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TIL 1010

Farke,Farke Sort It Out,Farke Sort It Out !

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[quote user="sgncfc"]If any of you seriously think that Farke is on borrowed time then you really haven''t been paying attention.

The model is in place and progress is being made. We have a solid Championship squad and there is absolutely no chance of relegation. I wonder what games you are watching. We just drew away to Ipswich - we didn''t lose; we weren''t outplayed; we had the better chances.

We are clearly nowhere near the finished article but he will be given time and will get at least another two year deal after this season to continue the progress without the remaining high earners and with more academy graduates coming through.

He and the coaching staff are clearly developing the players they are bringing to the club and have already brought several academy players through earlier than any other manager in our history.

You can post on forums all your silly negative comments and chant whatever you like. You can even stop going to games (those of you that do), but you''ll be back when we start winning. He is going nowhere anytime soon.

Because it is working. Can you really not see that?[/quote]

The only thing that is working is Delias constant penny pinching with two bob managers and extremely cheap players. The club is getting worse each season. If you are happy with that, then my hat goes off to you. I prefer winning football matches, as opposed to whatever it is you seem to enjoy.

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The model I am working the problem is it''s a suboptimal model

This model has been chosen as its the only one tang would applied the stowmarket 2 to remain owners of the club. It has nothing to do with what is in the best interests of the club

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[quote user="sgncfc"]If any of you seriously think that Farke is on borrowed time then you really haven''t been paying attention.

The model is in place and progress is being made. We have a solid Championship squad and there is absolutely no chance of relegation. I wonder what games you are watching. We just drew away to Ipswich - we didn''t lose; we weren''t outplayed; we had the better chances.

We are clearly nowhere near the finished article but he will be given time and will get at least another two year deal after this season to continue the progress without the remaining high earners and with more academy graduates coming through.

He and the coaching staff are clearly developing the players they are bringing to the club and have already brought several academy players through earlier than any other manager in our history.

You can post on forums all your silly negative comments and chant whatever you like. You can even stop going to games (those of you that do), but you''ll be back when we start winning. He is going nowhere anytime soon.

Because it is working. Can you really not see that?[/quote]

Absolutely no chance of relegation? With respect, that’s a very delusional statement. Look at our results so far this season, current league postion, and form from the end of last season into this. Factor in the loss of key players, we are most certainly not guaranteed survival in this league.

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There was some “sort it out” chanting yesterday but it was certainly not representative of most of our fans there. If we had lost then maybe after the game there would have been a lot more discontent but yesterday the manager did enough. The problem now is that the honeymoon is well and truly over and some fans are going to judge him on a game by game basis, another bad string of results and that may well be it.

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We weren’t outplayed by them. No id hope not as they were rock bottom of the league. They did still manage more shots than us though, if you don’t buy a ticket and all that

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="TIL 1010"]
 a few renditions of '' You don''t know what you''re doing ''.
[/quote]
Can I suggest some of our fans pop down to Asda or Morissons and

get dvd''s of Aladdin to watch on a Saturday afternoon rather than go to

the football - I''m sure you would love it - you know who you are -

you''re the ones that like to mindlessly slag off our club or our players

in the middle of matches.  In a pantomime you are supposed to boo the

villains - and lucky for you they make it really obvious in pantomimes

who the villains are and everyone loves it because everything happens as

it should.  
I can''t quite believe what I

have read about the chants that were at the ground today. Shouting "You don''t

know what you''re doing" is absolutely ironic. At matches, slagging off

the team, club, manager or whoever is in your tiny minds when you do it

is pathetic behaviour from people who are obviously so removed from real

life - or just plain thick - that it is laughable.
The clue is in the word "Support". Look it up.  
[/quote]
Exactly this.
Truly pathetic from our ''support'' yesterday but not particularly surprising given what the Carrow Road crowd has typically been serving up for a long time now. In fact, not just pathetic but shameful and embarassing.

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I don’t blame them because we way we cane out after half time was completely unacceptable and is not a one off either.

