The Positive Brexit Thread

[A Load of Squit 5,162]

Distressed are the Cheesemakers for they have inherited the dearth.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/nov/15/cheesemaker-sells-firm-to-overcome-brexit-barriers-after-losing-600000-in-sales

“The sad thing is that small businesses like ours cannot have access to the EU,” he said. “Selling the company is a great solution … it secures the future of the company with a historical cheesemaker.

“But I still feel very let down and bitterly disappointed by the fact I’ve had so many conversations with the Department for International Trade and government ministers and nothing happens.

“They are impotent because of their Brexit policy. They are so anti-Europe they won’t even discuss getting a better deal sorted out. Getting access to the single market has to be the first step.”

[How I Wrote Elastic Man 1,187]

12 hours ago, Herman said:

A great country run by ****ing idiots.

 

A deal just for the sake of doing a deal 

Another Liz Truss screw up 

[Herman 9,763]

20 minutes ago, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

A deal just for the sake of doing a deal 

Another Liz Truss screw up 

A good photo op and nothing else.

[A Load of Squit 5,162]

Brexit in one sentence.

"The UK gave away far too much for far too little in return."

 

[Herman 9,763]

6 hours ago, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

A deal just for the sake of doing a deal 

Another Liz Truss screw up 

Adding to this, from a conversation I heard earlier, is that Truss threw away whatever decent hand we had in the negotiations because she wanted to get it done in a set time. There was a big summit upcoming so she handed the Australians what they wanted. 

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

1 hour ago, Herman said:

Adding to this, from a conversation I heard earlier, is that Truss threw away whatever decent hand we had in the negotiations because she wanted to get it done in a set time. There was a big summit upcoming so she handed the Australians what they wanted. 

Surely the real point is all the dumbos who suspended all rational thought and at the time claimed it was 'good' deal. A 'benefit' of Brexit purely it seems for 'political' means. Only now does Useless come out (fearing for his farming seat) and call a spade a spade.

Well I call them all out as spades. 

[PurpleCanary 5,558]

6 hours ago, Herman said:

Adding to this, from a conversation I heard earlier, is that Truss threw away whatever decent hand we had in the negotiations because she wanted to get it done in a set time. There was a big summit upcoming so she handed the Australians what they wanted. 

Indeed. But I think it was more than just working to a deadline she had imposed. One of the boasts she made in trying to become prime minister was that she had got deals done, and I assume she included trade deals in that, despite being warned against whatever she was trying to push through. She was making a virtue of being alone against a hidebound bureaucratic consensus.

But it doesn't take much guesswork to imagine that in cases such as the Oz deal what she painted as a hidebound consensus was actually experienced officials trying desperately to stop her from selling out UK agriculture.

[sonyc 5,517]

I remembered this Newsnight item when first broadcast (even posting on the subject of agriculture, having read many articles around the time before Brexit, and just before we knew what the Brexit deal entailed). Came up on a Twitter feed.

She was just telling it as it was. To listen to Eustace is utterly depressing because we knew what would unfold.

Shocking of the governmen to actually negotiate such a poor settlement. Even more so that Johnson trumpeted the deal as a great thing. 

Edited November 15, 2022 by sonyc
No video first time round

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

13 hours ago, sonyc said:

I remembered this Newsnight item when first broadcast (even posting on the subject of agriculture, having read many articles around the time before Brexit, and just before we knew what the Brexit deal entailed). Came up on a Twitter feed.

She was just telling it as it was. To listen to Eustace is utterly depressing because we knew what would unfold.

Shocking of the governmen to actually negotiate such a poor settlement. Even more so that Johnson trumpeted the deal as a great thing. 

 

I think as I alluded to above - every 'trade deal' done by Truss and the Brexiteers now needs a review - as they were mainly rushed through and done for political posturing as opposed to sound economic reasons - indeed Useless in his interview was already stating that we might have to consider withdrawing from such agreements ... Australia, CPTTP etc. as the full barely understood implications and external arbitration panels say yes you must take for instance unlimited hormone fed beef. Franky all of Truss's decisions both as Foreign Secretary and PM are fully suspect as now well proven.  Reminds me of the ongoing mess Johnson created with Brexit - and NI. I suppose stupid is as stupid does.

