V.A.R

[HairyTeeth 16]

Hello fellow City fans i hope you are all keeping well.

What an absolute mess it has turned out to be since Coronavirus has struck regarding the football in the UK.

My biggest issue with Project Restart is the cancellation of VAR. We all know VAR has been anti Norwich all season so if this happens then surely all points whether lost or gained should be nullified and the table updated accordingly. VAR was an integral part of the game this season and surely must of been part of a contract to allow VAR to be used at Norwich games. So by carrying on the season at neutral grounds and no VAR we are in an entirely different season therefore if its cancelled we cannot be relegated without playing 38 games. 

You cant just make the rules up to suit Liverpool there are 20 teams in the league. We would be 1 point from safety and 2nd from bottom if it restarts with no VAR.

What are peoples thoughts on this?

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 3,776]

It isn't just VAR; it's the neutral venues, the increase in subs, the alleged wearing of masks or 'distancing' marking at corners. The rules are so far removed from what they were at the start of the season that they may as well just play resume the league playing table tennis.

But let's not forget: it's all about the 'integrity of football'.

[Mason 47 1,373]

It's only an option offered by IFAB that is up to the PL to take up or not.

I'd like to say they would be aware of just how bad the reaction would be if they did something so brainless- but at this point we're already so far removed from the season already played that it just wouldn't surprise me.

[HairyTeeth 16]

There is no way they can cancel VAR and play the rest of the season with the points the teams are on now. Without VAR if we play on it will be Null and Void if points are not changed. On that alone there is no reason to restart. We have a very very good case if it restarts without VAR. 

[Flying Dutchman 744]

5 hours ago, HairyTeeth said:

We all know VAR has been anti Norwich all season

No, we don't. Please don't presume to speak for everyone if you're going to speak absolute nonsense.

This line alone is the reason we will always remain 'little old Norwich' in the eyes of many, including our own fans unfortunately.

It isn't anti-anyone. If anything it's simply anti-football as we know it.

Stop being a victim. VAR has been awful, granted, frankly I'd love to see the back of it. And it may have felt really against us for a while, but it wasn't just out to get us.  It was incredibly bad for every team, individually and at some point.

Liverpool have had just as many goals disallowed as their opponents (3), they also had as many subjective decisions (1) in their favour as they did against them (that doesn't 'suit Liverpool' as you put it). Man City have had MORE goals disallowed (3) than their opponents (1). 

Some just only see what they want to see.

Edited May 9, 2020 by Flying Dutchman

[nutty nigel 7,507]

Thanks for reminding me about VAR. Something else that did nothing for the fans in the stadiums. Far better for football on tv when folks can do the odd job about the house during the breaks in play. 

[HairyTeeth 16]

6 hours ago, Flying Dutchman said:

No, we don't. Please don't presume to speak for everyone if you're going to speak absolute nonsense.

This line alone is the reason we will always remain 'little old Norwich' in the eyes of many, including our own fans unfortunately.

It isn't anti-anyone. If anything it's simply anti-football as we know it.

Stop being a victim. VAR has been awful, granted, frankly I'd love to see the back of it. And it may have felt really against us for a while, but it wasn't just out to get us.  It was incredibly bad for every team, individually and at some point.

Liverpool have had just as many goals disallowed as their opponents (3), they also had as many subjective decisions (1) in their favour as they did against them (that doesn't 'suit Liverpool' as you put it). Man City have had MORE goals disallowed (3) than their opponents (1). 

Some just only see what they want to see.

Haha calm down. Sounds like someone shat on your cereal.

VAR has cost us a lot this season and with our bad injury count earlier in the season we have been very unlucky. 

Even if we restart the season i think we would have a good chance of staying up. We certainly arent the worst team in the league.

[wcorkcanary 4,329]

7 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

Thanks for reminding me about VAR. Something else that did nothing for the fans in the stadiums. Far better for football on tv when folks can do the odd job about the house during the breaks in play. 

