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BobLoz3

Is it possible to love Farke any more than we do??

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Yes.. according to the front page article!

Talking of how Norwich is his home "and will always be"

Gone a bit weak at the knees... 😍

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If he secures promotion I am sure we will all love him just that little bit more...

and the Farke Rap will need updating once again.

Edited by Chip20
I'm a klutz.
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Seems a nice chap and his manner appears to be quite humble. Just the way he stayed out of the Ipswich fracas illustrates his coolness and thoughtfulness.

I didn't want him here last year. Thought the football was dire. And to be honest anyone who says it wasn't is being a tad over romantic about what has happened this season. But I was wrong and never been more happier to be so.

But lets not forget, there is a backroom team and I also have to applaud Webber's recruitment which has dovetailed nicely with our tactics and produced some football we haven't really seen since the Walker days.

 

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The football last season was a few patches of scintillating play with large swathes of the tedious. Teams would ultimately find us out and win. However, it was clear there was a plan, but a difficult one to swallow.

I even heard Delia out chants (albeit from only one or two) and anti DF chants at some matches, which was unfair in my opinion.  

Daniel Farke has turned out to be everything we hoped, and much, much more. His style, vision and execution is putting City back on the footballing map again, people refer to us in glowing terms. We have always had a good reputation of a playing side and this will enhance it to a different dimension if it continues.

I am 'loving what he is doing' and hope to see the same next season, in another division. 

OTBC

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Yes, I mean, at times last year I wondered about what the heck was going on with our football! But I always thought that Farke was such an affable and lovable character that I didn't want him out, nor did I boo.

I have a couple of people who sit in front of me, some of whom booed the hell out of Farke and the team after the SECOND game of this season. I couldn't quite believe what I was hearing and it caused a big argument between me and this one guy, who actually attempted to be aggressive towards me and another guy I always chat to when moving down towards the front of the lower Barclay. It was all a bit ridiculous. That guy still comes to games, though, but I don't think I've ever heard him sing Farke's name.

Point is... There are always going to be people who don't like what they're seeing (at any football club) but what Farke and Webber have achieved, allied with our players performing so well, is nothing short of spectacular thus far. Long may it continue!

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2 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

I didn't want him here last year. Thought the football was dire. And to be honest anyone who says it wasn't is being a tad over romantic about what has happened this season. But I was wrong and never been more happier to be so.

 

 

What about those of us who didn't think it was dire last season and said so at the time? Particularly the second half.

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I liked him as a person and got what the club were trying to do with the new structure. However I didn't think he was the right person to lead the team at pretty much any point last season. We seemed afraid to break at pace or press in higher areas. The football was uninspiring and lacked intent. We relied on having digs from distance and individual brilliance. 

This season he has taken the passing foundation he built and really added to it and made it great to watch. There is certainly a little less caution and we have a plan in the final third. Players who didn't look like they would fit last season do now and he has allowed some of the existing young players at the club to flourish. If he can top it with promotion it will be quite a remarkable achievement.

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5 minutes ago, hogesar said:

What about those of us who didn't think it was dire last season and said so at the time? Particularly the second half.

I have always said stick with it Hogesar, I had a conversation with a friend  only yesterday. He gave up his season ticket end of last season, I was surprised and said at the time that was hasty, and he has since grudgingly agreed. 

I saw enough to keep faith and even in the early games this season, put it down to bad luck as much as anything. Still pleasantly surprised we are top, but as games  go by I see why. 

Farke is good, damn good. 

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What about those of us who didn't think it was dire last season and said so at the time? Particularly the second half.

As I said, I believe you were being over romantic in what you thought or saw. If you honestly believe that what you saw last season was a curtain raiser for this then I applaud you. But I think you were in the minority. I honestly thought we would see out his contract and find someone else. I believed Webber would stay but the coaching staff would be gone.

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13 minutes ago, hogesar said:
2 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

I didn't want him here last year. Thought the football was dire. And to be honest anyone who says it wasn't is being a tad over romantic about what has happened this season. But I was wrong and never been more happier to be so.

