Surfer 1,547 Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) Unfortunately you have not met the US press and media. This will be spun as vindication of Trump, and reason to block every law proposed by the Democrats as retribution. You have to put the stake in the heart of the fascist monster when you can, it isn’t just a parlour game being played, it is a necessary action to be taken to rid our democracy of this disease. And they just blew it, big time. Edited February 13, 2021 by Surfer 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
horsefly 4,300 Posted February 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said: I see this as a win-win for the Democrats whatever happens which is why I guess they went for it. If he is impeached as surely he should be then that's a win for US democracy and the Democrats. If he isn't the that’s due to the GOP being in thrall to Trump which will leave a festering gangrenous sore at the heart of the party which the Dems can keep picking at for years. An open goal. It will the GOP that will have suffered a dereliction of duty. Yep! Exactly that. Trump still lost the election even though he actually increased his vote. Of course he also managed to increase the Democratic vote by far, far more. Since the failed insurrection the Republican party have been hemorrhaging many thousands of their more moderate supporters. If he is found not guilty of inciting insurrection then he will prove more of a hinderance to the Republicans than the Democrats. Anyone not persuaded of conspiracy theory tripe will have watched the astounding video evidence and have little doubt about Trump's guilt or complicity, and will find it extremely hard to lend him their vote in the future. The good of America, and indeed the good of the GOP would be best served by finding Trump guilty by a resounding majority. That would enable the country to move on from this awful four year experiment in the subversion of US democracy. It would also alllow the Republican Party an opportunity to expunge itself of white supremacist filth and the politics of hatred. However such is the moral cowardice and naked self-interest of individual Republican politicians, that they will find him not guilty. So it looks like a win-win for the democrats whatever the outcome. However, it won't be much of a win for US society which will continue to be riven by Trump's insistence on igniting hatred wherever he can persuade the deplorables to do his bidding. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Surfer 1,547 Posted February 13, 2021 I wish I could be as positive as you are about this - I see the death of American democracy one mid-term 2022 election away. So the Republicans blackmailed the Democratic leadership. Of course they did, they always do that and always will. If you don't move to finish the giant when he's on the ground then he'll get up and finish you sooner or later. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Surfer 1,547 Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) This speech will be passed over by the press as "Mitch being Mitch". When he had an opportunity to do something about it, he ducked his responsibility to the nation. Will Republican voters hear Mitch's speech - of course not, Fox etc will just crow "Trump innocent!" Mitch made sure the Senate could not hold the trial when when Trump was still President, then voted to acquit Trump explaining he was no longer in power. Edited February 13, 2021 by Surfer 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Donald J Trump 24 Posted February 13, 2021 I am the Resurrection Victorius!!! Massive waste of the captiols time and effort which only highlights one thing. The Presidents poplularity merely shields the ongoing corrupt day to day of the American polictican system. Democrat/Republics its just one massive swamp. I'll be back! 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yellow Fever 3,783 Posted February 13, 2021 21 minutes ago, Surfer said: This speech will be passed over by the press as "Mitch being Mitch". When he had an opportunity to do something about it, he ducked his responsibility to the nation. Will Republican voters hear Mitch's speech - of course not, Fox etc will just crow "Trump innocent!" Mitch made sure the Senate could not hold the trial when when Trump was still President, then voted to acquit Trump explaining he was no longer in power. I think McConnell would be very happy with criminal protection. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Surfer 1,547 Posted February 13, 2021 That seems to be his play - so leave it to somebody else: how brave Mitch. We expected nothing other than this of you. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lharman7 39 Posted February 13, 2021 5 hours ago, Surfer said: And just like that ... The Provisionals caved to Lennin’s Communists. The Weimar Republic caved to Hitler’s Fascists. The Liberals granted Boris his GE and inflicted Brexit. And the Democrats just caved to Trumps’ corrupt and anti-democratic Republican Party. I just f....’n give up.... Definitely think you should give up. You and your Democratic socialists are nothing but hypocrits. You are vile and disgusting. The hate on your side blinds you. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lharman7 39 Posted February 13, 2021 4 hours ago, horsefly said: Yep! Exactly that. Trump still lost the election even though he actually increased his vote. Of course he also managed to increase the Democratic vote by far, far more. Since the failed insurrection the Republican party have been hemorrhaging many thousands of their more moderate supporters. If he is found not guilty of inciting insurrection then he will prove more of a hinderance to the Republicans than the Democrats. Anyone not persuaded of conspiracy theory tripe will have watched the astounding video evidence and have little doubt about Trump's guilt or complicity, and will find it extremely hard to lend him their vote in the future. The good of America, and indeed the good of the GOP would be best served by finding Trump guilty by a resounding majority. That would enable the country to move on from this awful four year experiment in the subversion of US democracy. It would also alllow the Republican Party an opportunity to expunge itself of white supremacist filth and the politics of hatred. However such is the moral cowardice and naked self-interest of individual Republican politicians, that they will find him not guilty. So it looks like a win-win for the democrats whatever the outcome. However, it won't be much of a win for US society which will continue to be riven by Trump's insistence on igniting hatred wherever he can persuade the deplorables to do his bidding. And the hypocrisy blinds yet another. Calling for support is not inciting violence. President Trumps lawyers show that very aptly in there video evidence. The hatred has only come from the Democrats and msm for the last 4 years! Fact! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rock The Boat 1,331 Posted February 14, 2021 8 hours ago, Surfer said: Unfortunately you have not met the US press and media. This will be spun as vindication of Trump, and reason to block every law proposed by the Democrats as retribution. You have to put the stake in the heart of the fascist monster when you can, it isn’t just a parlour game being played, it is a necessary action to be taken to rid our democracy of this disease. And they just blew it, big time. Oh dear. How sad. Never mind. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
horsefly 4,300 Posted February 14, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, lharman7 said: And the hypocrisy blinds yet another. Calling for support is not inciting violence. President Trumps lawyers show that very aptly in there video evidence. The hatred has only come from the Democrats and msm for the last 4 years! Fact! HaHaHa! I see RTB has to post under 2 names to get some support. Still trying the old "fake news" defence; what an utter joke you are. YOU LOST THE ELECTION, get over it. The result was exactly as predicted, and Putin's pu*ssy is still free to do his work destroying the Republican Party, I don't think many will weep about that. Can't wait for the trials of all his white supremacist supporters in a proper of court of law. Then we shall hear time and time again that they believed Trump called them to storm the Capitol. Then, of course we'll see plenty of court action involving Trump himself; I believe the number of suits lodged against him has passed 30 now. McConnell and his fellow mice are clearly hoping the courts will do the job that they were too cowardly to do themselves. Perhaps we should run a sweepstake on what Trump gets found guilty of first: my money is on tax fraud but it could easily be sexual assault, or vote tampering, or theft of campaign funds, or... (take your pick!). Edited February 14, 2021 by horsefly 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
horsefly 4,300 Posted February 14, 2021 8 hours ago, Donald J Trump said: I am the Resurrection Victorius!!! Massive waste of the captiols time and effort which only highlights one thing. The Presidents poplularity merely shields the ongoing corrupt day to day of the American polictican system. Democrat/Republics its just one massive swamp. I'll be back! Keep going old boy! You did a fabulous job getting "boring" Biden a record 81 million votes. He wouldn't have got close to that without your help. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,760 Posted February 14, 2021 7 hours ago, lharman7 said: And the hypocrisy blinds yet another. Calling for support is not inciting violence. President Trumps lawyers show that very aptly in there video evidence. The hatred has only come from the Democrats and msm for the last 4 years! Fact! The new Republican campaign video. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A Load of Squit 5,162 Posted February 14, 2021 8 hours ago, lharman7 said: Definitely think you should give up. You and your Democratic socialists are nothing but hypocrits. You are vile and disgusting. The hate on your side blinds you. You see the thing is, they care more about 5 dead people and over a hundred injured more than you do. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sonyc 5,517 Posted February 14, 2021 2 hours ago, A Load of Squit said: You see the thing is, they care more about 5 dead people and over a hundred injured more than you do. It's depressing, definitely. This isn't about "right and left" or "socialists". That's reductive in the extreme. Rather, it's a perfect example of 'history repeating itself' (think how weak administrations in Europe were sleepwalking in the 1920s and 1930s whilst populists tied themselves to nationalist symbols and motifs....the modern day example is "MAGA"). I think this sums up the whole affair better than anything⬇️ 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,760 Posted February 14, 2021 "...whilst populists tied themselves to nationalist symbols and motifs." Like this you mean?😀 Anyway, it sounds like the Republicans threatened to slow government right down, block nominees and bring a halt to the Covid reliefs rather than bring truth to the people. The question is for Democrats, Labour, Liberals etc. How do we fight against people that have zero moral guidance without lowering ourselves to their level? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yellow Fever 3,783 Posted February 14, 2021 40 minutes ago, sonyc said: It's depressing, definitely. This isn't about "right and left" or "socialists". That's reductive in the extreme. Rather, it's a perfect example of 'history repeating itself' (think how weak administrations in Europe were sleepwalking in the 1920s and 1930s whilst populists tied themselves to nationalist symbols and motifs....the modern day example is "MAGA"). I think this sums up the whole affair better than anything⬇️ I was thinking much the same thing like how in 20's an 30s 'democracies' accommodated populists and extreme nationalists. It was easier to bend than to stand up to them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
horsefly 4,300 Posted February 14, 2021 11 hours ago, lharman7 said: Calling for support is not inciting violence. President Trumps lawyers show that very aptly in there video evidence.The hatred has only come from the Democrats and msm for the last 4 years! Fact! Perhaps you had better let Mitch McConnell, the leader of the Republicans in the senate, know that. He holds Trump absolutely responsible for the violence: Senate minority leader Mitch McConnell said on Saturday that Donald Trump was “practically and morally responsible” for the insurrection at the US Capitol on 6 January. "They [the mob] did this because they’d been fed wild falsehoods by the most powerful man on Earth because he was angry he lost an election" https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/13/mitch-mcconnell-trump-republicans 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
