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1 hour ago, Six Pack said:

Let's get this right ! You're on this thread blabbering a massive assessment about Passlack - mainly negative...

but you've never seen him play ! You are kidding me right ??!!

Making assumptions because he's never been in the match day squad. The makeup of a match day 18 almost never includes specialist a rightback, leftback, left wing or right wing. These managers in the 21st century are smart - the 18 usually includes the starting eleven, another goalkeeper, other defenders that cover multiple positions, other midfielders that cover multiple positions, other wide midfielders that cover both flanks and a couple of strikers. Specialist players only appear when they start to cover an injury or out-of-form player in their specific position. eg Lewis is injured, next game you see Heise starting (a special leftback) - but hes never in a match day squad, is he ?

I thought you were serious !

Your point doesn't really stack up when you look at our benches.

When Lewis was injured and Godfrey was shifted to left back Pinto got on the bench. We finished the season with two central defenders and two central midfielders on the bench most weeks. Passlack would actually have given us more variety and cover on the bench (especially considering he can play right midfield). 

As I say I can only judge on the evidence around me. Generally people are willing to trust Farke's judgement on most things- yet people do seem to desperately want to convince themselves that Farke actually really rated Passlack but just didn't show it.

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2 minutes ago, king canary said:

Your point doesn't really stack up when you look at our benches.

When Lewis was injured and Godfrey was shifted to left back Pinto got on the bench. We finished the season with two central defenders and two central midfielders on the bench most weeks. Passlack would actually have given us more variety and cover on the bench (especially considering he can play right midfield). 

As I say I can only judge on the evidence around me. Generally people are willing to trust Farke's judgement on most things- yet people do seem to desperately want to convince themselves that Farke actually really rated Passlack but just didn't show it.

If that’s the case that Farke didn’t rate him why not send him back? He kept him here and if he comes back might prove to be a worthy signing as Aarons showed to be last season.....probably one you’d want to see go out on loan last year to get games?

Lets wait and see what Farke does this summer should Passlack come back I’d be happy to see him back.

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1 hour ago, Indy said:

If that’s the case that Farke didn’t rate him why not send him back?

We have no insight into the structure of the deal, perhaps it made no sense financially? 

He didn't get a look in, even when injuries would indicate he should've at least made the bench..

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2 minutes ago, kirku said:

We have no insight into the structure of the deal, perhaps it made no sense financially? 

He didn't get a look in, even when injuries would indicate he should've at least made the bench..

Again we had home grown restrictions so to have him on the bench would have meant a more versatile and impact substitution taken off the bench.

As you say we don’t know but Farke didn’t terminate the loan and didn’t have anything negative to say about him so I’m at a loss why he’s getting this negative criticism when the likes of marshal was sent out on loan and hasn’t really featured for us either! He’s 28....

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1 minute ago, Indy said:

Again we had home grown restrictions so to have him on the bench would have meant a more versatile and impact substitution taken off the bench.

As you say we don’t know but Farke didn’t terminate the loan and didn’t have anything negative to say about him so I’m at a loss why he’s getting this negative criticism when the likes of marshal was sent out on loan and hasn’t really featured for us either! He’s 28....

Homegrown - not sure the evidence stacks up for this.

Pinto preferred on bench. Large parts of the run-in with both Klose and Hanley on the bench. Surely if Passlack were a viable option, it'd have made more sense to have him instead of Timm? Then there'd be cover for 3 positions instead of 1.

He managed all of 6 minutes of league football and barely made the bench, we trust Farke on player selection and so it's pretty clear he wasn't rated all that highly.

 

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12 minutes ago, kirku said:

Homegrown - not sure the evidence stacks up for this.

Pinto preferred on bench. Large parts of the run-in with both Klose and Hanley on the bench. Surely if Passlack were a viable option, it'd have made more sense to have him instead of Timm? Then there'd be cover for 3 positions instead of 1.

He managed all of 6 minutes of league football and barely made the bench, we trust Farke on player selection and so it's pretty clear he wasn't rated all that highly.

