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4 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Grandson's girlfriends antibody result says she had it. So we assume our Grandson had it. So, as he lives with us, I assume we had it.

You can take that flag down now 😉

plague.jpg?height=142&width=200

and hopefully the news is as good as it sounds

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3 minutes ago, Bill said:

What is now apparent is that the country is running itself obvious to absurd pronouncements from the government.

People are deciding themselves what distancing they will observe, likewise with masks.

Volunteers have been doing a magnificent job organising a distributing food, The whole health service right across the board have shown commitment and dedication that speaks volumes for them and the human spirit in general.

Widespread and peaceful protests show that voters want  a better society than what the last ten years have dumped on us. And it has been people like Marcus Rashford to put into words what so many know is right.

This horrific killer virus has s seen so many 'ordinary' folk rise to the fore - against so many politicians who have been found wanting.

Bob Dylan may have sung about the 'times they are a changin' - but we have to make that change happen. It is in our hands how we go from here. Royal yachts and painted planes, or schools and nurseries. Do we listen to Jacob Rees-Mogg, or Marcus Rashford ?

Embrace the future or cling to te past. Share our wealth and knowledge with the youth, or resent what they have.... their live ahead of them.

Greta Thurnberg, or Pritti Patel - who best represents your position on the future will tell you all you need to know ......................... .....................mostly about yourself

 

 

If you're looking for a little ray of hope Bill, have a read of James Martin's The Meaning of the 21st Century (the author not the chef). Ultimately he is an optimist (should add 'was').

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10 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Grandson's girlfriends antibody result says she had it. So we assume our Grandson had it. So, as he lives with us, I assume we had it.

Hope you can get a test too Kg.

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Just now, sonyc said:

If you're looking for a little ray of hope Bill, have a read of James Martin's The Meaning of the 21st Century (the author not the chef). Ultimately he is an optimist (should add 'was').

no, will have a look, thanks

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8 hours ago, Herman said:

NHS to now go with the Apple Google track and trace app. 🤨

In a massive u-turn that Guido repeatedly warned would have to come about, the NHS has finally given up on the bug filled, battery draining, and privacy invading, in-house, centralised app it was building, instead opting for the Apple-Google decentralised model Guido has long advocated. Finally. 

Back in May, Guido reported that the NHS “bizarrely rejected the decentralised, secure and intelligently designed Apple-Google contact tracing framework in favour of a centralised approach.” Guido’s experts then comprehensively rebutted the health departments arguments, concluding by saying:

“Why is the NHS trying to develop its own entire infrastructure and app rather than use a system developed by some of the world’s best software engineers at Apple and Google? Why do you think you know better than the people who literally wrote the operating system? We hope the Government has not got it wrong on this IT project this time…

Looks like the trial on the Isle of Wight did not really go well…

Matthew Lesh, the Head of Research at the ASI tells Guido

“We have lost crucial time, but it is welcome that the Government has listened to public concerns to get this important project right. It was always folly for NHSX to try building an app from scratch. Despite assertions, it was never going to work as well or ensure privacy would be protected as the Apple-Google framework.

The decentralised, Apple-Google approach will protect privacy, work across borders, limit battery drain, and effectively work in the background. A more effective app will help protect the NHS and save lives as winter approaches.”

Better late than never…

 

🤨 <   😀

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19 minutes ago, Jools said:

In a massive u-turn that Guido repeatedly warned would have to come about, the NHS has finally given up on the bug filled, battery draining, and privacy invading, in-house, centralised app it was building, instead opting for the Apple-Google decentralised model Guido has long advocated. Finally. 

Back in May, Guido reported that the NHS “bizarrely rejected the decentralised, secure and intelligently designed Apple-Google contact tracing framework in favour of a centralised approach.” Guido’s experts then comprehensively rebutted the health departments arguments, concluding by saying:

“Why is the NHS trying to develop its own entire infrastructure and app rather than use a system developed by some of the world’s best software engineers at Apple and Google? Why do you think you know better than the people who literally wrote the operating system? We hope the Government has not got it wrong on this IT project this time…

Looks like the trial on the Isle of Wight did not really go well…

Matthew Lesh, the Head of Research at the ASI tells Guido

“We have lost crucial time, but it is welcome that the Government has listened to public concerns to get this important project right. It was always folly for NHSX to try building an app from scratch. Despite assertions, it was never going to work as well or ensure privacy would be protected as the Apple-Google framework.