What about those of us who didn't think it was dire last season and said so at the time? Particularly the second half. 

From what I saw last season, we had definite promise of good things to come, especially as the season progressed.

 

1 minute ago, Grant Holts Moustache said:

 Players who didn't look like they would fit last season do now

Don't you mean that the ones that didn't fit in have left?

If you mean Stiepermann, he was actually pretty good in the positions he was asked to play in.

Imo the biggest problem last season was Murphy and Oliveira - their inability to adapt to what was being asked of them.

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From what I saw last season, we had definite promise of good things to come, especially as the season progressed.

To be honest with you LDC, you always have a positive attitude and I have applauded that before when others have attacked you. But you also have to accept that there is nothing disloyal in being negative or fed up at times. And last season didn't seem any better than under AN to me.

So in a way I am even more delighted than you to see the magnificent stuff we have been playing lately because I didn't see it coming.

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We probably think the same as Farke as Huddersfield fans thought of Wagner about 2 seasons ago. Things change in football, nothing lasts forever. Enjoy it while we can.

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Yes... thanks Captain Obvious! 😂😉

I know things change. If we make it to the promised land it will be a huge challenge. I'm just saying the same as you really. Enjoy the here and now. I like what Farke is saying about how he feels and, why not, Norwich/Norfolk can be his home even if he does get another job in England. Works for Worthington, who I believe still lives round these parts and has done ever since he managed us!

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15 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

We probably think the same as Farke as Huddersfield fans thought of Wagner about 2 seasons ago. Things change in football, nothing lasts forever. Enjoy it while we can.

Things changed for Huddersfield when Webber left. If he'd stayed how many of Leitner, Trybull , Stieperman, Pukki and Buendia might they have signed by now? 

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Farke and Webber said it would take 4 transfer windows to get the team sorted - after 3 they had the league top of the table. 

Was never going to be instant success and I doubt anyone really thought it would be this good so quickly (I suspect Webber and Farke are also surprised just how well it has gone). 

Farke is very good at the media side of things and knows what to say and when, which really helps build and affinity to the fans. 

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Yep... All things we're aware of!

It's a nice thing to say and it makes me want to give the man a big hug. Job done!

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Let's think back to last season. There was definite promise from Christmas onwards. Who remembers the Bolton game where we drew 0-0. Some of the football that day was scintillating however we couldn't turn it into goals. Many people had similar views to this last season:-

http://norwichcity.myfootballwriter.com/2018/04/03/the-board-made-a-risky-call-is-that-not-better-than-sticking-with-same-old-and-not-even-trying-a-different-route/

If you imagine this season without Pukki and Rhodes the results may be similar  It would have been unrealistic to expect the transfers and style of play to be completed in the first season. I still think it miraculous that we've achieved what we have in the second season.

Results have a huge bearing on what us football fans find enjoyable. And we didn't get the results last season even though the transition became obvious from January. If we had this points total and had made it up by 1-0 wins and 0-0 draws most of us would be happy. Maybe not quite as happy without the scintillating football but happy all the same 

However when it got ridiculous was OTT whingeing and whining at the start of this season when we'd already added the goals. Those who now claim it was like we flicked a switch and it all came right after Ipswich away are nuts! That's akin to believing you have fairies riding unicorns at the bottom of the garden.

After all what really was the difference between WBA at home and Derby at home?

Thankfully we are all as one now. But for how long...

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1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

From what I saw last season, we had definite promise of good things to come, especially as the season progressed.

 

Don't you mean that the ones that didn't fit in have left?

If you mean Stiepermann, he was actually pretty good in the positions he was asked to play in.

Imo the biggest problem last season was Murphy and Oliveira - their inability to adapt to what was being asked of them.

Yes Stieperman was one of them, he did OK but I can't imagine even you saw him as anything more than a utility player. 

I will also add Vrancic, you could see last season he was a good passer who worked hard but often he left gaps in the middle and arrived a bit too late when tracking players. 

Srbeny looked an absolute shocker last season too. He hasn't had to be called on often this season but has done a job. 

