What makes Farke special then?

[Dame to Blame 95]

6 hours ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Roger Schmidt, because I think it would have to be a German under this regime with Webbers obsession with German players, and to avoid a complete overhaul of the squad. Achieved good things with Salzburg and to a degree at Leverkusen, currently unemployed. 

Or did you assume that we were all ignorant on this forum and would say Sam Allardyce or Tony Pulis, because you think we lack knowledge or imagination? 

Not a bad shout his win ratio is pretty good, but i do wonder why he got sacked from his last two jobs . Personally i would be sticking with Farke , and give him another season to get us back. 

[Dr Greenthumb 746]

8 hours ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Keep hearing it, losing track of why it is.

Is it just a case of believing something if you repeat it enough? 

Don't hear fans from other clubs saying it? 

The media don't say it? 

How many times has he changed tactics to completely turn a game? How many match winning substitutions? 

Realised a while back that his game management is pretty much non-existent, late last season we saw that he wasn't prepared to rotate a squad either and we saw fatique problems.

The real 'special one' was the Spurs manager today, he responded to his teams failings with substitutions at various stages, seemed to be pretty effective if you ask me. 

He made subs, he won the game.

I mean, is it the team spirit he fostered last year? Because that's no different to the Lambert promotion and the Worthington promotion, both times went up with great team spirit.

Could argue that he's been instrumental in bringing through a couple of talented young players, I'll credit him that, but how much of this is down to some sort of special ability and how much of it is just down to us being lucky enough to have a good crop coupled with being a bit skint so not having much choice but to use them? 

Take Craig Bellamy for example. We were skint, he was a bit good, so obviously we played him. Then other teams realised he was good so we sold him. Weren't rocket science really was it? 

What's so special about Farke? Seems completely devoid of ideas on game day to me. 

He performed a miracle without being backed last season and it is still achievable with a pathetic backing in the premier league, he is not a bad manager, his one downfall is he is too loyal to players 

[Hardhouse44 261]

9 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

You are basing your judgment on this season alone. Fair enough. But last season he performed a small miracle.

And the board or Webber didn't back that miracle up. The club is left to scratching around for not EPL quality Europeans. Rhodes was too expensive apparently, for example.

I shudder at the thought of us spending all the money like Villa have but seeing the quality that has come in, there are better in the Championship.

I don't like his use of zonal marking and the use of subs baffles me but he has produced a team that can entertain at the level this squad reaches. And that is not EPL. I am positive that Pukki, Buendia and Aarons would be even better players going to better clubs.

But that’s all you can base it on. Even the greatest managers get sacked eventually because of what’s happening in the present despite the past. Who’d have though Pochettino who have gone this season after taking spurs to the champion league final! 
 

Yes we didn’t invest but that’s what everyone wants isn’t super super never in debt safety. Whilst you shudder at the thought of spending what villa have the sad thing is we didn’t need to spend anywhere near that much as we already had much better players than them in many positions. We needed to spend some money to compliment the good we had. We needed to address the defensive frailties and if Farke wasn’t pounding on Webber’s and Delia’s door every day between promotion and the close of the transfer window screaming those sentiments he is as culpable as them.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

19 minutes ago, Hardhouse44 said:

But that’s all you can base it on. Even the greatest managers get sacked eventually because of what’s happening in the present despite the past. Who’d have though Pochettino who have gone this season after taking spurs to the champion league final! 
 

Yes we didn’t invest but that’s what everyone wants isn’t super super never in debt safety. Whilst you shudder at the thought of spending what villa have the sad thing is we didn’t need to spend anywhere near that much as we already had much better players than them in many positions. We needed to spend some money to compliment the good we had. We needed to address the defensive frailties and if Farke wasn’t pounding on Webber’s and Delia’s door every day between promotion and the close of the transfer window screaming those sentiments he is as culpable as them.

Watford have spent an average of £19m net since coming up, complete myth that every team up here is being bankrolled by mega money.  

£20m is honestly what I thought we'd be spending, looking for value like Watford do. Instead people think we are going to walk the league again with Drmic and Rupp, whilst we inevitably lose several talents that we'll seriously struggle to replace with comparable quality. 

 People are deluded. We saw our future last night, it's praying that Rupp and Drmic have got something going for them.

A few more £500k Germans and it's cross our fingers time in a league where Brentford pay £5m for a centre back. 

The biggest failure this season is a failure to do down with a stronger squad. West Brom yo-yo's several times and then established themselves in the Premier League. 

But each time they spent conservatively but improved their core group. 

Drmic and Rupp, great. That's our promotion dividend.

