greenwichcanary 0 Posted August 28, 2017 I had a feeling last year the club were heading for yet another long spell of championship mediocrity. It all felt abit 2005/06 last season did, Decent squad on paper yet underperforming,manager clearly struggling yet kept on. Now it feels like history is repeating itself. For those that don''t remember in 2007 in the glorious days of Peter grants management we bought a load of sub standard Scottish, European and Englishplayers no one had really ever heard of, the likes of Julian brellier, David strihavka, Ian Murray. All hyped up and yet all disasters and sold a few months later. Always worried me that this summers batch of intakes was the same, whilst I know the top division of bundeslga is decently standard are the lower leagues the same? I mean Timm klose played for one of the best teams in Germany and even he struggled with the championship at times last season and I mean Is playing for Dortmunds reserves going to be anywhere near the same intensity as playing in this league. I''m not saying I''m writing off this lot already but feels like my fears are being confirmed, I just hope they can prove me wrong as don''t want the same rubbish we had back then. I''m just ranting a bit here I know but frustrating as we''ve been here before. I really thought we''d learnt lessons and after 4/5 years in prem there''s no way we should be in this sort of position. Southampton went down to league 1 with us in 08/09 and look where they are now. Yes I know they have wealthy owners but still they are light years ahead of us and it''s a tad annoying. I fear we''re in for a long spell in this league and all the work of mcnally and lambert is being thrown away Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0 Posted August 28, 2017 * has been thrown away.This summer we deceided not to use our competitive adavantage we had over others in this league and condem ourselves to an average mid table championship team at best.It''s so horribly frustrating. We shouldn''t be in this position, completely self inflicted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dean Coneys boots 1,382 Posted August 28, 2017 Spot on Lincoln/ our team only just missed out last season and that was because we had a poor defence.Instead of replacing the hapless martin - the one constant in our dire defence of recent seasons, we kept him on and went for overhaul of an otherwise decent squad. Had we simply kept Irvine, signed two proven champ CB s and a decent LB - Dijks- I firnly believe we would be near the top. Instead we hit reboot a summer too early - aimed for mid table - and seem to have totally messed up with poor recruitment and too many risks. The board owe us explanations Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FenwayFrank 2,423 Posted August 28, 2017 Don''t remember you campaigning for Irvine to stay dean Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0 Posted August 28, 2017 Complete agree with the summer too early statement.We''ve done this summer, what should have happened next summer should promotion not been achieved this season.I will admit, I didn''t really want Irvine. In hindsight, I wish we''d stuck with him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dean Coneys boots 1,382 Posted August 28, 2017 No but I did advocate for Dijks and two good CB as our transfer business... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yorkshire Canary 118 Posted August 28, 2017 There are some similarities. After relegation from the PL under Worthington we got worse by the season and saw constant managerial change the good players being sold and dross bought apart from wes. It could be history repeating itself. I hope not but it quickly has that negative feel I fear this time next year the good players will have departed and we are trying to offload a load of unknown German players noone wants Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rogue Baboon 0 Posted August 28, 2017 The similarities are clearly there. In a way we are already seeing it with 2 key positions (GK & CM) being covered by loan players, a hallmark of the Roeder days Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,583 Posted August 28, 2017 [quote user="lincoln canary "]Complete agree with the summer too early statement.We''ve done this summer, what should have happened next summer should promotion not been achieved this season.I will admit, I didn''t really want Irvine. In hindsight, I wish we''d stuck with him.[/quote]If we had gone hell for leather, spunking millions on players, with long contracts, to get us up and then failed to get up, then we would have been properly up shit creek. We''d still have a large expensive squad, with literally no money coming in. That would lead to sure fire bankruptcy and a definite Roeder era revisit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A Load of Squit 5,066 Posted August 28, 2017 [quote user="Rogue Baboon"]The similarities are clearly there. In a way we are already seeing it with 2 key positions (GK & CM) being covered by loan players, a hallmark of the Roeder days[/quote]No, the Roeder days had us covering EVERY position with loan players. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0 Posted August 28, 2017 [quote user="Herman"][quote user="lincoln canary "]Complete agree with the summer too early statement.We''ve done this summer, what should have happened next summer should promotion not been achieved this season.I will admit, I didn''t really want Irvine. In hindsight, I wish we''d stuck with him.[/quote]If we had gone hell for leather, spunking millions on players, with long contracts, to get us up and then failed to get up, then we would have been properly up shit creek. We''d still have a large expensive squad, with literally no money coming in. That would lead to sure fire bankruptcy and a definite Roeder era revisit.