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Bournemouth & Watford ' Allegedly ' Sniffing Around Jamal Lewis.

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nutty nigel wrote the following post at 29/06/2018 4:31 PM:

keyboard warrior

noun

informal

a person who makes abusive or aggressive posts on the Internet, typically one who conceals their true identity.

Let’s not forget Canary call Mr Nutty, that is your true name? No hidden identity!? So in summary we have Social Media and Canary Call to gage opinion. Both are utterly damning in their verdict. Case closed!

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[quote user="JF"]nutty nigel wrote the following post at 29/06/2018 4:24 PM:

JF wrote:

Different times, internet polls are where it’s at now👍🏻

How convenient. No need to support the club, buy tickets or go to games. As long as you can use social media you can have your say. Will it catch on?

Don’t like it myself but you can’t stand in the way of progress and change 👍🏻[/quote]
I love it JF. It means we can have a right old tear up online that will not make the slightest difference to anything that happens at Carrow Road. 

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[quote user="JF"]nutty nigel wrote the following post at 29/06/2018 4:31 PM:

keyboard warrior

noun

informal

a person who makes abusive or aggressive posts on the Internet, typically one who conceals their true identity.

Let’s not forget Canary call Mr Nutty, that is your true name? No hidden identity!? So in summary we have Social Media and Canary Call to gage opinion. Both are utterly damning in their verdict. Case closed![/quote]
There is a hidden identity but no abusive or aggressive posts. 
BTW people do call me nutty in person. However not all of them since it''s been my id on here...

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@Nutty

A touch touchy today...

Going back a couple of pages but I actually broadly agree with you- there are some here who won''t give credit where it is due. For instance the idea that the shouldn''t be credited for the appointment of Lambert because of McNally is silly. I also don''t think they deserve stick for Naismith and Jarvis as they were just letting McNally and Neil, the two guys in charge of this sort of thing do what they thought was right. The uproar of some if Smith & Jones had nixed a deal for a player as they didn''t think it was financially correct would have been huge.

Similarly I don''t think Smith & Jones deserve credit for the finding and development of Lewis or Maddison as that is just leaving the football people to do their job as any sensible owner should do.

Where I do hold them responsible is for the sort of things they are directly responsible for- managerial appointments, financial management, long term strategy.

So for me they''ve created the financial environment and situation through their poor decision making that has us over a barrel when bids come in and forces the manager and sporting director to eternally try to ''do more with less.'' Hanging on to failing managers for too long, hiring expensive and washed up mates to run the club and in the longer term refusing to consider new investment.

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Never touchy Kingo.

The things you hold them responsible for are just part of being a football league club and not things that happen to our club alone.

What championship club doesn''t have to restructure after parachute payments run out?

Fans of every club believe managers Are sacked/not sacked at the right time.

All owners choose who is on their boards.

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I never claimed these things were happening to our club alone Nutty.

But I only really care about Norwich and the decisions made here. Just because other fans thing their managers should have been sacked earlier doesn''t make the decisions made here correct.

Just because all owners choose who is on their board doesn''t make the decision to hire a known failure like Moxey any smarter.

Just because other clubs have to restructure doesn''t make the model they''ve chosen above criticism.

So the fact other clubs have to deal with similar circumstances is pretty irrelevant.

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This is exactly my point Kingo. The anti Smith & Jones stuff is not about how our club performs compared to others. It''s about a standard that''s been set for them alone. It''s personal in other words.

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Very different things ''slim.

But if you believe not then why aren''t there riots? After all said and done the folk who didn''t want Chase out didn''t protest just like the folk who don''t want Smith and Jones out aren''t protesting. So that''s an interesting question to ask those who want them out.

The riots didn''t remove Chase. If anything he dug in more and took the protesters on every step of the way. Only Geoffrey Watlings money removed him.

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i think the Telegraph interview and the way we are not for sale has caused this towards Delia & MWJ

money is tight and will become even tighter in football with more money in PL and other championship clubs being taken over and the club is going to be given to someone with less money than Delia and MWJ is a concern for some

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for me it i have nothing personal against Delia and MWJ as long as they do the best they can for NCFC

i wonder if they are missing out by not showing willing to sell the club only time will tell when Tom gets the club if it will be good or bad just like any new owner etc

i am worried that Tom does not have the wealth as a safety net ,what would happen if the club needed some money ?

but nothing personal if it was someone else i would feel the same

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Of course it is partly personal- it is personal to me because they are the owners of my club.