To be fair to Farke he is now making subs earlier and they are influencing games as on Sunday but this trend of only stepping up the intensity and playing with the necessary tempo/bite after we go behind needs to be addressed. Whatever the tone/content of his half time team talks is it doesn’t seem to be working.

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[quote user=" Badger"]Frankly, I hear it very frequently when we go behind at home games, so it''s hardly news. The vast majority of our supporters are excellent and loyal to the club, but there is a tiny minority who react very badly whenever things do not go well - it always has been the case. Imo, it is silly to start writing off a manager after half a dozen games in a season, when he is still trying to integrate new players, particularly when we have sold so much talent since he has joined. I''m sure that there are experts who think otherwise.[/quote]

The thing is though badger we are going to be selling and replacing players every summer so does the same apply every season? Also once again the whole of last season can not be written off.

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[quote user="sgncfc"]If any of you seriously think that Farke is on borrowed time then you really haven''t been paying attention.

The model is in place and progress is being made. We have a solid Championship squad and there is absolutely no chance of relegation. I wonder what games you are watching. We just drew away to Ipswich - we didn''t lose; we weren''t outplayed; we had the better chances.

We are clearly nowhere near the finished article but he will be given time and will get at least another two year deal after this season to continue the progress without the remaining high earners and with more academy graduates coming through.

He and the coaching staff are clearly developing the players they are bringing to the club and have already brought several academy players through earlier than any other manager in our history.

You can post on forums all your silly negative comments and chant whatever you like. You can even stop going to games (those of you that do), but you''ll be back when we start winning. He is going nowhere anytime soon.

Because it is working. Can you really not see that?[/quote]
I do agree with most of that, but beware of the "we are too good for relegation" stuff - no club can afford to be complacent.  I do believe progress is being made too and the logic of what Farke does is there to see - if people want to see it.  Even the move to a more direct syle is part of a logical development and a result of Farke adapting his philosophy to the needs of the league.  Super fitness as a result of the extra training we do, keeping the ball as a good technical side should do, allied to a more robust direct style. 
I compared it to the Stringer era a while ago, but it seems to me you could go further - Farke is a combination of Saunders (extra fitness a key component), Stringer (posession a key component) and Walker (take the abiliity to keep possession and make it more direct).  Obviously Farke has not achieved what those managers did (yet), but the logic is faultless - take the best attributes of what a good footblling side does and see it through to fufillment. It is working - and it will develop and improve - but it won''t be easy, simply because of the quality of the opposition in this league, which is very, very strong.

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I am no doom monger and suspect we will finish lower mid table. That said for some to totally discount the potential of relegation is being complacent. Last season 42 would have been safe which is about where we are 6 games in. The previous season Blackburn went down with 51 and we are not hitting those levels yet. Regardless of the model Farke needs a stonking run the stand any chance of a new contract

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The model is in place?

What model? a model that Webber got lucky with once at Huddersfield, you cant just do the same thing elsewhere and expect to replicate it so easily.

Progress is being made?

How so? Feck all progression, this years team is worse than last year and we are worse off at this point than we were last year.

"absolutely no chance of relegation."

Give me 50/1?

We have a solid Championship squad?

Deluded, absolutely deluded. Relying on Rhodes and Pukki for goals with Srbeny to save the day. Still leaking goals. An Alex Tettey who literally as forgotten how to kick a ball at some points this season. An ex-international goalkeeper who couldn''t catch a cold.

Realistically we''ve sold five of our best players for close to £40-50 Million. We''ve invested none into the team. We''ve got our best striker and someone could could be the best striker in the league sat not playing football. We''ve a worst team than last year. Our end of season form was terrible, we''ve started the same way. We''re no better off then when Alex Neil left, the same Alex Neil who took Preston to 7th. We finished behind Ipswich, Leeds, Sheff United and Millwall. Clubs a farce. I cant engage with this team of foreigners who don''t know what it means to play for this club or in this division. I''m fed and the predictability is all too tedious.

How anyone can put a positive spin on the last 14 months is beyond me.