keelansgrandad 6,679 Posted February 14, 2021 The twists and turns of the GOP is nothing new and hardly surprising. McConnell is somehow trying to pretend he is a minority leader by voting with his politics and talking with his belief. Ultimately, it shouldn't escape anyone that Trump was found not guilty by a voting system but actually lost by a simple majority which would suffice in any other system. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yellow Fever 3,783 Posted February 14, 2021 (edited) 18 minutes ago, horsefly said: Perhaps you had better let Mitch McConnell, the leader of the Republicans in the senate, know that. He holds Trump absolutely responsible for the violence: Senate minority leader Mitch McConnell said on Saturday that Donald Trump was “practically and morally responsible” for the insurrection at the US Capitol on 6 January. "They [the mob] did this because they’d been fed wild falsehoods by the most powerful man on Earth because he was angry he lost an election" https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/13/mitch-mcconnell-trump-republicans Exactly - McConnell thinks and says he's basically guilty as charged but escapes only on a useful engineered technicality as that he's not (now) the President. McConnell think he's been clever but I suspect he has now committed the GOP to years of internal strife, splits and infighting & all for a pyrrhic short term gain. Edited February 14, 2021 by Yellow Fever 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sonyc 5,517 Posted February 14, 2021 1 hour ago, Yellow Fever said: I was thinking much the same thing like how in 20's an 30s 'democracies' accommodated populists and extreme nationalists. It was easier to bend than to stand up to them. We think much the same then. Trump is a kind of loudspeaker for one part of the American soul. I wish Trump had just stayed on his golf course but I read he is starting the talk again about the movement only just starting. And in not stamping this out, the dark portents not only lie undisturbed but are ready for rekindling. It harks back to those days of the 'varterland'. That may read like quite some statement. Yet, the US needs a different psychology to thrive. It remains to be seen now what direction the Republicans take. It is still possible it will lead to a kind of hell. I hope they do have the kinds of argument and internal strife you've mentioned in your post. Because only in this process will some truths about what they really stand for will emerge. They have become so fused / entrenched / influenced / controlled (choose your adjective) by their previous 'leader' that it looks from the outside anyway, to be some task ahead to determine their identity, their soul. It is a time for hope with Biden but these times are not without some foreboding. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill 1,788 Posted February 14, 2021 there is still the no small matter of the pending criminal charges Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SHRIMPER 328 Posted February 14, 2021 Moscow Mitch also said that tRump will face a lot of heavy duty legal battles..cannot be soon enough now that he has lost a lot of his presidential powers have been stripped away. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PurpleCanary 5,558 Posted February 14, 2021 On 12/02/2021 at 18:03, PurpleCanary said: If it wasn't so serious Tuberville would be a hoot. He gets the three branches of the American federal government wrong, and said this beauty: “I tell people, my dad fought 76 years ago in Europe to free Europe of socialism.” Or fascism, as the rest of the world knows it to be and calls it such. The useful thing about Tuberville being so spectacularly thick is that it now gives us a global scale for dumbness, to go alongside, for example, the Hoey Scale for Brexit Brainlessness. So I think we can rate the claim that the Nazis were socialists at 8.5 on the Tuberville Scale of Senile Stupidity. Some might argue that it should be marked higher, since it is a really cretinous notion to believe. But having read some of Tuberviile's comments on other subjects I suspect we will need to leave the 9 and the 10 free for even more absurd and mistaken beliefs. It may even be, like the amps in Spinal Tap, that we need to dial up 11s. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nevermind, neoliberalism has had it 159 Posted February 14, 2021 lets not be blind in one eye, what happens over there is happening here. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,760 Posted February 14, 2021 7 minutes ago, nevermind, neoliberalism has had it said: lets not be blind in one eye, what happens over there is happening here. Oh we know. We are becoming like Orban's Hungary at an alarming rate. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lharman7 39 Posted February 14, 2021 8 hours ago, Herman said: The new Republican campaign video. Naww you tried so hard, bless. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lharman7 39 Posted February 14, 2021 7 hours ago, A Load of Squit said: You see the thing is, they care more about 5 dead people and over a hundred injured more than you do. Yes they must do, after all they planned the whole thing. I wish they had called Parasite Pelosi up as a witness. She'd of been obliterated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheGunnShow 5,940 Posted February 14, 2021 4 hours ago, Herman said: "...whilst populists tied themselves to nationalist symbols and motifs." Like this you mean?😀 Anyway, it sounds like the Republicans threatened to slow government right down, block nominees and bring a halt to the Covid reliefs rather than bring truth to the people. The question is for Democrats, Labour, Liberals etc. How do we fight against people that have zero moral guidance without lowering ourselves to their level? Side-effect of ****ty electoral models that need blowing up as they're not representative, nor are they democratic. Both the UK and USA have outdated, useless FPTP models. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill 1,788 Posted February 14, 2021 3 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said: Side-effect of ****ty electoral models that need blowing up as they're not representative, nor are they democratic. Both the UK and USA have outdated, useless FPTP models. it is not FPTP it is the lack of engagement by voters Share this post Link to post Share on other sites