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king canary

Credit for Webber

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Nutty

You claimed people were ''rewriting history'' by wanting Farke gone a couple of months ago and now thinking he should have a new contract.

That isn''t what ''rewriting history'' actually means though. If Mike or someone was claiming they''d always backed Farke then you might have a point.

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It''s beyond me how so many seem to want to lump themselves in with posters like Mike. It''s not about changing minds. It''s about the nastiness and billy big bolloxing posters with a nasty streak sweep under the carpet along side changing their minds.

With most of us it''s just funny. We have our set views and bend everything that happens into shape with those views. But there are some, like Mike, who go a lot further than just being funny.

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[quote user="Crabbycanary3"]Without pouring too much water on this, I would rather have Webber than not for sure, but does this situation reflect on what went before he turned up in that role, and therefore putting extra shine on the job he has done , thus far?

We are not totally privy to what goes on behind the scenes, but when Webber came in, anyone worth their salt (he looks the real deal, previous incumbents in that well paid job, perhaps not so), would see what state we were in, and plan ahead with a workable strategy. i.e getting contracts in place for those assets, forward thinking signings etc.

[/quote]

Michael Bailey tells the story that he interviewed Alan Irvine towards the end of his caretaker reign and had asked him which players from the youth team could make the step up to the first team, and he was lukewarm on Maddison and Godfrey. No one else was on the radar and Irvine had been involved in the U23 coaching, with a supposedly good reputation for developing youth.

Certainly there''s been a radical overhaul of the academy, and Webber, in part is to credit for that.

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Credit to all involved in the improvement we are seeing at the moment. I think there is more to come from Webber on other levels surrounding other areas of running the club, especially if we don''t achieve promotion. Happy days.

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[quote user="Icecream Snow"][quote user="Crabbycanary3"]Without pouring too much water on this, I would rather have Webber than not for sure, but does this situation reflect on what went before he turned up in that role, and therefore putting extra shine on the job he has done , thus far?

We are not totally privy to what goes on behind the scenes, but when Webber came in, anyone worth their salt (he looks the real deal, previous incumbents in that well paid job, perhaps not so), would see what state we were in, and plan ahead with a workable strategy. i.e getting contracts in place for those assets, forward thinking signings etc.

[/quote]

Michael Bailey tells the story that he interviewed Alan Irvine towards the end of his caretaker reign and had asked him which players from the youth team could make the step up to the first team, and he was lukewarm on Maddison and Godfrey. No one else was on the radar and Irvine had been involved in the U23 coaching, with a supposedly good reputation for developing youth.

Certainly there''s been a radical overhaul of the academy, and Webber, in part is to credit for that.[/quote]
I assume that wasn''t a mishearing of Middleton?!

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]It''s beyond me how so many seem to want to lump themselves in with posters like Mike. It''s not about changing minds. It''s about the nastiness and billy big bolloxing posters with a nasty streak sweep under the carpet along side changing their minds.

With most of us it''s just funny. We have our set views and bend everything that happens into shape with those views. But there are some, like Mike, who go a lot further than just being funny.[/quote]

Ha ha ha ha ha... that is rich mate!

I bear no nastiness at all..I have been guilty of replying in the manner of the post I was replying to but really?

Don''t dish it out if you get upset when people reply accordingly.

I will say what I feel about my club and will change my mind when I wish to regardless of petty little digs.

If you are polite I will be polite back.

Anyway, I hope we sort out Farke''s contract soon as I think he is now showing what a great job he is doing.

OTBC

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[quote user="Capt. Pants"]Credit to all involved in the improvement we are seeing at the moment. I think there is more to come from Webber on other levels surrounding other areas of running the club, especially if we don''t achieve promotion. Happy days.[/quote]

The players have started to gel which is great but still not sure on a wife & husband being on a board of three that have to make important decisions.

In fairness to Webber he said judge him on 3/4 transfer windows hence why I think it would be best to judge him at the end of the season.

Looking good though...

Reason I have become more posiive towards Farke is the progress with Cantwell, Max & Lewis...plus his impact on Madders. If we have to continually sell then we need Farke...

OTBC

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[quote user="Mike "][quote user="nutty nigel"]It''s beyond me how so many seem to want to lump themselves in with posters like Mike. It''s not about changing minds. It''s about the nastiness and billy big bolloxing posters with a nasty streak sweep under the carpet along side changing their minds.

With most of us it''s just funny. We have our set views and bend everything that happens into shape with those views. But there are some, like Mike, who go a lot further than just being funny.[/quote]

Ha ha ha ha ha... that is rich mate!