Agreed ! During  the time taken to disallow Pukkis goal v spurs I walked the dog and made a Victoria  Sponge Cake. Although I had milked the cow earlier to save time with the cream, but I get your point.

[wcorkcanary 4,329]

2 hours ago, HairyTeeth said:

Haha calm down. Sounds like someone shat on your cereal.

VAR has cost us a lot this season and with our bad injury count earlier in the season we have been very unlucky. 

Even if we restart the season i think we would have a good chance of staying up. We certainly arent the worst team in the league.

Pay attention!! We are in fact the     " Best Worst " team in the League. 

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 3,776]

4 hours ago, HairyTeeth said:

Haha calm down. Sounds like . We certainly arent the worst team in the league.

Just out of interest, who would say are worse than us?

[HairyTeeth 16]

15 minutes ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Just out of interest, who would say are worse than us?

Newcastle, Brighton, West Ham, Villa, Palace, Bournemouth. Yes we lost against some of these teams but when you play midfielders at centre back through no choice it will weaken any side. 

Zimmermann and godfrey only played 6 times together this season and got 8 points. We played 8 games with midfielders at centre back and got 1 point. 

With a settled defence it creates confidence and stability something which we were unlucky not to have. 

Some people dont realise we had a major injury crisis earlier in the season which would put anyone on the back foot. 

With some luck on the injury front like other teams have had we would be well clear of the bottom 3.

[Mason 47 1,373]

Don't get me wrong I definitely don't believe there was an anti-Norwich bias by VAR this season- it's been a shambles for everyone.

 But it is completely reasonable to say that without VAR intervention throughout this season we would have more points than we do now; so much so that safety at this point would be a genuine tangible goal and not a 'Little miracle'

The potential that they'll rescind VAR for this 9-game mini season basically would make the previous 29 games redundant.

 

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 3,776]

20 minutes ago, HairyTeeth said:

Newcastle, Brighton, West Ham, Villa, Palace, Bournemouth. 

You genuinely believe all of these teams are worse than us? I'd say that on paper Brighton and Villa are probably not much better than us but certainly not worse, but all the other teams are clearly ahead of us

We're miles behind them all in the table and there has to be a reason for that, and it isn't just injuries as we aren't the only ones who suffered.

West Ham were without their first choice goalkeeper for three months and had to alternate between Roberto, who couldn't catch a cold, and David Martin who was a 34-year-old lower-league journeyman who had never played in the Premier League.

When Palace played us in January, four of their seven subs had never played a minute of senior football in their career, such was their injury crisis.

Villa suffered long term (minimum three months) injuries to their first choice goalkeeper (Heaton), first choice striker (Wesley) and a key midfielder (McGinn).

Yes, we suffered with injuries, but so did everyone else. Using them as an excuse to say we'd have another 10-15 points is absolutely delusional, as I'm sure West Ham, Palace and Villa would claim the same thing.

[HairyTeeth 16]

Yes they all had injuries but ours were extreme. Even Farke mentioned it when we had no fit centre backs at 1 point. 

We had ours 1st half of the season and everyone knows that when you fall behind in the Premier league it is psychologically difficult to make up the points with a severely weakened team.

With a more settled team yes i believe we would have an extra 10-15 points than we have now.

 

 

[East Rider 548]

24 minutes ago, Mason 47 said:

Don't get me wrong I definitely don't believe there was an anti-Norwich bias by VAR this season- it's been a shambles for everyone.

 But it is completely reasonable to say that without VAR intervention throughout this season we would have more points than we do now; so much so that safety at this point would be a genuine tangible goal and not a 'Little miracle'

The potential that they'll rescind VAR for this 9-game mini season basically would make the previous 29 games redundant.

 

I agree with this.

It is not beyond the probability that we would have been in a better position without VAR and when it did us harm against teams such as Spurs and Liverpool it also knocked the little momentum we had built up. I also believe we could have been out of the bottom three by now.

However, whilst I continually bemoaned our bad luck regarding defensive injuries and 'what could have been' with our team this season, the common denominator in all the trial and tribulations has been the 'team.'

