Tour de France 2019

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

The tactics sometimes confuse me.

Thomas said he didn't want to make a break earlier as he might have taken Alaphillipe with him. But he made a break and Alaphillipe was unable to respond, admittedly 3K further up the hill. Ineos seem to go by the book and I wonder if that could be their downfall. Pinot looks on form and strong.

To take a team into the Tour just to concentrate on the GC does limit the options. I would love to see them join the breakaway now and again or have a sprinter as they did with Cavendish and Viviani.

[FenwayFrank 2,459]

Yeah, I think with Ines/sky, the criticism has always been about their lack of flair. They’re a bit like the title winning Arsenal team that won 1-0 every week, successful but not exciting to watch

[SwindonCanary 455]

Luke Rowe  has been disqualified from the tour, following a racing incident with Tony Martin.  Sounds like the organizers want a Frenchman to win this year, as it was Tony Martin's fault.

 

 

 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

Luke Rowe  has been disqualified from the tour, following a racing incident with Tony Martin.  Sounds like the organizers want a Frenchman to win this year, as it was Tony Martin's fault.

It does look like they are hoping for Pinot or Alaphillipe. I don't know what the squabble was really about but it was definitely panniers at six paces and nowhere near a disqualification offence. We see much worse in sprint finishes.

[FenwayFrank 2,459]

Alaphilippe still hanging on but I think this now going to be won by Bernal or Pinot with Thomas finishing fourth.

[canarydan23 4,060]

Pinot has abandoned. He was riding in pain yesterday with a leg muscle injury. They had hoped it would clear up overnight but it hasn't. Absolutely devastating, he had a huge chance to win and end the French drought and become a legend in his country for eternity. Alaphilippe still has that chance, but I actually thought Pinot was France's biggest hope.

Such a terrible shame.

[canarydan23 4,060]

What a farce. Potentially the greatest finale to a Tour de France ruined by weather and a race control decision.

The commissaires have a tough decision to make but I can't help feeling there has to be another option.

[PurpleCanary 5,557]

6 minutes ago, canarydan23 said:

What a farce. Potentially the greatest finale to a Tour de France ruined by weather and a race control decision.

The commissaires have a tough decision to make but I can't help feeling there has to be another option.

Is this a first? Le Tour halted by hail?! But I don't think this changes the probable end result. Alaphilippe was only catching up a bit on the descent and there was still a 7km climb to the finish. The likelihood is Bernal would anyway have taken the yellow jersey today, and tomorrow's stage, ending with a 33km climb, is tailor-made for Bernal (and even Thomas) and potential hell for Alaphilippe.

[canarydan23 4,060]

4 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

Is this a first? Le Tour halted by hail?! But I don't think this changes the probable end result. Alaphilippe was only catching up a bit on the descent and there was still a 7km climb to the finish. The likelihood is Bernal would anyway have taken the yellow jersey today, and tomorrow's stage, ending with a 33km climb, is tailor-made for Bernal (and even Thomas) and potential hell for Alaphilippe.

I think the mudslides were the main factor. 

I think we've been denied an epic end. Cannot see past Bernal now, but had that stage gone on I don't think he'd have held his advantage. He us dominant at altitude, whereas Alaphilippe is awful. The last climb didn't go as high so I would have vet on Thomas and Kruiswijk to close that gap, particularly with Uran, Nibali and Buchmann working as a group. Alaphilippe is phenomenal on the descent, he'd sliced 15 seconds off before it was called, he'd have probably reached the bottom of the climb to Tignes with Thomas, Kruiswijk et al. I don't believe with those chasing as a group, and without the altitude advantage, Bernal would have taken a minute's lead over the finish line. 

I'm still gutted. Probably the greatest end to a TdF in living memory was on the cards this morning. Pinot's injury and freak weather has made it a damp squib of a finish. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I think the only excitement tomorrow will GE the battle for second. 

[PurpleCanary 5,557]

10 hours ago, canarydan23 said:

I think the mudslides were the main factor. 

I think we've been denied an epic end. Cannot see past Bernal now, but had that stage gone on I don't think he'd have held his advantage. He us dominant at altitude, whereas Alaphilippe is awful. The last climb didn't go as high so I would have vet on Thomas and Kruiswijk to close that gap, particularly with Uran, Nibali and Buchmann working as a group. Alaphilippe is phenomenal on the descent, he'd sliced 15 seconds off before it was called, he'd have probably reached the bottom of the climb to Tignes with Thomas, Kruiswijk et al. I don't believe with those chasing as a group, and without the altitude advantage, Bernal would have taken a minute's lead over the finish line. 

I'm still gutted. Probably the greatest end to a TdF in living memory was on the cards this morning. Pinot's injury and freak weather has made it a damp squib of a finish. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I think the only excitement tomorrow will GE the battle for second. 