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Lakey reckons that Farke is a combination of Saunders, Stringer and Walker ! Dear God i will have a pint of what you drink mate as to me it looks more like Morgan, Megson and Roeder.

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[quote user="CDMullins"]The model is in place?

What model? a model that Webber got lucky with once at Huddersfield, you cant just do the same thing elsewhere and expect to replicate it so easily.

Progress is being made?

How so? Feck all progression, this years team is worse than last year and we are worse off at this point than we were last year.

"absolutely no chance of relegation."

Give me 50/1?

We have a solid Championship squad?

Deluded, absolutely deluded. Relying on Rhodes and Pukki for goals with Srbeny to save the day. Still leaking goals. An Alex Tettey who literally as forgotten how to kick a ball at some points this season. An ex-international goalkeeper who couldn''t catch a cold.

Realistically we''ve sold five of our best players for close to £40-50 Million. We''ve invested none into the team. We''ve got our best striker and someone could could be the best striker in the league sat not playing football. We''ve a worst team than last year. Our end of season form was terrible, we''ve started the same way. We''re no better off then when Alex Neil left, the same Alex Neil who took Preston to 7th. We finished behind Ipswich, Leeds, Sheff United and Millwall. Clubs a farce. I cant engage with this team of foreigners who don''t know what it means to play for this club or in this division. I''m fed and the predictability is all too tedious.

How anyone can put a positive spin on the last 14 months is beyond me.[/quote]

The only purpose of this model is to keep this club out of debt,so Delia and her family get their knees up every week without having to put a penny in to the club. Then they can have their yearly board meeting, con the Delia lovers who attend and get that nephew closer to the helm just to put the nail in to the club

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[quote user="Jim Smith"]The thing is though badger we are going to be selling and replacing players every summer so does the same apply every season? Also once again the whole of last season can not be written off.[/quote]I am not sure that this is the case - it largely depends upon the wage budget.We have a choice - we can "over-pay" and have a wage budget that our revenue can sustain. If this is the case, we will have to make up the shortfall from player sales. Alternatively, we can reduce the wage budget to a level where there is no need to sell. A club with our attendances and, n.b.  other commercial revenue, would be bale to maintain a wage budget similar to the median or above in the Championship.My guess is that we will go somewhere between the two. We will run a player wage budget that is consistent with the expectation that we will sell players to generate extra revenue. The reality of any championship club''s situation is that without parachute payments, if premier league clubs come calling the player will want to go. So I accept that there is a "livestock" development element to the clubs plans.However, we have mainly made the financial transition that was necessary following relegation with a bloated and sometimes over-paid squad and can start to build a team. The need for wholesale player sales is ended.

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The upside of the new model is that we will always have a club to support unlike the Rushdon and diamonds and scarboroughs of this world. The downside is a slow but gradual deterioration in status and expectations. Funny how things go full circle for decades prior to the 1970s we were a club that bounced between in effect league 1 and the championship, we may be heading that way again. The the level of support stays high and we manage to produce and sell good young players then championship will be more probable. The consequence of a significant drop in support and failure to generate transfer surplus is obvious. The caveat also is by chance we may occasionally hit on a managerial gem for short term success

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"Because it is working. Can you really not see that?"

Do I need to squint? Because no I can''t see that.

We''ve gone backwards in basically every way possible under Farke. Less points, less goals, lower in the league, lower quality of players, lower attendances. We''ve conceded a few less but that is about it.

I''m amazed that ''we weren''t outplayed'' by Ipswich is seen as a positive.

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I cannot see what the fuss is about if a few boos percolate.

Ever since my first match in 1960, there have been moans, groans, boos and chants.

When the boos and moans become very loud and very persistent, then the club is in trouble. Until then, I can''t see why it has become an almost hate crime to boo. It is so unimportant in the scheme of things. The lack of singing and cheering is more of a worry.

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[quote user="CDMullins"]The model is in place?

What model? a model that Webber got lucky with once at Huddersfield, you cant just do the same thing elsewhere and expect to replicate it so easily.

