The Positive Brexit Thread

[Van wink 2,994]

17 minutes ago, BigFish said:

It was Neil's extraordinary on and off camera outbursts during This Week against Owen Jones when the later attempted to hold Neil to account for the Spectator's editorial policy that was effectively the beginning of the end of Neil's BBC career.

Is that the Owen Jones whose sloping his shoulder and distancing himself from Corbynism.

[BigFish 1,986]

Yep, that will be the one.

However rather than sloping and distancing he is trying to make sense of the dichotomy that Labour had policies that were popular with the electorate, in fact Johnson has implemented many, but the Party itself was often repellent.

Still he has a book to sell and Neil has plenty of spare time to contemplate that

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

17 hours ago, BigFish said:

Effectively the Conservative Party ceased to exist as a conservative party in the traditional sense. May's problem was to be in charge when this became obvious. Facing down the ERG wouldn't have been anymore conservative than Johnson's purge of the Remainers. A conservative party would have rejected the anti-EU rhetoric back in 1992, the failure to do so brought us to the UK's current predicament.

BF, of course you're right about the direction of travel in the Tory party, but I am not sure May could not have faced down the ERG with the kind of deal I outlined if she had done it at the very beginning of her premiership.

Not least because it would have put Labour on the sport, since it was in effect their policy - to leave the single market but stay as close as possible economically to the EU through a customs' union.

[Jools 584]

Brexit Britain’s goods exports to the world soar, whilst those to the EU fall

Facts4EU.Org presents the last 10 years of the UK’s global success, and the EU’s failures

© Brexit Facts4EU.Org 2020

Last year the UK’s exports to the non-EU world rocketed by 14.1%

A unique Brexit Facts4EU.Org analysis of the last 10 years of UK trade figures

Brexit Facts4EU.Org Summary

UK's exports to the Rest of the World are far outpacing those to the EU

• In 2019 the UK’s goods exports to the non-EU world soared by 14.1%
• By sad contrast the UK’s goods exports to the EU27 fell by 1.2%

© Brexit Facts4EU.Org - click to enlarge

In the last 10 years, the EU has profited more and more from its "Treasure Island"

• 10 years of a success story for the UK, with the non-EU trade balance improving by 33%
• 10 years of a sad story for our EU membership, with the UK’s trade defIcit with the EU more than doubling
• Last year the EU27 ‘made a profit’ of over £95bn on its goods trade with the UK (exports minus imports)

© Brexit Facts4EU.Org - click to enlarge

How do goods exports affect our economy?

Brexit Facts4EU.Org recently published the data on how our goods exports affect the UK’s economy. The facts are that goods exports are a small part, because of the UK’s strong services sector which dominates by a factor of almost 4:1.

Nevertheless our goods exports to the rest of the world are becoming increasingly significant. Below we show just one part of our research, which demonstrates clearly how the rest of the (non-EU) world is of far more importance to the UK’s GDP, and how its influence is growing.

© Brexit Facts4EU.Org - click to enlarge

Trade deals

In 60 years the EU has never managed to negotiate a trade deal with the largest economy on the planet : the United States. It has no trade deal with the second-largest economy: China.

In that same 60 years the EU has only just managed to do a deal (still not ratified) with the world’s third-largest economy: Japan. The United Kingdom Government managed this is in just eight months since leaving the EU (in name only) on 01 February 2020.

Trade deals are not required to do trade, but they can help. The vast majority of the world’s economies and businesses trade with the EU without a trade deal. No Single Market, no Freedom of Movement, no massive annual payments, no Level Playing Field, no Northern Ireland Protocol, nothing. Just normal WTO rules.

The myth of the EU's Single Market and Customs Union

At present, UK companies can sell their goods to EU27 countries with no tariffs. The EU's Customs Union is supposedly a tariff-free zone for EU members. The Single Market supposedly imposes common standards. These are facts which were lauded by all those who campaigned for Remain in the EU Referendum of 2016 and ever since.

A simple question must therefore be asked. If the EU's Single Market and Customs Union are so essential to be a part of, why have the UK's sales outside the EU increased by 14.1%, when the UK's sales to the EU have fallen by 1.2%?

Observations

 

These are facts you will not see on the BBC, Sky News, or ITN

The above facts come from our analysis of the official figures from the Office for National Statistics. They are freely available to all news organisations, and yet they are not reported.

Sky and ITN are commercial organisations, although they are still supposedly regulated by OfCom. The BBC on the other hand is publicly funded by licence payers and by the Government. Their endemic bias is so palpable in their news and current affairs output that the case for defunding that part of the organisation at the very least is clear. If they cannot adhere to their Charter, they are not fit for purpose.