Don't know what you mean about Murphy. He does what Hernandez does now but I would say he was more of a consistent goal threat with it. Bet he would have loved to have had the opportunity to supply Pukki and Rhodes last year too. Game after game he flashed balls across the 6 yard box but we had no one making a run and gambling on the ball coming in. A winger looks a lot better when they have a couple of poachers to supply. 

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17 minutes ago, Grant Holts Moustache said:

Yes Stieperman was one of them, he did OK but I can't imagine even you saw him as anything more than a utility player. 

I will also add Vrancic, you could see last season he was a good passer who worked hard but often he left gaps in the middle and arrived a bit too late when tracking players. 

Srbeny looked an absolute shocker last season too. He hasn't had to be called on often this season but has done a job. 

Don't know what you mean about Murphy. He does what Hernandez does now but I would say he was more of a consistent goal threat with it. Bet he would have loved to have had the opportunity to supply Pukki and Rhodes last year too. Game after game he flashed balls across the 6 yard box but we had no one making a run and gambling on the ball coming in. A winger looks a lot better when they have a couple of poachers to supply. 

Hernandez is so much better than Murphy.

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I'll stand by my opinion that last season was one of the most tedious I've ever experienced. If you got joy out of watching endless hours of a central midfielder standing on the ball, looking around and then passing it backwards then good for you I guess. I know people say we started to look better in the later stages but all I saw was a team who either couldn't score or couldn't defend and couldn't find the balance needed.

I was more convinced when we were losing games this early this season that things were going in the right direction- you could see the attacking play had more cohesion and results were mainly being undone by silly defensive errors.

Through all that though you'd never doubt he seemed like a strong, intelligent and dedicated individual.

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After all what really was the difference between WBA at home and Derby at home?

Good point Double N. And the both matches could have been so different, as could so much more, if we had put the penalty away or the ref not panicked over the floodlight failure. So much has hinged for us on individual mistakes by either players or officials.

And not just this season either.

But as you say the most important thing is that we have all been brought together, apart from the obvious twerps who can't wait for us to lose or fail so they can blame everyone from Delia's Mum to LDC, by some of the best football outside of all but the best teams in the Prem. Yes we are playing poorer opposition but the way we are doing it is a bit special.

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Parma Ham's gone mouldy

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A repeated criticism of Farke on this forum has been that the playing system he is trying to implement - and by extension the foundations of the new club-wide philosophy incorporated by Webber et al for youth to 1st Team - is too complicated, requires too much tactical flexibility, is in essence too foreign for our limited players, Country, English Championship culture.

 

 

 

 

Much of the recent focus has been in finances, where - it must be said - positivity and silver linings are very hard to come by. This Masterclass therefore looks over the horizon to what could the promised land of the vision looks like and hands over to Juanma Lillo - an innovator and disciple of Positional Play, which may be a template future vision - to offer a counter view to the thoughts that ‘it won’t work here, with our league’

 

 

 

 

“Those that have succeeded in playing this way have also succeeded in making most people in football fall into the easy trap of believing that to succeed with the positional system it’s vital to possess only “great” footballers. The contrary seems true to me. People are confusing the possible with the probable...

 

 

...The Coach can train with the probable in mind and try to increase his team’s probabilities or winning. But the possible? That a donkey might fly is possible but very improbable.And there are a thousand other examples of things that are possible, it very improbable.”

 

 

 

 

What Positional Play is trying to achieve is to significantly increase the likelihood of winning specifically via the style of play (alone).

 

 

“That is demonstrably true, it not only with exceptional football teams. It also applies to much more modest sides...because it has been associated with Cruff’s Ajax or Pep’s Barca, people conclude that to operate it you require exceptional players. ..in actual fact other playing models do absolutely require great players (but not Positional Play).

 

 

For example winning by playing two-touch football, where a central defender fires the ball three quarters of the pitch to a centre forward, is very unlikely to succeed. Winning when just a couple of players take a touch or two each is far less likely than Positional Play to be successful. 