Isn't hindsight a wonderful thing (for some) 🙂

 

 

[Herman 9,763]

Good question followed by a typical, twatty brexiter response.

 

[sonyc 5,517]

3 hours ago, Herman said:

Good question followed by a typical, twatty brexiter response.

 

John Crace nails it perfectly here with an elegant restrained kind of anger combined with the darkest humour. Brexit mentioned just the once!

As he says "you can fool some of the people some of the time".

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/nov/17/no-jokes-jeremy-hunt-cant-bridge-gap-between-tory-fantasy-and-reality?

 

And a footnote: Only 32% now think leaving the EU was a good idea - reported in the Independent. The tide has turned in this respect.

Edited November 17, 2022 by sonyc

[Herman 9,763]

40 minutes ago, sonyc said:

John Crace nails it perfectly here with an elegant restrained kind of anger combined with the darkest humour. Brexit mentioned just the once!

As he says "you can fool some of the people some of the time".

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/nov/17/no-jokes-jeremy-hunt-cant-bridge-gap-between-tory-fantasy-and-reality?

 

And a footnote: Only 32% now think leaving the EU was a good idea - reported in the Independent. The tide has turned in this respect.

I am a ranter about brexit and have been since the beginning but I have noticed that those that kept their opinions about it to themselves, mostly to keep the peace amongst family etc, are starting to get ranty about it. There is a shift happening, not fast  nor large enough imo, but still movement. (Those that voted for it won't talk about it.)

[Well b back 3,203]

Watching QT.

The man who just stated Brexit is a disaster was loudly applauded by what seemed all the audience.

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

37 minutes ago, Well b back said:

Watching QT.

The man who just stated Brexit is a disaster was loudly applauded by what seemed all the audience.

I think the fat lady is already singing farewell on Brexit - it's just yet to fully translate to the politians. The jury is back and delivered it's verdict.

[Herman 9,763]

7 hours ago, Well b back said:

Watching QT.

The man who just stated Brexit is a disaster was loudly applauded by what seemed all the audience.

The BBC keeps letting the country down by having a regular spot for these people. I'm not a BBC basher in general but their political coverage has been a problem for a long time. Constantly having these frauds on purely for ratings and not for truth telling.

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

4 hours ago, Herman said:

The BBC keeps letting the country down by having a regular spot for these people. I'm not a BBC basher in general but their political coverage has been a problem for a long time. Constantly having these frauds on purely for ratings and not for truth telling.

I didn't see the start of QT where they may of introduced the guests  - but I did I think see the parts you mention.

This may shock you but I agree with a lot of what Kate Andrews says from a logical perspective - she represents the view that for the UK to reinvent itself post Brexit (and Brexit for her was a prerequisite) we need a system much more like the American one - hire'em & fire'em and a much reduced 'welfare' state. Sadly that's not actually what our rather challenged mainly elderly Brexiteers want - they want the welfare state & NHS - their benefits including state pensions & care (which they largely never paid for but promised themselves cradle to grave).

In short she rightfully claims that in our straitened times a lot of this is becoming unaffordable - ergo we need to reform the pension/welfare system and indeed the NHS - quasi or semi privatise both - the ERG dream ticket. On the NHS perhaps a state budget for everybody (including drugs) - if you want to go beyond you can always insure or pay privately! Perhaps people will twig if you visit the US why their TV is so full of drug adverts - because you choose and pay for them yourself - ouch ($100s/month)!

Of course none of this was advertised pre the Brexit vote - but no you can't have European protection's and welfare systems and then compete globally with countries such as Asia (or US) that don't.

So although I disagree with Kate Andrews view of the the UK, unless we get ourselves back inside the European SM fence, I suspect that's where we are heading (logically)  - a place where most of protectionist Brexiteers can't compete and will 'sink'.

Tough love.

