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28 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

The ability to go back in time. The Government keep saying they are guided by science.

Are we really expected to believe that the 15th is going to make any difference from the 12th or else the science will be incorrect?

 

Gives backsliders like Billy time to get his order in.

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1 hour ago, Herman said:

 

And the evidence stands, that's why it only relates to public transport - not journeys made in private cars that might have 4 0r 5 passengers. It absolves those businesses from any future liability claims that is all.

It is the proximity and duration that is the concern - hence the nonsense peddled by hand crank and Ricardo about any relaxation being conditional (my words0 on wearing a mask has proven incorrect.

However countering righties nonsense is not the important point raised today, as

"The NHS coronavirus test-and-trace system designed to prevent a second deadly wave is not expected to work at full speed until September or October"

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jun/04/nhs-track-and-trace-system-not-expected-to-be-operating-fully-until-september-coronavirus

"More than a third of the 170,000 coronavirus tests claimed by the government on Wednesday were in fact kits sent out in the post, Downing Street has revealed."

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/coronavirus-uk-test-kits-postal-government-cases-a9548741.html

This is the truth that exposes Johnson's lies and misrepresentations - that are set against a backdrop of some of the highest death tolls in the world. Lies that are compounded by

"Italian health minister Pierpaolo Sileri undermined repeated denials from Downing Street that the government wanted the virus to spread in the community to build up a degree of immunity in the population.

Mr Sileri said Guiseppe Conte, the Italian prime minister, had recounted a conversation with Mr Johnson where the UK prime minister had told him he wanted to pursue herd immunity."
 
No wearing of fancy dress will distract from those failures and blatant lying. Neither will either bring back the 50-60 ,000 deaths.... caused by the terminally dim voting in as PM a man who has a history of failure and lies.
 
The blood is not just on his hands, but is shared by those who participated in this shameful period in our history.
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44 minutes ago, Herman said:

As with every measure being made or taken they should have been done months ago.

 

Over here we have, so they say, the most stringent measures currently in  Europe.  Face masks  looking likely to become mandatory  once public transport  is used to capacity. At the moment a standard bus is carrying about 12 passengers, max. Public getting restless as nongovt is taking an ultra cautious approach. From next Monday we are likely to be allowed  to travel up to 20km for non essential  purposes. Very clear.  Loved it when boris said not long after Cummins trip that in UK you were ok to travel to ' other places' ... wtf does that actually tell a thicko with no common sense. 

Best bit for me about the 20 km rule is that it gets me to some very good Bass beaches.  

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As more deaths occur, the shambles continues

"Tens of thousands of Britons had to be retested for coronavirus after the government sent their swabs to the US. Nearly 30,000 tests were found to be invalid after being flown out following problems at a UK laboratory last month."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/04/almost-30000-invalid-uk-coronavirus-tests-had-to-be-redone

Blood on the hands of those whose incompetence caused this - and on the hands of those whose weasel words try to defend that incompetence

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43 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Poor old Billy gets it wrong again.

Shouldn't  kick a man when he's  down.

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2 minutes ago, wcorkcanary said:

Shouldn't  kick a man when he's  down.

Fair point, he's in a pretty bad way.

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2 hours ago, Van wink said:

why does admitting anything make any difference to a deliberate breach putting people at risk

Now I don't have any particular axe to grind over Gardiner who is very much yesterday's man with regards to Labour party politics but if you can't see the difference between someone admitting an honest mistake and someone totally disreagrading the law, the advice and public opinion that says more about you than anything else @Van wink

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2 hours ago, Van wink said:

why does admitting anything make any difference to a deliberate breach putting people at risk

What’s the difference in the regulations between now and when Cummings drove 300 miles, drove to a hospital with coronavirus symptoms and went for a nice day out?

 

Doing what you’re allowed to do and getting too close to someone is still not ‘alright’ but is a massive amount different to what Cummings did. 

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I wonder what the reaction will be if it turns out that Alok Sharma is found to have Coronavirus ?

Under the test and trace requirements it would mean all cabinet members will have to go into 14 day quarantine - as will those in Parliament yesterday. Some might even consider his actions "a deliberate breach putting people at risk ".

