Corona Virus main thread

[sonyc 5,492]

3 minutes ago, Mark .Y. said:

Yes, and so he should sonyc, I have been pretty impressed by his performance so far.

I still think though that if it was announced yesterday that Cummings was the living reincarnation of King Herod, he would be entirely forgiven if it turned out in a months time that he had persuaded the Government to reopen the pubs.

I know I'm a cynic at times   🙂

 

You should read Peck's piece on the Independent. He says as much in a scathing, sarcastic piece. 

[sonyc 5,492]

1 minute ago, ricardo said:

You should have stopped there😄

It is a source of lots of humour for me. I always feel such respect for the British sense of humour, dry, cutting, warm.

[......and Smith must score. 1,336]

3 hours ago, ricardo said:

Unless they have something else like proof he stopped at a service station I fear the bet is lost.

Yes you are probably right, much better for the opposition that he stays in the long run.

Well there’s CCTV footage of the public areas of all service stations.

The police claim to have visited his parents house in Durham and the Govt deny they did so if the police really want to nail him they might want to trawl through it all to spot him. There’s no way they didn’t stop somewhere en route.

One way or another I fancy you’ll win your bet.

 

[Barbe bleu 815]

I didn't want to stray into this debate but it seems to be the only one in town at the moment.

What is the actual advice he is said to have fallen foul of?  Both sides are adamant in their opinion that he has or has not breached the advice but I assume that it is possible to compare what he says he has done with the advice and point to what he has or has not done right or wrong?

And for full disclosure I thought the other two that resigned did the wrong thing. They both (i assume)had valuable skills and should instead have apologised, made a contribution to charity as penance and got on with it

 

 

Edited May 23, 2020 by Barbe bleu

[Herman 9,717]

This particular government has lost support from people like Tim Montgomery and Julia Hartley Brewer. They should start to worry.

[Herman 9,717]

9 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

What is the actual advice he is said to have fallen foul of?

"Do not drive your plague ridden **** 5 hours to your at risk parents house."

[Barbe bleu 815]

14 minutes ago, Herman said:

"Do not drive your plague ridden **** 5 hours to your at risk parents house."

 

Thanks. I actually dug the advice out for myself. 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-stay-at-home-guidance/stay-at-home-guidance-for-households-with-possible-coronavirus-covid-19-infection#if-you-are-living-with-children

Both arguments are probably sustainable

[ricardo 7,348]

24 minutes ago, Herman said:

This particular government has lost support from people like Tim Montgomery and Julia Hartley Brewer. They should start to worry.

Still 2-1 with Ladbrokes Herman.

[Van wink 2,994]

1 hour ago, TIL 1010 said:

Not going to reply to the lie you posted about me earlier then or the one posted a few weeks back that you have ignored also ?

To think you have the front to accuse others of lying.

He's been lying about a few of us today, a truly shocking character.

[Van wink 2,994]

4 hours ago, ricardo said:

Defending him am I?

When Ive already said I dont give  **** and have had 2-1 him going.

Looks like i am going to lose my money.

He thinks we have both been defending him, I certainly haven't,  making it up as he goes along, lying overload today even by Billy's standards

[Surfer 1,547]

Well that went well then ... not a surprise they sent in a sacrificial Transport Minister to explain how a 250 mile car journey with two adults with Covid symptoms and a child does not violate clear Government rules....  

https://www.indy100.com/article/dominic-cummings-government-press-briefing-lockdown-schapps-9529986

Edited May 23, 2020 by Surfer

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

When does the PM alter into No 10? Is it the same as after the war when there weren't any Nazis, they were Germans again.

Johnson hasn't put his name to anything has he. It was a message from a street address.

[Herman 9,717]

17 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

 

Thanks. I actually dug the advice out for myself. 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-stay-at-home-guidance/stay-at-home-guidance-for-households-with-possible-coronavirus-covid-19-infection#if-you-are-living-with-children

Both arguments are probably sustainable

What "both arguments"?

[ricardo 7,348]

6 minutes ago, Van wink said:

He thinks we have both been defending him, I certainly haven't,  making it up as he goes along, lying overload today even by Billy's standards

He just assumes you take any opposite position to him on everything. Obviously never reads the posts.

