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1 minute ago, Ian said:

Lol, you guys are absolutely hilarious.

We had 19 shots today; creating chances was not the issue.

No, finishing them was. Buendia and Onel have the capacity to finish as evidenced from last season.

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You can give pukki a rest on FIFA or championship manager but in real life you put an injection on his foot and play him.

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4 minutes ago, Canary Wundaboy said:

No, finishing them was. Buendia and Onel have the capacity to finish as evidenced from last season.

I was mainly referring to your defensive approach comment, bearing in mind we absolutely dominated that match on an offensive sense.

Onel has a fabulous chance to get a shot off in the last 60 seconds and opted not to take it. 

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6 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

I don’t know, you’ll have to consult the Farke substitute spreadsheet for exact timings 

Simple observations, even you could manage that, surely?

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20 minutes ago, king canary said:

The problem is we need wins not draws. I could have understood more if Farke had made just the one sub but two in the last few minutes makes zero sense to me- subs that late are best for time wasting and breaking up play, not influencing results.

Pukki has been misfiring for weeks, we've got a striker on the bench who just scored last weekend- where is the harm in giving Pukki a 20 minute rest and Drmic a chance to impress?

We need wins not draws... so re our striker with 11 in 24 this season, 5 in the last 11, our top scorer by a mile....let’s take him off 😕 

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8 minutes ago, king canary said:

Why would you have gone insane? Hes not scored from open play in a fair while, he was missing good chances today, why not give someone else a try?

Are you trolling me here?

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1 hour ago, Canary Wundaboy said:

No, finishing them was. Buendia and Onel have the capacity to finish as evidenced from last season.

But not evidenced this season, even when theyve started.

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1 hour ago, Aggy said:

We need wins not draws... so re our striker with 11 in 24 this season, 5 in the last 11, our top scorer by a mile....let’s take him off 😕 

Some nicely massaged stats there.

I could equally say 'our striker with zero goals from open play in the last 6 games.'

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1 hour ago, Ian said:

Are you trolling me here?

No I'm not. Do you think Pukki is in good form right now? Is he undroppable?

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3 minutes ago, king canary said:

Some nicely massaged stats there.

I could equally say 'our striker with zero goals from open play in the last 6 games.'

I don’t care. If the sole reason behind the sub is to try and win the game, you don’t take off Pukki. He might not have scored from open play for six games but he’s still the best finisher we’ve got by a mile. 

If he’s injured or you’re resting him fair enough. Trying to win a game no chance. Sacrifice literally anyone else instead. Absolutely crazy to suggest otherwise.

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1 hour ago, Dr Greenthumb said:

Hardly been making a 67th minute sub this season has he?

He made two at half time at Southampton - but I guess we can't mention that either because it doesn't fit the agenda does it? 

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6 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

He made two at half time at Southampton - but I guess we can't mention that either because it doesn't fit the agenda does it? 

Look, a few people mentioned subs and now itll forever be something to attack him for irrespective of facts.

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3 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

He made two at half time at Southampton - but I guess we can't mention that either because it doesn't fit the agenda does it? 

We were 2-0 down. The point that has been made over and over again is that he doesn't make substitutions when we are level or ahead in games, thus conceding momentum. It cannot be coincidence that we have conceded more points from winning positions than any other team this season.

Today he made a sub after 66 minutes, the earliest this season in a game when we've been level or ahead (barring injuries). He made a sub at 70 minutes when we were 2-1 up against Spurs at home. Those are the only two instances of giving a substitute more than 15 minutes when we've not been losing.

I love Farke and I find it difficult to criticise him, but these are the facts. Although it's only my opinion that these late substitutions are a contributory factor to the sheer number of points we've lost from winning positions, I think you'd have a hard time arguing that they weren't.

Farke has way, way more positives than negatives as a manager, but his substitutions this season have been his biggest weakness IMO.

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15 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

We were 2-0 down. The point that has been made over and over again is that he doesn't make substitutions when we are level or ahead in games, thus conceding momentum. It cannot be coincidence that we have conceded more points from winning positions than any other team this season.

Today he made a sub after 66 minutes, the earliest this season in a game when we've been level or ahead (barring injuries). He made a sub at 70 minutes when we were 2-1 up against Spurs at home. Those are the only two instances of giving a substitute more than 15 minutes when we've not been losing.

I love Farke and I find it difficult to criticise him, but these are the facts. Although it's only my opinion that these late substitutions are a contributory factor to the sheer number of points we've lost from winning positions, I think you'd have a hard time arguing that they weren't.

Farke has way, way more positives than negatives as a manager, but his substitutions this season have been his biggest weakness IMO.

He made three substitutions today when we were level in the game!!

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And as I've pointed out before he brought Hernandez on for Cantwell when we were ahead against Palace - and Palace then went on to equalise. 

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21 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

We were 2-0 down. The point that has been made over and over again is that he doesn't make substitutions when we are level or ahead in games, thus conceding momentum. It cannot be coincidence that we have conceded more points from winning positions than any other team this season.