It is clearly also personal to you Nutty- you like these owners and defend pretty much everything they do to the hilt.

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Kingo I like the club we have now and am grateful to them for building it. So I have something to lose. I also am not a believer in more money must mean better club. Those who don''t like the club we have now and who covet other people''s money don''t really have much to lose so can happily roll the dice.

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I''m grateful for a lot they''ve done for this club but I think its strong to say they ''built'' it- it has after all been around before them and will survive long after they''ve gone.

Things and times change and I''m of the opinion that their time as effective owners has past. In an ideal world they sell up, make a nice profit as a reward for all they''ve done for the club and we move on to the next era. Unfortunalty with the decision to pass the club on to Tom that option seems unlikely.

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You misunderstand Kingo. Or maybe I wasn''t clear. The club has been here since 1902. I really like the model they built that we have now.

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From the archives. NN''s reply

Re: Straw Poll- Who would like Delia and MWJ to sell the club?

Sell to just anybody - No

Sell to someone who will carry on with the community values but also add to the pot - Yes.

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Miss Demeanor wrote the following post at 01/07/2018 1:12 AM:

From the archives. NN''s reply

Re: Straw Poll- Who would like Delia and MWJ to sell the club?

Sell to just anybody - No

Sell to someone who will carry on with the community values but also add to the pot - Yes.

Is that not what we all want? No one is saying sell to just anybody. What a lot of fans have raised issue with is that since ‘that’ interview it’s plainly obvious that’s its a closed shop and their Nephew is getting it. They shot thmselves in the foot with that interview as that acknowledged the fans won’t like it but they don’t care

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Re: Straw Poll- Who would like Delia and MWJ to sell the club?

Sell to just anybody - No

Sell to someone who will carry on with the community values but also add to the pot - Yes.

that''s exactly what i want someone who has some wealth as a safety net for the club

My big worry is what if we have players that are not worth 10 / 20 million to get us out of a hole if it was not for Maddison and Murphy where would we be right now ?

We all think / know Tom has even less than Delia / MWJ thats my concern Where will Tom get money to invest if needed ?

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@Norfolkngood

Exactly.

I wouldn''t advocate a Tony Xia/Aston Villa style spending spree but we''ve already seen with the need to borrow money from fans for Colney upgrades that our current model struggles to fund even the essentials of running a football club.

I''d be happy with an owner who can generally allow us to spend most of what we bring in on new players. This is what happened with Fulham of late- they didn''t go out spending masses but if they sold a player for £10m odd it meant the manager could generally spend £8-9m on bringing in new players. We''ve made about £50m since January and I''d be surprised if even £10m of that has gone on fees thus far.

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[quote user="king canary"]@Norfolkngood

Exactly.

I wouldn''t advocate a Tony Xia/Aston Villa style spending spree but we''ve already seen with the need to borrow money from fans for Colney upgrades that our current model struggles to fund even the essentials of running a football club.

I''d be happy with an owner who can generally allow us to spend most of what we bring in on new players. This is what happened with Fulham of late- they didn''t go out spending masses but if they sold a player for £10m odd it meant the manager could generally spend £8-9m on bringing in new players. We''ve made about £50m since January and I''d be surprised if even £10m of that has gone on fees thus far.[/quote]
if you are using Fulham as your case study then you are not comparing like with like because Fulham have not been faced with the task of massively reducing their outgoings to match their income in the same way that Norwich has done.
At this point in time Norwich is having to recalibrate itself finacially due to the high wage earners still on its books. Get them out of the club and then in a couple of years time we may be in fulham''s current position whereby a higher proportion of our sales can go into re-investment instead of maintaining the club in a financially stable state.
But all this still requires the club to do things that make a section of the fans to become disgruntled. That is to say;
Are fans happy that we have to spend three or four years treading water until the club is financially stable?
If not, then would fans accept that, on reaching the Premier League we didn''t spend all our resources on upgrading players but kept a portion in reserve to spend after relegation (keep in mind the studies that show relegation is highly probable within three years)?
And finally, are fans happy that we are going to sell players at the £10m level after relegation (that is Jamal Lewis type players?
All three things would be neccessary in order to follow the Fulham model that you outline. But from what I can gather from this messageboard, when/if the club tries to do any of these things there always follows a chorus of moans and criticism.
The other thing I often hear is that we need a wealthy foreign investor to take over, but the posters never come up with names. It''s not good enough to say ''well such and such a club has just been taken over by a wealthy Chinese individual''. You need to come up with names of wealthy people who are willing to put money in without seeking to strip the club of its assets while at the same time allowing the club to keep its tribal identity.
Twelve months ago a lot of people were saying look how lucky Villa are to have Tony Xia as owner because of the huge amounts of money he was pumping on a gamble to get to the Premier League. Today, the talk is he wants to sell the club. So the future of Aston Villa now hangs on the choices to be made by somebody whose been badly burnt financially by English soccer. So I just don''t see he will be making choices on what''s best for the future of Aston Villa, which is not something you can say about our present owners, even if you disagree with them.