Though the stick insect might claim that it is an MPs duty to attend and vote on matters - unless they can't as Parliament is prorogued, or some have tried to block them having a vote on an Act of Parliament

Still, we shall have to wait for the test results

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Aggy said:

What’s the difference in the regulations between now and when Cummings drove 300 miles, drove to a hospital with coronavirus symptoms and went for a nice day out?

 

Doing what you’re allowed to do and getting too close to someone is still not ‘alright’ but is a massive amount different to what Cummings did. 

Fully agree with that but this nonsense that Bigfish is spouting about it being an “honest mistake” is just daft

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6 minutes ago, Bill said:

I wonder what the reaction will be if it turns out that Alok Sharma is found to have Coronavirus ?

Under the test and trace requirements it would mean all cabinet members will have to go into 14 day quarantine - as will those in Parliament yesterday. Some might even consider his actions "a deliberate breach putting people at risk ".

Though the stick insect might claim that it is an MPs duty to attend and vote on matters - unless they can't as Parliament is prorogued, or some have tried to block them having a vote on an Act of Parliament

Still, we shall have to wait for the test results

 

 

Either this is an elaborate trick or you are doing the time warp again.

anyway this should help

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52609777

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5 minutes ago, Bill said:

I wonder what the reaction will be if it turns out that Alok Sharma is found to have Coronavirus ?

Under the test and trace requirements it would mean all cabinet members will have to go into 14 day quarantine - as will those in Parliament yesterday. Some might even consider his actions "a deliberate breach putting people at risk ".

Though the stick insect might claim that it is an MPs duty to attend and vote on matters - unless they can't as Parliament is prorogued, or some have tried to block them having a vote on an Act of Parliament

Still, we shall have to wait for the test results

 

 

an update - just in, the result is negative, with the caveat

"there are concerns that tests may not come back positive in the early stages of infection."

oh dear

 

 

"

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“An update just in”.   🤣

yep about 3 hours before you posted your previous update 😃

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It’s always a reaction rather than a proactive response! Face masks in public places should have been mandatory weeks back, but I will just say, why are so many people like sheep and need a shepherd? Just buy available face masks and wear them.....no need to wait till bumbling Boris tells you!

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1 minute ago, Indy said:

It’s always a reaction rather than a proactive response! Face masks in public places should have been mandatory weeks back, but I will just say, why are so many people like sheep and need a shepherd? Just buy available face masks and wear them.....no need to wait till bumbling Boris tells you!

It’s always been sensible advice to prevent the spread of infection, along with all the other measures.

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18 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Fully agree with that but this nonsense that Bigfish is spouting about it being an “honest mistake” is just daft

I hadn’t followed Gardinergate, but having read up now it seems there is one serious difference between what he did and Cummings’ triple breach of his government’s own rules.

According to Gardiner he tested negative for the virus on Tuesday, and then failed to properly  self-distance  the next day. The point about Cummings was that after he went home to see his ill wife he failed to get himself or her or the child tested, and then firstly he went back into work and then they all went to Durham and then had the jaunt to Barnard Castle.

For all Cummings knew anyone of them or even all three of them could have been infected and so in danger of spreading the virus, while Gardiner at least knew that as recently as the day beforehand he wan’t infected.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

I hadn’t followed Gardinergate, but having read up now it seems there is one serious difference between what he did and Cummings’ triple breach of his government’s own rules.

According to Gardiner he tested negative for the virus on Tuesday, and then failed to properly  self-distance  the next day. The point about Cummings was that after he went home to see his ill wife he failed to get himself or her or the child tested, and then firstly he went back into work and then they all went to Durham and then had the jaunt to Barnard Castle.

For all Cummings knew anyone of them or even all three of them could have been infected and so in danger of spreading the virus, while Gardiner at least knew that as recently as the day beforehand he wan’t infected.

 

 

It's even simpler. Gardiner may be foolish but he wasn't trying to break the rules in public.

Cummings simply knew he was breaking the rules hence the secrecy and then the following misleading Spectator articles.

Indefensible.