I bear no nastiness at all..I have been guilty of replying in the manner of the post I was replying to but really?

Don''t dish it out if you get upset when people reply accordingly.

I will say what I feel about my club and will change my mind when I wish to regardless of petty little digs.

If you are polite I will be polite back.

Anyway, I hope we sort out Farke''s contract soon as I think he is now showing what a great job he is doing.

OTBC[/quote]
Except you won''t find posts where I behave like you Mike.
Anyway, what about the £250 quid you were billybigbolloxing about?
Can you point to another poster who behaves like that?

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[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="Mike "][quote user="nutty nigel"]It''s beyond me how so many seem to want to lump themselves in with posters like Mike. It''s not about changing minds. It''s about the nastiness and billy big bolloxing posters with a nasty streak sweep under the carpet along side changing their minds.

With most of us it''s just funny. We have our set views and bend everything that happens into shape with those views. But there are some, like Mike, who go a lot further than just being funny.[/quote]

Ha ha ha ha ha... that is rich mate!

I bear no nastiness at all..I have been guilty of replying in the manner of the post I was replying to but really?

Don''t dish it out if you get upset when people reply accordingly.

I will say what I feel about my club and will change my mind when I wish to regardless of petty little digs.

If you are polite I will be polite back.

Anyway, I hope we sort out Farke''s contract soon as I think he is now showing what a great job he is doing.

OTBC[/quote]
Except you won''t find posts where I behave like you Mike.
Anyway, what about the £250 quid you were billybigbolloxing about?
Can you point to another poster who behaves like that?
[/quote]

You should have taken the bet! Probably posted after you called me a "snowflake" but hey this is dull.

I will change my mind if the facts change and you feel free to pull me up on my previous posts (I find that a bit weird as I don''t keep a record of yours or others comments... But each to their own).

Like I said, let''s see if we can accept other views and discussions without the usual silly put downs.

Otbc

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Webber''s next major challenge will come if a) we go up and the entire first team squad except perhaps Krul, Klose, Leitner is below the needed quality, or b) we stay down and we can''t afford our current first team squad members of Klose, Hanley, Rhodes - where do we get quality replacements? And can we keep Aarons and Lewis under either scenario?

It''s why he gets paid the big bucks I guess :-)

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Mike

I don''t keep a record of your posts but some are unforgettable.

Like all that Billy big bolloxing about £250. Just because you have more money to throw around doesn''t make your opinion worth more than anyone else''s. It''s just boorish behaviour but fits well with the idea that more money is better and richer people are better.

You think I should have taken your bet? I haven''t got £250 to risk and, as I said at the time, if I had the bookies would have given me much better odds than evs.

However a poster called xymox took it. Or tried to. I wasn''t surprised it appeared to fall on deaf ears....

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@Surfer

I think that is a pretty harsh assesment of the current first team squad. I think Lewis, Aarons, Buendia, Hernandez and maybe a few others are more than capable of making the step up.

Equally I don''t see why we wouldn''t be able to afford to keep Hanley?

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Getting an interesting thread back on line, away from the petty in fighting that bores everyone other than those concerned...

Personally I feel Webber is doing a remarkable job. We have had to sell many millions of pounds of talent and replace them with low wage largely unknown players, few of which have played at the top level before. Those that have seem to have been persuaded to buy into the project and have turned down better financial deals elsewhere. Even Tettey has stayed on a lower deal. Fair enough one or two have not worked out but we have clearly picked up some absolute gems for virtual peanuts.

Add to that the way the academy has suddenly started to produce and the way he seems to work well with DF - surely not a coincidence.

He might be a little full of himself and his ability at times but to be frank I think considering what he has achieved he has every right to be bullish.

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"Personally I feel Webber is doing a remarkable job."

Fully agree, and with the rest.

The Championship is a complete mess of pottage at the moment and City are becoming a shining light among the dross.

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I have not changed my posting style since I joined the board. As you well know Hairy. So just maybe there was never a Halo to slip. Unlike your more recent subtle change into a poster who enjoys sniping with holier than thou digs.

I commented earlier. It was in the form of a question. You could maybe try to answer it.

Can we still judge Webber and Farke over the last 21games? Is that still "a thing"? Was it ever "a thing"?

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@Nutty

I''d always argued pretty strongly against the notion that Webber and Farke were intrinsically linked in that way (the old ''if Farke goes then surely Webber has to go?'' argument) as I believe large chunks of what Webber is working on behind the scenes aren''t going to reap immediate benefits. What Webber is doing in the project, Farke is just an aspect of that.

