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KiwiScot

Crystal Palace Tickets

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23 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

Bold 1: -

So once you're in the elite you can buy tickets for every game. There is no limit to the amount of times. And there's also no requirement for you to use the ticket.

Bold 2 :-

If your sliding scale of people were in your priority groups but ended their priority when they matched last seasons loyalty it would enable more tickets to go down through the groups fairly.

The first problem would exist within any sliding scale system except your idea, but I doubt that many would do that. They would probably go to enough of the games themselves to remain in the group. As for passing tickets on to fans who are not 'priority', that's basically the current system anyway- anybody can get towards the front of the queue by just paying their £50 anyway.

As for your sliding scale, I see what you're saying, but putting a cap on how many away tickets someone is eligible for like that is a rather unusual idea which I've never heard of before. And as I've said, it's unlikely that a fan would dramatically increase the amount of away games they go to from one season to the next.

Anyway, it looks like we're all arguing for the same thing at the end of the day. A better system than this that is based on loyalty. It just seems the majority of us want the tried and tested system that most clubs use and you want to experiment with a different one, but I just feel that yours is a little bit complicated and would probably lead to more arguments than a 'traditional' sliding scale scheme.

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19 minutes ago, king canary said:

Is there actually any evidence for that?

For good reason there's unlikely to be any hard evidence that it's happening but anyone lucky enough to be in the ' 750 ' would be daft not to try to get some away ' credit ' for next season if they attend few, or even no games at all this season. In probably 90% of cases you'd have people biting your arm off for your ticket even if you didn't already have someone who wanted it.

Edited by ......and Smith must score.

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3 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

For good reason there's unlikely to be any hard evidence that it's happening but anyone lucky enough to be in the ' 750 ' would be daft not to try to get some away ' credit ' for next season if they attend few, or even no games at all this season. In probably 90% of cases you'd have people biting your arm off for your ticket even if you didn't already have someone who wanted it.

These are people who travelled to a decent number of away games last season so I'd expect they'll be going to a fair few this season. Yes, if they are buying and then selling them on that is ****ty behaviour but it is ****ty behaviour caused by this system. If it turns out to be happening regularly then it is just another thing the club need to review.

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4 minutes ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

The first problem would exist within any sliding scale system except your idea, but I doubt that many would do that. They would probably go to enough of the games themselves to remain in the group. As for passing tickets on to fans who are not 'priority', that's basically the current system anyway- anybody can get towards the front of the queue by just paying their £50 anyway.

As for your sliding scale, I see what you're saying, but putting a cap on how many away tickets someone is eligible for like that is a rather unusual idea which I've never heard of before. And as I've said, it's unlikely that a fan would dramatically increase the amount of away games they go to from one season to the next.

Anyway, it looks like we're all arguing for the same thing at the end of the day. A better system than this that is based on loyalty. It just seems the majority of us want the tried and tested system that most clubs use and you want to experiment with a different one, but I just feel that yours is a little bit complicated and would probably lead to more arguments than a 'traditional' sliding scale scheme.

There is no cap on the amount. Just on the time spent in the various priority groups. It would still be possible for a 10 gamer to do more than 10. They just don't automatically have first choice after 10.

I've said this about the current system all along. You can read back through the last couple of months. But I also strongly disagree with just adding more people to this closed shop which seems to be what most people want.

As I said. I don't think what you are suggesting is fair. BTW before my buddy Hoola or Kingo get back on my case I don't think the current system is fair either. If I put that in each post enough times maybe.....

But maybe not🙃

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15 minutes ago, king canary said:

Ah, so it must be true.

No..

The quote was GMF. You attributed it to me. 

Probably not a poor politician but just maybe you could be the worst...

Edited by nutty nigel

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12 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

 But I also strongly disagree with just adding more people to this closed shop which seems to be what most people want.

But at least those people have earned the right to be in the shop. They've been in the shop or using the shop for many years. There may be queues outside, and some will get in, but others might need to wait until the people leave the shop or decide they no longer want to use it.

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4 minutes ago, king canary said:

These are people who travelled to a decent number of away games last season so I'd expect they'll be going to a fair few this season. Yes, if they are buying and then selling them on that is ****ty behaviour but it is ****ty behaviour caused by this system. If it turns out to be happening regularly then it is just another thing the club need to review.

Exactly the same thing happened last season under the old points system. Example : You have a shedful of points but can't get to a game and a mate wants to join your first priority group for a match but doesn't have enough points. He uses your membership number to get a ticket and you get the points. Win/win.

Review it they might but there's no way they can know if it's happening regularly or indeed at all. If they wanted to stop it they would have to abandon the ' Friends & Family ' scheme and make a sale conditional/checkable by ID on purchase and again on entering the event, eg, Wimbledon tennis, Glastonbury.

A logistical nightmare for NCFC and all the clubs they're visiting. Not going to happen.

