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One game in and there has already been a huge error that could impact on relegation /Champions League qualification. Why can't we get the hang of using it? It feels like the people responsible for it haven't got a grain of common sense. 

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My attitude has always been that if the technology was there (to correct human mistakes) then use it.

It works so well in other sports, it's been a disaster in football and should be suspended until a suitable way of using it is worked out.

Mm decisions for off-sides, yet they miss a foot or more on a goal line decision.

Perhaps they should follow cricket and have an appeal system whereby each team is allocated three for the game and can appeal for VAR intervention for a designated amount of suspect situations such as penalties, off-side goals and sendings off.

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Yep , must be so simple to come up with a fair  way of using it. No one wants incorrect  decisions. Any  random ten posters on here ( Well!, maybe not one in paricular)could work out a reasonable , open  and viable way of using it in one day if given a conference room , a couple of tech experts to give on screen examples and a supply of tea coffee and sambos. . They really must get their  shoite together.  Very poor indeed  so far.  Must do better.

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My concern is not whether it’s fair or not, it’s whether the technology actually works. And now it has been proven to be completely incompetent - the precedent has been set. But we already knew that after Mario’s pass through to Teemu in December...

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Up until last night goal line technology has been working fine, so last night is hopefully just a blip. My concern is that having seen the incident replayed just the once it was fairly obvious the ball had crossed the line so why didn’t VAR intervene?

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We are in an era that if an attacker's armpit hair is fractionally offside a goal can be disallowed, and yet we have to put up with this travesty. Not just for the possible impact on relegation as stated, but for the integrity of premier league football, the goal should be given - even now!

Reverse the wrong and make it a 1-0 win to Sheffield.

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Chris Wilder 🤣

We went to Tottenham last year, John Lundstram's big toe was offside and I was hanging around in the pouring rain for 10 minutes waiting for a decision. I don't understand why I can't wait 10 minutes in Birmingham.

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Sure, VAR should have checked the error, but let's not forget that it was the Hawkeye system that failed here in the first instance.

I know we are used to blaming VAR for everything, because its implementation is just that bad that it keeps messing up, but Hawkeye was the main culprit here, which is exactly why they have immediately taken full responsibility and apologised (fair play to them for that by the way).

Playing Devil's Advocate just for a moment: 

Is VAR (which has been hounded since day 1) REALLY going to try and challenge and overturn a Hawkeye decision (a system known for reliability and which has been accepted and respected by fans across multiple sports) on the very first game back after 3 months out? Or is it going to just let Hawkeye take some flack for once, slink back into the shadows and let someone else take the brunt? Let's not go down the conspiracy road, but you'd be forgiven for thinking this may have come into play.

I am not defending VAR in any way FYI, I cannot stand it and I think the implementation has been horrific, but the technology of VAR isn't the issue here, it's the operation and the odd updated rules it is enforcing (offsides etc.). The technology is enhanced video, to really break it down.

But I am not sure we need any additional excuses to attack VAR, it gives us plenty of reasons on its own, without having to attribute Hawkeye errors to it as well.

But Hawkeye getting it wrong is the clear headline here, with a nod to VAR still being cr@p and not stepping in where it should.

Edited by Flying Dutchman
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How much money has been spent telling us VAR will cure all the wrong decisions in the game?

It's no better than what was already there.

As has been already stated the magnitude of what this wrong decision could lead to is incredible, and still leads me to believe that the whole system is corrupt. The correct decision could have been  made within a matter of seconds, there have already been games this season that have been 'brought back' after a goal has been correctly awarded.

I stand corrected, having just seen it's Hawkeye's fault, but whoever s fault it is the fact remains it could have been corrected in seconds

Edited by First Wazzock

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30 minutes ago, pearsos said:

Up until last night goal line technology has been working fine, so last night is hopefully just a blip. My concern is that having seen the incident replayed just the once it was fairly obvious the ball had crossed the line so why didn’t VAR intervene?