Today he made a sub after 66 minutes, the earliest this season in a game when we've been level or ahead (barring injuries). He made a sub at 70 minutes when we were 2-1 up against Spurs at home. Those are the only two instances of giving a substitute more than 15 minutes when we've not been losing.

I love Farke and I find it difficult to criticise him, but these are the facts. Although it's only my opinion that these late substitutions are a contributory factor to the sheer number of points we've lost from winning positions, I think you'd have a hard time arguing that they weren't.

Farke has way, way more positives than negatives as a manager, but his substitutions this season have been his biggest weakness IMO.

How did that work out? 

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The question was apart from Emi was Onel and then Vrancic too late to really influence the game. I'd have to say yes. Neither had time to get into the match.

I understood if not wholly agreed that Vrancic didn't start but we'd weathered any Newcastle storm and looked comfortable by 60 mins. Cantwell had an off day anyway so Emi was like for like (and equally ineffective) but Vrancic or Onel on at 70 and we would have gone for it. 

Yes concerned that Pukki seems to have forgotten how to score. Even his two recent penalties have not been  convincing.

Edited by Yellow Fever

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35 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

He made two at half time at Southampton - but I guess we can't mention that either because it doesn't fit the agenda does it? 

We can play list all the games if you would like? 

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28 minutes ago, hogesar said:

Look, a few people mentioned subs and now itll forever be something to attack him for irrespective of facts.

“Facts” 2 games listed from 25

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18 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

He made three substitutions today when we were level in the game!!

Yes, but two of those were in the last five minutes, which is kind of the pattern I'm drawing attention to. I don't have an agenda here, I'm just stating facts.

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13 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

How did that work out? 

We conceded a goal and drew 2-2. You're getting a bit swivel-eyed about this now.

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12 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

We conceded a goal and drew 2-2. You're getting a bit swivel-eyed about this now.

Oh stop being silly Wolfie. I'm merely making the point that when he did exactly what you say you want him to do - i.e. bring on a sub when we were ahead - the outcome was that we still surrendered the lead. I'm just stating a fact! 

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1 hour ago, king canary said:

No I'm not. Do you think Pukki is in good form right now? Is he undroppable?

No,

Yes, simply because we dont have anyone to replace him.

It should also be noted that his work rate and link up play as been very good.

 

Its alright being cool on the internet saying "Yeah, I'd drop Pukki for Drmic" realistically if it was your decision, you wouldn't.

 

As for subs, I'm not sure too much more of what he can do in a game where we are dominating? He obviously doesnt really fancy Hernandez and thank god he didnt bring Emi on any earlier.

Edited by CDMullins

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4 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

Oh stop being silly Wolfie. I'm merely making the point that when he did exactly what you say you want him to do - i.e. bring on a sub when we were ahead - the outcome was that we still surrendered the lead. I'm just stating a fact! 

Yes, of course. That's a fact. But it's also a fact that he did not make substitutions earlier than 75 minutes when we were ahead against Wolves, Sheffield United, Arsenal, Crystal Palace and Leicester, resulting in 12 points lost from winning positions - all in the same month! Then we equalised against Spurs last week, didn't bring on fresh legs and conceded a winning goal. Another point gone.

This is the fact-based pattern I am drawing attention to, and the Spurs home game is the outlier.

 

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Some serious burying of heads in the sand going on here.

Zero points won from losing positions.

Huge amounts of points dropped from winning positions.

But questioning Farkes game management/use of subs is beyond the pale.

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1 hour ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

He made two at half time at Southampton - but I guess we can't mention that either because it doesn't fit the agenda does it? 

Yeah remind me how we done in that game.

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3 minutes ago, Canary dwarf said:

Yeah remind me how we done in that game.

To be fair, the two half-time subs changed the game that day. We were dreadful in the first half and lucky to be only 2-0 down, but ended up losing 2-1 and were seriously unlucky not to get a point.

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16 minutes ago, CDMullins said:

No,

Yes, simply because we dont have anyone to replace him.

It should also be noted that his work rate and link up play as been very good.

 

Its alright being cool on the internet saying "Yeah, I'd drop Pukki for Drmic" realistically if it was your decision, you wouldn't.

 

As for subs, I'm not sure too much more of what he can do in a game where we are dominating? He obviously doesnt really fancy Hernandez and thank god he didnt bring Emi on any earlier.

I never said I'd drop him, just that I'd have considered subbing him with 20 minutes left for Drmic based on his poor finishing and Drmic having scored on Saturday. 

How this equates to me being 'cool on the internet' I'm not sure.

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2 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

To be fair, the two half-time subs changed the game that day. We were dreadful in the first half and lucky to be only 2-0 down, but ended up losing 2-1 and were seriously unlucky not to get a point.

Yeah I did not see that game as I was working but I'll take your word for it😄

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