Corona Virus main thread

[ricardo 7,385]

42 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Whatever date is given to relax the lockdown, there will be a day before when you can't  and a day after when you can. It all seemed far too confusing Death Rigby.

So one has to ask why the World Hide and Seek Champion Boris has to wait until Sunday to announce anything. I very much doubt it has anything to do with rates of infection. 

I have criticised Trump enough but at least the guy has the respect to show his face at briefings and make himself look a fool.

 

If he made a statement today you would be saying he jumped the gun. We have always known it was Sunday, be patient.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

If he made a statement today you would be saying he jumped the gun. We have always known it was Sunday, be patient.

He is playing politics. He doesn't have to. He has a massive majority. And will .be PM for the next 10 years if he wants

[Herman 9,756]

21 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

If he made a statement today you would be saying he jumped the gun. We have always known it was Sunday, be patient.

He is playing politics. He doesn't have to. He has a massive majority. And will .be PM for the next 10 years if he wants

He doesn't want to make decisions that could come back to haunt him so they pump out two or three diffrent messages to keep everyone confused. Clever tactics but if he wants to be a leader then show some leadership. Love her or loathe her at least you knew Thatcher was making decisions whether they were popular or not.

[wcorkcanary 4,334]

3 hours ago, FenwayFrank said:

I’m not sure they would. Some people would think “ I can go to the beach next week, I’m only a few days early so I’ll go now” . The other thing is if the caveats change then the press will jump on that, use the phrase “ you promised” and report it all wrong again. However lock down is done it will be messy.

I get what you are saying Franko, but as I have always maintained....you cannot legislate for stupid.  Mixed messages cause doubt  , doubt leaves loopholes, real or imaginary, that people will try to exploit.  For sure there are people flouting the law here , was talking to a member of the Garda  Siochana this morning, who has been  manning roadblocks since restricted movement began . He said its the same people flouting regs time and again to the point that once entered on the database, that's their chance gone  , next time hefty fine. He says slowly but surely  these people are realising that their movements are on record as word is getting round. He also said that the clear plan laid out has allowed no wriggle room for miscreants, certain  dates mean certain  relaxation if covid strangulation is meeting targets. This has helped create a feeling of us against covid rather than us against them( the authorities). There will always be a few who dont give a toss.... they probably never will.

[BigFish 1,986]

1 hour ago, ricardo said:

If he made a statement today you would be saying he jumped the gun. We have always known it was Sunday, be patient.

It was due THURSDAY, and should have been made to PARLIAMENT where it could be given proper scrutiny.

Our amazing diappearing PM just wanted to deliver a party political broadcast in time for Monday's papers.

[BigFish 1,986]

Meanwhile in other news looks like the famous app is a turkey and the government is looking to adopt the approach taken by other European countries.

[Barbe bleu 823]

35 minutes ago, BigFish said:

Meanwhile in other news looks like the famous app is a turkey and the government is looking to adopt the approach taken by other European 

Do you have a link for this story?

Be a shame if it didn't work as I cant help thinking that at times like this a centrally planned intervention is probably better than the dispersed,  capitalist approach.

If it is a duffer hopefully we can move to a plan b quickly.

[Van wink 2,994]

52 minutes ago, BigFish said:

Meanwhile in other news looks like the famous app is a turkey and the government is looking to adopt the approach taken by other European countries.

What’s the story or are you teasing us?

[Aggy 755]

48 minutes ago, BigFish said:

It was due THURSDAY, and should have been made to PARLIAMENT where it could be given proper scrutiny.

Our amazing diappearing PM just wanted to deliver a party political broadcast in time for Monday's papers.

Had rather passed me by until I read this morning that it was supposed to be the 7th and then checked my calendar to realise it was already the 8th. 

However, the legislation just says the Secretary of State must review the restrictions every 21 days. No requirement to put it to Parliament or do anything but “consider”.
 

[The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (England) Regulations 2020, reg 3]

[Herman 9,756]

27 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

Do you have a link for this story?

Be a shame if it didn't work as I cant help thinking that at times like this a centrally planned intervention is probably better than the dispersed,  capitalist approach.

If it is a duffer hopefully we can move to a plan b quickly.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/may/07/uk-may-ditch-nhs-contact-tracing-app-for-apple-and-google-model

 

and an update on the IOW trials.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/08/what-have-we-got-to-lose-isle-of-wight-responds-to-nhs-covid-19-contact-tracing-app-

[Creative Midfielder 1,996]

13 minutes ago, Aggy said:

Had rather passed me by until I read this morning that it was supposed to be the 7th and then checked my calendar to realise it was already the 8th. 