In that case with respect part of the technology is VAR which should simply have over ruled the refs watch.

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I started this season entirely supportive of technology in football. I thought it was about time, it will take pressure off the referees and most importantly help make the right decisions, consistently.

I could not have been any more wrong. Had it not been for the virus, I would have expected the Premier League to be undertaking a massive enquiry right now into the effects it has had. We can't have another season like this; all VAR has done has become the source of the controversy, not the end of it. And now we've seen that the goal line technology is flawed too, I am left asking; what's the point with it? Scrap it all and go back to referees only. At least then we maintain the fluidity of the match, even if we have to put up with referees making mistakes. At least we can understand why referees make incorrect decisions. I can't for the life of me work out how VAR makes the decisions they do, or do not as the case actually is. 

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In defence of VAR, it wasn't actually responsible for the error last night, it was goalline technology. Maybe VAR should've stepped in (assuming it was allowed) but the problem was the 'GDS' failing rather than VAR.

37 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

The game should be replayed such is the magnitude of the error.

Perhaps Villa might win.

Last night, I went to the pub and when I arrived, a couple of my mates were actually talking about this incident, which is saying something considering they're Italian and weren't talking about the Coppa Italia final which happened last night. One of them said that in Italy there's a protocol for replaying a match if there was a 'technical error', such as a misinterpretation of the rules, even though it is rarely enforced.

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2 hours ago, Alex Moss said:

My concern is not whether it’s fair or not, it’s whether the technology actually works. And now it has been proven to be completely incompetent - the precedent has been set. But we already knew that after Mario’s pass through to Teemu in December...

Exacerbated because there is no margin allowed for error  .... as there is in cricket.

Technology has enhanced the game of cricket  whereby waiting for that decision upon appeal (and all shown on the big screen) is a significant part of the spectator enjoyment of the whole game.

It is ruining football, has caused weekly controversy and will continue to do so until it is put to more sensible use.

I believe the current phrase is , "Not fit for purpose."

Edited by BroadstairsR
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1 hour ago, Foxy2600 said:

Chris Wilder 🤣

We went to Tottenham last year, John Lundstram's big toe was offside and I was hanging around in the pouring rain for 10 minutes waiting for a decision. I don't understand why I can't wait 10 minutes in Birmingham.

Shame he wasn't as switched on during the game and got the 4th official to check the decision. Sheff Utd dozed their way through that game. At the end of the day Villa were worth a point at least and I can't really get excited about it. 

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Hawkeye failed but the issue here is with VAR again. What the officials appear to be saying is that because hawkeye is regarded as reliable, there was no thought of checking the point through VAR. That is ridiculous when even one replay showed quite clearly that there was an issue. VAR should have stopped the game, pointed out to the ref that there was an issue and had it checked. They could have requested the virtual still they use from hawkeye and when they were not able to provide that then used the camera angles available to make the decision.

As usual, a complete and utter lack of common sense from the officials who appear unable to apply common sense to any situation.

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11 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

Shame he wasn't as switched on during the game and got the 4th official to check the decision. Sheff Utd dozed their way through that game. At the end of the day Villa were worth a point at least and I can't really get excited about it. 

Although he wasn't moaning when VAR was used to overturn a red card by the on pitch referee for the first time ever at Carrow Road, despite the fact it probably should not have been. A decision that may well have cost us points and handed a couple to Shef U (I know they gave generally been hard done by too).

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1 hour ago, pearsos said:

Up until last night goal line technology has been working fine, so last night is hopefully just a blip.

Has it? How do we know it’s been working fine? We were only made aware that it was not working fine last night when it was proven without doubt that it is not 100% accurate. What about when it was accepted on finer margins because everyone thought the technology was foolproof?

That could be massive for Villa, that. Unfortunately it could also be massive for us too.

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It's like those in charge of VAR are literally trying to prove VAR is sh*t.

I think we have all the evidence we need.