It wasn't that much. More like five or six seconds. And both the last two days Alaphilippe has been out on his feet on the climbs. I agree it is a shame the race has been curtailed, but Bernal effectively won the Tour with yesterday's climb to the Iseran, making him Ineos' number one.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

7 out of 8 for Sky/Ineos. Whatever we think of them, they are the ultimate in coolness and professionalism. The only stage win was Friday's truncated effort and yet they are first and second on the podium.

I must admit though, I don't think this is the best lineup they have ever put out but when Froome is fit again they will have three Tour winners. Unless one of them decides to take a chance somewhere else. 

[SwindonCanary 455]

The French are not happy, they have note won their race since 1985 before many of today's  riders were born !  👍

[canarydan23 4,060]

What was shaping up to be a ten out of ten tour became a three out of ten. 

A winner who didn't win a stage sucks, like Froome in 2017, but a winner who didn't even podium? 

Awful. Such a disappointment. If only Pinot had stayed fit. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

A winner who didn't win a stage sucks, like Froome in 2017, but a winner who didn't even podium?

When Stage 19 was stopped, he was leading that stage and everyone was awarded a time so I guess the records will say Bernal won that stage

[canarydan23 4,060]

3 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

A winner who didn't win a stage sucks, like Froome in 2017, but a winner who didn't even podium?

When Stage 19 was stopped, he was leading that stage and everyone was awarded a time so I guess the records will say Bernal won that stage

Nope, no winner given for that stage. So he didn't podium a single stage.

He would almost certainly have managed to on Stage 19, though I doubt he would have kept the 1 minute plus advantage he had gained and Simon Yates would have been clear favourite for the stage. I suspect Bernal would have cut a deal to say that Yates helps him up the final claim in return for not contesting the stage win.

But given the fact that Thomas, Kruiswijk and Buchmann were in a bunch with Nibali and Uran, and would have probably been supplemented by Alaphilippe before the foot of the final climb to Tignes, that group co-operating would have eaten into Bernal's advantage (and would have almost certainly dropped Alaphilippe as they did so). The instances of Bernal's climbing dominance generally came at altitude; the discarded climb at the end of 19 did not go up that high.

They may not have caught him, but he wouldn't have taken the significant lead he did into the final meaningful stage. So he can't rely grumble that the cancelled stage denied him a podium finish as it benefited him well.

But the history books will say that Bernal is a Tour de France winner who didn't even finish in the Top 3 on any stage. That's not a great look for me.

[FenwayFrank 2,459]

Can anyone see Bernal, Froome and Thomas all staying with Ines next season ? I don’t think I can with Thomas the more likely to leave in my opinion

[Il Pirata 249]

On 26/07/2019 at 21:03, canarydan23 said:

I think the mudslides were the main factor. 

I think we've been denied an epic end. Cannot see past Bernal now, but had that stage gone on I don't think he'd have held his advantage. He us dominant at altitude, whereas Alaphilippe is awful. The last climb didn't go as high so I would have vet on Thomas and Kruiswijk to close that gap, particularly with Uran, Nibali and Buchmann working as a group. Alaphilippe is phenomenal on the descent, he'd sliced 15 seconds off before it was called, he'd have probably reached the bottom of the climb to Tignes with Thomas, Kruiswijk et al. I don't believe with those chasing as a group, and without the altitude advantage, Bernal would have taken a minute's lead over the finish line. 

I'm still gutted. Probably the greatest end to a TdF in living memory was on the cards this morning. Pinot's injury and freak weather has made it a damp squib of a finish. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I think the only excitement tomorrow will GE the battle for second. 

Sadly you were correct. Still a brilliant TDF, but the finish was robbed of a famous GC battle. Having said that, what a delight to see such a humble young man in Bernal stand in yellow. A worthy champion. 

I was lucky (or unlucky) enough to be on the road for stage 19. I decided against going to the final climb at Tignes and ride up and over the I'seran to sit 1.5km from the top. The weather was crazy, although not particularly where we were. At an altitude of 2700m above sea level we enjoyed sunshine and temperatures of 25 plus degree until about an hour before the race cam through. The wind picked up and the sky threatened, but bar a few spits of rain and some thunder, nothing really happened.

30 mins after the riders passed, we descended back towards Tignes. The roads were completely dry down the I'seran until we got to Val D'isere at 1800m altitude. literally it was like someone had opened a freezer door in front of us. At an altitude of nearly 1000m lower than were we'd been, the temperature must have been 15-20 degrees cooler! As we progressed out of Val the road was empty apart from a few gendarmerie, and the evidence of snow! Through a few tunnels and with the Tignes dam in view, we encountered proper snow!!  But only for like a sq KM max. But more than enough to make it dangerous to riders. We were shocked, as we rode up earlier in the day it must have been 30+ degrees here!  The weather was so localised that literally it had changed within 100 metres, and it was just bad luck that it hit the parcours. 