 

 

“All this confusion means that instead of people preaching that with Positional Play you increase the probability of winning, the refrain has become that you shouldn’t bother unless you possess truly great fottballers. It it’s just the contrary. The concept is that trying to win with only two or three players intervening in each attack, each using just two touches of the ball, it’s a miracle if you succeed. If people tell me there have therefore been many miracles, I’ll tell them yeah, it’s teams have pinned their hopes on this miracle, then they may achieve it (though either way it is random luck).

 

 

‘Anyone who claims that Positional Play only works if played by truly great footballers is really only interested in avoiding the difficulty of implementing this complex philosophy’ - Juanma Lillo

 

 

 

 

Parma

 

 

 

snake-eyes

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Thanks Parma,

 

 

 

 

interesting read. I disagree, however, with the idea that any player can play the positional play philosophy, well.

 

 

 

 

When Hughton was manager he was trying to implement a structured and some suggested, mature philosophy to the team. This involved the team moving up as one unit, maintaining possession and occupying the field of play. However, this philosophy, in my opinion, could not be implemented with the players at his disposal. Certain players fit philosophies better than others.

 

 

 

 

I would say the same is happening with Farke now.

 

 

 

 

However, what I am yet to hear/see is what the actual philosophy and, as such vision, that Farke has for the team.

 

 

 

 

Is it a true Positional Play philosophy based on ball retention only, or does he see a progression to faster movement and less sluggish attacking intent?

 

 

 

 

Your thoughts would be welcome.

 

 

 

 

Snake
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Parma Ham's gone mouldy

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Snake,

 

 

 

 

Pep Guardiola had a pretty pithy response when asked the same question, he commented that to define Positional Play as possession for possession’s sake as ‘Total ****’. It is designed to increase the chances of winning, nothing more, nothing less.

 

 

 

 

As Donald Trump knows well however, if you repeat a statement often enough, on a wide enough platform, mere repetition is often to define a new ‘truth’. Typically such a statement dismisses the different, hard to implement or intellectually challenging, precisely because it cannot be reduced to black-white simplicities which many rely on.

 

 

 

 

In the case of Positional Play the concept is not so complicated, nor does it rely on a miraculous Total Football player by technically-gifted, intellectual giants. Rather it owes much to the tactical concepts quite common to handball, basketball and Chess; namely that of structural solidity allowing penetration, an ongoing interconnection between all players founded on overloading the opposition in certain areas to create space elsewhere, that is then exploited to score a goal. 

 

 

 

 

On occasions it can be characterised as ‘constructive bunching’, the opposite of what many were taught at school, and requires the vast majority of the effort, thought and running to be implemented by those without the ball. This requires players to concentrate far less on themselves, the ball and their supposed position, rather to put themselves into the mind of the player and what he wants or needs. The aim is to move the opposition, rather than the ball per se. You are looking to construct movements as a units that create 2v1 opportunities in your favour in key areas of the pitch.

 

 

 

 

In this way tactical formations, whilst nominally useful to demonstrate certain possible scenarios on the pitch that we are trying to create, are largely a redundant paper exercise. Fluidity of thought and movement are far more important. Some key positions and structures will always remain key, though they will almost certainly not be covered by the same player in all scenarios. 442 can become 235 or return to a 343 in the space of a single attack. Players need to think beyond meaningless formations and focus on the requirements of the space, ball, teammates and opposition. It has been called ‘the death of the formation’ and can learned just as easily as anything else by those open-minded enough.

 

 

 

 

Parma 
 


 

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Broken or just accidental copy and paste that thr forum has dealt with nicely? 

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I think he's fantastic, but equally, his backroom staff are fantastic. He's earned our trust because of his honesty and integrity and I really hope he's given extended time to deal with any future blips, should they occur. I remember how much Alex Neil and Mike Walker were loved, and then how much things turned sour very quickly for them both. Mike left and then came back but the Alex Neil situation was quite awful at the end. Maybe those two examples aren't the best, I mean, Mike Walker did leave us for a "bigger club" so perhaps that was an issue and Alex was under insane amounts of pressure because of the squad he had.

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