An independent United Kingdom freed from the EU can do even better

Whenever we publish the research we have conducted, presenting facts which reflect badly on the EU, we suffer attacks from those who have never accepted the democratic decision of the British people in 2016 to leave the European Union.

One line of attack from Remoaner-Rejoiners is “Well, this just shows how we can stay in the EU and still sell around the World.” People like this completely miss the point.

Have any of the Remoaner-Rejoiners traded internationally?

Some of our team have done this for years.

We suggest that Remoaner-Rejoiners should try selling into France and see how they get on. Members of our team with this direct experience would rather sell to a company in Phoenix Arizona - even with tariffs - than to a company in Marseilles in the South of France.

A sense of pride and confidence may be returning

We believe that what is now changing is a feeling amongst business people that the United Kingdom will soon, once again, be a free and independent trading nation, unshackled by EU regulation.

Since 01 January 1973 when the UK joined what was then the Common Market, the British people have been subdued, thinking that the UK was just one small player in a massive EU trade bloc. This was always wholly untrue.

The fact is that, thanks to the Customs Union the UK became a captive market for the other EU countries. This is why German businesses refer to us as “Treasure Island”. The UK is the country that benefited least from the Single Market, as the EU Commission itself admits and which we have previously reported.

Now we sense a feeling of national pride returning, as more and more businesses feel ready to embrace the global market, unencumbered by EU rules and regulations, and ready to present excellent British products and services to all our friends around the world. We also see these international friends increasingly keen to buy British.

When we are finally and fully free of the EU’s totalitarian shackles,
we can’t wait to see the United Kingdom’s full and mighty potential unleashed.

We were here before the EU Referendum. We would like to be here to see the job finished. Thank you.

 

[ Sources: Office for National Statistics | EU Commission / Eurostat ] Politicians and journalists can contact us for details, as ever.

Brexit Facts4EU.Org, Sat 19 Sept 2020

 

 

Pink'Un Remainiacs --- Please take your negativity to your 'Brexit Reprise' thread 👍

[sonyc 5,491]

1 hour ago, PurpleCanary said:

BF, of course you're right about the direction of travel in the Tory party, but I am not sure May could not have faced down the ERG with the kind of deal I outlined if she had done it at the very beginning of her premiership.

Not least because it would have put Labour on the sport, since it was in effect their policy - to leave the single market but stay as close as possible economically to the EU through a customs' union.

Agreed Purple. Yet I believe May would never have wanted to appear to accept Labour policy at the time (Corbyn was very clear...and he wasn't clear much of the time on the Brexit issue....that we should focus our efforts on a customs union). It was a reasonable policy but the Labour Party was of course pretty much toxic with a heavy influence from Momentum. Had a more reasonable Starmer been in charge then May perhaps might have been more inclusive in her dealings with the wider H of C (but that is an 'if' and a very qualified 'perhaps'). We had the wrong folk in power at the wrong time. And we still do.

[SwindonCanary 455]

From Jools "In that same 60 years the EU has only just managed to do a deal (still not ratified) with the world’s third-largest economy: Japan. The United Kingdom Government managed this is in just eight months since leaving the EU "

I think that says a lot about us and little about the EU 

[Herman 9,713]

It's not 100% truthful and that says a lot about you and Jools. 

[SwindonCanary 455]

Europe will be wrecked! Polish MEP blames "arrogant" Brussels boss von der Leyen and Brexit Juncker

Edited September 19, 2020 by SwindonCanary

[A Load of Squit 5,128]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/18/brexiters-ignorance-disaster-clueless-us-ireland-boris-johnson

There is so much this government doesn’t know.

Start with the unexpected ignorance, which is of the US and US politics.

Underneath is the deepest ignorance of all: the wilful refusal to see the conundrum that Brexit poses. Put simply, if the UK leaves the single market and the customs union, there has to be a meaningful border (and border checks) between the UK and the EU. That border either divides the island of Ireland, reinflaming the conflict healed by the Good Friday agreement; or it falls in the Irish Sea, separating Northern Ireland from Great Britain and thereby splitting the United Kingdom.

Edited September 19, 2020 by A Load of Squit

[SwindonCanary 455]

https://www.politeia.co.uk/its-the-eu-not-the-uk-which-is-arguably-breaching-its-legal-obligations-under-the-withdrawal-agreement-by-professor-david-collins/?fbclid=IwAR1bhRPVLdSXHptcIA8azL5GiW_oxuUsD6jDeKgzGbMAmmhB4-SCSvV6hVQ

[horsefly 4,287]

6 minutes ago, SwindonCanary said:

https://www.politeia.co.uk/its-the-eu-not-the-uk-which-is-arguably-breaching-its-legal-obligations-under-the-withdrawal-agreement-by-professor-david-collins/?fbclid=IwAR1bhRPVLdSXHptcIA8azL5GiW_oxuUsD6jDeKgzGbMAmmhB4-SCSvV6hVQ

ffs even the UK government admits it would be breaking international law

[SwindonCanary 455]

33 minutes ago, horsefly said:

ffs even the UK government admits it would be breaking international law

it's the EU which is arguably breaching it's legal obligations under the withdrawal agreement !