Could you judge Farke after 21 games of this season? Sure it seems a pretty decent sample size but any number of games is always going to be arbitrary. Farke could be pulling up trees at game 21 then lose 10 on the bounce and return to uncertainty.

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I agree Kingo. They aren''t linked like that and were never meant to be. I understood the idea was that we could change the head coach with a minimum disruption to the rest of the staff . That only works if the rest of the staff are Webber appointments.

As for the 21 games. I don''t see the significance of 21 unless it was the 21st game of the season. But the last 21 games was the number they were being judged on. Is there any significance in 21 games?

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Asking the wrong person there- don''t remember mentioning anything about 21 games.

But I was happy to give judgement on his initial 50 odd games where he hadn''t done well- we''ve picked up since then though obviously.

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That all sounds a bit too complicated to me Nutty!

It''s never been a "thing" as far as I''m concerned. Personally I don''t go along with this 10/21 games in which to judge performance. Obviously DF has to be judged, like everyone else at the club, but there are so many things to consider and certainly he has had a huge amount of upheaval to cope with both in and out. On top of that there was a big learning curve for him personally. All these things point to him needing to be given a decent length of time to get things right. Setting an arbitrary number of games doesn''t make sense to me. We are making progress and team spirit is high so it just isn''t an issue.

By and large it is obvious when a managers time is up. I doubt Hurst going was much of a surprise to anyone for instance. Regardless of the number of games he was in charge it was obvious things were getting worse. I''ve never had that feeling with Farke.

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It''s certainly a rummun Kingo. Does anyone know the significance of 21 games?

Now I guess it''s either 14 games or 60 games. 24 points from 14 games looks pretty good. I prefer to judge on that. 84 from 60 not so good. If 21 games is still a thing I believe it''s 32 points from 21.

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I will give some credit where its due. I don''t like some of the things he says or comes out with (although some recent signs he''s learning and modifying that a bit) but in terms of recruitment of players on a budget he''s done pretty well.

You won;t get credit from me for selling good players for a decent price (anyone can do that) and the kids that have come through were all recruited under the previous academy regime but the recruitment of Zimmerman, Trybull, Leitner, Hernandez, Stiepermann, Vrancic, Krul and Pukki has been very good and the decision to give Tettey a new contract shows a promising grasp of reality. Hard to know how much the german signings are down to Webber''s knowledge or Farke''s (or both) but whichever is the case it has served us well.

I do think he left us a bit short at full back at the start of the season and Husband and Franke his obvious black marks so far but any team will make a few dud signings.

The bar in football is so low though that anyone with a modicum of common sense seems to stand out as competent.

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Interesting test coming up as well with Farke''s contract. He will be starting to get noticed now and he''s out of contract in the summer. When does the club twist and offer him a new one?

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Don;t recall saying that Nutty.

We''ve obviously had to embark on this project because of Delia and U remain unconvinced that its not going to make it very difficult for us to be competitive long term because it relies on having and retaining an excellent coach and consistently top notch recruitment and that is hard to sustain.

However, looking at the league this season and the quality of our team up against our competitors and an opportunity clearly presents itself because I don;t feel that I have seen anyone better than us. Obviously another promotion to the premier league would change things hugely and indeed enable us to really build on this model which in truth, would have been better implemented from a position of strength when we were in the top flight rather than reactively due to us having no choice!

Lets hope we can keep going and achieve the unexpected.

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The 21 games thing was it being 4 wins in 21. At the time it was a pathetic record and fans could rightly be concerned. Since then, the last 21 have obviously picked up a greater number of wins and points, which I think we can all agree is very satisfactory.

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]Mike

I don''t keep a record of your posts but some are unforgettable.

Like all that Billy big bolloxing about £250. Just because you have more money to throw around doesn''t make your opinion worth more than anyone else''s. It''s just boorish behaviour but fits well with the idea that more money is better and richer people are better.

You think I should have taken your bet? I haven''t got £250 to risk and, as I said at the time, if I had the bookies would have given me much better odds than evs.

However a poster called xymox took it. Or tried to. I wasn''t surprised it appeared to fall on deaf ears....[/quote]

Still havin a dig, still not willing to up the standard of debate, still having pops but not able to accept the same back...

Go on try be polite, it''s good... we might even end up friends :o)

PS. The rich thing is most amusing... reckon alot of my mates will be having a chortle at that..

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