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chicken

Situation analysis

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Winter is past its peak, spring is just round the corner how far have we come?At the beggining there was wild speculation about us getting automatic promotion first year back - we may have been bookies favourites but then the relegated teams always tend to be.That was before the summer exits and entries.The problem that we face at the moment is how many more players does it take to get the ship running again?The spirit is said to be high, I am sure it is. But one thing that no one seems to have brought up on here is the difference between this team and the one that got us promotion two seasons ago.I would say that Docherty is as good as Malky was with only the presence being the major difference. Fleming does what Fleming does. Drury as solid as ever.So where is the real problem? Is it the manager - well that would be easy to say, after all in every other industry if the team under a manager isnt performing it is the manager that gets it in the neck. I think football is no different and I am sure Worthington has been spoken to about the situation on more than one occaision. But like I said thats too easy, we''re letting the players off the hook.Its strange that for the first time Worthington comes out and really slates the players he gets a response and from quarters not quite expected. With half the squad with injuries etc we still manage to bludgeon the Blades and stuff Southampton. In some ways that didn''t surprise me.What the team has lacked this season is just that "team". Huckerby hasn''t looked out of sorts - he has just been doing the samething but the players arn''t adapting to it.Two seasons ago the core of the team had been playing with each other for a good two seasons or so. Just look at the names back then:Fleming, Malky and Drury had at least two seasons of playing alongside each other. Mullers had been at the club for at least three seasons, holt was on his third, rivers was more or less the same two/three seasons. Roberts, McVeigh again had seasons under their belt. They obviously helped the other players settle in and get used to the surroundings and football of the club.You look at the squad now:Green - hes been at the club for ten years! Number 1 for ages!Colin/Louis-Jean - Summer signings, the latter unfortunately has had it tough. I think he could really do a good job especially with the experience he offers.Docherty - 2nd seasonFleming - coming up for testimonial yearShackel - 2nd season breaking into the team now that he is fit againCharlton - 2nd seasonDrury - 4th seasonEtuhu - two monthsRobinson - one monthJarret - summerHenderson -Huckerby - 3rd seasonAshton - 2nd season (although he has just about made it to being a canary for a year)Hughes - summerThorne - summerSafri - second seasonMcVeigh - 5th/6th seasonI could go one but I think my point is starting to become apparent. There have been wholesale changes to the squad - not surprising when you look at the situation. Many players were not good enough and not young enough to be given the time for them to get better again if they were not on the way down anyway.Where he has had to Worthington has tried to bring in a mix. For example Colin at 23 is untested and still has a lot to learn, Louis-Jean 29 experienced and obviously reletively proven at this level.In midfield we have Etuhu 23 again getting better like Francis a bit of an unknown element, Hughes 27 old enough to know what is what, Robinson 29 a culured passer obviously brought in as cover for Safri.Thorne was obviously brought in for his experience as well as his scoring record which is not that far off what Iwan had given to us.I dont think that Worthington has made a bad signing, I think he has spent wisely and that the plan wont really come together untill next season. Now I am not saying that we should give Worthington another season - I am saying that any squad faced with that amount of changes is going to be taking a step back simply as they need time playing together to get used to the way eachother play.In recent weeks I think we have seen that they are starting to do that. Pretty passing did not win us promotion last time but you can not win a match if the team isnt "together" to fight as a unit. They say football is a game of 10 battles - 10 one on ones and if you win most of those then your on top. To an extent that is true, but it is also about giving each other the chance to win those one on ones and covering just incase they don''t.Believe me when I say that knowing you have someone capable behind you makes you play more confidently. If you know the players behind/infront of you are suspect or that you dont know how they are going to deal with something it changes how you approach the individual battle. It sometimes looks as if you lack in confidence or are scared to take players on.It takes time for players to gel. Some players are quicker than others - thats what sets them apart like Ashton and to some extent Huckerby.So who do I blame? I blame time - there is never enough time. Especialy in a season. We needed Etuhu and Robinson in the summer, they werent available then.Will we do alright? I think so, we shall just have to wait and see. If we finish outside the top six I will be upset but will put it down to lack of experience. How many of those players would you be willing to let go? I think only perhaps Brennan is at risk of being surplas.

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often, it is teams like the Old Norwich and now Reading, who get promoted. I think this is because the team has been together a long time and gradually got better and better. Then one season, a couple of good signing and the confidence is sky high, hence they take the league title.

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In midfield we have Etuhu 23 again getting better like Francis a bit of an unknown element, Hughes 27 old enough to know what is what, Robinson 29 a culured passer obviously brought in as cover for Safri.

what thew hell are you talking about - etuhu getting better???

Robinson Cultured passer!!!!!! Hughes whatis what!!!!!!

you nowhat the funniest thing is, our best midfielder now does not get into wigans team...

what more can i say.

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I really enjoyed reading this post, a thorough and fair analysis of players and manager without resorting to insults and outrageous claims. Unfortunately it seems that the one needed resource that you highlight is what the WO''s will not give him.

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Thank you for that Chicken - an antidote to most of the other one-note current threads. I agree that Worthy''s signings this year are better than last year''s efforts, and that they need time to gel. And another  major factor is the injuries that have stopped the players gelling. But to my mind there''s a laziness around the club - all this talk of "work ethic" is just talk, whereas it should apply right through, from administration, to coaching, to individual players. The impression I get is that no-one in that chain is actually busting their balls to improve the situation. We all know that the players we put out (leaving aside injuries) can play good football, and occasionally we see it. It''s not quite Premiership football, because we''re not quite a Premiership Club, but it''s at least as good as any other side in this league. And we shouldn''t forget that last season''s surprise relegation side, Southampton, are below us, despite being a "Premiership Club".

You say, quite rightly, that pretty passing did not win us promotion. What did win us promotion was 3 things: a solid defence, a stable line-up with few injuries, and the genius that was Huckerby. Of those, only the first (the solid defence) is still present. We still expect Hux to carry the weight of creativity that he did then, and he isn''t doing it now. That exposes the rest of the midfield to the glare of the spotlight, and so far they''ve been found wanting. That may be due to a succession of injuries, or it may be due to the players not being up to it: from my point of view, it''s too soon to tell until we see the best formation playing a run of games. Certainly, on paper they should be better than the midfield of the promotion squad - e.g. Hughes has the energy of Holt, but more footballing skill, Robinson has more passing ability than anyone we''ve had there for years (yes, including the overrated Mulryne), and Etuhu.... is, errr, bigger than Francis. But, as someone said somewhere else, football isn''t played on paper.

Basically the whole Club needs to wake up and understand on what''s needed to take the next step. To focus all the heat, and the hate, on the manager just misses the point.

Thanks again Chicken, for a well-reasoned, balanced post, and I hope others take it on in the same spirit.

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The players we have signed are utter dross , and now we are going to sell what little class we have left . The season in the Premiership has been wasted and we are now no better than Ipswich .Please go Worthington and go now.

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[quote user="premier1"]The players we have signed are utter dross , and now we are going to sell what little class we have left . The season in the Premiership has been wasted and we are now no better than Ipswich .Please go Worthington and go now.[/quote]

the players we have signed have been dire with not one of them improving the team''s first 11.