[Herman 9,713]

Which legal obligations?

[BigFish 1,986]

20 minutes ago, SwindonCanary said:

it's the EU which is arguably breaching it's legal obligations under the withdrawal agreement !

Even you highlight arguably which invalidates the entire sentence and article. The EU are literally not breaching the WA, while the UK admits it is.

That is why the government is struggling to find a single lawyer in Scotland willing to betray his professional ethics and take the role of Advocate General.

Face it Cummings thought he was being clever and ballsed this up.

[BigFish 1,986]

8 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

BF, of course you're right about the direction of travel in the Tory party, but I am not sure May could not have faced down the ERG with the kind of deal I outlined if she had done it at the very beginning of her premiership.

Not least because it would have put Labour on the sport, since it was in effect their policy - to leave the single market but stay as close as possible economically to the EU through a customs' union.

May didn't have the numbers at the start of her Premiership, that was the thinking behind the 2017 GE. A conservative government would have supported the deal you outlined but conservatism was already a minority view.

[Herman 9,713]

 

[SwindonCanary 455]

Guess who's the favourite to be chief of the WTO, none other than Liam Fox !

[BigFish 1,986]

32 minutes ago, SwindonCanary said:

Guess who's the favourite to be chief of the WTO, none other than Liam Fox !

Except he isn't, is he? Has between zero and **** all chance.

You need diplomacy and international support to win a position like that and Brexit Britain has neither.

Ngozi Okonjo-Iweala of Nigeria and Amina Mohamed of Kenya are the frontrunners

[horsefly 4,287]

12 hours ago, SwindonCanary said:

it's the EU which is arguably breaching it's legal obligations under the withdrawal agreement !

So the the UK would definitely breach international law but "arguably" the EU already are. Well instead of cutting and pasting another piece of Brexiteer guff why not present that argument here and defend it? The chances of you doing that are of course nil. More rant and no reason.  Laughably incompetent guff from those for whom the reality of the disastrous nature of the UK's position is just too horrific to admit. 

[SwindonCanary 455]

Legal arguments showing how the EU has broken its own treaty with the UK

• Essential condition of participating in Withdrawal Agreement (WA) : to secure a free trade agreement (FTA)
• The EU has been acting in breach of a material term of the WA by denying the UK an FTA
• The EU has attempted to impose wholly unreasonable restrictions on the UK which no other country would accept
• The treaty was therefore entered into by the UK on a false premise from the EU
• The EU has breached its legal obligation to act in good faith
• The WA breaks the terms of the Good Friday Agreement
• The WA is in breach of the ECHR principle of the right to vote
• The WA is in breach of the UN Charter's principle of “self-determination”, its most important tenet
• The UK Government must now pass an Act of Parliament superseding and revoking the WA

[A Load of Squit 5,128]

 

신나는이밤 SINBAM 1  COM 신밤 】대전건마'(강남OP수원OP일산OP대전OP동탄OP분당OP'강남건마 대구오피 

[ Sources: Office for National Statistics | EU Commission / Eurostat ] Politicians and journalists can contact us for details, as ever.

Brexit Facts4EU.Org, Sat 19 Sept 2020

[horsefly 4,287]

21 minutes ago, SwindonCanary said:

Legal arguments showing how the EU has broken its own treaty with the UK

• Essential condition of participating in Withdrawal Agreement (WA) : to secure a free trade agreement (FTA)
• The EU has been acting in breach of a material term of the WA by denying the UK an FTA
• The EU has attempted to impose wholly unreasonable restrictions on the UK which no other country would accept
• The treaty was therefore entered into by the UK on a false premise from the EU
• The EU has breached its legal obligation to act in good faith
• The WA breaks the terms of the Good Friday Agreement
• The WA is in breach of the ECHR principle of the right to vote
• The WA is in breach of the UN Charter's principle of “self-determination”, its most important tenet
• The UK Government must now pass an Act of Parliament superseding and revoking the WA

Christ almighty! you just don't grasp what the idea of providing an argument means do you. This is a list of a ASSERTIONS not arguments. You need to provide evidence and argument to make good those assertions. When you do that I (and many others no doubt) will happily demonstrate the absurdity of the assertions put forward by these numbskulls 

[SwindonCanary 455]

Can you come up with an argument as to why we should re-join the EU ? 

