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Canary Poirot

We are the new Nottingham Forest

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And why? Because we have all of the same problems they had. Overpaid players who don''t take any pride in their profession.

Our players know that they won''t get it this good anywhere else. We''re one of the bigger clubs in the Championship, and thus can afford to pay them good money, money they wouldn''t get elsewhere. So how do you motivate them? Difficult. There have been tomes and tomes written about how you motivate people to work harder. As it appears it''s almost impossible to sack professional footballers, we''re stuck with them until they''re out of contract or we pay them off, which reduces our options for replacements. Because, lets face it, most of our players carry no value in the transfer market.

Graham Taylor when he quit Watford the second time, said there was a huge problem motivating players in the Championship who knew they weren''t good enough to play in the Premiership. As they''ve got it as good as they''ll ever have it.

Unless the players perform, we will be in League 1 next season. We could sack Worthington, and try someone else, but if the players don''t perform, we''ve had it. Forest eventually sacked Paul Hart, but Gary Megson couldn''t turn them around. And even this season he is having trouble motivating them, and no one can argue that Megson isn''t a disciplinarian. So unless the players start performing, we''re up the creek.  

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Itend to agree with you Poirot ,  but not with the analogy  to Forest !  their problems started when their board dissolved  , to be replaced by a consortium  of money men ...   who wheeled and dealed  while  the club started to go downhill  , managers [ warning one ! ] came and went , then along came Platt the prat ! no management  experience , bought all his  dud Italian cronies to the club ...  funds dried up , the club nosedived   into relegation after relegation     is it any wonder that the board  hesitate to  begin the management merrygo round ?    

As you say ,  at the end of the day , it IS the players who are letting us down  !   if Nigel goes , those players will STILL be here !!   what will the new manager do ? bullwhip `em ?? 

Re` Safri , I STILL say  he shouldn`t have   gone to play  that international !   he WAS injured , and he knew it !   by doing so  he made that injury worse ,  and now  we are reaping  the wirlwind ....

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IMO the club and everyone in it are too comfortable. We are losing every match just like the one before, and not really trying to get anything from the games. Yet nobody seems to be doing anything about it!

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Norwich have several players who have proved they can perform in the premiership what Norwich are suffering from in my view , is what France suffered from in the 2002 world cup. Norwich are not prepared to do the dirty work , the honest hard working stuff , they are not prepared to grind out results. I think there are too many players at Norwich who feel they should be in the premiership now and still can''t understand how we threw it away at Craven Cottage, take for example the match against Sheffield Wendsday , Norwich performed well in the first half and then were very aware of the pressure on them in the second and crumbled. I think there should have been a feeling amongst the team at that point that a draw would be better rather than a defeat . Too many times this season Norwich have been too arrogant to settle or fight for a draw when it has been needed, maybe Nigel Worthington should cast his mind back to when he took charge and it was simply a case of making sure we got something from the game as opposed to trying to kick start a championship winning campaign .

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some good points poirot,although i would say some of the current squad are definately better than championship standard even though you wouldnt notice that at the moment.ther is definately a lack of motivation within the team at the moment,what has caused this i dont know.obviously the terrible start hasnt helped,but,im sure most would agree we just havnt got it going all season,the "hunger" simply hasnt been there.we seem unable to get out of the losing mentality.the players seem down and ill at ease on the pitch.obviously,confidence ,or lack of it are contributing to our downfall ,unfortunately,this will only improve as the results do.somehow things have to change and worthy and all the coaching team must work to re-motivate the team in some way or we will slip away to div1 to face another decade in the wilderness.

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to right the players are just going through the motions  i think its time the players got a bit of stick as giving 100 percent support is not having any impact on them

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Definitly true. Forest had good players when they went down, similar to us now. Anyone who doesn''t think we can be relegated is in for a big shock

Its a lack of tactical awareness IMO.

Why don''t we choose and put out our best 11, and work a formation around them.

Today we had JJ and Brennan in the middle of the park.

Why don''t we go away from 4-4-2?? We''ve tried every combination of players, so why not change formation??