[/quote]We didn''t need to go hell for leather, far from it. We just needed to keep Howson and Dorrans, sign Djiks and a proper centrehalf and we''d have been set. By releasing Ruddy, Bennet and Bassong and selling Jacob we''d have be fine financially. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,583 Posted August 28, 2017 FFS Lincoln. Howson didn''t want to be here and Dorrans was an average midfielder. And we''ve needed a whole new defence for a long time. One CB would not have been enough. I''ll let you off with Dijks though. I''m feeling generous. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0 Posted August 28, 2017 Dorrans, average!? Lol. You don''t get then do you. He was a decent player at this level. He''s been replaced by three midfielders that currently are not, and may not ever be. (Trybull, Vrancic, Steipermann) As for Howson wanting to leave, don''t be so niave. You don''t know that, your just trusting the spiel from Webber. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FenwayFrank 2,423 Posted August 28, 2017 So he wanted to stay did he Lincoln ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ginja 26 Posted August 28, 2017 [quote user="Herman"]FFS Lincoln. Howson didn''t want to be here and Dorrans was an average midfielder. And we''ve needed a whole new defence for a long time. One CB would not have been enough. I''ll let you off with Dijks though. I''m feeling generous.[/quote]I agree there''s no point arguing over keeping players who were actively disruptive towards the team and didn''t want to be here, I feel last season suffered for keeping too many players who didn''t want to be here. However I do feel that we missed the kind of player Howson/Dorrans offered on Saturday, midfielders capable of shielding the back four, Dorrans wasn''t exactly Messi but he got stuck in back to front, breaking up play and helping the defence. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yorkshire Canary 118 Posted August 28, 2017 I think both Lincoln and German are both half right. I liked dorrans and he would have done a job but accept that howson wanted out. I have no problem releasing our ageing defenders and ruddy but would have retained Bennett on much lower wages as back up if he had agreed a deal. Selling Jacob murphy gave us a cash windfall and allowed josh to step up which by and large he has. I would have prefered we dip into league 1 for defenders rather than Germany at least they would have been used to the physical side of the game and we would have had spare cash to go to the bank. It cannot be underestimated what a blow losing Pritchard was. Will we see klose again or will he move on who knows. Unfortunately we have brought in 3 defenders and incredibly they seem to be worse. I am a bit more optimistic about steipperman. Things have got off to a very bad start though I don''t think we will go down this season next one mind may well be a real relegation scrap Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0 Posted August 28, 2017 [quote user="FenwayFrank"]So he wanted to stay did he Lincoln ?[/quote]Who knows FF. But he was under contract and had heard nothing from him prior to any transfer that suggested he was unhappy and wanted to leave. If the club wanted him, I''m sure he''d have stayed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,583 Posted August 28, 2017 "He added: “Jonny, via his agent, made it very clear during my first week in the job he didn’t want to be here and wanted to move back to the north.“It’s been a really challenging start for Daniel [Farke], being met with two senior players in Jonny and Graham Dorrans making it clear they didn’t want to be here. They were both desperate to go from well before he arrived.”"I suppose Webber could be lying. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0 Posted August 28, 2017 [quote user="Herman"]"He added: “Jonny, via his agent, made it very clear during my first week in the job he didn’t want to be here and wanted to move back to the north.“It’s been a really challenging start for Daniel [Farke], being met with two senior players in Jonny and Graham Dorrans making it clear they didn’t want to be here. They were both desperate to go from well before he arrived.”"I suppose Webber could be lying.[/quote]Exactly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,583 Posted August 28, 2017 Ok, Webber''s a liar then. Nice one Lincoln. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ROBFLECK 131 Posted August 28, 2017 I agree with a lot that has been said here, but the "Dorrans debate" is just not significant...the "Dijks debate" is! Our left back is cr@p and our CB''s are underwhelming!I had some hope when I saw Zimmermann play at Fulham... but all my optimism has gone now! We are NOT going to challenge for promotion this season neither are we going to improve on last season defensively unless a miracle is performed by our sporting director. I was seething on saturday and had the same feeling as I did after the 7-1 drubbing by Colchester. I agree with the point that we threw away a lot of opportunities after the first promotion to the PL with Lambert...this club could have been a settled PL outfit and I still believe that, even though we don''t have the wealth some other clubs have Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ginja 26 Posted August 28, 2017 [quote user="Herman"]Ok, Webber''s a liar then. Nice one Lincoln.[/quote]Funny how neither Howson or Dorrans denied the claims of Webber?It''s like he was telling the truth... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites