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Spillay

And now Watford are winning..

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Yeah, I think Nutty's going to win this. Over the last decade far more overseas owners have taken their clubs backwards or sideways rather than forwards, especially when you factor in that teams like Leeds, Forest Sheffield Wednesday and others have had multiple sets of overseas investors that have failed to take the club forwards. 

Better the devil you know, for me. There's a chance that a new billionaire owner could make us a Premier League regular (or as regular as a club like Palace or Bournemouth could possibly be) but there's a greater chance that they wouldn't, based on other clubs who have tried this approach.

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17 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

I'm struggling now tbh. It seems that all our peers have had the same bad luck then 

Tell you what, we could play a game of tennis where you serve me a club like us who has done better and I'll return one that hasn't. 

BTW, if you use clubs that are fixtures in the PL then I'll use clubs that have never been there. I suggest you serve Leicester....

Naughty naughty Nutty! Changing the debate now I see. No fair. I never said we hadn't done well considering our  financial constraints. However, you said...

5 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

But the change fans want is for us to be bought by someone with more money...It's to be more successful that is wanted. And that's where there's no correlation. Because on all evidence the chances are we'd be less successful...

Your words, not mine.

OTBC

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1 minute ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Yeah, I think Nutty's going to win this. Over the last decade far more overseas owners have taken their clubs backwards or sideways rather than forwards, especially when you factor in that teams like Leeds, Forest Sheffield Wednesday and others have had multiple sets of overseas investors that have failed to take the club forwards. 

Better the devil you know, for me. There's a chance that a new billionaire owner could make us a Premier League regular (or as regular as a club like Palace or Bournemouth could possibly be) but there's a greater chance that they wouldn't, based on other clubs who have tried this approach.

Nutty stated that money had no impact on success. He's wrong. 

OTBC

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4 minutes ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Yeah, I think Nutty's going to win this. Over the last decade far more overseas owners have taken their clubs backwards or sideways rather than forwards, especially when you factor in that teams like Leeds, Forest Sheffield Wednesday and others have had multiple sets of overseas investors that have failed to take the club forwards. 

Better the devil you know, for me. There's a chance that a new billionaire owner could make us a Premier League regular (or as regular as a club like Palace or Bournemouth could possibly be) but there's a greater chance that they wouldn't, based on other clubs who have tried this approach. 

Indeed, many owners have f*cked clubs up, no argument there. 

OTBC

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2 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Naughty naughty Nutty! Changing the debate now I see. No fair. I never said we hadn't done well considering our  financial constraints. However, you said...

Your words, not mine.

OTBC

And I'm sticking by that. I've listed these clubs countless times on here. There is no correlation because the chances are we'd have been less successful. 

Where's your evidence to the contrary?

 

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3 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Nutty stated that money had no impact on success. He's wrong. 

OTBC

No nutty didn't.

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2 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Nutty stated that money had no impact on success. He's wrong. 

OTBC

Depends what you're basing it on.

Obviously the big six have been the best sides in the country over the last ten years because they're also the six clubs who generate the highest revenue, so there's obviously a correlation there between being rich and being successful.

However, outside the big six, there doesn't appear to be much of a correlation between success and the wealth of the owner.

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There is no evidence whatsoever on weather we would be more successful or less successful under different ownership, only opinions. Other clubs experiences either good or bad can’t be used as evidence for what our experience would be. We’ve a hell of a team with the current owners we have, and are still in with a chance  of staying up and hopefully keeping this group of players together. One day this argument will become relevant when the current owners have had enough, as in my opinion clearly Tom isn’t the answer. But that’s not today. 

Edited by JF

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Just now, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Depends what you're basing it on.

Obviously the big six have been the best sides in the country over the last ten years because they're also the six clubs who generate the highest revenue, so there's obviously a correlation there between being rich and being successful.

However, outside the big six, there doesn't appear to be much of a correlation between success and the wealth of the owner.

Indeed, once financial fair play kicked in the days of a Chelsea or a Man City (or even a Norwich...) pushing their way onto the top table became a much more difficult ball game.

