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2 minutes ago, CANARYKING said:

Surely it’s time to divert some of the vaccines to teachers to enable kids to go back, they will soon have missed a year’s schooling which they will never get back.

I agree-  priorities are wrong

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2 minutes ago, CANARYKING said:

Surely it’s time to divert some of the vaccines to teachers to enable kids to go back, they will soon have missed a year’s schooling which they will never get back.

Israel are vaccinating the 16 - 18 year olds so they can finish their education. The vaccines currently in the U.K. I should point out however are only regulated for 18 +

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2 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

I agree-  priorities are wrong

And I feel ( personal opinion ) all healthcare workers and carers that have had the Pfizer jab should have their second jab at 3 - 4 weeks.

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1 minute ago, Well b back said:

And I feel ( personal opinion ) all healthcare workers and carers that have had the Pfizer jab should have their second jab at 3 - 4 weeks.

Yes - NHS front line first and fully -  and I think you may recall i made an earlier comment on the youngsters. I think the Israelis have it right.

Those that can 'lockdown' or isolate for a few weeks or months more can't honestly be top priority.  

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43 minutes ago, Well b back said:

 

The latest doing the rounds is that we do now have data on the one jab and Johnson is not releasing it as he needs to win the vaccine race, highly unlikely I should add.

 

Finn is saying there is unpublished data from research by his own University, Bristol that supports the 12 weeks and will be published by the end of this week or next .

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1 minute ago, Van wink said:

Finn is saying there is unpublished data from research by his own University, Bristol that supports the 12 weeks and will be published by the end of this week or next .

That will be interesting as I understood due to gps refusing to not give the second jab, the vast majority of first jabbers had the jab after Christmas. Don’t publish it get it out there if it is correct or at least to Pfizer and WHO.

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1 minute ago, Well b back said:

That will be interesting as I understood due to gps refusing to not give the second jab, the vast majority of first jabbers had the jab after Christmas. Don’t publish it get it out there if it is correct or at least to Pfizer and WHO.

His research is looking at immunisation rates of people admitted to hospital, if most of the early Pfizer cohort have received the second jab then I'm not sure his research will move things forward, certainly not in relation to Pfizer.

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11 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Finn is saying there is unpublished data from research by his own University, Bristol that supports the 12 weeks and will be published by the end of this week or next .

I hope he has evidence, what he said earlier was definitely based on how other vaccines work.

Earlier we told you how a professor has defended the policy being adopted in the UK for a leaving a gap of up to 12 weeks between the first and second doses of the Covid vaccines.

Professor Adam Finn, a member of the government’s committee on vaccine strategy, has said this is based on “rock-solid evidence”.

Prof Finn said based on knowledge of how other vaccines work, there is likely to be better protection after the second dose when it’s delayed.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Van wink said:

His research is looking at immunisation rates of people admitted to hospital, if most of the early Pfizer cohort have received the second jab then I'm not sure his research will move things forward, certainly not in relation to Pfizer.

As much as I would love this to work out, I am not sure like you that will move the debate on as the Israeli data ( official Pfizer data ) said 17% ( 183 I believe ) of those with ‘ severe COVID ‘ had had their first Pfizer jab, but this was the older age group.
Again I absolutely stress I want him to be 100% correct, but in the meantime acting on the side of caution we must immunise healthcare workers and carers with the second jab, make it clear without any doubt to people with 1 jab ( of Pfizer ) they must carry on as is and stop coming out with comments like ‘ restrictions maybe able to be relaxed in mid February ‘ as it misleads in case one jab is not as good. Likewise with Oxford as @yellowfever said facts that the public can understand should be highlighted daily so everybody understands, stressing that even then it depends how your bodies immune system takes to the vaccine.

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10 minutes ago, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

Government has given powers to local authorities to maintain lockdown measures until July 17th

Hopefully a bit over the top and won't be needed, not sure if they couldn't just review every couple of weeks or so instead, though 

It would make things clearer if we knew what was the government's ultimate aim, to accept that the virus is here to stay and learn to live with it, or to try and eradicate it.  I certainly hope it's the former and that Boris isn't on one of his ego trips.

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Expect lower vax figures for the next two days.

Weekend effect shows up today and tomorrow.

Back up again on Wednesday.

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40 minutes ago, Well b back said:

As much as I would love this to work out, I am not sure like you that will move the debate on as the Israeli data ( official Pfizer data ) said 17% ( 183 I believe ) of those with ‘ severe COVID ‘ had had their first Pfizer jab, but this was the older age group.
Again I absolutely stress I want him to be 100% correct, but in the meantime acting on the side of caution we must immunise healthcare workers and carers with the second jab, make it clear without any doubt to people with 1 jab ( of Pfizer ) they must carry on as is and stop coming out with comments like ‘ restrictions maybe able to be relaxed in mid February ‘ as it misleads in case one jab is not as good. Likewise with Oxford as @yellowfever said facts that the public can understand should be highlighted daily so everybody understands, stressing that even then it depends how your bodies immune system takes to the vaccine.

