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Can we pleaaase not make Steips the skapegoat this year. I  can see it coming already. Some d1ck behind me on saturday was whinging for Farke to 'get him orrf, e'z useless' ! 

we need to look at his contribution more closely, he drives us forward so many times. done underestimate what effect getting us up the pitch 20, 30 yards can have. even if he then plays a sidewards pass, its huge to our gameplay.

he had a huge hand in 2 of teemu's goals on saturday too, how many players would have tried the turn and shot for pukki's first goal? instead, he played it calmly back out to emi and the rest is history. 

i think he is a confidence player so the moaning and groaning just because he isnt scoring isnt going to help

 

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Just now, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Well, attention has moved away from Cantwell in the last week or so and somebody has to be the scapegoat. Stiepermann is probably behind Hanley in the current pecking order, though. 

and Krul...

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He does frustrate sometimes when he loses possession in promising places and this is exacerbated when the loss of possession turns a chance at a goal into a dangerous counter for the opposition, so he's bound to irk sections of fans.

However, I suspect he is one of these players that if you took him out of the side we would struggle massively. If Hernandez was about, I would have been tempted to put Cantwell in Stiepermann's position with Onel out wide to try it out, but I wouldn't have been in the least bit surprised if it didn't work out.

I think he's one of those players whose importance you don't realise until he isn't there.

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Posted (edited)

We can’t not have a scapegoat, come on let’s keep this real. 😉

Edited by Van wink
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Agree with this. It was Marco's incisive through pass to Cantwell that led to Pukki's goal. If Cantwell had finished it himself it would of need Marco's assist.

They play as a team and all add something different.

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He's been one of the weaker performers in the first couple of weeks and there is an argument for him dropping to the bench to accomodate someone like Vrancic. That isn't scapegoating.

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Yes, someone behind me was shouting how he needed taking off.

He's actually a very intelligent player who knows where and when to take up space and when to simply lay it off as opposed to drive with the ball. He also moves well to link up with either fullback.

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Posted (edited)

Howabout not having any scapegoats this season?  Stieps proved his value last season and what a goal threat he can be - and he will get shooting positions this season - he had three at Liverpool and on another day will score one of those.

Edited by lake district canary
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But on a serious note, Stiepermann is very unorthodox as a number ten, but he contributes more to the team than some people realise. 

He may not have the quick feet, turn of pace or tricky dribbling that a traditional player in that role has, and he may not be able to play eye-of-the-needle through balls on a regular basis, but he has other qualities.

His size unsettles opponents, in a similar way to Marouane Fellaini at Everton when he played that role. That makes life a lot easier for Buendia, Cantwell and Pukki as they have someone else to do the dirty work and allow them to play. 

Besides, Stiepermann's technique isn't exactly poor and he possesses an excellent shot from range and has the tactical nous to make the right decision most of the time and link play very well.

I see no reason to drop Stiepermann at this time.

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Just now, hogesar said:

Yes, someone behind me was shouting how he needed taking off.

He's actually a very intelligent player who knows where and when to take up space and when to simply lay it off as opposed to drive with the ball. He also moves well to link up with either fullback.

Also a number of defensive aerial clearances at corners!

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1 minute ago, king canary said:

He's been one of the weaker performers in the first couple of weeks and there is an argument for him dropping to the bench to accomodate someone like Vrancic. That isn't scapegoating.

In your opinion do you think Vrancic could do a steady job there? When he replaced Leitner in that deep lying role it was near seamless. From memory of Vrancic in that first season in that position he seemed much too slow but understand it would have been a transition from Bundesliga to EFL..

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One thing a lot of people miss is the number of defensive headers that Stiepi wins - especially from opposition set pieces. We're not the best at defending set pieces as it is and if we took him out we'd be even more vulnerable. 

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6 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

Also a number of defensive aerial clearances at corners!

You beat me to it by about a second Yellow Fever. 🙂

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Just now, Half Ar5ed Hipster said:

In your opinion do you think Vrancic could do a steady job there? When he replaced Leitner in that deep lying role it was near seamless. From memory of Vrancic in that first season in that position he seemed much too slow but understand it would have been a transition from Bundesliga to EFL..

I've never been a huge fan of Vrancic at the 10 role simply because it limits his range of passing. I was impressed with how Leitner slotted in when he replaced Steipermann v Liverpool so I could see pushing him up with Vrancic in the deeper role. Equally I'd be interested to see Roberts come in with Cantwell in a more central role. I'm not saying we should drop Marco, just that suggesting it isn't scapegoating or heresy. 