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Let’s not split hairs around Hawkeye vs VAR, it’s the way technology as a whole is failing in the officiating of the game. If we’re really at a point where one technology group cannot intervene when another technology group has made a clear and obvious error then something is seriously wrong! It’s all supposed to be there to stop mistakes from being made, why is that simple goal so difficult?!

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1 minute ago, Canary Wundaboy said:

Let’s not split hairs around Hawkeye vs VAR, it’s the way technology as a whole is failing in the officiating of the game. If we’re really at a point where one technology group cannot intervene when another technology group has made a clear and obvious error then something is seriously wrong! It’s all supposed to be there to stop mistakes from being made, why is that simple goal so difficult?!

As I mentioned on the other thread, the reason stated by the PGMOL was that because there was no signal from the refs watch there was no reason for VAR to engage in a check.

That reasoning is clearly a total bust and personally I've never had a greater feeling that VAR has been used to influence the 'narrative' of the season. I don't necessarily think it's some great big conspiracy, but outside of being genuinely corrupt I can't understand how anyone would think that what happened yesterday was the best course of action- VAR has forensically analysed every tiny detail for the season up til now, it is only used that way in this country and to the derision of fans, managers, players and even FIFA. The non-goal yesterday was a open goal for VAR to show its value and suddenly it wants to preserve the flow of the game and not interfere with the ref?

The people in charge of English football are either corrupt of dangerously stupid to the point I'm surprised they've worked out how to cross roads safely. 

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1 hour ago, Mason 47 said:

As I mentioned on the other thread, the reason stated by the PGMOL was that because there was no signal from the refs watch there was no reason for VAR to engage in a check.

 

They actually said that?! JFC

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Besides, all that “flow of the game” crap was supposedly for the benefit of the supporters in the ground, clearly not an issue any longer so why do they keep finding excuses to ignore the mistakes?

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7 hours ago, TIL 1010 said:

I thought that VAR could step in if goal line technology gets it wrong, maybe not ?

Absolutely. When there wasn’t a GLT replay available it was obvious there was a problem, and the VAR ref should have taken a look. 
 

Yes Hawkeye admitted error, but the reason stated is not believable. The cameras are supposed to be parallel with the goal line, and there were no players standing on the goal line - that could have blocked their view - except the goal keeper who stepped back over it. ANY excuse from the EPL is like Hancock’s excuse on the tracing app, it’s just one more example of inexcusable incompetence. 

Edited by Surfer
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3 hours ago, Canary Wundaboy said:

Besides, all that “flow of the game” crap was supposedly for the benefit of the supporters in the ground, clearly not an issue any longer so why do they keep finding excuses to ignore the mistakes?

Because they are not really being held to account. Sounds familiar. 

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13 minutes ago, wcorkcanary said:

Because they are not really being held to account. Sounds familiar. 

Yes, another case of power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. 

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10 hours ago, Surfer said:

Absolutely. When there wasn’t a GLT replay available it was obvious there was a problem, and the VAR ref should have taken a look. 
 

Yes Hawkeye admitted error, but the reason stated is not believable. The cameras are supposed to be parallel with the goal line, and there were no players standing on the goal line - that could have blocked their view - except the goal keeper who stepped back over it. ANY excuse from the EPL is like Hancock’s excuse on the tracing app, it’s just one more example of inexcusable incompetence. 

The excuse is a lie. At least 2 tv cameras caught it clear as day. They need to show us what their cameras saw. My guess is incompetency played a part. The camera(s) weren't turned on, had lens caps on, or were pointed in the wrong direction. Something basic like that. 

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You can have all the technology there is but at the end of the day it is up to human beings to make sure that the system is infalable, that it is set up correctly, that it's switched on and that it is working properly.

And then when things do go pear shaped you also need human beings to take control of the situation, review what has happened and make the right decision.

This was a complete failure on 3 levels - Hawkeye, VAR and the Officials on the pitch.

Everybody in the World saw that the ball was over the line except the numpties who are employed to make sure that the right decisions are made.

Premier League my ****

 

Edited by Making Plans

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