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To a degree it is the players who do or do not perform, but they are merely the tools.   The manager should be able to get them to perform week in, week out without it coming to the stage it has now.  The writing was on the wall last season, and all that we could see wrong then is now coming home to roost, big time.  Players not technically proficient, players out of position, players not up to it preferred in place of those who are.  Defensive substitutions to kill the game off, not go on to win it, and so on.

I do agree with Graham Taylor''s comments that everyone has their limit, given their ability, and most of our squad wouldn''t make the step up.  However, that didn''t stop the likes of Malky and Iwan before.  We know, given the right blend Hucks, Safri, Green and Ashton would be able to walk into quite a few Prem teams, they just don''t have the right blend here to even get to the top of the Championship.  Why, because Worthy, even at the start of the season was tactically naive, and this season this has become even more apparent.  We can''t defend, we can''t create, we can''t score.  All pretty basic footballing requirements, really.

I didn''t go to Wolves but from all accounts I have heard it was Luton, QPR all over again, except they weren''t clinical enough to get more than two. 

Worthy now is a defeated man, all the excuses (or reasons given however you look at it) have been used.  Injuries, bedding in, commitment, etc etc).  

He can''t motivate the players - fine, then get someone in that can.  The majority of them are good enough for this league.  The rest are competent replacements for injuries for e few games to cover. 

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quite right if we don''t change things now i can see us losing in 1st round of fa cup next year and being mid-table in league one

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   I think performance related pay must come in eventually . Hypothetically the players would get say 1 grand for a loss , 4 grand for a draw and 8 grand for a win . I think you''d see a marked improvement to the performances and results immediately      

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[quote]To a degree it is the players who do or do not perform, but they are merely the tools. The manager should be able to get them to perform week in, week out without it coming to the stage it has now. ...[/quote]

If the quote comes up  correctly [ which it almost never does ! ]  you will  see  a contradiction or two Gazza !    the quote should read " we can`t  defend , we can`t create , we can`t score , all pretty basic footballing requirements really "

All the " we`s " refer to the players !    what are we dealing with here ?  naughty children who wont do what theyre told ?  criste , these are grown men , who are drawing bleddy good wages on the assumption  that they have LEARNED their  trade , KNOW  what the " basics " are  , KNOW   what they have to do  to get the ball in the net ......   if these grown up " professionals "  need cajoling  and coaxing  into doing  what they`re paid for  , then we ARE in deep deep  manure !!    

We are top of the championship for attendances  , with a few exceptions , our players  are not fit for  the conference !   with sincere  apologies to the conference players !!

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As a former semi-professional and conference player I think I should shed some light on the shower that is our first team squad. They are pathetic, and do not deserve the money they receive. I think a lot of you do not realise the responsibility professional footballers have. Their responsibility is to go out on the field and to motivate themselves (yes amazingly, if you take pride in your performance as a player you work your damnest to play well) and to at least fight. Every player has a shocker every now and then. It happens. But even if you''re having a shocker, you still have to compensate that performance with something. You might be playing abysmally, but you should fight, show comitment, aggression, let the opposition know you are on the pitch. Believe me, it makes a huge difference. Even if you can''t string a pass together on the day, just competing on aggression and determination, you can avoid defeat most weeks (if you are up against real quality, fair do''s, fight isn''t enough if you''re playing poorly).

Too many of our first team would struggle to make impacts in the conferance. I''m not joking when I say this. You could hit certain players in the NCFC first team hard for the first ten minutes, and as they aren''t up for the fight, would fade from the game (including certain centre mids). Too many of our players fancy themselves way too much. They are pathetic. If I was fit enough, I would demand a trial at Norwich, as I am 100% certain I would do better than the shower that plays in our centre mid. They are pathetic, and are not worth more than £300 a week.

Sacking the manager wouldn''t make one iota of difference if you ask me. The players need to take a long and hard look in the mirror for me, as they are playing like clowns at the moment. They are certainly not conducting themselves as professionals. They need to be reminded that there are thousands of young men who would gladly take their places and wages and fight for the NCFC cause, as the shower that we currently have are unable to. And do you know, if I played against them in the FA Cup 3rd round, I''d love sticking my foot into 50:50 challenges against our players, knowing full well I''d win them all. They have no courage, no hunger, no concept of wanting to win, they just pick up their inflated wages at the end of the week and go on the lash. They deserve no respect even from a semi professional club. They are abysmal and shameful.

