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paul moy

Wuhan coronavirus

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5 hours ago, ricardo said:

So if some area, be it a town or city gets locked down you think Amazon and Deliveroo will still be coming round do you?

He still doesn’t quite get this does he

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Posted (edited)

Mike Pense tells us 4 deaths in U.S today, they ain’t seen nothing yet, but dont panic, Donald says it’s not a problem and everything is well under control. Thank goodness the US testing regime is so accurate and the virus hasn’t got very far in their country😳 Trumps’ son seems to think the virus is being talked up by the Democrats and other medical experts deliberately to get rid of Dad. Oh dear, this is going to end very badly!

Edited by Van wink

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I was out in the city after the game on Friday night.....I also went out Saturday night with a few mates.....The personal hygiene habits of some folk are seriously questionable and frankly quite disgusting......The amount of times I went to the loo for a wazz then witnessing blokes walking away from urinals or exiting toilet cubicles and breezing past soap dispensers and washbasins then ambling straight out of the door.....Watching people in the majority of bars sneezing and coughing making absolutely no attempt to stop the diffusing of disgusting droplets of their nasal or lung contents.....and that's a percentage of disgusting dire folk ignoring the basics of hopefully reducing, restricting or limiting the spread of a pandemic virus.....What chance have we got of seriously curtailing the infectious virus, when the common basics of human hygiene aren't being utilised?..... 

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Mello Yello said:

I was out in the city after the game on Friday night.....I also went out Saturday night with a few mates.....The personal hygiene habits of some folk are seriously questionable and frankly quite disgusting......The amount of times I went to the loo for a wazz then witnessing blokes walking away from urinals or exiting toilet cubicles and breezing past soap dispensers and washbasins then ambling straight out of the door.....Watching people in the majority of bars sneezing and coughing making absolutely no attempt to stop the diffusing of disgusting droplets of their nasal or lung contents.....and that's a percentage of disgusting dire folk ignoring the basics of hopefully reducing, restricting or limiting the spread of a pandemic virus.....What chance have we got of seriously curtailing the infectious virus, when the common basics of human hygiene aren't being utilised?..... 

Dirty feckers! Chewing gum in the urinals eh, who does that and who fishes it out and reuses it?

Edited by Van wink

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The stable genius is on videotape asking why the US can’t use flu vaccine against this virus? 
 

From his meeting today at the White House with heads of pharmaceutical companies.

“Do you think it would help”? No, Mr President, not at all” Glad he asked though, I’m sure none of the so called “experts” had thought of that....

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I appreciate that people are understandable scared but if they think 98pc are going to completely stop to reduce the risk of the 2px then they are going to be disappointed. We decide to live with flu and at some point we will live and or die with this 

the young people are unconcerned  as their  risk is low that they are not even mentioning it. The only comment I’ve seen is from a young caring person noting all the war and disease going on around the world all the time that no one cares about. This is primarily killing the old and people with lifestyle illnesses. The older generation have said that they don’t care about issues which younger people care about like freedom off movement and climate change and have shown no concern for refugeees or immigrants or other religions or races so the young are questioning why they should be concerned about a generation that’s shown a blatant disregard for them and other people. 
 

Even if everyone got it then that be 2pc of the population. This are people who are mainly old and sick and largely unproductive so the expectation is it will reduce growth by 1pc as it Passes through the population who will largely recover and extensive resources are thrown to develop mitigating vaccines and treatment and there is a recovery and bounce back phase as there is with all disasters. No one is saying this will be easy in the meantime apart from perhaps Trump. 

Lots of people are now starting to work from home which is entirely possible with modern IT. for many it is unnecessary to work from an office. 

im not saying that I haven’t got supplies in or doesn’t make sense to have some supplies in but the younger generation don’t bother with cars and rely on delivery services and just renting transport of the Street when they need. I see more delivery trucks on the way to the supermarket than cars. A large part of my shopping is just delivered by a fleet of various delivery services with an option just to drop the goods off on the door step and they is loads of Young gig workers making deliveries on bikes. This will continue as maintaining the food chain will be a priority as people will focus on delivering essential products rather than other products if required. And there will plenty of people willing to make money out of the situation  

There have been no reports of starvations. delays. disruption and reduced choice. Yes but not starvation. The use of delivering services and apps has been an essential part of keeping the supply chain going in Wuhan. Those living in the past  would be wise to avail themselves of modern services and technology.to increase their options rather than mocking. The world has moved on. 

