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JB

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Mmm yeah wonder what Hanley is doing wrong not to be first choice..... what happened last time he started a game?

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Maybe the problem isn't the back two (I'm sure Zimmermann and Klose are the preferred pair) maybe it's the defensive pair in front of them... remember we are missing both one of our first choice center backs and both our first choice defensive midfielders. All of that should be rectified over the next few weeks, so keep the faith, we'll be fine. 

 

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After 6 games, we were 17th in the league, with 5 points and a goal difference of -3. Hanley started all six games, Pinto featured in 3. Neither has featured since, in which time we have risen to 2nd in the league, with 54 points and a goal difference of +16. Please can someone explain to me the pressing reasons for selecting either of them ahead of the players who are currently getting the nod.

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Not factually true Westcoast, that aside, there were 9 other players plus, who featured in those games too.

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8 minutes ago, Ray said:

Not factually true Westcoast

Happy for you to spell out the corrections Ray. Do they affect my point?

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6 minutes ago, westcoastcanary said:

Happy for you to spell out the corrections Ray. Do they affect my point?

Happy for you to admit you were factually wrong and imo yes they do. Had it been Klose who was injured early doors would the upturn have been any different, I suspect not. There have been many injuries, etc. So why single out these guys, Hanley in particular?

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13 minutes ago, splendidrush said:

.....don't start. 

:classic_biggrin:  I'll do it just for you SR. But I would like to know what was factually wrong in my post. 

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Westcoast, Hanley has featured since then, OK he wasn't on the pitch for long, but did feature.

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1 hour ago, westcoastcanary said:

After 6 games, we were 17th in the league, with 5 points and a goal difference of -3. Hanley started all six games, Pinto featured in 3. Neither has featured since, in which time we have risen to 2nd in the league, with 54 points and a goal difference of +16. Please can someone explain to me the pressing reasons for selecting either of them ahead of the players who are currently getting the nod.

I think I can help here.....Hanley is a better defender than Godfrey....and would also help the rest of the back 4 and we would ultimately concede less goals and not have to keep needing to score 3 or 4 goals in home matches in order to win them

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5 minutes ago, Ray said:

Westcoast, Hanley has featured since then, OK he wasn't on the pitch for long, but did feature.

Ray, I think it's clear that Farke would prefer Klose and Zimmerman if they are both fit, Godfrey has come in as cover and has held his own. Hanley got sent off after coming back from injury, an injury that most thought would be a disaster for us. As it turned out, it was the start of our run up the table. It's clear that a player who was  seen as a shoe in at the start is now down the pecking order.  Pinto the same. 

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13 minutes ago, Ray said:

Westcoast, Hanley has featured since then, OK he wasn't on the pitch for long, but did feature.

Ray, I think it's clear that Farke would prefer Klose and Zimmerman if they are both fit, Godfrey has come in as cover and has held his own. Hanley got sent off after coming back from injury, an injury that most thought would be a disaster for us. As it turned out, it was the start of our run up the table. It's clear that a player who was  seen as a shoe in at the start is now down the pecking order.  Pinto the same. 

Edited by splendidrush
Double

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GJL,

MY opioid the same as yours, inasmuch Hanley and Klose would be a better pairing defensively, may be not so much flair but haven't we got enough of that anyway. 

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Just now, Ray said:

GJL,

MY opioid the same as yours, inasmuch Hanley and Klose would be a better pairing defensively, may be not so much flair but haven't we got enough of that anyway. 

Can't resist this! "Opioid' might be thought peculiarly apt in the context! :classic_biggrin: Hope we haven't too much of it .............

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We are holding our own still, despite the attrition to our defence and the astonishing age of the replacements and even starters. However, I agree old heads are needed when the run in starts and Hanley in my opinion would be a good man in there.

Klose is class and we should get him back in ASAP, but CZ has been generally immense for us this season.

Who'd be a manager eh?

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Fair point WC, let's hope we don't need too much of it, or any at all!!

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2 minutes ago, Ray said:

Fair point WC, let's hope we don't need too much of it, or any at all!!

👍 Maybe taking the idea of alternative medicine too far? 😋 (PS I'm with you re. Alt. Med. by the way -- but don't let's start that one again).

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11 hours ago, KiwiScot said:

Yes I am wondering myself what Hanley and even Pinto are doing wrong to go get into the first team. You have 8 players in that area(Not counting Stiepermann) but only 5 of them ever get gametime. If these 3 are not good enough then they need moved on to make way for someone to give some competition to the 5.

Are you seriously suggesting Pinto should play instead of Aarons!

Before Boxing Day we were second and looking to play Forrest, Derby, West Bom, Sheffield U and Leeds in the next seven games. All while carrying some crucial injuries. We are only one game away from finishing that run of very tough fixtures with three top players on the verge of coming back. We are still second!

We have every chance.

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Passlack was sub yesterday and would be

11 hours ago, splendidrush said:

Pinto is not getting a game anytime soon, unless Max is injured. Hanley will be further away once Klose is fit.

Passlack would be the obvious cover for right back. Can't see Pinto playing in this team again. I like him, but he hasn't cut the mustard under Farke. 

As for Hanley, he will have to wait his chance. Zimm generally does great and Godfrey is excellent. Yes there is the odd mistake, maybe lack of experience a factor, but while we are holding our own in automatic promotion places, why would we change anything much?

Tettey might help the defence a bit more when he is back, but if we continue to get results without him, even he will find it hard to get back in the team. 

Edited by lake district canary

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5 hours ago, Hairy Canary said:

Are you seriously suggesting Pinto should play instead of Aarons!

Before Boxing Day we were second and looking to play Forrest, Derby, West Bom, Sheffield U and Leeds in the next seven games. All while carrying some crucial injuries. We are only one game away from finishing that run of very tough fixtures with three top players on the verge of coming back. We are still second!

We have every chance.

No just mentioning who in the defense is not getting game time and I mainly thinking about Hanley. Thinking about it I doubt Pinto could fill in for centre back.

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I don’t think the amount of goals conceded is primarily caused by the personnel, but it is more a result of the system Norwich play. 

The way Aarons and Lewis push forward means the 2 centrebacks, whoever they are, are basically doing the job of a back 3. Which will always result in Norwich conceding goals. 

For the record, Farke has said that Zimmermann has been the best defender so far this season. Godfrey is in ahead of Hanley as at least one defender who is comfortable on the ball is required for the passing game to work.  Zimmermann is okay with the ball, but Klose and Godfrey are the best defenders Norwich have in that regard - Hanley is the weakest. A Hanley/Zimmermann partnership would probably require a change in tactics. 

Tettey not being around has knock on effects as well of course. Trybull doesn’t have the same defensive instincts and doesn’t get back to support the centrebacks as much as Tettey (although he did a good job of it on Saturday). 

Leitner certainly covers more ground than Vrancic, but Vrancic makes more interceptions and tackles than Leitner. Vrancic has been Norwich’s best player since Leitner’s injury and I don’t think it is a given Mo will immediately come back into the team when fit. Getting both those players into the team in a system that fits them could be Farke’s big challenge for the remainder of the season. It may be going to a back three solves both issues with Norwich being able to get Hanley onto the pitch and Leitner and Vrancic in front of them. Who drops out is the question though. 

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I don’t particularly rate Hanley defensively if I’m entirely honest. I’ve not seen anything at any point in his time here (or really before his time here either) which suggests he alone would be the difference between us “shipping goals at home” and us not shipping goals at home.

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