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Jim Smith

Taking a step back from this "webberlution" business for a moment the home form and league position are

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not acceptable on any level and should not be excused.

With the players he has at his disposal Farke should have us higher in the league than this and at the vey least challenging for the top six. It has not been a good season.

I do not advocate sacking him but I do not share the optimism that we will improve next season when we will no doubt not have Tettey, Wes, Maddison, Oliveira and Leitner.

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Nor Gunn or Reed, who I thought decent again today at RB.

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Must admit I''d like to see this lot let off the leash in Lambert style especially now we effectively have 10 games to experiment We might concede a few but I bet we''d score a hatful with a higher pace and more directness.

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[quote user="Tumbleweed"]Must admit I''d like to see this lot let off the leash in Lambert style especially now we effectively have 10 games to experiment We might concede a few but I bet we''d score a hatful with a higher pace and more directness.[/quote]But you know its just not going to happen this season. DF  will keep to his kind of style and what we seen at home all season will carry onto May. The summer, with its transfer window, will be likely the most important window for Webber and Farke and while the fans will hold patience for this season, if there is not any improvement in points and goals in the next season, come around Christmas, its not hard to see the City fans start to really vent their frustrations, by then having held patience for 18 months. So for me, there is still time yet, but no football fan will forever accept constant 0-0 home results, least of all City fans.

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It will take a stroke of managerial genius to keep us in the championship next season. I’m sure we’ll be longing for another season of mid table mediocrity as we have witnessed this. What a fiasco.

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The reason why we are now is because of the time before Webber walked into the club not after. Annalise that not what is now.

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I’m analysing what is now and now is some of the worst football played at carrow rd in many many years. This is down to Farke and/or Webber. I have very little doubt that the players at this club are capable of better football and better results than this. Forget anything that went on before these two arrived.

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Thought we played well tonight. Unfortunate not to win it.

I think there would be far less complaints if some of our away wins had been at home instead but it''s not really happened for us at Carrow Road.

I dont think we have a top 6 squad and thats been apparent for the majority of the season. I think selling Pritchard probably dented that moreso.

Our back 4 / 5 our top 6 material. Past that we have a very good number 10, average other midfielders, average wingers and a very very average strikeforce.

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Anyone would do well to convince me that we didn’t start this season with a top six squad.

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Yes, but at least at the start of the season we had an over hyped view on Oliviera and also had Jerome and Pritchard.

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Forest had the better chances and should have won. Will cut DF some slack but he''ll have to hit the hround running next season. It feels like the 2nd season under Hughton now. Largely negative tactics and slow getting the ball forward. We won''t ever get out this league with shocking home form like this.

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Webber’s lack of class and cheap shot at Alex still haunting him as PNE are still fighting for the playoffs.

Without Gunn, Klose, Reed and Tettey next season, these 0-0 s could turn to defeats.

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[quote user="The gut"]I’m analysing what is now and now is some of the worst football played at carrow rd in many many years. This is down to Farke and/or Webber. I have very little doubt that the players at this club are capable of better football and better results than this. Forget anything that went on before these two arrived.[/quote]This accusation has been made quite a few times recently, on other threads. Is it really the worst, or is what is meant that the football is boring? A bit unEnglish even? Last season, with a squad that really should at least have made the play-offs , yes we scored loads of goals, but we conceded at a rate of 1.5 a game, and ended up gaining 1.15 points per game. We are now conceding only 1.05 goals a game.If the defence has been improved, that is a key part of what makes good football. It may be more for the purist, and dull to watch if you want end to end action, but it hardly counts as bad. No least because defence is the basis of what makes a successful side. Sort the defence out, so the default position is that you don''t lose, and you can build from there.It may not work (there is an obvious downside in that the attack may get starved) but it shouldn''t be a surprise that Farke is going this way, given his default-don''t-lose record last season of 16 wins 15 draws and only 3 defeats.

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@Purple

Football is subjective isn''t it? There is no way of proving ''this is good football'' or ''this is bad football'' objectively.

For me, the worst football I''ve ever seen from us was the second season under Hughton, followed by Grant.

The best was Lambert and some of Worthingtons stuff. I never enjoyed Neil''s as much as some as it seemed so unbalanced.

But each to their own and all that.

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In Laymen''s terms, Norwich City are solid, yet ineffective.

I can''t see anything better than that in the horizon because the system is flawed.

Farke would be highly unlikely to hold down a job at any other club in the football league, because unless you have top class personnel, you play a system that suits the squad. And we don''t.

Lambert would of still been in League One if he had have employed Farke''s style of tedium.

Transition? To what? To where?

It''s all a mirage.

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There is a small part of me that wonders....what if he wasn''t German?

What if he was an English manager without the fancy continental stylings and a good way with the media?

Would the same level of patience be extended?

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[quote user="king canary"]@Purple

Football is subjective isn''t it? There is no way of proving ''this is good football'' or ''this is bad football'' objectively.

For me, the worst football I''ve ever seen from us was the second season under Hughton, followed by Grant.

The best was Lambert and some of Worthingtons stuff. I never enjoyed Neil''s as much as some as it seemed so unbalanced.