At his frothing best today.😁

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

 

[wcorkcanary 4,329]

3 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

. Rees Mogg is rapidly showing a posh voice and wealthy upbringing doesn't make you clever. It just accentuates your stupidity.

 Rees Mogg the complete opposite of Troy Deeney then,who looks rough but is clearly a smart bloke that people are happy to have as captain and spokesman.  

 

[wcorkcanary 4,329]

1 hour ago, Barbe bleu said:

I didn't want to stray into this debate but it seems to be the only one in town at the moment.

What is the actual advice he is said to have fallen foul of?  Both sides are adamant in their opinion that he has or has not breached the advice but I assume that it is possible to compare what he says he has done with the advice and point to what he has or has not done right or wrong?

And for full disclosure I thought the other two that resigned did the wrong thing. They both (i assume)had valuable skills and should instead have apologised, made a contribution to charity as penance and got on with it

 

 

The guidelines in UK are so ambiguous that unless directed by the law to stop  doing something, then you are technically not committing an " offence". 

So you are correct Bleuo , he did and he didnt.  I expect the slippery cont to survive.

[sonyc 5,492]

1 hour ago, Yellow Fever said:

I wonder if the Guardian and Mirror have a bit more of the story 'up their sleeves' for tomorrows 'exclusives' and headlines!

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/dominic-cummings-ignored-coronavirus-lockdown-22075857

Seems they have some more snippets from local people around Durham 

[ricardo 7,348]

4 minutes ago, wcorkcanary said:

The guidelines in UK are so ambiguous that unless directed by the law to stop  doing something, then you are technically not committing an " offence". 

So you are correct Bleuo , he did and he didnt.  I expect the slippery cont to survive.

Some people have been complaining for weeks that the instructions aren't clear so I wonder what has now brought this sudden clarity😉

[Yellow Fever 3,749]

10 minutes ago, sonyc said:

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/dominic-cummings-ignored-coronavirus-lockdown-22075857

Seems they have some more snippets from local people around Durham 

Oh Dear.

Lots of witnesses. 

Game over.

Ricardo will be pleased.

 

Edited May 23, 2020 by Yellow Fever

[ricardo 7,348]

6 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

Oh Dear.

Lots of witnesses. 

Game over.

Ricardo will be pleased.

 

Still 13/8 worth another go.

[sonyc 5,492]

2 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Still 13/8 worth another go.

You should trade out for a small profit R

[kick it off 1,948]

25 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Some people have been complaining for weeks that the instructions aren't clear so I wonder what has now brought this sudden clarity😉

Well the ardent BoJo diehards have been assuring us that everything is perfectly clear and entirely black and white.... one would presume that Cummings would be clear on the guidance seeing as he's essentially puppet master, and at the time, the guidance was clearly "Stay at home, save lives"... his wife's sister apparently lives two streets away in London for what that's worth.

Edited May 23, 2020 by kick it off

[ricardo 7,348]

14 minutes ago, sonyc said:

You should trade out for a small profit R

Apparently at one stage it went to 4-1 and there I was thinking 2's was value. There must have been some thick wedges on him staying for that to happen.

Always with your gut, sometimes you can over analyse🙄 it.

Evens now.

Edited May 23, 2020 by ricardo

[kick it off 1,948]

Just now, ricardo said:

Always with your gut, sometimes you can over analise it.

That sounds painful.... I'll stick to analysing rather than analising I think.

[......and Smith must score. 1,336]

1 hour ago, Barbe bleu said:

I didn't want to stray into this debate but it seems to be the only one in town at the moment.

What is the actual advice he is said to have fallen foul of?  Both sides are adamant in their opinion that he has or has not breached the advice but I assume that it is possible to compare what he says he has done with the advice and point to what he has or has not done right or wrong?

And for full disclosure I thought the other two that resigned did the wrong thing. They both (i assume)had valuable skills and should instead have apologised, made a contribution to charity as penance and got on with it

 

 

Cummings is bang to rights on this. After they had recovered his wife wrote an article for the Spectator about their illness. She claims her OH was laying in bed for ten days ‘ at home ‘ with breathing difficulties but failed to mention they were in fact in Durham. I wonder why she did that ? Might that have been because it might not look too good to say that infected with the virus they travelled over 250 miles to deposit their potentially infected son with Cummings over-70 year old at risk parents ? Cummings knew the rules, he got found out.