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10 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

make a sale conditional/checkable by ID on purchase and again on entering the event, eg, Wimbledon tennis, Glastonbury.

A logistical nightmare for NCFC and all the clubs they're visiting. Not going to happen.

I don't know, it's the law in Italy and isn't really a problem. You just have an extra check before the turnstile, where you have to show your ticket and photo ID before you get to the turnstile where you scan your ticket for entry.

I'm not advocating the system by the way, I'm just pointing out that it's not unworkable.

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29 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

No..

The quote was GMF. You attributed it to me. 

Probably not a poor politician but just maybe you could be the worst...

I didn't attribute to you. You insinuated it was happening, I asked if there was any evidence.

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16 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

Exactly the same thing happened last season under the old points system. Example : You have a shedful of points but can't get to a game and a mate wants to join your first priority group for a match but doesn't have enough points. He uses your membership number to get a ticket and you get the points. Win/win.

Review it they might but there's no way they can know if it's happening regularly or indeed at all. If they wanted to stop it they would have to abandon the ' Friends & Family ' scheme and make a sale conditional/checkable by ID on purchase and again on entering the event, eg, Wimbledon tennis, Glastonbury.

A logistical nightmare for NCFC and all the clubs they're visiting. Not going to happen.

Fair enough. 

Suppose it's not hugely different to someone lending their season ticket to a mate when they can't go.

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23 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

Exactly the same thing happened last season under the old points system. Example : You have a shedful of points but can't get to a game and a mate wants to join your first priority group for a match but doesn't have enough points. He uses your membership number to get a ticket and you get the points. Win/win.

Review it they might but there's no way they can know if it's happening regularly or indeed at all. If they wanted to stop it they would have to abandon the ' Friends & Family ' scheme and make a sale conditional/checkable by ID on purchase and again on entering the event, eg, Wimbledon tennis, Glastonbury.

A logistical nightmare for NCFC and all the clubs they're visiting. Not going to happen.

Man City do it as people were buying tickets to get tickets for the really big games. Their solution is a % have to pick up their tickets at the opposing venue with ID. If you buy more than one ticket using friends and family each of those tickets are allocated to each individual as you personally cannot have more than 1.

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1 hour ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

But at least those people have earned the right to be in the shop. They've been in the shop or using the shop for many years. There may be queues outside, and some will get in, but others might need to wait until the people leave the shop or decide they no longer want to use it.

If you want to start bringing many years into it the old duffers will get all the tickets.

Your loyalty model was based on what was done last season. But you want a system based on that which is totally unfair. What's wrong with ensuring everyone gets the games they qualify for?

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10 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

If you want to start bringing many years into it the old duffers will get all the tickets.

Your loyalty model was based on what was done last season. But you want a system based on that which is totally unfair. What's wrong with ensuring everyone gets the games they qualify for?

But it isn't totally unfair in my opinion, and the opinion of others, too.

Also, what are the games that everyone qualifies for?

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1 minute ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

But it isn't totally unfair in my opinion, and the opinion of others, too.

Also, what are the games that everyone qualifies for?

I don't care how many people think it's fair. I don't.

Surely the games everyone qualifies for are on your sliding scale?

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Just an aside , today  on the radio they were discussing  the globalisation of football. 20 years ago the average age of people attending matches was 28, today its 42. Someone mentioned earlier  that  certain  changes could lead to the old duffers getting all the tickets,  seems like they already may well be, for whatever reason. Maybe youngsters  aren't as interested  or wont  commit to season tickets. More research needed.

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32 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

I don't care how many people think it's fair. I don't.

Surely the games everyone qualifies for are on your sliding scale?

I get the impression that we're just going round in circles.

Shall we just both agree that we don't like the current system and would like a fairer distribution based on loyalty?

With that, I'm out. I look forward to seeing you all on the 'Aston Villa tickets' thread next week, where we will have the same argument again and fail to reach to a conclusion.

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1 minute ago, wcorkcanary said:

Just an aside , today  on the radio they were discussing  the globalisation of football. 20 years ago the average age of people attending matches was 28, today its 42. Someone mentioned earlier  that  certain  changes could lead to the old duffers getting all the tickets,  seems like they already may well be, for whatever reason. Maybe youngsters  aren't as interested  or wont  commit to season tickets. More research needed.

The main reason is generally attributed to cost, but that's another story.

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14 minutes ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

I get the impression that we're just going round in circles.

Shall we just both agree that we don't like the current system and would like a fairer distribution based on loyalty?

With that, I'm out. I look forward to seeing you all on the 'Aston Villa tickets' thread next week, where we will have the same argument again and fail to reach to a conclusion.

I guess. But I'd still like an explanation in to how rewarding a loyalty of 10 tickets with 20 is fairer than just the 10 that qualified them.