However, the legislation just says the Secretary of State must review the restrictions every 21 days. No requirement to put it to Parliament or do anything but “consider”.
 

[The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (England) Regulations 2020, reg 3]

I don't think anyone is suggesting that he has broken the law just, as usual, his promises.

He told us last week that he would have a plan which he would announce yesterday after the statutory review had been conducted but he didn't announce it to Parliament or the people, just the Tory press.

This isn't leadership or competent governance, it's an ongoing election campaign which has led to a shambolic response to this horrible virus and a death toll which already the biggest in Europe is still growing at the fastest rate in Europe, and this latest mess isn't going to help one little bit.

[The Bristol Nest 513]

I have reliable information regarding the Sunday statement but can't share all 5 three week phases here.  Suffice to say that if each phase Increased infection rates we will revert to the previous one. Restarting sport behind closed doors is due, if the initial phases do not lead to a rise in the R 0 rate,  in Phase 3 on June 29th.

Sod it I'll start a thread!

 

Edited May 8, 2020 by The Bristol Nest

[Aggy 755]

5 minutes ago, Creative Midfielder said:

I don't think anyone is suggesting that he has broken the law just, as usual, his promises.

He told us last week that he would have a plan which he would announce yesterday after the statutory review had been conducted but he didn't announce it to Parliament or the people, just the Tory press.

This isn't leadership or competent governance, it's an ongoing election campaign which has led to a shambolic response to this horrible virus and a death toll which already the biggest in Europe is still growing at the fastest rate in Europe, and this latest mess isn't going to help one little bit.

Whether he should have announced it publicly yesterday based on other comments is a different point. However, I was responding to BF’s suggestion he should have put it before Parliament for scrutiny - he has no obligation to do so and, as far as I’m aware, hasn’t said he would.

[Herman 9,756]

3 minutes ago, Aggy said:

Whether he should have announced it publicly yesterday based on other comments is a different point. However, I was responding to BF’s suggestion he should have put it before Parliament for scrutiny - he has no obligation to do so and, as far as I’m aware, hasn’t said he would.

I think the Speaker Hoyle thinks he should have put it before Parliament and gave him a bit if a ticking off.

[Aggy 755]

Just now, Herman said:

I think the Speaker Hoyle thinks he should have put it before Parliament and gave him a bit if a ticking off.

Fair enough - but perhaps the speaker and co should have thought about that when passing the initial legislation!

[Creative Midfielder 1,996]

14 minutes ago, Aggy said:

Whether he should have announced it publicly yesterday based on other comments is a different point. However, I was responding to BF’s suggestion he should have put it before Parliament for scrutiny - he has no obligation to do so and, as far as I’m aware, hasn’t said he would.

So without a statement to Parliament or to the public we are expected to believe that he has discharged his statutory duty and 'reviewed the restrictions and considered whether changes are necessary' and although he apparently believes that the country needs a daily 'briefing' he doesn't consider the result of his review is worth mentioning.

Like I said, this is not leadership or even competent governance.

Edited May 8, 2020 by Creative Midfielder

[Van wink 2,994]

This is what Welsh first minister announced, expect the same

[Barbe bleu 823]

2 minutes ago, Creative Midfielder said:

So without a statement to Parliament or to the public we are expected to believe that he has discharged his statutory duty and 'reviewed the restrictions and considered whether changes are necessary' and although he apparently believes that the country needs a daily 'briefing' he doesn't consider the result of his review is worth mentioning.

Like I said, this is not leadership or even competent governance.

If you think he has failed to discharge is statutory duty you should definitely seek an injunction. Good luck with your application.

There have been failings for sure but you probably need to stop looking so hard for fault in every single thing that is done or not done, it just makes you look rabidly partisan and undermines you.

[Creative Midfielder 1,996]

6 minutes ago, Aggy said:

Fair enough - but perhaps the speaker and co should have thought about that when passing the initial legislation!

Definitely, but daft as it seems perhaps the Speaker and HoC assumed Johnson would do the right thing without actually being legally compelled to do so.............................no I can't believe it either - haven't they learnt anything from the events of the last few years 🙄

[Aggy 755]

1 minute ago, Creative Midfielder said:

So without a statement to Parliament or to the public we are expected to believe that he has discharged his statutory duty and 'reviewed the restrictions and considered whether changes are necessary' and although he apparently believes that the country needs a daily 'briefing' he doesn't consider the result of his review is worth mentioning.