Only bright light is Byram, but not when you realise he's the Aaron's replacement and he'll end up with a Heise/Husband type signing as his competition.

I don't believe in the 'project', as I don't think there really is one. It's just little old Norwich again and this season will go down as a wasted opportunity. 

[non-scoring strikers 113]

I don't understand the argument on here whereby people think that 'being backed' or 'spending/investing' means instant success. We hardly spent a bean compared to most Championship clubs last season but we won the league. It's not about spending a particular sum of money it's about how you spend money.

There are people here stating that if Farke had money to spend then he would've kept us up without a doubt. What makes you say that?

He still hasn't shown any inclination of improving our biggest problem area - the defence. Not with personnel (with the exception of Byram) nor with tactics.

It isn't money that doesn't make game changing substitutions, it isn't money that plays players when they're carrying injuries, it isn't money that tells our players to pass back to the keeper from the halfway line, it isn't money that reacts after the damage is done. 

I just find it such an odd argument, and one that is made by people who really don't understand what they are watching.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

2 hours ago, Dr Greenthumb said:

He performed a miracle without being backed last season and it is still achievable with a pathetic backing in the premier league, he is not a bad manager, his one downfall is he is too loyal to players 

He didn't "perform a miracle", he won promotion to the top tier with a club which has a long history of winning promotion to the top tier. 

It's no more a miracle than the time Worthington took us up, or the time Lambert achieved double promotion. Or any of our achievements in the 80's.  

Why was last season a bigger miracle than those? 

So Nigel Worthington is a genius? I mean, I liked him, a good manager, but based on your criteria surely a genius? 

From almost bankrupt League 1 club to 12th in the Premier League in three years under Lambert who used academy kids to get us out of league one. Surely makes Lambert a super mega genius?

Edited January 23, 2020 by TeemuVanBasten

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

Just now, non-scoring strikers said:

I don't understand the argument on here whereby people think that 'being backed' or 'spending/investing' means instant success. We hardly spent a bean compared to most Championship clubs last season but we won the league. It's not about spending a particular sum of money it's about how you spend money.

There are people here stating that if Farke had money to spend then he would've kept us up without a doubt. What makes you say that?

He still hasn't shown any inclination of improving our biggest problem area - the defence. Not with personnel (with the exception of Byram) nor with tactics.

It isn't money that doesn't make game changing substitutions, it isn't money that plays players when they're carrying injuries, it isn't money that tells our players to pass back to the keeper from the halfway line, it isn't money that reacts after the damage is done. 

I just find it such an odd argument, and one that is made by people who really don't understand what they are watching.

In fairness we don't know how much input Farke has on signings, sometimes it feels like Webber just gives him the players. 

[hogesar 9,618]

6 hours ago, Surfer said:

We seem to have reverted to the behavior of the season before last. We finished mid-table that season and if I recall the complaint was we were obsessed with possession and did nothing with it. Then last year we transitioned quickly through the midfield, so while still having lots of possession, our behavior was to first move forwards rather than sideways. For whatever reason its changed over the past few games - it could just be as simple as we have lost confidence in our own ability, and not changed tactics. 

That's simply not true. Even last night we created opportunities but didnt take them and Pukki was pretty wasteful. 

Against Bournemouth we should have scored 3 goals.

I still enjoy watching us play. Contrary to what the OP thinks pretty much every opposition fan has pointed out how they like how we play. Spurs fans said we deserved more from the game. Plenty of pundits have praised our style etc - to claim we now dont play nice passing football and we arent recognised for it is nothing more than a lie.

[Herman 9,717]

5 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

He didn't "perform a miracle", he won promotion to the top tier with a long history of winning promotion to the top tier. 

It's no more a miracle than the time Worthington took us up, or the time Lambert achieved double promotion. 

Why was last season a bigger miracle than those? 

So Nigel Worthington is a genius? I mean, I liked him, a good manager, but based on your criteria surely a genius? 

Oh do **** off mate. Whine all you like but don't rewrite history, especially from last year. A novice manager with a load of kids and misfits playing some quite brilliant football, got us promoted as champions, when the majority, even City fans, had us down as mid-league nearly men. He did phenomenal last year, even uniting the fans to make last season something quite special that will live on for decades.

[JF 694]

Enjoy Farke and his football while he is here. He is going to manage at a far bigger club than us one day. His achievements on a shoe string budget with the brand of football he plays will attract far bigger clubs that will be able to fund the quality of player required to make his football successful 

[Nono 19]

The OP is just full of it I'm afraid. 

Can't even be bothered to point argue his idiotic claims. 