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32 minutes ago, Indy said:

It’s always a reaction rather than a proactive response! Face masks in public places should have been mandatory weeks back, but I will just say, why are so many people like sheep and need a shepherd? Just buy available face masks and wear them.....no need to wait till bumbling Boris tells you!

it is because they are of minimal use that they have not been mandatory

and if the above edit had any point then they would be mandatory from tomorrow and they would also be a legal requirement in similar places ie works vehicles, police vans, fire engines, private cars etc

in fact all vehicles that carry more than two people in close proximity

and the original claim by a couple of clueless righties was that it would be mandatory for everyone to wear a mask outdoors as part of any relaxation of lock down

these absurdities will go the way of bead car seats, bits of rubber hanging off cars to protect against being struck by lightening and carrying bottles of water

 a silly fad that will disappear to be replaced by something as equally stupid to fleece the gullible

 

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3 hours ago, Herman said:

As with every measure being made or taken they should have been done months ago.

 

That's cheating.  What would you do now?

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Do everyone that defended Cummings is now pointing out that Gardiner broke the rules and everyone that criticised Cummings is now distinguishing the two.

A long long time ago we talked about bias  (it was on the basis of the bias being unwitting.  

Anyone, honestly, believe that bias is not emerging here!!

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3 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

The ability to go back in time. The Government keep saying they are guided by science.

Thats cheating as well!   What, possible, change would you make?   

Is it that the government follow the epidemiological advice even if it is at the expense of the economy,?

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16 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

Do everyone that defended Cummings is now pointing out that Gardiner broke the rules and everyone that criticised Cummings is now distinguishing the two.

A long long time ago we talked about bias  (it was on the basis of the bias being unwitting.  

Anyone, honestly, believe that bias is not emerging here!!

Err... nothing to do with bias. The facts are clearly different. I don’t think anyone has said that Gardiner should be praised for not complying with social distancing measures. But the only bias would be if you refused to see the difference between the two cases.

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7 minutes ago, Aggy said:

Err... nothing to do with bias. The facts are clearly different. I don’t think anyone has said that Gardiner should be praised for not complying with social distancing measures. But the only bias would be if you refused to see the difference between the two cases.

Yes the facts are different and different conclusions are possible.  

So I assume your position is that Gardiner did wrong? 

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12 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

Yes the facts are different and different conclusions are possible.  

So I assume your position is that Gardiner did wrong? 

I assume others will recognise hand crank, that whatever name you post under, this is no more than a another attempt to deflect from the Tories guilt and incompetence over their failings

And yes, it is you hand crank as well we both know

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41 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

Thats cheating as well!   What, possible, change would you make?   

Is it that the government follow the epidemiological advice even if it is at the expense of the economy,?

I would change the fact that every government minister to speak about getting kids back to school has done it with **** assertions about it being specifically to close the disadvantage gap. Correct technically in so much as the gap will grow with kids not in school, but if anyone was unclear that is just a by-product of them wanting to get people back to work, then look no further than them not extending the free school meals vouchers over summer holidays.

Admittedly, FSM would not normally get them over summer hols, but we are not in normal times and the poorest who rely on these, are likely to be the ones who've been hit hardest.... even those who are furloughed. 80% of what you were already scraping to survive with, is proportionately far more drastic than 80% of a comfortable salary and disposable income. The cost is a drop in the ocean considering how much is already being spent and it would be a low-cost, high reward scheme.... but of course, they don't really give a **** about the poor and closing the gap as we already know - they only want them in school so their wealthy mates can put their parents back to work and resume profiteering and tax dodging.

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49 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

Do everyone that defended Cummings is now pointing out that Gardiner broke the rules and everyone that criticised Cummings is now distinguishing the two.

A long long time ago we talked about bias  (it was on the basis of the bias being unwitting.  

Anyone, honestly, believe that bias is not emerging here!!

I do believe the situations are different, but I'm happy to condemn Gardiner for being irresponsible if we're talking absolute, simplistic polarity on the issue. If we're taking a more realistic, adult approach and looking at it on a scale then both are on the wrong side of it but Cummings is further along that scale by a country mile, because what he did was patently more dangerous at a time when lockdown was tighter, and he helped make the rules.

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