Like I said, this is not leadership or even competent governance.

I’m not disputing that we have no way of knowing to what extent it has been ‘considered’. But there isn’t any explanation in the legislation of what ‘considered’ requires the Secretary of State to do. I considered what to have for tea last night - is that sufficient for the Secretary of State when considering national legislation? Probably not, I would agree, but then why wasn’t something more robust added to the regulations in the first place?

For comparison, the lengthier coronavirus act 2020 (which deals with many things but not the lockdown per se) requires a motion to be put before Parliament at a specified dat win the future which then needs to be debated (effectively the motion is that the act shouldn’t yet expire) - if the motion is rejected then the act has to be repealed within 21 days. 

The regulations dealing with our ability to leave our own homes just requires ‘consideration’. I get that they tried to push those regulations through ASAP but they’re a pretty big deal and weren’t scrutinised properly at the time. 

[Surfer 1,547]

34 minutes ago, Creative Midfielder said:

Definitely, but daft as it seems perhaps the Speaker and HoC assumed Johnson would do the right thing without actually being legally compelled to do so.............................no I can't believe it either - haven't they learnt anything from the events of the last few years 🙄

Um the Speaker does not pass legislation, the HoC does, and last time I checked the Tories had a solid majority. So yet another cop out from expected and reasonable behavior, "always in campaign mode and not governing" is the truth in UK and US unfortunately. 

[ricardo 7,385]

Through the looking glass.

[BigFish 1,986]

2 hours ago, Barbe bleu said:

Do you have a link for this story?

Be a shame if it didn't work as I cant help thinking that at times like this a centrally planned intervention is probably better than the dispersed,  capitalist approach.

If it is a duffer hopefully we can move to a plan b quickly.

UK may ditch NHS contact-tracing app for Apple and Google model

I for one won't be using the the government's app as it stands, even though as an Android user it would actually avoid the problem they have with iPhones.

Should they junk it, and follow the Europeans that would be different.

[Barbe bleu 823]

3 minutes ago, BigFish said:

UK may ditch NHS contact-tracing app for Apple and Google model

I for one won't be using the the government's app as it stands, even though as an Android user it would actually avoid the problem they have with iPhones.

Should they junk it, and follow the Europeans that would be different.

My understanding based on the news articles posted above is that the NHS app would give the government a much better picture of the spread of the virus and might lead to a better testing strategy.

Is privacy your concern?

[Surfer 1,547]

Meanwhile - Disney Shanghai is reopening, and the Dutch are moving ahead with opening theme parks in May too.

https://www.mbs.news/c/2020/05/dutch-theme-parks-will-soon-reopen-their-gates.html

 

 

[Herman 9,756]

1 hour ago, Barbe bleu said:

If you think he has failed to discharge is statutory duty you should definitely seek an injunction. Good luck with your application.

There have been failings for sure but you probably need to stop looking so hard for fault in every single thing that is done or not done, it just makes you look rabidly partisan and undermines you.

Whilst some won't question anything others will question everything.

[Van wink 2,994]

9 minutes ago, Surfer said:

Meanwhile - Disney Shanghai is reopening, and the Dutch are moving ahead with opening theme parks in May too.

https://www.mbs.news/c/2020/05/dutch-theme-parks-will-soon-reopen-their-gates.html

 

 

Limited attendance.....should get on the rides a bit quicker. Maybe we’ve all been taken for a ride!

[Surfer 1,547]

Just now, Van wink said:

Limited attendance.....should get on the rides a bit quicker. Maybe we’ve all been taken for a ride!

For sure... a good test for the rest of the world to follow if successful. Disney prices are truly shocking, maybe they will be desperate enough to discount tickets ? .... I know many in California want the parks reopened as 100,000+ jobs depend on them.

[Van wink 2,994]

17 minutes ago, Surfer said:

For sure... a good test for the rest of the world to follow if successful. Disney prices are truly shocking, maybe they will be desperate enough to discount tickets ? .... I know many in California want the parks reopened as 100,000+ jobs depend on them.

Massive industry. You just brought back some happy memories for me, is Ghirardelli’s open?

[Surfer 1,547]

30 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Massive industry. You just brought back some happy memories for me, is Ghirardelli’s open?

Nope, all their stores in California are still closed... the Disney one will probably be the last to open as it's in the park itself. Check that - there is one "to go" kiosk open in San Francisco near Pier 39.... getting my car keys 😉

Edited May 8, 2020 by Surfer