Ultimately the brutal reality will be there will probably be significant disruption but ultimately the 98pc will prevail over the 2pc. Follow expert advice advice. medical advice, lead a healthy life style and increase your options with modern technology and services if you want to increase your ability to cope.  It is those that adapt to changes in society that prevail. 

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2 hours ago, T said:

I appreciate that people are understandable scared but if they think 98pc are going to completely stop to reduce the risk of the 2px then they are going to be disappointed. We decide to live with flu and at some point we will live and or die with this 

the young people are unconcerned  as their  risk is low that they are not even mentioning it. The only comment I’ve seen is from a young caring person noting all the war and disease going on around the world all the time that no one cares about. This is primarily killing the old and people with lifestyle illnesses. The older generation have said that they don’t care about issues which younger people care about like freedom off movement and climate change and have shown no concern for refugeees or immigrants or other religions or races so the young are questioning why they should be concerned about a generation that’s shown a blatant disregard for them and other people. 
 

Even if everyone got it then that be 2pc of the population. This are people who are mainly old and sick and largely unproductive so the expectation is it will reduce growth by 1pc as it Passes through the population who will largely recover and extensive resources are thrown to develop mitigating vaccines and treatment and there is a recovery and bounce back phase as there is with all disasters. No one is saying this will be easy in the meantime apart from perhaps Trump. 

Lots of people are now starting to work from home which is entirely possible with modern IT. for many it is unnecessary to work from an office. 

im not saying that I haven’t got supplies in or doesn’t make sense to have some supplies in but the younger generation don’t bother with cars and rely on delivery services and just renting transport of the Street when they need. I see more delivery trucks on the way to the supermarket than cars. A large part of my shopping is just delivered by a fleet of various delivery services with an option just to drop the goods off on the door step and they is loads of Young gig workers making deliveries on bikes. This will continue as maintaining the food chain will be a priority as people will focus on delivering essential products rather than other products if required. And there will plenty of people willing to make money out of the situation  

There have been no reports of starvations. delays. disruption and reduced choice. Yes but not starvation. The use of delivering services and apps has been an essential part of keeping the supply chain going in Wuhan. Those living in the past  would be wise to avail themselves of modern services and technology.to increase their options rather than mocking. The world has moved on. 

Ultimately the brutal reality will be there will probably be significant disruption but ultimately the 98pc will prevail over the 2pc. Follow expert advice advice. medical advice, lead a healthy life style and increase your options with modern technology and services if you want to increase your ability to cope.  It is those that adapt to changes in society that prevail. 

Learn something every day. Today I learnt that “young people” don’t apparently have under lying health issues. Strange as I would consider myself to be relatively young, and if I got this virus I’d very likely be in a lot of trouble with it, given how badly a common cold can affect me

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There are many young people and children with health conditions, through no fault of their own and certainly not through poor lifestyle choices, that make them more vulnerable to an infection of this type. T is clueless on this subject as he is on most things to be honest.

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2 minutes ago, Van wink said:

There are many young people and children with health conditions, through no fault of their own and certainly not through poor lifestyle choices, that make them more vulnerable to an infection of this type. T is clueless on this subject as he is on most things to be honest.

 

2 minutes ago, Van wink said:

There are many young people and children with health conditions, through no fault of their own and certainly not through poor lifestyle choices, that make them more vulnerable to an infection of this type. T is clueless on this subject as he is on most things to be honest.

Yes, as I said I’d consider myself relatively young and have suffered from chronic asthma since childhood. This virus would seriously compromise me, as would the flu but there are vaccines for that.

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T still hasn't progressed beyond stage two of Schopenhauer's three stages of truth.

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31 minutes ago, JF said:

 

Yes, as I said I’d consider myself relatively young and have suffered from chronic asthma since childhood. This virus would seriously compromise me, as would the flu but there are vaccines for that.

You are not alone JF, there are many who would be seriously compromised regardless of age.

The USA has only just begun testing in any quantity. Watch the numbers.

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Where did I say that some young people do not have heath problems. I said that they are relatively low risk. The younger people are then the lower the risk and a healthy life style reduces the chances of the conditions  associated with a higher death rate.
 

But given the majority of older UK adults don’t follow expert advice and are overweight it seems they are willing to increase the risk. Obviously some people have conditions outside their control. The risks increase with age and health conditions  That is just reality  My risk is higher than someone younger than me  That is just the way it is  

i primarily take my info from the WHO as I always prefer original source information but if someone thinks they know better than the WHO that is up to them. I much prefer expert information facts evidence and analysis.  Likewise if they don’t want to avail themselves of modern alternatives it is entirely up to them  

It is not a subject that I’m interested in arguing about but I appreciate this is a topic that some people are hype sensitive about just as I don’t appreciate racist, nationalistic, xenophobic and islamophobic comments because of my own experiences but each to their own.