But each to their own and all that.[/quote]KC, I think you can say objectively that Farke has improved the defence, and so made us harder to beat. The statistics bear that out. I would say, to use your examples, there is a significant contrast there with Neil, and with Hughton''s second season, where the philosophy seemed to be based on not conceding, without the defence - or the necessary defensive coaching - to make that plausible.My point was that posters seem to be ignoring that improvement under Farke, which surely has to be classed as an element of "good football", in their assessments. But I get that many find it boring to watch. And I might, if I saw more than four or five games a season...

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By objective metrics, yes he''s improved the defence. We''ve also gone backwards in most other measurable ways though- goals, points, league position etc.

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Tha aim of football is to out score the opposition. You can’t have played well if yet again you’ve failed to find the net or even trouble the keeper. There is no points available for possession and nice ineffective passing. Yet again an opposition defence has had one of its easiest run outs of the season, that’s not playing well

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I don’t think it’s lack of coaching, I watched a few games this year and we control the ball well, we actually control most games, the issue is quality and disruption by so called ego players, some of whom have been removed on loan others still here, but Farke football is a vast improvement, we’ve only lost 1 in 14 in the league.

Webber still has a lot to prove, if we can’t off load Naismith & Jarvis we still need to cover their estimated combined 3 million in wages next year, that’s a big lump off our finances next year.

Summer will go a long way in how good we’ll be next year.

We have some great potential players in Godfrey, Thompson & Lewis, if it’s likely we’ll lose Klose, Maddison, Oliveira, with Wes & Tettey moving on too, it’s going to be argued that next season will still this so called transition, but it’s not, it’s our level, every season will see sales and changes, no differ to the past.

Shame we ever signed Naismith & Jarvis little return for nearly 30 million outlay, huge to our club.

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Its certainly not the worst football technically we have seen at Carrow Road. Indeed, it is probably some of the most technically correct football we have seen at Carrow Road. But due to the lack of end product it is also some of the dullest.

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But Jim that’s down to lack of finishing at times, had Murphy or Maddison took their chances last night we would have won that last night.

I’m not convinced by any means that we have a squad destined for promotion next year, long way off in my opinion, but we’re playing decent football, just not moving forward quickly enough or taking chances.

Agree with a lot of comments, lose Tettey, Klose and Maddison in the summer and we’ll be in the shite! IMO

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I gave Farke the benefit of the doubt to start with but think he is losing the plot.

Slating your own players in public can''t do much for team morale - that''s Oliviera, Watkins, Murphy and Edwards that he''s done that to now.

Yes there has to be discipline and man management but i don''t like his style - I know the number of Oliviera haters are growing by the week but he''s still our best striker by a long stretch and to replace him with a totally ineffective third tier German replacement was simply cutting off his nose to spite his face.

Yes we have a very fit team now due to the tough training regime, but how about putting the ball in the box now and again - that way we might have a chance of finding the net.

I really hope he can turn things round for next season but without Maddison, Oliviera and a few other big wage earners it''s going to be a challenge.

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I like the style of play Farke is trying to implement and I still genuinely believe it could work. But with Oliviera our only real proven striker (and even that''s arguable) it''s looking like we''re going to have to create a lot of chances per game for any of our strikers to actually score, which might require a slight change in setup. Even then i''m not sure what we could significantly change. Maybe two up front just to relieve the pressure on one? I''m not sure that would be too conducive with our overall playing style but it''s an option I guess.

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I suppose if wanted 3 at the back we could go 3-5-2 instead of the 3-4-3ish we were playing a few weeks back

Something like...

Gunn

Zimmerman - Hanley - Klose

Pinto - Leitner - Tettey - Maddison - Lewis

Srbeny - Oliveira

Obviously you would be relying on full backs to supply all the width, but you could have Oliveira dropping short and Srbeny getting into the box

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Interesting. The "webberlution" , and the quality of football subjective or otherwise, are separate issues IMO.

The Webberlution ,some may say, is a reaction to a given set of financial circumstances . We are looking to exist on our income, which is falling, and we need to cut our cloth. Having spoken to some of the key individuals what I would say is that this is a very effective piece of PR.

Last night we saw a continued example of lots of possession in relatively neutral areas of the pitch. DF''s default is to keep the fullbacks wide in possession, but this leads to lack of bodies in transition - and Forest nearly scored twice in the first half because of it. Sides like Forest, Bolton , Ipswich, Burton work this out - leave the fullbacks and overload the key areas - so our play is restricted to areas where you are unlikely to score from. So I''m afraid I don''t see this as a revolution, I see it as a coach with a desire to play in a certain way, and not being able to break sides down. One goal at home in three games - caused ironically from a long ball, a cross and an unmarked header supports this view.

The reality is that at Colney there is a photograph of our goal celebration at Wembley after Jerome scores. All the players have now left to be replaced by ... well to be replaced. That is the reality of the revolution , and we will finish in our lowest league position for some time.

Peoples take on this largely reflects their agenda, or their overall take on the Club.

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I believe one of our problems is crossing. When we do decide to do it, they are in most cases poor.

Two stood out for me last night. Reed hot one across last night and there was no sign of movement in the box. If Holt had been playing he would have run in front of the defender and given himself a chance. Srbeny stood and waited.

Wes put one in during stoppage time and we put the header wide.

But the rest of the time they all hit the front man. Beckham was hailed as a good crosser of the ball. He didn''t have the pace to go past anyone but his initial movement gave him the half yard he needed to swing the ball over.

Countless times last night we stopped and allowed their full backs to show us the inside and a poor cross resulted.

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