Edited November 18, 2022 by Yellow Fever

[PurpleCanary 5,558]

This may not be a first, but I notice that Rachel Reeves dared to mentio the B word in her reply to the chancellor yesterday:

"With a modern industrial strategy where government works hand in hand with business, properly fixing business rates so that small businesses and our high streets thrive again, fixing the holes in the government’s Brexit deal so that our businesses can trade on the global stage, and ensuring Britain is the best place in the world to start and grow a business."

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

1 hour ago, PurpleCanary said:

This may not be a first, but I notice that Rachel Reeves dared to mentio the B word in her reply to the chancellor yesterday:

"With a modern industrial strategy where government works hand in hand with business, properly fixing business rates so that small businesses and our high streets thrive again, fixing the holes in the government’s Brexit deal so that our businesses can trade on the global stage, and ensuring Britain is the best place in the world to start and grow a business."

Yes -  its creeping back in to the general discourse - I saw Bailey at the BoE and then the OBR mention it as a significant factor. The King has no clothes as was always plain to see. Tick tock.

Oddly - the way the public at large work is that they'll want something, anything (but not themselves) now to blame for the angst they are about to endure - and hey-presto we have a ready made (and fully deserving villain). Those who spent years blaming the EU for every error of their own are about to get the tables reversed and be fully blamed for the fiasco whether they deserve it or not. 'Brexiteer' will become synonymous with Luddite or Cretin.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-11-16/boe-latest-bailey-says-uk-s-shrinking-labor-market-a-shock

[PurpleCanary 5,558]

6 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

Yes -  its creeping back in to the general discourse - I saw Bailey at the BoE and then the OBR mention it as a significant factor. The King has no clothes as was always plain to see. Tick tock.

Oddly - the way the public at large work is that they'll want something, anything (but not themselves) now to blame for the angst they are about to endure - and hey-presto we have a ready made (and fully deserving villain). Those who spent years blaming the EU for every error of their own are about to get the tables reversed and be fully blamed for the fiasco whether they deserve it or not. 'Brexiteer' will become synonymous with Luddite or Cretin.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-11-16/boe-latest-bailey-says-uk-s-shrinking-labor-market-a-shock

Indeed, but Labour have been at pains not to mention Brexit at all. I am not sure by this line from Reeves about fixing the holes in the Tories’ Brexit deal may be new.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,548]

On 18/11/2022 at 16:56, Yellow Fever said:

Yes -  its creeping back in to the general discourse - I saw Bailey at the BoE and then the OBR mention it as a significant factor. The King has no clothes as was always plain to see. Tick tock.

Oddly - the way the public at large work is that they'll want something, anything (but not themselves) now to blame for the angst they are about to endure - and hey-presto we have a ready made (and fully deserving villain). Those who spent years blaming the EU for every error of their own are about to get the tables reversed and be fully blamed for the fiasco whether they deserve it or not. 'Brexiteer' will become synonymous with Luddite or Cretin.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-11-16/boe-latest-bailey-says-uk-s-shrinking-labor-market-a-shock

In a couple of years max, this government is gone. If you're talking about voters to blame, they're a nebulous bunch and you won't land any punches while still managing to alienate those that are offended by you blaming them. Those who blamed the EU won't get any more blame than those who blamed Daniel Farke for us not being better than we were before he was dispatched without our fortunes miraculously turning around afterwards.

And, once it's all done, you're still left with the fact that the only way back is to go through the whole process of aborting everything the country has been doing since Brexit, going through the whole process of rejoining the EU and accepting whatever concessions the EU might demand (if they were willing to risk accepting the UK back given how burnt they were when it left), with the likes of Farage in the wings ready for a comeback to terrorise the main parties with negative tactics at the ballot box the way they did in 2019.

Edited November 19, 2022 by littleyellowbirdie

[Surfer 1,547]

One would hope that the likes of Farage (Trump, Boris, Truss) have lost all credibility

Edited November 20, 2022 by Surfer

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

I see today the Times is reporting tentative discussions on a so called Swiss style alignment with the EU. 

In simple terms it's economic reality reasserting itself. Light at the end of the misguided  hard Brexit tunnel.

[Indy 3,300]

8 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

I see today the Times is reporting tentative discussions on a so called Swiss style alignment with the EU. 