 

Pinto wasn’t on the bench while Passlack was fit! We didn’t have cover at right back on the bench after the first few games after Aarons made that position his own!  Not sure that’s much of an argument, so no one saying the same about Hanley? Or Marshall? Both ditched after a mediocre start to our first 6 games for youngsters who basically proved their worth.

Well we all see things differently and I’d be very happy to have a Young right back from Dortmund who has represented his country at all youth levels than Marshall as back up this season.

 

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2 minutes ago, Indy said:

Pinto wasn’t on the bench while Passlack was fit! We didn’t have cover at right back on the bench after the first few games after Aarons made that position his own!  Not sure that’s much of an argument, so no one saying the same about Hanley? Or Marshall? Both ditched after a mediocre start to our first 6 games for youngsters who basically proved their worth.

Well we all see things differently and I’d be very happy to have a Young right back from Dortmund who has represented his country at all youth levels than Marshall as back up this season.

 

Yes he was. When Lewis was injured in December Pinto was on the bench.

Also take a look at our bench v Stoke for instance

McGovern

Hanley

Klose

Leitner

Vrancic

Rhodes

Cantwell

To me that suggests Farke would rather play a central defender out of position if Aarons got injured than Passlack. Hardly a ringing endorsement.

 

 

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Posted (edited)
58 minutes ago, Indy said:

Pinto wasn’t on the bench while Passlack was fit! We didn’t have cover at right back on the bench after the first few games after Aarons made that position his own!  Not sure that’s much of an argument, so no one saying the same about Hanley? Or Marshall? Both ditched after a mediocre start to our first 6 games for youngsters who basically proved their worth.

Well we all see things differently and I’d be very happy to have a Young right back from Dortmund who has represented his country at all youth levels than Marshall as back up this season.

 

The reason that there's no debate over the others is that they're contracted to the club, as it stands they're here this season, Passlack isn't. The bench has been covered by king canary above.

We all see things differently, I agree. Some of us take the evidence of last season when he was actually a Norwich player rather than looking at what he did years ago, in a different position, and placing an emphasis on the club he's contracted to (all players who play for big clubs must be *amazing*, just like the colossus that was Ignasi Miquel..), despite the fact that the writing's been on the wall for him at BVB for quite a while.

Edited by kirku

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1 hour ago, king canary said:

Yes he was. When Lewis was injured in December Pinto was on the bench.

Also take a look at our bench v Stoke for instance

McGovern Hanley Klose Leitner Vrancic Rhodes Cantwell

To me that suggests Farke would rather play a central defender out of position if Aarons got injured than Passlack. Hardly a ringing endorsement.

Pinto was on the bench when Lewis was injured because he can play left back, simples (as he showed earlier in the season, can't remember which match it was).  Passlack was simply unlucky that he was on the sidelines - due to circumstance not ability. The appearances he did make in the cup games, were actually pretty good. In other circumstances - ie if Aarons hadn't broken through, he would likely have had many more chances to get minutes on the pitch.

As for the Stoke match, that bench looks experienced and classy. which one would you have left out to accomodate a youngster with no championship experience?

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11 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

As for the Stoke match, that bench looks experienced and classy. which one would you have left out to accomodate a youngster with no championship experience?

Make your mind up.

As for the rest of it, you're right; if he'd have been good enough to even get in the match day squad then he would've had "more chances to get minutes on the pitch". The sky is also blue, by the way.

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The more I read, the more I think it’s actually quite ridiculous that people are so passionately criticising someone as ‘not up to it’ when they’ve never even seen the lad play! You can’t form an opinion on him just because he was kept out by a wonderful talent in Max, and neither can you form a true opinion of what Daniel Farke’s thoughts are on the player, it is just pure speculation on your part. But what I know is fact is IF you were at the league cup game where we were playing a Premier League side, then you’d know that he’s actually a very decent player regardless of not managing to dislodge the incredible Max Aarons last season!