Progress is being made?

How so? Feck all progression, this years team is worse than last year and we are worse off at this point than we were last year.

"absolutely no chance of relegation."

Give me 50/1?

We have a solid Championship squad?

Deluded, absolutely deluded. Relying on Rhodes and Pukki for goals with Srbeny to save the day. Still leaking goals. An Alex Tettey who literally as forgotten how to kick a ball at some points this season. An ex-international goalkeeper who couldn''t catch a cold.

Realistically we''ve sold five of our best players for close to £40-50 Million. We''ve invested none into the team. We''ve got our best striker and someone could could be the best striker in the league sat not playing football. We''ve a worst team than last year. Our end of season form was terrible, we''ve started the same way. We''re no better off then when Alex Neil left, the same Alex Neil who took Preston to 7th. We finished behind Ipswich, Leeds, Sheff United and Millwall. Clubs a farce. I cant engage with this team of foreigners who don''t know what it means to play for this club or in this division. I''m fed and the predictability is all too tedious.

How anyone can put a positive spin on the last 14 months is beyond me.[/quote]
I was doing my best to take you semi-seriously until I got to the bit I''ve highlighted, thankfully that confirmed what I thought originally - you haven''t got a clue what you''re talking about.

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[quote user="detroit94"]Not sure how much longer Farke should get. Yes he made some brave decisions today with Aaron''s and Godfrey. But he, Webber and the board need to stop taking the supporters for granted we pay high prices and turn up in large numbers. We are sleepwalking into L1 if we are not careful. I have followed City since the early 70s and this is the worst situation since the mid 90s in my opinion. If results don''t pick up we are in trouble. Today was good in that 3 young defenders really acquitted themselves well but we should be doing better than that with the players we have.[/quote]

Have I missed something. One of Webber’s aims was to change the academy / development of young players. Your post contradicts in saying the youth players were good then blaming Webber for introducing changes that saw us with 4 probable premiership youngsters on the pitch. What is it you want from Webber ?

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'' Changes that saw us with 4 probable Premiership youngsters on the pitch ''.
I am sure the board will be absolutely delighted with that which means we can sell them to keep balacing the books to remain debt free and we can start the conveyor belt all over again with another rebuilt.
Marvellous !

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Farke is good with bring youngster through because he is a Development coach

Not a championship Head Coach / Manager

And lets face facts these youngsters were at the club before Webber and Farke like Maddison was good anyway

Cantwell has been the best youngster in teams since under 14''s

just because they are playing now does not mean it is down to Farke and Webber !

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[quote user="TIL 1010"]
'' Changes that saw us with 4 probable Premiership youngsters on the pitch ''.
I am sure the board will be absolutely delighted with that which means we can sell them to keep balacing the books to remain debt free and we can start the conveyor belt all over again with another rebuilt.
Marvellous !
[/quote]

That IS pretty much the plan they outlined, isn’t it? Of course, promotion would change things a bit..

I’m not sure that the use of ‘debt free’ is entirely accurate either. There will certainly be times where we accrue some debt, a facility was in place to accommodate such a situation for this season. It’s more that we have to be self-sustainable and this generate our own income. To that end, it’s imperative that we blood these young players; Lewis will likely be the next to go.

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[quote user="norfolkngood"]Farke is good with bring youngster through because he is a Development coach

Not a championship Head Coach / Manager

And lets face facts these youngsters were at the club before Webber and Farke like Maddison was good anyway

Cantwell has been the best youngster in teams since under 14''s

just because they are playing now does not mean it is down to Farke and Webber ![/quote]
Isn''t that missing the point a bit - Farke has only been here just over a year so it could hardly be any other way.
Surely what is encouraging is that for many years now our Academy has been producing youngsters for which we''ve had high hopes but in practice vcry, very few of them have fulfilled the potential they seemed to have. Look at our FA Youth Cup team for instance, the Murphys made it but where are all the rest?
In many cases it may be that promising youngsters don''t end up cutting it at professional level through no fault of the Academy/club. But I do think it is becoming harder and harder for young players to make the transition - there are very few managers in this country, especially in the Champs or Prem, who are more than six to eight games from the sack if things are not going their way. So the vast majority of managers prefer experience over potential and take only limited interest in their youngsters because their focus is almost inevitably short-term.
Farke has a plan for our youngsters to enable them to make the transition from youth to 1st team and he is brave enough to play them when he thinks they are ready even when he has experienced options available. IMO he should be applauded for that.