The decentralised, Apple-Google approach will protect privacy, work across borders, limit battery drain, and effectively work in the background. A more effective app will help protect the NHS and save lives as winter approaches.”

Better late than never…

 

🤨 <   😀

What is your opinion on chlorinated chicken?

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Good old guido still shilling for the tories. Nothing ever changes. 

Just to add, even the Daily Mail know who is to blame for yet another fiasco, a predicted one at that. 

Edited by Herman

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LEVEL 3!

Well done everyone! A major triumph! We've made it to a shorter sentence.

  • Level 3 - A Covid-19 epidemic is in general circulation
  • Level 4 - A Covid-19 epidemic is in general circulation; transmission is high or rising exponentially

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12 hours ago, Mr Angry said:

What is your opinion on chlorinated chicken?

it would appear to be like the poor lad himself - full of sh*t

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Hope you can get a test too Kg.

I don't think the full antibody test is available to anyone other than NHS staff. Would be good to know if we all have had it and not suffered any symptoms.

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Foreign Office minister James Cleverly was on Question Time last night. He said: “We now have a testing system which tests huge numbers of people on a daily basis – hundreds of thousands of people.”

But the government has not published daily figures for how many people are being tested for coronavirus for nearly a month

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5 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Foreign Office minister James Cleverly was on Question Time last night. He said: “We now have a testing system which tests huge numbers of people on a daily basis – hundreds of thousands of people.”

But the government has not published daily figures for how many people are being tested for coronavirus for nearly a month

Here he is, cluelessly contradicting Hancock

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/tory-minister-contradicts-government-on-tracing-app-claims-on-bbc-1-6708416

a farkin shambles - that has caused 1000's of deaths, and will no doubt cause more

get him, fat boy and the rest out

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51 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Foreign Office minister James Cleverly was on Question Time last night. He said: “We now have a testing system which tests huge numbers of people on a daily basis – hundreds of thousands of people.”

But the government has not published daily figures for how many people are being tested for coronavirus for nearly a month

Welcome to your new, American inspired, normal (as predicted by George Orwell) The Government will lie to you, not provide any facts, ask you to trust the Dear Leader and most essentially not believe the evidence of your own eyes. Time to put a stop to all of this and insist on truth, science, honesty and trust. Over to you in the UK to insist on that, over here we are slowly starting to make some progress towards reversing the damage of the last few years. 

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2 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

Hope you can get a test too Kg.

I don't think the full antibody test is available to anyone other than NHS staff. Would be good to know if we all have had it and not suffered any symptoms.

My boss just took one. Cost him 40 quid but proved that he did have it as he suspected. 

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1 hour ago, Surfer said:

Welcome to your new, American inspired, normal (as predicted by George Orwell) The Government will lie to you, not provide any facts, ask you to trust the Dear Leader and most essentially not believe the evidence of your own eyes. Time to put a stop to all of this and insist on truth, science, honesty and trust. Over to you in the UK to insist on that, over here we are slowly starting to make some progress towards reversing the damage of the last few years. 

I think that is already happening over here - with folk doing what they consider best or necessary

 Distancing controls are in place in shops, but that I suspect is merely to avoid any future ligation.

Government pronouncements are by in large now being treated with indifference, or ridiculed whenever the latest failure is announced

Watching Johnson and the government is like watching those old films of early attempts at flight, as you know whatever levels of confidence there is it will end in absolute failure. The only question being how spectacularly.

The protesting on the street is now a manifestation of wider grievance, and will not go away with a few 'tips of the hat' towards past injustices.