In simple terms it's economic reality reasserting itself. Light at the end of the misguided  hard Brexit tunnel.

For three years we were told our financial status wouldn’t change we’d still be the biggest financial sector in the EU with the biggest stock exchange too, we’ll that’s fallen down too now! You can see why even this disjointed conservative government is starting to change its ideas!

The UK needs the EU more than the EU needs Britain….the best outcome is for a Swiss / Norwegian style agreement in place and quick.

[horsefly 4,300]

We shouldn't forget that overwhelmingly Tory MPs voted to remain in the referendum. Circumstances conspired to allow the ERG to hold the party to ransom, and the utterly shameless Johnson recognised Brexit as his best opportunity to fulfil his personal ambitions irrespective of the damage caused to the country. History will not judge them kindly and will show them up to be the unscrupulous bas*tards who wrecked the UK economy in pursuit of personal prejudice. The project now is to minimise the long-term effects of the colossal damage they have already caused. The ERG mob will remain as determined as ever to sabotage any improved relationship with the EU but the realistic among the Tories and all the members of opposition parties will recognise the need to salvage what we can by tying ourselves as closely as possible to the EU single market.

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

I think Peston nails it here - and Labour's reason for standing back and watching (as the polls swell for those that realize Brexit as enacted was profound mistake) 😉

https://t.co/nDY5Or2Id5

The explosion can be heard in deep space. So here's the point. The economic case for forging a better trading relationship with the EU is straightforward and obvious. And the politics is completely toxic.So here is the nightmare for the prime minister and chancellor. They'll deny from breakfast till bed-time that a Swiss-style relationship with the EU is not on the agenda, but the Brexiters in their own party will never believe them, partly because their permanent way-of-life is vigilance against betrayal and also because the background economics mean this time they are right to fear betrayal.

Or to put it another way, none of this will or can be sorted till after the next election, the more so since it is in the interest of the Labour Party to be utterly disengaged in it all, in the expectation that (yet again) Brexit will tear apart the government.

 

[Herman 9,763]

7 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

I think Peston nails it here - and Labour's reason for standing back and watching (as the polls swell for those that realize Brexit as enacted was profound mistake) 😉

https://t.co/nDY5Or2Id5

The explosion can be heard in deep space. So here's the point. The economic case for forging a better trading relationship with the EU is straightforward and obvious. And the politics is completely toxic.So here is the nightmare for the prime minister and chancellor. They'll deny from breakfast till bed-time that a Swiss-style relationship with the EU is not on the agenda, but the Brexiters in their own party will never believe them, partly because their permanent way-of-life is vigilance against betrayal and also because the background economics mean this time they are right to fear betrayal.

Or to put it another way, none of this will or can be sorted till after the next election, the more so since it is in the interest of the Labour Party to be utterly disengaged in it all, in the expectation that (yet again) Brexit will tear apart the government.

 

I think the majority of us can understand Labour's position on brexit at the moment. It's not a likeable position but it is the most sensible. They can't give the rabid brexiters and papers any ammo to reopen the old wounds, of which they are desperate for, so letting it play out this way is for the best. It'll be a slow and long route back to a semblance of sensible governance so any remain supporters getting upset at this need to calm down and think a bit.

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

Another one that got away - a fishermans tale.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/nov/21/200-jobs-at-risk-as-icelandic-fish-processing-firm-pulls-out-of-uk-brexit-coronavirus

[Yellow Fever 3,783]

3 hours ago, Herman said:

I think the majority of us can understand Labour's position on brexit at the moment. It's not a likeable position but it is the most sensible. They can't give the rabid brexiters and papers any ammo to reopen the old wounds, of which they are desperate for, so letting it play out this way is for the best. It'll be a slow and long route back to a semblance of sensible governance so any remain supporters getting upset at this need to calm down and think a bit.

Yes - Once this lot are history the country can start to recover its senses. 2 years.

Edited November 21, 2022 by Yellow Fever

[SwindonCanary 455]

We must wean economy off immigration, Labour leader to warn businesses

[Herman 9,763]

Slowly turning Swindo into a Labour voter.