[horsefly 4,287]

1 hour ago, SwindonCanary said:

Can you come up with an argument as to why we should re-join the EU ? 

First, I note you aren't prepared to defend those assertions you cut and paste. Can't say I blame you because they are so obviously crass (for example the assertion that, "The EU has been acting in breach of a material term of the WA by denying the UK an FTA" is so mind-numbingly stupid surely even you can see it. Do tell me what part of the WA obliges the EU to give the UK an FTA. And if it did there would be no need for these sodding talks to happen in the first place. You have to be amazingly thick not to see how ludicrous this claim is. It amounts to saying that the EU have to give us an FTA on our terms without question. Jesus!).

Second, like every anti-Brexiteer that I've seen on this site so far, I've accepted that Brexit has happened and that we can't simply re-join the EU. You numbskulls have ruined that possibility. Thus we remoaners (as you like to call us) consider it our patriotic duty to argue for the best deal possible to avoid the the immense economic and political damage that a hard-line no deal Brexit would visit upon our nation. But if you want a reason for why we should have remained, one is the 5% drop in GDP that is the kindest forecast for what Brexit will cost the UK (find me a respected economist who says otherwise). Even the chief Brexit tw*t Jacob Rees-Bogg  admitted it would take over a decade to recover the level of economy close to what it would have been had we not left. But then dear old Jacob made sure he moved his head offices to Dublin before Brexit happened (ditto Dyson to Singapore et al). His millions are nicely secure within the single market, how about yours? 

I now look forward to your strong defence of the cut and paste assertions you posted.

[SwindonCanary 455]

 drop in GDP don't forget the virus !

[horsefly 4,287]

2 minutes ago, SwindonCanary said:

 drop in GDP don't forget the virus !

Keep up. The 5% prediction was well before the virus. I suspect it's going to be a whole lot worse now. Now get to work on defending those assertions. Looking forward to seeing your incisive arguments

[SHRIMPER 328]

1 hour ago, horsefly said:

 is so mind-numbingly stupid surely even you can see it.

No he cannot mate. SWINDO is so cringingly stupid it is painful. I think a frontal lobotomy could help, but I doubt it.

 

 

[SwindonCanary 455]

1 hour ago, horsefly said:

Keep up. The 5% prediction was well before the virus. I suspect it's going to be a whole lot worse now. Now get to work on defending those assertions. Looking forward to seeing your incisive arguments

That what I was pointing out, it will be a lot worse now, due to the virus 5% was a figure they came up with but after we've established our self's it will go up

. 

Edited September 20, 2020 by SwindonCanary

[BigFish 1,986]

3 hours ago, SwindonCanary said:

Legal arguments showing how the EU has broken its own treaty with the UK

• Essential condition of participating in Withdrawal Agreement (WA) : to secure a free trade agreement (FTA) - Untrue, the condition was to enter into talks on a FTA. The EU is, and continues to do this. On the other hand the UK has failed to produce the fishing, state aid and level playing field protocols that they wish for.
• The EU has been acting in breach of a material term of the WA by denying the UK an FTA - Untrue, see above
• The EU has attempted to impose wholly unreasonable restrictions on the UK which no other country would accept - Untrue, the EU is negotiating protections for the single market to manage risks from the proxity and scale of UK trade
• The treaty was therefore entered into by the UK on a false premise from the EU - so no false premise to the oven ready deal that the UK entered into willingly
• The EU has breached its legal obligation to act in good faith - See above, no foundation for this
• The WA breaks the terms of the Good Friday Agreement - the UK willing signed this oven ready deal
• The WA is in breach of the ECHR principle of the right to vote - UK law is that treaties are Royal perogatives, this this doesn't apply
• The WA is in breach of the UN Charter's principle of “self-determination”, its most important tenet - UK law is that treaties are Royal perogatives, this this doesn't apply
• The UK Government must now pass an Act of Parliament superseding and revoking the WA - confusing this one. Does the moron who wrote it refer to the WA Act or WA treaty because revoking the Act doesn't revoke the treaty and revoking the treaty breaks international law.

So this is not really a legal argument, or at least one that wouldn't get laughed out of court. Perhaps this is why the gov hasn't found a single Scottish lawyer willing to take the role of Advocate General and make it.

[horsefly 4,287]

44 minutes ago, SwindonCanary said:

That what I was pointing out, it will be a lot worse now, due to the virus 5% was a figure they came up with but after we've established our self's it will go up

. 

still really looking forward to the moment when you grace us with what I'm sure will be some scintillating argument and evidence