I want our players to stand up and be counted. They should show some commitment. Some pride. Some passion. Some aggression. If they can''t, tear their contracts up, and tell them to play for Forest Green or to go back to Canada - we don''t want you.

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I think that deserves reiterating  Poirot !  the rabid  worthy outers  please read and digest  ....   kriste ! even some of the PLAYERS admit they`re c**p !!   and if they don`t` know ... who does ?

 

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[quote]Itend to agree with you Poirot , but not with the analogy to Forest ! their problems started when their board dissolved , to be replaced by a consortium of money men ... who wheeled and dealed ...[/quote]

Sheded Re your note on Safri and how vocal you have been on this forum.  Did you happen to read Doncasters EDP article on Friday?  Here''s a qoute.

"A good example is the club''s decision to let Youssef Safri travel to Morocco to play in his country''s crunch World Cup qualifying tie against Tunisia, just days after he had been substituted at Brighton after suffering an injury during the game. And then came off injured again, while playing for his country.

Letters and emails written by supporters have labelled our decision to let Youssef travel to Morocco as "bizarre" and "naïve" and accused the club of being "spineless".

Sadly, these criticisms assume that Norwich City actually had the ability to prevent Youssef playing in Morocco.

Quite simply, we have no such power. FIFA, the world governing body, gives national associations the right to call up players for international fixtures. And clubs have no power to say "no". We are forced to release injured players to national associations, and it is their medical staff (not ours) who make the decision on the fitness of the players.

Whatever the concerns of our own medical staff (which were rightly and properly expressed), the Moroccan Football Association have the absolute right to determine whether their player is fit to play, or not."

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Sheded and Canary Poirot, sad but admirable sentiments from both of you, you''ve hit my nail on the head as accurately as possible. "Well said".

It would add strength to your points: If we could imagine a scenario with the manager injured, and in hospital for a month or or more. The fact is, we would still have the same group of under performers in the team with the exception of four that I wo''nt name here.

"Do the boards? sack Worthy!! posters, still imagine that what we have here are in any way likely to get stuck in and produce the goods"?.  In the motor world, if the engine is not up to the job, changing the steering wheel will not produce the horse power to get us to the top of the hill, whatever tactics are put in place. It is apparent to me that Hucks and one or two others found that the fashion world was also too stressful, and after only one dressing up session, were too knackered to put on a show on the football pitch. He for one in my estimation has too many negatives against his football ability too have a regular place in the team, until he addresses and corrects the following; What was it that was said on his CV," ca''nt head the ball, cant tackle, is not able to fill a defensive roll, and habitually leaves holes in the mid-field for the opposition to exploit also he''s not a proper striker!!!  as well as "cant be coached" Nigels'' Words.

I would suggest: CP and Sheded, that these posts of yours must be placed on the notice boards in NCFC for the players perusal!!

 

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[quote]Sheded Re your note on Safri and how vocal you have been on this forum. Did you happen to read Doncasters EDP article on Friday? Here''s a qoute. "A good example is the club''s decision to let Youss...[/quote]

I think ZLF gave me  those details Saint !   wouldn`t it be correct that if  Safri had  heeded the advice of our medic , and Nigels   plea , and told FIFA  that he was injured  , then that .... would be THAT ??    

Safri knew he had a groin injury ,  he chose to chance  inflaming the injury  to play for his country  ... sure enough  , and predictably , he  made the injury worse !    thats what got me vocal !! 

As I think I mentioned in a previous post , groin injuries are notorious for being difficult to cure ,  and its clearly  costing us  .....

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it doesnt matter if he tells Fifa.. he HAS to travel when called up... he knew he was injured,, but the morroco medical team, for whatever reason, passed him fit.. so  he had to play.

 Works the same way with England too... and all nations in fact.. u might be injured in ur club physios eyes but not your contries.. saffers had little choice but to play... he could of feigned an injury on the pitch i suppose but thats unprofessional and he wouldnt do that

jas :)

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