Just wants to bash possibly the best squad and manager as a group we have ever had. 

Absolute idiot.

Edited January 23, 2020 by Nono
Op is a ****

[king canary 7,580]

16 minutes ago, non-scoring strikers said:

I don't understand the argument on here whereby people think that 'being backed' or 'spending/investing' means instant success.

You don't understand it because nobody is making it.

[king canary 7,580]

Farke has done a magnificent job developing players- I can think of very few that haven't improved significantly under his watch. For that alone he is a special coach/manager.

I don't agree he can't change games- he did it regularly last season, which makes his inability/unwillingness to do more from the bench all the more frustrating this season.

[lake district canary 4,531]

10 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

He didn't "perform a miracle", he won promotion to the top tier with a club which has a long history of winning promotion to the top tier. 

It's no more a miracle than the time Worthington took us up, or the time Lambert achieved double promotion. Or any of our achievements in the 80's.  

Why was last season a bigger miracle than those? 

So Nigel Worthington is a genius? I mean, I liked him, a good manager, but based on your criteria surely a genius? 

From almost bankrupt League 1 club to 12th in the Premier League in three years under Lambert who used academy kids to get us out of league one. Surely makes Lambert a super mega genius?

So much in this post to comment on its difficult to know where to start, but really, it feels as if that no recognition has been given to the gigantic changes that have taken place under Farke.  A whole new squad with just Tettey and a third goalkeeper remaining from the previous era. Lambert had his two main play makers ready made in Holt and Hoolahan and Worthington built his team over four years. Farke essentially built his team in one year and in the process brought a brand and style of football that at times is breath taking to watch. 

[non-scoring strikers 113]

We should have scored more goals but we didn't and we don't. Shoulds and the admiration of Burnley fans and Ian Wright won't keep us up.

We haven't scored more than one goal in a game since the FA cup game against Championship side Preston. In the league you have to go back to Tottenham at home on the 28th December, before that was the 1st December against Arsenal. We simply do not score enough goals and are over-reliant on Pukki and Cantwell for them. The former is now looking fatigued, particularly after being played through his injury, and the latter is only good in spells.

Norwich fans love accepting mediocrity.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

5 minutes ago, Herman said:

Oh do **** off mate. Whine all you like but don't rewrite history, especially from last year. A novice manager with a load of kids and misfits playing some quite brilliant football, got us promoted as champions, when the majority, even City fans, had us down as mid-league nearly men. He did phenomenal last year, even uniting the fans to make last season something quite special that will live on for decades.

Yeah and Lambert and Worthington did the same with f*ck all money and a bunch of misfits and/or kids. 

They are not "geniuses" for that, they are just good achievements.

Farke is not a f*cking "genius", he's a good man manager who has done a good job bringing through a few young players. 

Funny old world football, I'm sure I'll find posts on here from 2012 calling Lambert a genous. I seem to remember people being annoyed that Swansea and Rodgers were stealing all the credit from the media. 

In hindsight the media picked the right manager to praise.

Last season won't "live on forever" because it's already evident that Norwich fans have already forgotten or substantially downgraded 2009-2012, clearly!! 

[Midlands Yellow 3,942]

5 minutes ago, JF said:

Enjoy Farke and his football while he is here. He is going to manage at a far bigger club than us one day. His achievements on a shoe string budget with the brand of football he plays will attract far bigger clubs that will be able to fund the quality of player required to make his football successful 

Will be interesting to see what Farke can do at a club where he will be financially backed. Hope that day doesn’t come for a while but it’s hard to manage at Norwich and reach your full potential. 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

4 minutes ago, Nono said:

The OP is just full of it I'm afraid. 

Can't even be bothered to point argue his idiotic claims. 

Just wants to bash possibly the best squad and manager as a group we have ever had. 

Absolute idiot.

Best squad we've ever had? You having a laugh? 

F*ck me.  

1985-1995 our halcyon days I can assure you of that. 

[Herman 9,717]

Last season will live on forever. Like Lambert's time these things will be remembered because they were fantastic seasons, playing brilliant and exciting football. If you can't appreciate the good times, and what the managers did for us, then that's pretty sad.

[king canary 7,580]

Just now, Herman said:

Last season will live on forever. Like Lambert's time these things will be remembered because they were fantastic seasons, playing brilliant and exciting football. If you can't appreciate the good times, and what the managers did for us, then that's pretty sad.

I do think the OP has a point with this- ever since he left people have done their best to play down the achievements of Lambert and that team, just as people like to play down the successes under Chase because of how it ended. 