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1 minute ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

One thing a lot of people miss is the number of defensive headers that Stiepi wins - especially from opposition set pieces. We're not the best at defending set pieces as it is and if we took him out we'd be even more vulnerable. 

Exactly as noted above. A bit of an unsung hero at times!

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3 minutes ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

But on a serious note, Stiepermann is very unorthodox as a number ten, but he contributes more to the team than some people realise. 

He may not have the quick feet, turn of pace or tricky dribbling that a traditional player in that role has, and he may not be able to play eye-of-the-needle through balls on a regular basis, but he has other qualities.

His size unsettles opponents, in a similar way to Marouane Fellaini at Everton when he played that role. That makes life a lot easier for Buendia, Cantwell and Pukki as they have someone else to do the dirty work and allow them to play. 

Besides, Stiepermann's technique isn't exactly poor and he possesses an excellent shot from range and has the tactical nous to make the right decision most of the time and link play very well.

I see no reason to drop Stiepermann at this time.

One of the things Marco does very well is find pockets of space between the oppositions defence and midfield and then turn and run at defenders when he has the ball. I'm not sure of anyone else in our team who can do that (Cantwell maybe?) as effectively.

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One of my favourite players but he looked nervous before the start at Anfield and he has had a slow-ish start.  It was a shame one of his attempts at Liverpool didn't go in - I think a goal would do him the world of good.

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Just now, king canary said:

I'm not saying we should drop Marco, just that suggesting it isn't scapegoating or heresy.

Of course not, Farke's been quoted as suggesting it'll be more horses for courses this season, which you'd expect. Stiepi was nailed on starter last season but then it's a bit different when playing Hull compared to S'Hampton et al because the quality is a lot different.. Be interesting to see a mix up as you've suggested.

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5 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Howabout not having any scapegoats this season?  Stieps proved his value last season and what a goal threat he can be - and he will get shooting positions this season - he had three at Liverpool and on another day will score one of those.

I don't think we have actually had scapegoats very often. Just some people love to cry the s word the second anyone says anything critical of a players performance. 

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Steiperman is improving, his play in preseason games was appalling, improved slightly at Anfield and again against Toon.

 

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He looked off the pace in pre-season but the reason he plays is that his role in the team is important and he plays it very well. Our third goal on Saturday and the ease with which he cut them open with that through ball illustrated that. When in form he just knows when to release the ball to maximum effect and he seems to be growing in stature with each game. When off form he can hold onto it a bit too long at times and run into trouble.  Its worth remembering though that for players like him this is a particular jump up in quality from the level they've played at for much of their recent careers. It will take a bit of time to adjust to the pace and technical requirements. I felt he played well at the weekend.

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Again, people have to weigh up what he adds to the team other than the fact that he isn't one of our amazing,tricky technical players. Several times on Saturday Krul and Hanley were forced into rushed clearances and who did they aim for? He won a good number and I also noticed Newcastle doubling up on him which freed up space for the likes of Cantwell. Also three or four vital defensive clearances. Well worth his place in the team.

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What are we having to scapegoat exactly?  A convincing win and dominating team performance against an established premier league team?!  This sounds like a very content situation to me 😂

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Marco has built a strong understanding of pukkis game and also allows buendia, Onel and Cantwell do what they do. I think he is a confidence player and at times last season he did walk like a giant and if he can do that more often then he will do it.

He is a mismatch for a deep centre midfielder or centre half and he plays intelligently knowing that. I agree we probably don't see every bit but we do see it when he runs down a cul de sac or a ball is the wrong choice. But that is because he is in that critical role and sometimes he can look plucky.

With where the team is coming from he is more than capable and I hope his levels remain high. I do think he may be at his ceiling but he can prove me wrong and keep soaring.

In the Summer I believe we needed an improvement in that position but it didn't mean he could perform and following the summer he is our number 10. The ball through to Cantwell was cracking, the cross to Pukki in the first half was spot on. He has good quality, as do many of our team and squad; we will need all of them this season.

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It's also his work without the ball that is so intelligent/useful. So often he makes runs which create space for the ball carrier to drive into or a receiver to step into and gain a couple of extra seconds when the ball comes to them and I don't think that's something that a lot of people appreciate.

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1 hour ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Well, attention has moved away from Cantwell in the last week or so and somebody has to be the scapegoat. Stiepermann is probably behind Hanley in the current pecking order, though. 

why does someone have to be the scapegoat though

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