OTBC

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6 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

And I'm sticking by that. I've listed these clubs countless times on here. There is no correlation because the chances are we'd have been less successful. 

Where's your evidence to the contrary?

Play fair Nutty; I'm still waiting for your evidence.

And if there's no correlation, how can you ignore the top six? You didn't indicate you were in your original post:

It's to be more successful that is wanted. And that's where there's no correlation. Because on all evidence the chances are we'd be less successful...

If there's "no correlation", why are there no other clubs in the PL with owners worth less than 100m other than ours? The league should have quite a few if you're correct. Like I said earlier, I'm not disputing that we've done well we with what we've got. But we are very much the exception to the rule...and that won't last forever.

OTBC

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1 hour ago, JF said:

There is no evidence whatsoever on weather we would be more successful or less successful under different ownership, only opinions. Other clubs experiences either good or bad can’t be used as evidence for what our experience would be. We’ve a hell of a team with the current owners we have and are still in with a chance  of staying up and hopefully keeping this group of players together. One day this argument will become relevant when the current owners have had enough as in my opinion clearly Tom isn’t the answer. But that’s not today. 

Just to be clear - I'm not having a go at Delia as I think she's done as well as she  can with the club. Like wise, I'm not having a go at Nutty (I'm quite enjoying the back and forth) as he is 100% entitled to his opinion. I just fear that eventually we will get left behind.  

OTBC

Edited by Disco Dales Jockstrap

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31 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Play fair Nutty; I'm still waiting for your evidence.

And if there's no correlation, how can you ignore the top six? You didn't indicate you were in your original post:

It's to be more successful that is wanted. And that's where there's no correlation. Because on all evidence the chances are we'd be less successful...

If there's "no correlation", why are there no other clubs in the PL with owners worth less than 100m other than ours? The league should have quite a few if you're correct. Like I said earlier, I'm not disputing that we've done well we with what we've got. But we are very much the exception to the rule...and that won't last forever.

OTBC

Maybe you should revisit and quote the whole post then...

I agree. But the change fans want is for us to be bought by someone with more money. However it's not someone with more money that is wanted. It's to be more successful that is wanted. And that's where there's no correlation. Because on all evidence the chances are we'd be less successful...

Then you'd quite clearly see that there's no correlation between clubs being bought by someone with more money being more successful than our present ownership model.

How you get from that to "Nutty stated that money had no impact on success. He's wrong." would make a troll proud...

 

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Watford played well. United had a terrible day with two defensive howlers that both resulted in goals. Foster was the best player on the park. I’m not sure what this tells us;

The better performers on the day won?

The least expensive team won? 

A good keeper is worth his weight in gold?

I’m not entirely convinced that the outcome of one single game really offers any deeper insights into our own situation other than the fact that good performances are eventually rewarded. 

 

Edited by Bonzo
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2 hours ago, Bonzo said:

Watford played well. United had a terrible day with two defensive howlers that both resulted in goals. Foster was the best player on the park. I’m not sure what this tells us;

The better performers on the day won?

The least expensive team won? 

A good keeper is worth his weight in gold?

I’m not entirely convinced that the outcome of one single game really offers any deeper insights into our own situation other than the fact that good performances are eventually rewarded. 

 

I sincerely hope you're right but that needs to be happening sooner rather than later, preferably starting today.

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Watford seem to playing better under Pearson, they looked organised against Man United who never had a shot on target until they were 2-0 down. They were also extremely unlucky against Liverpool last week. However I think there are a number of other teams who we could finish above, for instance Bournemouth don't look great, West Ham look poor and had players fighting each other on the pitch yesterday, I thought we were also better than Villa, Southampton have hit a good patch but that is likely to come to an end sooner rather than later, I also think Brighton could be dragged into it. In my opinion we shouldn't be looking at other teams so much as it won't matter if we can't add points to the board, we need to do our job first and then hope results go in our afterwards. 

Edited by Alex

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