Professor Finn said the government was following the science and insisted there was “absolutely rock-solid evidence that if you give a dose of the vaccine to more people you give them protection and save lives”

He said that evidence from a University of Bristol study on the coronavirus immunisation rates of people admitted to hospital should be published at the end of this week or next week.

He said that unpublished data suggested that protection from the first dose of the vaccine “persists nicely” over 12 weeks rather than starting to decline. “There’s certainly no sign of any significant fall. What we know from other vaccines and from the human immune responses is that they don’t plateau and fall in that kind of time period,” he said.

 

 

I dont think his "rock solid evidence" will addresses your concerns, this evidence relates to the fact that the more people you vaccinate the more lives you will save, it doesn't address whether immunity from Pfizer drops off, as you said earlier, what is supporting his view is his knowledge of how other vaccines behave. He is of course hugely experienced and eminent in the field of respiratory infection and vaccine trials, which adds huge weight to his professional opinion, but thats what it is as I see it atm, an expert opinion.

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21 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Professor Finn said the government was following the science and insisted there was “absolutely rock-solid evidence that if you give a dose of the vaccine to more people you give them protection and save lives”

He said that evidence from a University of Bristol study on the coronavirus immunisation rates of people admitted to hospital should be published at the end of this week or next week.

He said that unpublished data suggested that protection from the first dose of the vaccine “persists nicely” over 12 weeks rather than starting to decline. “There’s certainly no sign of any significant fall. What we know from other vaccines and from the human immune responses is that they don’t plateau and fall in that kind of time period,” he said.

 

 

I dont think his "rock solid evidence" will addresses your concerns, this evidence relates to the fact that the more people you vaccinate the more lives you will save, it doesn't address whether immunity from Pfizer drops off, as you said earlier, what is supporting his view is his knowledge of how other vaccines behave. He is of course hugely experienced and eminent in the field of respiratory infection and vaccine trials, which adds huge weight to his professional opinion, but thats what it is as I see it atm, an expert opinion.

Guys - my take is the read across from Moderna (same underlying tech as Pfizer) which indeed now does show some extended interlude 1 -2 jab data.

Benchwarmer - please accept the jab - what ever one it's far safer for you, your family and everybody else than not doing so. We can have arcane discussions and opinions on the current vaccines but they are all better than nothing however taken.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that for the elderly - the exact people we are vaccinating at present, many with compromised immune systems, the 2nd jab may be needed more urgently to give the vaccine every chance (else why bother!) for them - especially if there are more dubious versions of the virus around. We can see the efficacy roll off within the elderly even in the official current data. Those that are more robust the 1st to 2nd  'delay' becomes more acceptable.

As per VW - these are however are now ALL political decisions since whatever you do some will miss out, be delayed or frankly die waiting. It was a crass diabolical (in the true sense) political decision to relax restrictions over Christmas.

Edited by Yellow Fever

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38 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Expect lower vax figures for the next two days.

Weekend effect shows up today and tomorrow.

Back up again on Wednesday.

It’s because the data has to be loaded manually by each practice / hub ect. This is normally done the day after vaccinating but most surgeries empty on a Saturday and Sunday, whereas the hubs stay open 7 days with their data inputters ( if that’s a word ).

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Here’s some good news for Moderna re the South African variant.

Moderna's Covid vaccine appears to work against new, more infectious variants of the virus found in the UK and South Africa, according to scientists from the pharmaceutical company.

Early laboratory tests suggest antibodies triggered by the vaccine can recognise and fight the new variants.

More studies are needed to confirm this is true for people that have been vaccinated with the Moderna jab. 

The new variants have been spreading fast in a number of nations over recent weeks. 


 

 

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17 minutes ago, Well b back said:

Here’s some good news for Moderna re the South African variant.

Moderna's Covid vaccine appears to work against new, more infectious variants of the virus found in the UK and South Africa, according to scientists from the pharmaceutical company.

Early laboratory tests suggest antibodies triggered by the vaccine can recognise and fight the new variants.

More studies are needed to confirm this is true for people that have been vaccinated with the Moderna jab. 

The new variants have been spreading fast in a number of nations over recent weeks. 


 

 

Thanks, thats good news, lab study doesn't always replicate to the real world but it's hugely encouraging. As time goes on it will be interesting to see if there is much between any of the vaccines in terms of efficacy and ability to deal with new variants

Edited by Van wink

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48 minutes ago, Well b back said:

It’s because the data has to be loaded manually by each practice / hub ect. This is normally done the day after vaccinating but most surgeries empty on a Saturday and Sunday, whereas the hubs stay open 7 days with their data inputters ( if that’s a word ).