The right has had its moment in the sun, as with parts of Europe in the mid 20th century, but many now feel that a change is long overdue. Rule by bigotry and age is no longer delivering what society needs and wants and is acting as an impediment to progress,

I suspect it will not just be statues that fall.

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And the latest is that despite what Matt Hancock has claimed, Apple has said they have “no idea what they are talking about as they have not spoken to us” and “ our technology is already working in Germany and Holland”

This is a parallel to Trump stating they were working on a Covid app with Google, who immediately denied it. 
 

Cummings / Miller , Boris / Donald it’s all the same political cancer... you guys have to get them out of power NOW - and Starmer is your best bet to engineer that ....

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52 minutes ago, Surfer said:

 Cummings / Miller , Boris / Donald it’s all the same political cancer... you guys have to get them out of power NOW - and Starmer is your best bet to engineer that ....

 

🤣

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12 hours ago, Herman said:

Good old guido still shilling for the tories. Nothing ever changes. 

Just to add, even the Daily Mail know who is to blame for yet another fiasco, a predicted one at that. 

Matthew Gould is the CEO of ‘NHSX’, the Quango set up to “foster innovation” in the NHS, despite the prior existence of NHS digital, who already had the same mandate. Another expensive layer of civil servants with little or no tech expertise in the NHS.

Gould is not a techie, he is a former UK ambassador to Israel and a career diplomat with no background in the private sector or technology. Gould is an old school friend of George Osborne. Osborne had former Cabinet Secretary Jeremy Heywood appoint Gould to a role at DCMS despite the lack of relevant experience. Gould likes to crow about the ‘UK-Israel tech hub’ he set up when UK ambassador to Israel. At DCMS, Gould was supposed to manage government relations with ‘GAFAM’ (Google, Apple, Facebook, Amazon and Microsoft). He spent a lot of taxpayers’ money flying business class to California, where he would apologise for Brexit and then berate them about data privacy issues. Needless to say, GAFAM’s senior execs like Zuckerberg ignored Gould’s requests for meetings and fobbed him off on PR people like Nick Clegg. Gould felt slighted and maintains a grudge against GAFAM.

Nonetheless, Osborne encouraged Matt Hancock to appointed Gould to be ‘CEO’ of NHSX. His appointment was greeted with a collective sigh of despair across the tech-industry that a self-declared ‘tech bluffer’ with no real experience got the £150,000 job. “Let’s be clear” as Matt Hancock likes to say, it is Matthew Gould that has really screwed up the NHS Covid tracing app. Apple is not, as he is trying to spin, to blame.

Gould chose to pursue a policy of “Build rather than Buy” against the advice of everyone who did not work for him. You had two of the world’s largest technology companies joining forces to develop a decentralised, privacy-focused application that most of the world has rolled out in order to trace Coronavirus outbreaks. On the other hand, you have Gould’s team at NHSX, within a government department, outsourcing the build to external contractors based in Switzerland. Who could have predicted it would go wrong? Everyone.

The decision to build the software rather than buy it in – especially as it was already close to existing at the time – was Gould’s decision. It was a decision made for his and NHSX’s glory more than the public interest. Dominic Cummings when he was outside government would rail in blogs about the culture of the Civil Service, where Oxbridge bluffers with no clue would fail and face no consequences. Gould, who read philosophy and divinity at Cambridge, is a classic example. Gould should be fired over this fiasco…

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9 minutes ago, Jools said:

 

🤣

Middle of the first Norwich game in 3 months and this guy is the only one in the non football section commenting on political posts.

Why are you even on this forum?

  • Like 1

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1 hour ago, South Sider said:

Why are you even on this forum?

Because I find you utterly irresistible 🙃

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Virus was found in water samples in Italy in December. Further evidence that it was circulating some time before we first thought.

i suspect it was well established in the UK earlier than we realised.. 

Edited by Van wink

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35 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Virus was found in water samples in Italy in December. Further evidence that it was circulating some time before we first thought.

i suspect it was well established in the UK earlier than we realised.. 