If people think they know better than experts such as the WHO than ultimately that is their choice and I will never change their view. I personally think that ignoring the advice of people with knowledge experience and qualifications is not a good idea but I understand others have a different view 

The government is limiting their actions now because the they see that the costs outweigh the benefits. That will change over time. Clearly the view on costs of actions versus the risks changes depending on people’s age and health but the government assessment will ultimately depend on the majority rather than the minority.
 

There are roughly 9m global deaths since the virus started of which only 3009 are due to Covid 19.  Humans are not very good at assessing risk as they over inflate risks in the news compared to other risks. That doesn’t mean I don’t think this is serious and won’t escalate or that people shouldn’t think through how they would cope with different circumstances. 

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17 minutes ago, T said:

It is not a subject that I’m interested in arguing about but I appreciate this is a topic that some people are hype sensitive about just as I don’t appreciate racist, nationalistic, xenophobic and islamophobic comments because of my own experiences but each to their own.

 

Can't see much difference myself. Bracketing people together and making generalised judgments based on prejudice is exactly what you are doing. 

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Posted (edited)

This T character.

He sure bumps himself up a lot. Likes himself too much.

 

I wonder what this valuable contribution he makes amounts to?

 

Seems to me he might well be a  middle-man (salesman)...possibly on the internet. Yuk! Own up man.

My father, in his eighties spent his whole working life in the medical profession saving people's lives.He's very vulnerable.

I wonder what this T actually does to make him so valuable to society?

Such a nasty hostile individual. I thought he had moved to Germany.Why does he infest this site then? He's clearly not much of a City fan as I don't recall him posting much on football matters.

Edited by BroadstairsR

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I'll tell my 16 year old Granddaughter who is Diabetic One that she need not worry because we should be talking  in generalities rather than particular cases. That will ease all our current concerns.

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42 minutes ago, ricardo said:

T still hasn't progressed beyond stage two of Schopenhauer's three stages of truth.

That could be the case but my view is irrelevant as I will not be making the decisions. The views that do matter are those of the WHO, PHE and the UK govt all of whom I happen to completely agree with on this matter and all of whom freely admit as I do that there is a range of possible  outcomes. 
 

peiples views will depend on their perceived risk and their attitude to risk. Personally I have a balanced investment portfolio and undertake risky sports but follow guidance based on expert analysis. Other people have different views and are fully entitled to them as far as I’m concerned. 
 

im afraid people do die and will die from Covid 19 and of course that is not nice but that is the fundamental nature of the human condition. Personally I will follow expert guidance but fully accept that whatever I do I will at some point die from Covid 19 or something else and the world will go on.  

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You are now entering stage three where the problem becomes Widly accepted as self evident.

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So Boris has chosen.

He had a choice to make - 

Close schools, large gatherings and similar and try to preemptively slow (I won't saw contain) the virus - saving no doubt a very great many lives especially in the over 65's but take an early economic hit and derail his spending plans / budget.

OR

Just be reactive - accept the likely lots of deaths (1%+ ?) in his 65+ boomer voter base (well they've largely already voted for him now) but put the economy first whatever the (human) cost.

I'm sorry to put it so bluntly but that is what he has done. By the time he tries/needs to implement any of his measures it will already be way too late if not already. Let history judge.

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I happen to think racists nationalists xenophobes and islamophobic people are not very nice and I’m clearly not concerned about being liked by such people but each to their own and am always open to renunciation reconciliation and apologies. 


 I’ve never doubted that the world will go on without me.No where have I said Covid  19 is nice or fair. It is what it is. That the risk is higher as you get older and for those with other conditions is just an avoidable fact which I fully appreciate is not palatable but it is what it is. There is nothing that I can say or do which will change those facts however difficult they are to some people. I could say we should lock down now to reduce the risk for the 2pc but it is not going to happen. 
 

 I don’t have any professional football experience or qualifications and I’ve no doubt a lot of people on here have more knowledge on football than me which is why I don’t comment on football. I’m just a punter watching on TV so don’t have a particular view.
 

I think you will find Covid 19 is an international issue as many things are in reality which doesn’t respect borders no matter how much people want to isolate themselves. We live in a globalised world and disease has moved around the world as long as mankind has. 

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5 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

So Boris has chosen.