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1 minute ago, Alex Moss said:

The more I read, the more I think it’s actually quite ridiculous that people are so passionately criticising someone as ‘not up to it’ when they’ve never even seen the lad play! You can’t form an opinion on him just because he was kept out by a wonderful talent in Max, and neither can you form a true opinion of what Daniel Farke’s thoughts are on the player, it is just pure speculation on your part. But what I know is fact is IF you were at the league cup game where we were playing a Premier League side, then you’d know that he’s actually a very decent player regardless of not managing to dislodge the incredible Max Aarons last season!

They’ll be the first complaining if we were to sell Aarons and replace him with Marshall!

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10 minutes ago, Alex Moss said:

The more I read, the more I think it’s actually quite ridiculous that people are so passionately criticising someone as ‘not up to it’ when they’ve never even seen the lad play! You can’t form an opinion on him just because he was kept out by a wonderful talent in Max, and neither can you form a true opinion of what Daniel Farke’s thoughts are on the player, it is just pure speculation on your part. But what I know is fact is IF you were at the league cup game where we were playing a Premier League side, then you’d know that he’s actually a very decent player regardless of not managing to dislodge the incredible Max Aarons last season!

The point is, that nobody's seen him play. You can't form an opinion on a player who played 6 minutes of league football and a few league cup games.

What you can do is draw the very reasonable conclusion that Farke didn't fancy him, not even enough to include on the bench.

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, Indy said:

They’ll be the first complaining if we were to sell Aarons and replace him with Marshall!

Would you not complain if we were to replace the current Young Player of the Year and probable best talent out of the club since Bellamy with a converted midfielder we shipped off to Millwall? I'd also be pretty miffed if the replacement was someone who couldn't get near the team last year and has no more than about 20 career appearances to his name.

Most reasonable people would expect the club to invest in a new first choice right back, if Aarons were to be sold. It's not rocket science.

Do you think it'd be any different if we sold Emi and replaced him with Cantwell? And Cantwell actually played..

Edited by kirku

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10 minutes ago, kirku said:
23 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

As for the Stoke match, that bench looks experienced and classy. which one would you have left out to accomodate a youngster with no championship experience?

Make your mind up.

As for the rest of it, you're right; if he'd have been good enough to even get in the match day squad then he would've had "more chances to get minutes on the pitch". The sky is also blue, by the way.

I don't know what you  mean "make up your mind".  We all know he didn't have championship experience and it was no surprise he didn't get minutes given Aarons' emergence.   The argument is whether he is good enough to be back up again next season - and that is something that only Farke can decide.  It seems that view is that because he didn't make the break through last season he's not worth considering this...but that is not necessarily right. He is a year older, he is well versed in the Farke methodology and would be a good option as a squad member.  Those that got hooked up by my "key cog" comment seem to forget that the off the field player dynamic is just as important as the onfield one.....and there wasn't much wrong with anything last season.......

Stiepermann had limited opportunities in his first season and was written off by many.......that really did turn out well....

 

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7 minutes ago, kirku said:

The point is, that nobody's seen him play. You can't form an opinion on a player who played 6 minutes of league football and a few league cup games.

Yes you can. He did ok when called upon. The openings for the first team were just not there for him....not his fault.

8 minutes ago, kirku said:

What you can do is draw the very reasonable conclusion that Farke didn't fancy him, not even enough to include on the bench.

What you can conclude is that Farke had other options to consider, not that he didn't fancy him.  Not every player in the squad could be on the bench....not to mention the home grown rule which was mentioned several times as being a bit awkward to manage.

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4 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

I don't know what you  mean "make up your mind". 

In one thread he's a "key cog in a title winning squad" and in this one it's no surprise we didn't put an inexperienced youngster on the bench.

While I'd hardly be up in arms if he ended up coming back, we don't have the budget to be spending money on players who couldn't get on the bench in the Champ when, as others have rightly pointed out, our current 2nd choice RB has been somewhat of a flop and with no indication that Passlack would even be ahead of him.

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Yes you can. He did ok when called upon. The openings for the first team were just not there for him....not his fault.