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@RTB

Of course I''m not comparing like for like because I''m advocating for a change. However I''d wager Fulham have had to reduce costs over time after their relegation from the Premier League, however the impact is mitigated by having an owner who can subsidise losses.

Also the idea that posters need to come up with names of people to buy the club is just fucking absurd. It isn''t the job of fans to identify millionaires to take over the club and to suggest you can''t advocate for a change of ownership with knowing someone who''d be interested in buying the club is patently ludicrous.

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[quote user="JF"]Miss Demeanor wrote the following post at 01/07/2018 1:12 AM:

From the archives. NN''s reply

Re: Straw Poll- Who would like Delia and MWJ to sell the club?

Sell to just anybody - No

Sell to someone who will carry on with the community values but also add to the pot - Yes.

Is that not what we all want? No one is saying sell to just anybody. What a lot of fans have raised issue with is that since ‘that’ interview it’s plainly obvious that’s its a closed shop and their Nephew is getting it. They shot thmselves in the foot with that interview as that acknowledged the fans won’t like it but they don’t care[/quote]
Is that what we all want JF? I don''t think so. In fact the term "community club" has been described as "tinpot" and used as ridicule in attacks on our owners.
But my opinion on this hasn''t changed and if you look back at the original thread I said that I believed it was the opinion of the owners and I still do. I guess where it all breaks down is in the different people''s definition of a community club. If you look at recent threads where posters claim we are a "so called community club" they have been about prices and asking for donations. This is not my definition of a community club. For me it''s not just about what the club can do for the community but also what the community can do for the club.
Our club is grounded solidly in the community but wasn''t always. If you think back to Chase times we weren''t a community club. There were very few shareholders and the club wasn''t really answerable to anyone. We certainly didn''t see the community standing up to be counted when the bank were calling the debt in. It took Geoffrey Watling buying him out before the community stepped up. At that point Smith, Jones and Foulger stepped up and invested. Later we had share two issues underwritten by Smith & Jones where the community stepped up to help and earlier this year the community stepped up again and the Canaries Bonds sold out in a few days. All this shows that the club has the confidence and support of the community. And of course the club is very visible in the community through their charity partners the CSF. And while the CSF is self funding there''s no doubt being the partner of our football club goes a long way to making that funding happen. Many individuals also don''t wait to see what the club can do for them and step up beside the club to make a difference in the community.
All this is why I take with a pinch of salt the claims that a protest group could be formed like happened with Robert Chase to force the current owners out. Because while there was still a reasonably sized minority supported Chase they didn''t really stand up to be counted when the protests started. However things are very different now with large numbers of the community   one way or another being stakeholders in the club.
It''s interesting that Miss Demeanor brought this up as the original thread was his and he said I made a good point and he agreed. But I suppose having multiple IDs it would be possible to have multiple opinions. Do you still agree MissD/?/Ron Manager[:^)]

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"When they go low, we go high!!"

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[quote user="king canary"]@RTB

Of course I''m not comparing like for like because I''m advocating for a change. However I''d wager Fulham have had to reduce costs over time after their relegation from the Premier League, however the impact is mitigated by having an owner who can subsidise losses.

Also the idea that posters need to come up with names of people to buy the club is just fucking absurd. It isn''t the job of fans to identify millionaires to take over the club and to suggest you can''t advocate for a change of ownership with knowing someone who''d be interested in buying the club is patently ludicrous.[/quote]

So this mythical millionaire (actually it would need a billionaire these days) who is going to take over and plough millions into our club while at the same time keep our community club status thriving and yet not taking anything out for himself may actually not exist at all?

In fact, I''d go further and say without a doubt such a person doesn''t exist. They would all want something in return.

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