I don't think it is the OP who can't appreciate the 09-12 seasons, it is others.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

6 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Farke essentially built his team in one year and in the process brought a brand and style of football that at times is breath taking to watch. 

Wagner built his in less time than that.

Farke did a good job getting us out of the Championship and getting us across the line after a wobble. 

As far as achievements go though... It sits beneath the double of promotion followed by mid-table finish. Sits below Walker (first managerial job) taking a team tipped for relegation to 3rd place.

Sits beneath 1985. 

It's just what it is, a good achievement. 

In the future, and with reflection, fans will weigh that up and look at things a bit more objectively. 

Lambert's achievements here phenomenol. Not a "genius" though, as is evident when looking at his whole CV. 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

2 minutes ago, king canary said:

I do think the OP has a point with this- ever since he left people have done their best to play down the achievements of Lambert and that team, just as people like to play down the successes under Chase because of how it ended. 

I don't think it is the OP who can't appreciate the 09-12 seasons, it is others.

Thank you for understanding my point, about Farke's achievement in the context of how it will be written in the history books. 

People soon forgot the three incredible years we had under Lambert. I still remember them. 

People saying this is our best ever squad, yet I was at both legs of the Munich tie! 

People call me the revisionist but talk like our club was founded 5 years ago. 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

7 minutes ago, Herman said:

Last season will live on forever. Like Lambert's time these things will be remembered because they were fantastic seasons, playing brilliant and exciting football. If you can't appreciate the good times, and what the managers did for us, then that's pretty sad.

It's not me who has elected to forget the good times, it's the people who call Farke a genius and say this is our best ever squad.

[Herman 9,717]

4 minutes ago, king canary said:

I do think the OP has a point with this- ever since he left people have done their best to play down the achievements of Lambert and that team, just as people like to play down the successes under Chase because of how it ended. 

I don't think it is the OP who can't appreciate the 09-12 seasons, it is others.

I'm sorry but that is rubbish. Nobody plays down the achievements of those eras. People slag off Lambert because of what he has become, ditto Chase. The football at the time was quite brilliant.

 

2 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

It's not me who has elected to forget the good times, it's the people who call Farke a genius and say this is our best ever squad.

Nobody is forgetting the good times. Why have you got it into your head that people are?

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

1 minute ago, Herman said:

Nobody is forgetting the good times. Why have you got it into your head that people are?

If people call this our best ever squad then they definitely have short memories or are very young. It's literally on this thread you t1t. 

[king canary 7,580]

2 minutes ago, Herman said:

I'm sorry but that is rubbish. Nobody plays down the achievements of those eras. People slag off Lambert because of what he has become, ditto Chase. The football at the time was quite brilliant.

 

People absolutely do play them down. 

The league one season you often hear 'we already had Holt and Hoolahan, anyone could have taken us up.'

The Premier League season is often dismissed as 'unsustainable, no foundations being laid for the future.'

You don't have to look far to find those opinions on here.

[Hardhouse44 261]

Surely we’re missing the point. What was his remit for this season. If it wasn’t to retain premiership status. If the board didn’t  at least make that his seasons goal then you should all want a new board ASAP and if that was his remit he’s failed. Trouble is so many on here want it both ways. That’s not business, that’s not progress, that’s not ambition and it’s certainly is professional football!

[king canary 7,580]

29 minutes ago, Nono said:

Just wants to bash possibly the best squad and manager as a group we have ever had. 

 

While I don't fully agree with the OP, hyperbole like this kind of makes his point for him.

It doesn't really stack up that our best ever squad and manager currently sit rock bottom of a league we've finished 11th and 12th in within the last decade. 

[Midlands Yellow 3,942]

Why does Delia get such an easy ride compared to what Chase received ? When people have a little dig on here regarding her achievements a few react like your attacking a personal friend. 

[Dr Greenthumb 746]

48 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

He didn't "perform a miracle", he won promotion to the top tier with a club which has a long history of winning promotion to the top tier. 

It's no more a miracle than the time Worthington took us up, or the time Lambert achieved double promotion. Or any of our achievements in the 80's.  

Why was last season a bigger miracle than those? 

So Nigel Worthington is a genius? I mean, I liked him, a good manager, but based on your criteria surely a genius? 

From almost bankrupt League 1 club to 12th in the Premier League in three years under Lambert who used academy kids to get us out of league one. Surely makes Lambert a super mega genius?

Lambert spent more in the first premier league Summer than Farke has in his whole time at the club. 
Any decent player he inherited, he had to sell. How much did he get back? 
 

Since you are having a Farke witch hunt today, who do you suggest replaces him?