I disagree that the other two resignations were wrong. The Scottish Chief Medical Officer broke the rules twice and despite Sturgeons desperate efforts to save her she correctly had to go. Apparently she was very good at her job but that’s incidental. Similarly Neil Ferguson, also a gifted individual, met his mistress when he knew full well this was against official guidance. He had the decency to resign.

Cummings should go the same way.

 

[ricardo 7,348]

6 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

Cummings is bang to rights on this. After they had recovered his wife wrote an article for the Spectator about their illness. She claims her OH was laying in bed for ten days ‘ at home ‘ with breathing difficulties but failed to mention they were in fact in Durham. I wonder why she did that ? Might that have been because it might not look too good to say that infected with the virus they travelled over 250 miles to deposit their potentially infected son with Cummings over-70 year old at risk parents ? Cummings knew the rules, he got found out.

I disagree that the other two resignations were wrong. The Scottish Chief Medical Officer broke the rules twice and despite Sturgeons desperate efforts to save her she correctly had to go. Apparently she was very good at her job but that’s incidental. Similarly Neil Ferguson, also a gifted individual, met his mistress when he knew full well this was against official guidance. He had the decency to resign.

Cummings should go the same way.

 

Its often not the offence but nearly always the attempted cover up that does for them.

Edited May 23, 2020 by ricardo

[ron obvious 1,501]

16 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

Cummings is bang to rights on this. After they had recovered his wife wrote an article for the Spectator about their illness. She claims her OH was laying in bed for ten days ‘ at home ‘ with breathing difficulties but failed to mention they were in fact in Durham. I wonder why she did that ? Might that have been because it might not look too good to say that infected with the virus they travelled over 250 miles to deposit their potentially infected son with Cummings over-70 year old at risk parents ? Cummings knew the rules, he got found out.

I disagree that the other two resignations were wrong. The Scottish Chief Medical Officer broke the rules twice and despite Sturgeons desperate efforts to save her she correctly had to go. Apparently she was very good at her job but that’s incidental. Similarly Neil Ferguson, also a gifted individual, met his mistress when he knew full well this was against official guidance. He had the decency to resign.

Cummings should go the same way.

 

Hmm. Not sure, though you'd really have to read the original papers  ...

Imperial College epidemiologist Neil] Ferguson was behind the disputed research that sparked the mass culling of eleven million sheep and cattle during the 2001 outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease. He also predicted that up to 150,000 people could die. There were fewer than 200 deaths. . . .

In 2002, Ferguson predicted that up to 50,000 people would likely die from exposure to BSE (mad cow disease) in beef. In the U.K., there were only 177 deaths from BSE.

In 2005, Ferguson predicted that up to 150 million people could be killed from bird flu. In the end, only 282 people died worldwide from the disease between 2003 and 2009.

In 2009, a government estimate, based on Ferguson’s advice, said a “reasonable worst-case scenario” was that the swine flu would lead to 65,000 British deaths. In the end, swine flu killed 457 people in the U.K.

Last March, Ferguson admitted that his Imperial College model of the COVID-19 disease was based on undocumented, 13-year-old computer code that was intended to be used for a feared influenza pandemic, rather than a coronavirus. Ferguson declined to release his original code so other scientists could check his results. He only released a heavily revised set of code last week (beginning of May), after a six-week delay.

[Herman 9,717]

Aren't those a bit like the Y2K conspiracist reasonings? Because his predictions didn't come true it's because the science and data was faulty rather than the fact people worked bloody hard to stop the predictions coming true?!

Edited May 23, 2020 by Herman

[BigFish 1,986]

2 hours ago, Mark .Y. said:

No, I'm not missing the point.

So, he can be an easy target - and absolutely rightly so, in my opinion he has clearly f*cked up and should take the appropriate action.

The point I was making is that in a couple of months time a huge swathe of the British population won't care.

Missed again, they may forget this incident but Cummings will create more incidents. Each of these will erode trust in Johnson because Cummings is unelected, arrogant and doesn't care what anyone else thinks.