Despite the strong mitigating factors here our 'team' has not been good enough to be anywhere, except where we are now. We were aware at the start of our season that reinforcements were needed in defence and simply failed to act positively enough.

It would be wrong to relegate us on the points per game scenario. If they did, we would have to bury our pride to fight the situation given how we as NCFC have handled a prefect opportunity to do something decent this season with the basis of such a good team we had at the end of last season. 

 

 

Edited May 10, 2020 by East Rider

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 3,776]

19 minutes ago, HairyTeeth said:

Yes they all had injuries but ours were extreme. Even Farke mentioned it when we had no fit centre backs at 1 point. 

We had ours 1st half of the season and everyone knows that when you fall behind in the Premier league it is psychologically difficult to make up the points with a severely weakened team.

With a more settled team yes i believe we would have an extra 10-15 points than we have now.

Nearly every team goes through an injury crisis during the course of a season. It's how you deal with it, and unfortunately, we didn't deal with it as well the other teams who also had one.

Also, since we've had our defenders back, our form has declined. We went around 700 Premier League minutes without a goal from open play in January and February, and you can't blame that on the defensive injury crisis during the autumn.

We haven't been good enough, and we've been the worst team in the league, which is why we're bottom and several points away from 19th.

[Mason 47 1,373]

12 minutes ago, East Rider said:

I agree with this.

It is not beyond the probability that we would have been in a better position without VAR and when it did us harm against teams such as Spurs and Liverpool it also knocked the little momentum we had built up. I also believe we could have been out of the bottom three by now.

However, whilst I continually bemoaned our bad luck regarding defensive injuries and 'what could have been' with our team this season, the common denominator in all the trial and tribulations has been the 'team.'

Despite the strong mitigating factors here our 'team' has not been good enough to be anywhere, except where we are now. We were aware at the start of our season that reinforcements were needed in defence and simply failed to act positively enough.

It would be wrong to relegate us on the points per game scenario. If they did, we would have to bury our pride to fight the situation given how we as NCFC have handled a prefect opportunity to do something decent this season with the basis of such a good team we had at the end of last season. 

 

 

And I agree with this in turn. Ultimately for myself (and many others I think) I had adopted the view that whilst it would be absolutely fantastic if we somehow stayed up this year, the table as it stands says it would be particularly unlikely and relegation was something I've accepted. You can argue 'til the cows come home about how philosophically we're much better than 20th but the cold, hard truth of points won doesn't agree.

The reason I'm vocal against the proposed quick-fixes to get the season running again is that the story of the entire season changes if they are implemented. VAR has had an irrefutably contentious stake in our season, and we would almost certainly have been better off under those conditions from the start. It doesn't get much better with the other fixes, even having 5 subs available- you could barely see a game go by without a thread on here about Farke being reluctant to use subs, and I dare say he would have been a lot more open to throwing on Drmic and Srbeny earlier in games with the safety of being able to shore things up with Amadou and Byram if we pulled it back. Even something as trivial as shorter games is quite relevant for us (if games finished after 45 minutes this season we would be 14th).

I can accept that we were probably going down. I can accept that we really didn't get the summer window right and we shot ourselves in the foot as a result. But the idea that we have to play some Frankensteinian mini-season essentially for the benefit of the teams at the top (and Leeds) under the false flag of maintaining the 'integrity of the beautiful game' whilst hundreds still die every day- no time for that whatsoever. 

 

[Well b back 3,182]

Apparently FIFA have now given the PL permission to withdraw VAR for the rest of the games.

 

[HairyTeeth 16]

6 hours ago, Well b back said:

Apparently FIFA have now given the PL permission to withdraw VAR for the rest of the games.

 

Well the table needs to adjust without VAR all season. Scousers 15 points ahead and played a game more than Man City. 

Brighton would be bottom and we would be 2 points from safety with 9 games left. 

They cant have it both ways. Like ive said before we signed a contract stating to play 19 home and 19 away games with VAR. Playing at neutral grounds without VAR is a break of contract therefore relegation is taken off the table.