what a load of rubbish

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Mr Rankin, to be honest I have had enough of you complete tosh!Have not improved the team?Right lets look at this now:Midfield:Out: Francis (didn''t want to be here), Holt (past his best), Mulryne (I rated him back in the day but he no longer wanted to be here), Jonson (not up to it).In: Hughes (who embodies passion and enthusiasm a better version of Holt), Robinson (a good solid passer of the ball and not scared of working hard unike Mullers!), Etuhu (I am sure this will come right and you boo boys certanly wont help).Midfielders that stayed - Safri, Brennan, Henderson (if thats what you want to call him).I would say that in at least three out of the four signings we have improved the squad the only question at the moment hangs over Etuhu really but I am sure he will get better because 23 is young.And I am really sorry if this upsets you but I don''t believe this to even be opinion! There is no way that you can say that Hughes is not better than Holt, or that Robinson is a lazier player than Mullers - and from what I have seen of Etuhu at least all he wants to do is play football instead of drive fast cars ala Francis.I am not entirely sure but I think we are still a couple of players short of the squad numbers we had last season.All I wish is that people were realistic. At the beggining of the season people were banging on about Jagielka when everyone else in the country new that prem clubs were sniffing and he would cost £3million at least. Now people are banging on about Koumas who yes is a brilliant player on the ball when he wants to be but has never lived up to the reputation he has.If he was that great why does Mark Hughes not start him for Wales unless there are injuries?The facts are there to see if anyone can be bothered to pick them up and look at them!Also just want to add a rant about the person that wants to know why we cant keep Ashton as Crystal Palace can keep AJ - no one wants AJ he is a one trick pony. He is like Darias Vassel, bloody quick but thats it. One more season in the prem and he would be sussed out. The only teams in for him are Birmingham who cannot afford the £5-6million Palace are after.Ashton is by far a better alround player - if he goes it will be a shame but I can''t blame the guy. The england team are in need of a good solid striker like him and I am convinced that if he goes it will be for that reason and not for money primarily. It is down to the player at the end of the day - agreeing a fee is merely the last part of the process.

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"I dont think that Worthington has made a bad signing, I think he has spent wisely."

 Having sat through one of the worst performances I have ever witnessed from a Norwich midfield, I find it impossible to agree with this statement. Hughes, Etuhu and Jarrett, all of whom Worthington was desperate to sign, were dreadful today. Hughes is incapable of passing a ball more than 15 yards, Etuhu ambles about like he''s out for a summer stroll, and Jarrett is awful - he can''t pass, he can''t tackle and, worst of all, he wimped out of a couple of challenges AGAIN today!

Colin was a liability again, demonstrated by that needless handball that led to their second goal.

That''s four bad signings, for a start.   

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A nice reasoned post - well thought, and decently written. Whilst I agree the main component for any manager or team is time, an important factor is the continuity of the team. And the main influence in this is a manager who has had five years to cultivate and create a team to the best of his ability. I understand that no team will ever have prolonged success - Liverpool, Man Utd, and more recently, Arsenal are testament to this.

What I want to see in terms of personal are marked improvements. We dont have the resources and finances in the club to buy Walcotts, Wright Phillips, and other players in the hope that in a couple of season we may get decent return for our investment. In reference to our promotion season, I remember Crouch, Harper, Svensson, McKenzie, Cooper, and all performed well, as well as Hucks ( who had the longest run in the team) were all bought in that season. And we still went up.

It was this combination of loanees, and new signings, as well as a bonded team for me that got us promoted. Arguably we have that now - Greeno, Drury, Fleming, and Hucks, McVeigh, Safri (when he''s fit) with new players. So I dont believe the formula we are using this season is much different from 2003/4. I also couldnt believe you state "Worthy hasnt made a bad signing". As you allude to - time will be be the judge. Lets meet up for a beer at the end of the season, and put that to the test.

The other approach that is seeming to grate with many fans is the tactics that are currently employed by Worthy et al. In our promotion season (as someone posted earlier) we were attacking as a unit. We would have quick passing and interplay up front, with numbers getting forward. If needed, Iwan would get it directly up to him, but it was the amount of firepower we had at our disposal going forward that won it for us, as well as our solid defence. And we played as a team - we certainly are not doing this at present. It is a throwback to the Megson era, with clueless chickens runnning around as players, whacking the ball forward a la Daryl Sutch in hope that we might make a chance. I understand that players cant instantly pick up the pace, tactics, and work off other players, but surely that it something that should be corrected on the training pitch? It is apparent that it isnt.