At this point, we had no idea the race had been cancelled and assumed the race had gone on to finish at Tignes! As we passed Tignes and tried to decend to Bourg st Maurice where our car was parked, we were stopped and informed of a landslide blocking the road. At which point the heavens opened and we got a drenched.

An hour or so later we were descending back to the car in biblical rain with chattering teeth! NEVER been so happy for heated car seats!!! We got back to our chalet and enjoyed some beer and pizza before watching the highlights in shock as we found out the races outcome. 

It was a pretty crazy day, but fortunately we made the right decision in terms of where to watch the race, and got to see the riders pass. But perhaps more fortunately, we avoided the bad weather whilst sat on Europe's highest mountain pass. Had we have got the snow, hail and cold temperatures, we could have been in a very difficult position on a very remote and exposed mountain. 

Vive Le Tour! 

 

[Il Pirata 249]

12 hours ago, FenwayFrank said:

Can anyone see Bernal, Froome and Thomas all staying with Ines next season ? I don’t think I can with Thomas the more likely to leave in my opinion

Factor in Carapaz too, the Giro winner! Its one heck of a roster.... but I can't see any of them leaving. Thomas is well payed and will get a shot at GC again, but possibly not in the tour. The only team capable of challenging Ineos in the Gt's is Jumbo Visma. Rumours are Tom Dumoulin is joing them too. And with Roglic and Kryswijk (sp), that's three GC contenders. With George Bennett, possibly four. So if Thomas left Ineos he'd only move himself further away from winning a GT - Unless he went to Jumbo Visma, which just isn't going to happen. Look at Richie Porte, I'm sure he wished he'd stayed now. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

Factor in Carapaz too, the Giro winner! Its one heck of a roster.... but I can't see any of them leaving. Thomas is well payed and will get a shot at GC again, but possibly not in the tour. The only team capable of challenging Ineos in the Gt's is Jumbo Visma. Rumours are Tom Dumoulin is joing them too. And with Roglic and Kryswijk (sp), that's three GC contenders. With George Bennett, possibly four. So if Thomas left Ineos he'd only move himself further away from winning a GT - Unless he went to Jumbo Visma, which just isn't going to happen. Look at Richie Porte, I'm sure he wished he'd stayed now. 

What about the rest of the roster Il Pirata? There are a few UK guys like Stannard, Swift, Doull who are unlikely to get a role in the big three. And with Geoghan Hart and Dunbar showing promise, will these chaps want to be only riding in the smaller events?

It is a big roster and with the probable demise of Katusha and others thinking about continuing, there will be a few riders looking for a ride somewhere else.

And do you think we could put out a good UK team to challenge? How about:

Froome, Thomas, Yates, Yates, Cavendish, Rowe, Geoghan Hart, Dowsett. I know it is highly unlikely but that looks a strong lineup to me who could forget the obsession with just GC and look for stage wins as well.

[Il Pirata 249]

3 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

Factor in Carapaz too, the Giro winner! Its one heck of a roster.... but I can't see any of them leaving. Thomas is well payed and will get a shot at GC again, but possibly not in the tour. The only team capable of challenging Ineos in the Gt's is Jumbo Visma. Rumours are Tom Dumoulin is joing them too. And with Roglic and Kryswijk (sp), that's three GC contenders. With George Bennett, possibly four. So if Thomas left Ineos he'd only move himself further away from winning a GT - Unless he went to Jumbo Visma, which just isn't going to happen. Look at Richie Porte, I'm sure he wished he'd stayed now. 

What about the rest of the roster Il Pirata? There are a few UK guys like Stannard, Swift, Doull who are unlikely to get a role in the big three. And with Geoghan Hart and Dunbar showing promise, will these chaps want to be only riding in the smaller events?

It is a big roster and with the probable demise of Katusha and others thinking about continuing, there will be a few riders looking for a ride somewhere else.

And do you think we could put out a good UK team to challenge? How about:

Froome, Thomas, Yates, Yates, Cavendish, Rowe, Geoghan Hart, Dowsett. I know it is highly unlikely but that looks a strong lineup to me who could forget the obsession with just GC and look for stage wins as well.

I'm not sure any of the other riders you first mention are GT contenders tbh. Perhaps Dunbar might make a decent mountain domestique, but by their nature they are much better suited to the spring classics and the smaller events. Pavel Sivakov is probably the one after Bernal with superior talent. It's been nice having a British team with British GT winners, but I don't see anyone coming through currently that will continue that trend. And team INEOS don't seem to have the same goals anymore. GT winning is the only goal... And Dave Brailsford seems to have a new obsession doing that with South American riders. Team Sky were very close to a sponsorship deal involving the Columbian government / businesses (sound legit, right!?) before INEOS moved in. 

As for the UK team, we have some very good riders. But it would be very difficult to have a sole UK team and compete. I think as stage racers, the Yates brothers are right up there with the best.