What you can conclude is that Farke had other options to consider, not that he didn't fancy him.  Not every player in the squad could be on the bench....not to mention the home grown rule which was mentioned several times as being a bit awkward to manage.

Like Srbeny did OK when called upon. Quick, get Drmic on the blower, he's not needed because Dennis the Menace put two past Cardiff reserves.

This feels a bit circular now, and there's only so many times I can repeat the facts. 6 minutes of league football. A couple of cup games. Barely on the bench. If that doesn't indicate to you that Farke didn't fancy him, then I really don't know what would. Making him man the turnstiles?

Edited by kirku

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16 minutes ago, kirku said:

Would you not complain if we were to replace the current Young Player of the Year and probable best talent out of the club since Bellamy with a converted midfielder we shipped off to Millwall? I'd also be pretty miffed if the replacement was someone who couldn't get near the team last year and has no more than about 20 career appearances to his name.

Most reasonable people would expect the club to invest in a new first choice right back, if Aarons were to be sold. It's not rocket science.

Do you think it'd be any different if we sold Emi and replaced him with Cantwell? And Cantwell actually played..

Nope but as you said earlier the difference is they’re already our players so according to your philosophy we’re better off playing Marshall than getting Passlack back on loan or permanently should the worst case happen and someone makes a stupid offer for Aarons!

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, kirku said:

Like Srbeny did OK when called upon. Quick, get Drmic on the blower, he's not needed because Dennis the Menace put two past Cardiff reserves.

This feels a bit circular now, and there's only so many times I can repeat the facts. 6 minutes of league football. A couple of cup games. Barely on the bench. If that doesn't indicate to you that Farke didn't fancy him, then I really don't know what would. Making him man the turnstiles?

Yes, it's getting repetitive.

You have written him off because you think Farke did. 

I haven't written him off because I don't think Farke did.

Never the twain will meet. 

Oh...and I haven't written Srbeny off either......

Edited by lake district canary

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Indy said:

Nope but as you said earlier the difference is they’re already our players so according to your philosophy we’re better off playing Marshall than getting Passlack back on loan or permanently should the worst case happen and someone makes a stupid offer for Aarons!

Hello, Strawman, my old friend; what a bizarre take on my comments. I've already made my opinion quite clear on what I'd expect to happen if we sold Aarons, we'd buy a new right back.

If that ended up being Passlack then I'd be extremely surprised but would also trust that Farke and Webber knew what they were doing and I can't see them letting us start a Premiership season with Ben Marshall as the first choice right back.

Edited by kirku

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On 28/06/2019 at 11:10, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

And always injured. He needs a loan spell to get some match sharpness as he has barely played for a couple of years, in my opinion.

I enjoyed your performance during Kylie

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People seem to be missing the point here.

It isn't that I, or anyone think Passlack is an awful player. It is that we think he's not someone we should be signing to play in the Premier League.

Also the excuses as to why he didn't get into the team are now so many they are getting contradictory. 

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9 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

He’s just signed for Fortuna Sittard on a season long loan. 

So maybe not a key cog. 

Who knew?

Lets see if he can get in the team at the bottom of the Eredivise...

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Re the bit about him not even getting on the bench and bringing Hanley in... Did anyone mention this might have been because we needed to fulfil the homegrown quota?

This thread was a bit TL;DR so I figured I'd ask. Probably been discussed.

On 30/06/2019 at 14:46, Alex Moss said:

The more I read, the more I think it’s actually quite ridiculous that people are so passionately criticising someone as ‘not up to it’ when they’ve never even seen the lad play! You can’t form an opinion on him just because he was kept out by a wonderful talent in Max, and neither can you form a true opinion of what Daniel Farke’s thoughts are on the player, it is just pure speculation on your part. But what I know is fact is IF you were at the league cup game where we were playing a Premier League side, then you’d know that he’s actually a very decent player regardless of not managing to dislodge the incredible Max Aarons last season!

I would suggest that this is the right kind of reply to make with regards to Passlack, anyhow.

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