He had a choice to make - 

Close schools, large gatherings and similar and try to preemptively slow (I won't saw contain) the virus - saving no doubt a very great many lives especially in the over 65's but take an early economic hit and derail his spending plans / budget.

OR

Just be reactive - accept the likely lots of deaths (1%+ ?) in his 65+ boomer voter base (well they've largely already voted for him now) but put the economy first whatever the (human) cost.

I'm sorry to put it so bluntly but that is what he has done. By the time he tries/needs to implement any of his measures it will already be way too late if not already. Let history judge.

Agreed

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15 minutes ago, ricardo said:

You are now entering stage three where the problem becomes Widly accepted as self evident.

I’ve never thought otherwise. There is an ever persistent risk for a global pandemic and no one knows exactly how it will pan. out. Some have escalated and some have fizzled out and it is difficult to know at the start what will happen until more info is available.

 I have consistently said though that I thought they will weigh the costs and risks and it looks like they will limit restrictions   There comes a point where you can’t always contain these things and you can only mitigate and let things take their course which appears to be go the policy.
 

The low number of positive tests in the UK and that is seems more prevalent in close groups maybe some comfort that social distancing may restrict the spread to some extent. 

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25 minutes ago, T said:

I’ve never thought otherwise. There is an ever persistent risk for a global pandemic and no one knows exactly how it will pan. out. Some have escalated and some have fizzled out and it is difficult to know at the start what will happen until more info is available.

 I have consistently said though that I thought they will weigh the costs and risks and it looks like they will limit restrictions   There comes a point where you can’t always contain these things and you can only mitigate and let things take their course which appears to be go the policy.
 

The low number of positive tests in the UK and that is seems more prevalent in close groups maybe some comfort that social distancing may restrict the spread to some extent. 

China has a population of 1.5 billion.

So ask yourself this question. If its just a case of 3k deaths do you think they would shut down their entire economy for a month.

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21 hours ago, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

WHO recommends washing hands whilst singing "happy birthday" twice 

Surely it should be "ring a ring a roses"?

Anyone affected by this yet? We have a guy at work quarantined as he has been in contact with a confirmed case 🙁

A lady in our team was at the Venice Carnival and has been self-isolating in Wymondham for the past twelve days. We also have an Iranian lady in our team who is currently in Iran.......:classic_huh:

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Anybody starting to think that massive cuts to the NHS, privatising elderly care and moving essential care workers (and other numerous occupations) onto zero hour contracts may have been short termist folly? 

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1 hour ago, Yellow Fever said:

So Boris has chosen.

He had a choice to make - 

Close schools, large gatherings and similar and try to preemptively slow (I won't saw contain) the virus - saving no doubt a very great many lives especially in the over 65's but take an early economic hit and derail his spending plans / budget.

OR

Just be reactive - accept the likely lots of deaths (1%+ ?) in his 65+ boomer voter base (well they've largely already voted for him now) but put the economy first whatever the (human) cost.

I'm sorry to put it so bluntly but that is what he has done. By the time he tries/needs to implement any of his measures it will already be way too late if not already. Let history judge.

I think those are pretty much the choices faced by every country in the world. Don't think we are unique in any way. 

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3 minutes ago, ricardo said:

China has a population of 1.5 billion.

So ask yourself this question. If its just a case of 3k deaths do you think they would shut down their entire economy for a month.

No. I don’t and no where have I suggested that I don’t think this is serious. I really don’t think I’m disagreeing with most of what you are saying just I prefer to focus on the 98 figure rather than than the 2. That is just a different perspective on the same thing.  I don’t think they shut down their whole economy though and this does suggest this can be restricted albeit with significant disruption. Maybe I would just like an apology and a refrain from previous comments I found highly offensive but I fully accept that my chances of Covid 19 are higher ;-). 
 

The report on the govt assessment says worst case scenario. 80 pc get effected with about 50pc developing symptoms and 1 pc death rate. so that is 0.004pc death rate. 4 in thousand. compared to an annual mortality rate of 9 in a thousand. Not good but limited. 
 

The Bank of England and all other reports I’ve read think that the effect will be large but temporary. which makes sense when you look at the figures above. 

im just agreeing with main stream thought. 

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8 minutes ago, Herman said:

Anybody starting to think that massive cuts to the NHS, privatising elderly care and moving essential care workers (and other numerous occupations) onto zero hour contracts may have been short termist folly? 

I'm reminded of that old insurance advert 'We won't make a drama out of a crisis'

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

I'm reminded of that old insurance advert 'We won't make a drama out of a crisis'

How about - No crisis should go to waste...

Edited by Yellow Fever

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