On other points - I think we can make reasonable assesments of players by talking to other fans, and forming our own opinions of what we have seen. For instance, I didnt want Peter Thorne as a signing  - Over the Hill. Ethuhu, from what I saw @ Man City, was a great all action midfielder. Not now. Jarrett - the jury is still out for me, Colin - played in the Europe and the Champions League with PSV - can he look so bad in the Championship? Lois Jean - my best mates a Forest fan and said he was good, so I was looking forward to seeing him. Ever since the Inter game, he has been awful. And Hughes - you only have to talk to any Reading fan to gauge their feelings - something I can whole heartedly empathise with.

MAybe I am being too hard on Worthy - but it is only because I want to see Norwich playing to their true capabilities, and performing at the highest level, which I believe we are capable of with certain changes made.

 

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The signings are fair. Hughes is very passionate and spirited. Jarrett, well is just poor. Colin is weak and a liability. However Etuhu shows moments of brilliance such as his run through on goal, i just think he needs some more confidence to get that will to do it constantly.

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The problem with this attitude of "give Nigel time" is this:

He now knows he has time.

He knows he can do what he fancies for a couple of seasons, he knows he can buy a few players that don''t work out, he knows he can basically get away with it for a while.

And getting away with it he is.

It''s not the signings that have ruined it, we got to the playoff final with Rivers, Easton, Mulryne (who was never really that good), Nielsen etc etc who are all worse than those we have now. And it''s not the "familiarity" element, although I''m sure it helps. The aforementioned players were all new to the club (except fat Phil) and look at Sheff Utd now, and Portsmouth in 2003 - pretty much a new squad.

The problem is organisation. We don''t have any. Nobody seems to know their role, their position. We don''t know the best formation, we have no set-pieces, we have no technique for how to defend as a team, no formula for a successful attack. The positioning of the players is wrong, the movement off the ball is non-existent and

- no matter what you say, Chicken -

that is Nigel''s fault.

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"Hughes is very passionate and spirited." So is my wife, but I wouldn''t put her in the team (although she can probably pass better than Hughes).

"Etuhu shows moments of brilliance such as his run through on goal." And, remind me, what did he do at the end of this "brilliant run"? Oh, yes, he didn''t know what to do with the ball and fell over.

The signings were rubbish, IMHO.

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I think people have missed the point here.Firstly without stating wether I want Worthy in or out I was trying to put a reasoned few thoughts together about a team that isnt performing.Like I said enough people on here have had their pennies worth of wining about Worthington - I was simply tring to suggest that in the circumstances could we really have gotten better players in especially when we needed so many to make up a squad?Yes I am sure we could have not signed Hughes or Etuhu and paid £1million for Koumas if you like but that would leave us in a much worse position now. Had that have been the case we would have to have offered Mullers a new deal to keep him in as cover.Lets face it - where would we be now with the current spat of injuries?Now I am not saying that Worthington should stay or go. I think in many ways both good and bad that it would be a better time for him to go in the summer for both the man and the club.There is no time at this point in the season and unless we can get hold of a Dowie I don''t think the players will be turned around quickly enough.I think our position is very difficult. The board have a duty to provide a stable club so that the fans can at least hope to watch a team contesting for the 21st to 26th football league positions.As with many other people who are fed up with the Worthy bashers - who exactly would you have brought in in the summer? Stone?And Malky - please! The guy cost us more than Iwan and gave us two or three good seasons out of about five. He has never had much pace and couldn''t pass for fudge. I liked him as a player as you knew what you were getting with him and it was no nonsence. I don''t see many people complaining about seeing Matt Jackson being let go - and look at him now.Yes great servant to the club but as many people have rightly said, would probably not been up to Prem.

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