🙃👍

Edited by nutty nigel

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On another point, I’ve just remembered that I haven’t yet had a response from NCFC about what steps they took to make sure that Liverpool fans didn’t get hold of tickets in our end at Anfield. I’ve sent them a reminder.

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7 minutes ago, Mr Angry said:

On another point, I’ve just remembered that I haven’t yet had a response from NCFC about what steps they took to make sure that Liverpool fans didn’t get hold of tickets in our end at Anfield. I’ve sent them a reminder.

Whatever steps they took, they didn’t work 

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3 hours ago, king canary said:

I didn't attribute to you. You insinuated it was happening, I asked if there was any evidence.

I said it, based upon personal experience, having been offered tickets for Burnley by three different priority members, plus Palace by another priority member.

Additionally, there’s numerous social media posts by individuals (who I’d say are usually pretty reliable) who have stated similar of receiving / passing on of tickets.

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11 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

I guess. But I'd still like an explanation in to how rewarding a loyalty of 10 tickets with 20 is fairer than just the 10 that qualified them.

🙃👍

Dont forget it's a MINIMUM of 10 tickets, and to get those last season, you would assume that they had a reasonable amount of points from their attendance the previous season. 

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Along with the fairness of it all , the football club is aware that it has an aging fan base. All Clubs where the majority of season tickets are renewed have this . Looking around the upper Barclay and this is obvious. The City stand too. 

I am in this category. I’ve had a ticket for years . I’m lucky to be able to get tickets on occasion so I could take my family but many can’t . 

My contention with the membership was the arbitrary £50. On the other hand it is an opportunity to open up the availability of tickets away from the the same old folk (like me) . Anything to do with the club reflects this - the AGM and fan organisations will largely be older folk. 

There is no obvious solution but this is yet another aspect that the Club would have taken into account . More youngsters today mean more fans tomorrow. If they can’t get tickets then they will find something else to do. 

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1 hour ago, Graham Paddons Beard said:

Along with the fairness of it all , the football club is aware that it has an aging fan base. All Clubs where the majority of season tickets are renewed have this . Looking around the upper Barclay and this is obvious. The City stand too. 

I am in this category. I’ve had a ticket for years . I’m lucky to be able to get tickets on occasion so I could take my family but many can’t . 

My contention with the membership was the arbitrary £50. On the other hand it is an opportunity to open up the availability of tickets away from the the same old folk (like me) . Anything to do with the club reflects this - the AGM and fan organisations will largely be older folk. 

There is no obvious solution but this is yet another aspect that the Club would have taken into account . More youngsters today mean more fans tomorrow. If they can’t get tickets then they will find something else to do. 

That's one of the reasons why I'm in favour of rewarding loyalty while making tickets available to as many fans as possible and totally against closed shop schemes.

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1 minute ago, nutty nigel said:

That's one of the reasons why I'm in favour of rewarding loyalty while making tickets available to as many fans as possible and totally against closed shop schemes.

Can u have both? 

Rewarding loyalty is done on existing scheme, but that's a closed shop, elite in your view

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19 minutes ago, Greavsy said:

Can u have both? 

Rewarding loyalty is done on existing scheme, but that's a closed shop, elite in your view

The debate is being sidetracked by the ‘labelling’ of fans. Surely the only supporters who should be guaranteed a ticket to every away game are the away season ticket holders. However, the  revised scheme offers the same access benefits to priority members, which is slightly odd considering many previously attended less than half the games last season.

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5 minutes ago, GMF said:

The debate is being sidetracked by the ‘labelling’ of fans. Surely the only supporters who should be guaranteed a ticket to every away game are the away season ticket holders. However, the  revised scheme offers the same access benefits to priority members, which is slightly odd considering many previously attended less than half the games last season.

Totally disagree about the labelling of fans. It's labelling of groups. Our club set up the groups.

Anyway, all the popular systems seem to be about rewarding loyalty while keeping people out. My suggestion was to reward loyalty, but only like for like, while letting people in. 

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46 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

Totally disagree about the labelling of fans. It's labelling of groups. Our club set up the groups.

Anyway, all the popular systems seem to be about rewarding loyalty while keeping people out. My suggestion was to reward loyalty, but only like for like, while letting people in. 

I don't want to get sucked into another circular debate but I think it worth repeating- nobody was being kept out for the last two or three seasons. Anyone who wanted to follow Norwich away last season had multiple chances- however it appears these people only want to do so when the league and opposition is glamorous enough for them.

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47 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

Totally disagree about the labelling of fans. It's labelling of groups. Our club set up the groups.

Anyway, all the popular systems seem to be about rewarding loyalty while keeping people out. My suggestion was to reward loyalty, but only like for like, while letting people in. 

You’re right in part, Nutty - it’s the Club who named the groups, not the fans. But they certainly don’t use words like ‘elite’, which is something I’ve generally tried to avoid, simply because it misses the main point relating to the consequences of the revised scheme and its associated weaknesses. 

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