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Webber sees us as a feeder club.

He''s motivated by negotiating big deals. Signing for pennies and making a big profit. Listen to his comments around the Maddison deal, his delight at being a big part in the negotiations was tangible.

Proportionally we are under investing in the first 11, and any ambition to build a side capable of promotion is more than questionable. There is no immediate plan or motivation for a return to the Premier League. That much is clear.

The biggest concern is this lack of ambition filtering through the club, resulting in our young stars forming the mind-set that Norwich is merely a steeping stone to bigger and better things. And when this happens, you''ve got no chance of building anything successful on the pitch.

I liked it under McNally and Bowkett, when we invested in the first team. When results on the pitch where high priority. And for the first time in Norwich''s history, we weren''t a selling club!

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[quote user="lincoln canary Golden Coppel"]Webber sees us as a feeder club.

He''s motivated by negotiating big deals. Signing for pennies and making a big profit. Listen to his comments around the Maddison deal, his delight at being a big part in the negotiations was tangible.

Proportionally we are under investing in the first 11, and any ambition to build a side capable of promotion is more than questionable. There is no immediate plan or motivation for a return to the Premier League. That much is clear.

The biggest concern is this lack of ambition filtering through the club, resulting in our young stars forming the mind-set that Norwich is merely a steeping stone to bigger and better things. And when this happens, you''ve got no chance of building anything successful on the pitch.

I liked it under McNally and Bowkett, when we invested in the first team. When results on the pitch where high priority. And for the first time in Norwich''s history, we weren''t a selling club![/quote]
Total gibberish. Of course Webber would be delighted with the Maddison deal - anyone who is realistic about our club would be. Why do you assume there is no ambition? Why?  Because we sold players? The Maddison and Murphy money has been put to good use,  balancing the books and putting together a good balanced squad.  And your view that we stopped being a selling club for a while, that is plain rubbish - all clubs sell players, even Man City.  Also the view in hindsight is that we should not have spent all our money on the players in the PL - it turned out to be shortsighted. I don''t now where people get all this negatve stuff from, it''s as if they delight in being negative.

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Nice try Lincoln but...

You, on the one hand criticise an alleged lack of ambition and then in the next breath say that this affects the mind-set of our young stars. If the height of our “young stars” ambitions is to play for Norwich City then I’d question their ambition completely. I also suspect that they wouldn’t progress very far in the game. It has always been thus. Craig Bellamy, Darren Eadie, Chris Sutton etc etc

No amount of perceived ambition would stop our best players being picked off by other clubs. At any given time there is a pecking order. That’s why we could take Dean Ashton from Crewe, James Maddison from Coventry and Nathan Tedmond from Birmingham. By the same token it’s why Leicester took Madders from us yet lost Mahrez to Man City.

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[quote user="TIL 1010"]
'' Changes that saw us with 4 probable Premiership youngsters on the pitch ''.
I am sure the board will be absolutely delighted with that which means we can sell them to keep balacing the books to remain debt free and we can start the conveyor belt all over again with another rebuilt.
Marvellous !
[/quote] Funny but I''ve always been under the impression that there was something wholly admirable about the highly respected Southampton FC Academy, which has succeeded precisely in building such a conveyor belt of talent, some of whom you find playing regularly in the Saints first team for a while before moving on, others of whom are snapped up by other clubs before becoming established first team players at St Mary''s. Not only do the proceeds of sale fund the conveyor belt, they contribute positively to the club balance sheet. That''s the model we seek to emulate and I really find it hard to grasp what''s wrong with it.

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