Yes. Makes you wonder what the real toll is

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10 hours ago, Van wink said:

Virus was found in water samples in Italy in December. Further evidence that it was circulating some time before we first thought.

i suspect it was well established in the UK earlier than we realised.. 

I posted a link a good couple of months ago (maybe March) about how the Netherlands was pioneering research into wastewater to little interest (well, none!) here. It offered another metric and even a leading / predictive indicator of the prevalence of the virus for authorities to act upon. 

Here is a recent article. There are also many more story links in here. Interesting stuff.

 

Sewer surveillance part of Dutch national Covid-19 dashboard | Dutch Water Sector

https://www.dutchwatersector.com/news/sewer-surveillance-part-of-dutch-national-covid-19-dashboard

 

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What many have suspected

"Ministers have been accused of playing down the gravity of the coronavirus pandemic after it emerged that more than 1,000 people died every day in the UK for 22 consecutive days – in stark contrast with daily tolls announced by the government.

According to an analysis of official figures, the darkest day came on 8 April as the country prepared for Easter under lockdown, when a record 1,445 people died from Covid-19 in 24 hours."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/19/over-1000-deaths-day-uk-ministers-accused-downplaying-covid-19-peak

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This is what will bring the Government down - the constant lying. Eventually the British public will say "Enough"! We are at that point in the US now despite the administration's ever more desperate moves to pervert justice (and the Republican party's willingness to go along with it) . In the UK the tide will turn too and I don't care what the majority is in Parliament, MPs will not long follow a broken leadership that they see is about to sink under the waves. 

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Young people living independently is almost certainly an important factor why Nordic countries (excl. Sweden) have done so well and why Italy and Spain had such a hard time despite tough lockdowns. Interestingly France and UK and similar in proportion of young people living with their parents. France has done better, but that's probably for policy reasons:

If you look at the FT policy response index, you'll see France locked down earlier and harder than UK. I couldn't find Google mobility data go as far back as March, but France's wasn't that dissimilar from UK in early May atleast.

Idiosyncratic factors like timing of holidays, football matches and large church services have an impact, but I doubt they determine the final result. Culturally the French are habitual kissers, Italians love their family dinners and the Spanish talk loudly. 

Interesting: Spain has the most elevators per capita in the world with Italy the second!

 

318017052_Covid19deathspercapita_18_06_2020_andShareofyoungpeoplelivingwiththeirparents2018eurostat.thumb.jpg.25c8224050b618dd25d9e34688758273.jpg

Financial Times Covid19 response index.jpg

Google mobility trends france UK.jpg

Elevators per capita.jpg

Edited by Upo

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"nteresting: Spain has the most elevators per capita in the world with Italy the second! "

 

eh ?

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59 minutes ago, Surfer said:

This is what will bring the Government down - the constant lying. Eventually the British public will say "Enough"! We are at that point in the US now despite the administration's ever more desperate moves to pervert justice (and the Republican party's willingness to go along with it) . In the UK the tide will turn too and I don't care what the majority is in Parliament, MPs will not long follow a broken leadership that they see is about to sink under the waves. 

The major problem will be in passing legislation

We have already seen umpteen u-turns, and stuff that was promised (brexit) now abandoned.

Any radical change which might have passed unnoticed, or had most thinking 'let's give it a go' will now provoke the response of 'what are they up to now ?"

My thought is the Tories will allow Doris to carry on long enough that the whole shambles can then be laid at his door - and a leadership challenge will come sometime in 2021. They will need a government more in tune with current thought - not a buffoon mixed up in all manner of scandals and dodgy dealings.

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November 5th Bill. Mark it in your calendar. The Thursday it is confirmed the US Electorate has dumped Trump, and a day for Boris to go too. Or the day we walk hand in hand to fascism.

Edited by Surfer

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21 hours ago, Jools said:

Dominic Cummings when he was outside government would rail in blogs about the culture of the Civil Service, 

This implies that Guido believes Dominic Cummings is now "inside" the government?

He is not, he is a Special Adviser...which is, in fact a special type of civil servant

or, at least, that´s what he is supposed to be

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