party. 

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51 minutes ago, JF said:

“I said from day one maybe we had a 5pc chance of staying up without spending money. Look at the team sheet for this game and it was more or less our Championship line up without some key players like Christoph Zimmermann and Grant Hanley. 

“To be able to be successful it is not realistic. I was fully committed to this way because it was important for the mid to long term. 

 

“With all respect to my players on this level, this season, at times it has looked like men against boys. We needed to be at our best to get results. We tried to over-achieve in enough games but the odds were against us.”

This seems like a pretty honest assessment from Farke. I don’t think he’s lost the players, I just think a long moral busting season has taken its toll. He’s basically been put in the firing line and been asked to do an impossible job for the sake of securing the future of the club, his career has probably suffered a set back as a result of this. 

 

It is a little worrying that we are now saying that Zimmerman and Hanley are PL quality 😉

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