Our local surgery was definitely open Saturday, steady stream of people in and out. There are 3 local surgeries that have "joined" together and all the jabs are given at the one nearest me. I didn't pass Sunday but,a s I say, certainly looked to be going flat out on Saturday.

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26 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Thanks, thats good news, lab study doesn't always replicate to the real world but it's hugely encouraging. As time goes on it will be interesting to see if there is much between any of the vaccines in terms of efficacy and ability to deal with new variants

I really hope it won't be that interesting..............

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Just now, Mark .Y. said:

Our local surgery was definitely open Saturday, steady stream of people in and out. There are 3 local surgeries that have "joined" together and all the jabs are given at the one nearest me. I didn't pass Sunday but,a s I say, certainly looked to be going flat out on Saturday.

There will be many open, but the data is manually loaded the next day by data inputters. We vaccinated on Friday where I help, but the data was being loaded on yesterday meaning our six hundred show tomorrow. I suspect there are just as many vaccinated on a Saturday as a Friday, but the data has to be loaded.

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7 minutes ago, Mark .Y. said:

Our local surgery was definitely open Saturday, steady stream of people in and out. There are 3 local surgeries that have "joined" together and all the jabs are given at the one nearest me. I didn't pass Sunday but,a s I say, certainly looked to be going flat out on Saturday.

Yep ours was too, fortunately I was able to get my first jab. Pleased that they are now out in the community vaccinating housebound people too.

Just seen WBB's comments above, when I had mine there was someone in the room on a terminal, I wonder if they were entering data in real time?

Edited by Van wink

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10 minutes ago, Mark .Y. said:

Our local surgery was definitely open Saturday, steady stream of people in and out. There are 3 local surgeries that have "joined" together and all the jabs are given at the one nearest me. I didn't pass Sunday but,a s I say, certainly looked to be going flat out on Saturday.

Spoke with ours week before last & they said they were NOT getting involved.

No surprise really, as they only open 9-5 anyway.Patients being sick is a real PITA for them!!

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10 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Yep ours was too, fortunately I was able to get my first jab. Pleased that they are now out in the community vaccinating housebound people too.

Just seen WBB's comments above, when I had mine there was someone in the room on a terminal, I wonder if they were entering data in real time?

Yes, I guess each surgery may have it's own system for data entry.

I would assume that the personal record of each patient would be updated as they are actually vaccinated ???

That would mean you would just have to collate the total at the end of the day for submission.

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3 minutes ago, Mark .Y. said:

Yes, I guess each surgery may have it's own system for data entry.

I would assume that the personal record of each patient would be updated as they are actually vaccinated ???

That would mean you would just have to collate the total at the end of the day for submission.

I would guess that general clerical work is mainly done during normal weekday working hours hence the delays. People, even clerical workers, tend to expect extra pay at weekends! The full updates can wait for Monday/Tuesday anyway.

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National

22195 - 592

Local

image.png.f8a5dbaab1fde0a06f9c6752eb68bd97.png

image.png.025bcb54499fb32e6a8c6a5d4f00a2a9.png

image.thumb.png.6add488012ff2f4dc86b5f645513c41a.png

image.png.004cef18c4494d32f99bf276bfcad5b5.png

Quite clearly over the hump now, hospitalisations falling quite rapidly.

Vax numbers showing weekend effect and will again tomorrow.

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19 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Yep ours was too, fortunately I was able to get my first jab. Pleased that they are now out in the community vaccinating housebound people too.

Just seen WBB's comments above, when I had mine there was someone in the room on a terminal, I wonder if they were entering data in real time?

I think that’s your medical records.

I will 100% confirm for you but it won’t be for a few days as we are not getting anymore vaccine until Friday. The hubs may well have enough people and resources to load it the same day. We have 4 people calling the dont shows and ringing for new appointments if it becomes apparent we have vaccine left. On Friday we had 600 doses and administered exactly 600 doses. The hubs I assume are different as they operate 7 days a week, but I can’t be certain as I haven’t worked one just the central surgeries.

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4 minutes ago, ricardo said:

National

22195 - 592

Local

image.png.f8a5dbaab1fde0a06f9c6752eb68bd97.png

image.png.025bcb54499fb32e6a8c6a5d4f00a2a9.png

image.thumb.png.6add488012ff2f4dc86b5f645513c41a.png

image.png.004cef18c4494d32f99bf276bfcad5b5.png

Quite clearly over the hump now, hospitalisations falling quite rapidly.

Vax numbers showing weekend effect and will again tomorrow.

until the restrictions are eased

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32 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Yep ours was too, fortunately I was able to get my first jab.

I wonder what category hand crank falls into

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