Nelson Oliviera

[Bill 1,788]

Totally, totally clueless !It doesn''t matter if it''s in Row Z, Row K, A foot over, or clips the

outside of the post, they are ALL misses, and when assessing shooting

accuracy, they are all just as bad as each other in terms of the end

result.But is not the end result that is being judged is it ? It is your absurd claim that you can judge players by meaningless shyte.That the suprb pass to put Murphy through in the 2nd half was the same "a successful pass is a successful pass, it doesn''t matter if it''s 2 yards, 10 yards or 50 yards" as a 2 yard tap when taking a short corner is beyond absurd.If a player runs past a couple of defenders but sees only one other player up with and attempts a cross that is a failure, whereas a defender wanting to run the clock down and taps it around his final third of the pitch can clock up a few successful passes. Anyone watching the game will see that and value both in the contrext of the game.Whereas saddos sat at home looking at shyte, that has much relevance as horoscopes, have a better perspective ! ! !dearie lord me

[Rogue Baboon 0]

Jerome drops deep & runs into the wide channels a lot more than Oliveira. He gets commended for his work rate.

Oliveira gets no service so drops deep & wide to get involved in the play & gets slated for trying?

[Thisisbabyish 0]

After the 20th failed backheal you''d think you''d show your opponent a little more respect especially being 0-0 at home after 80 minutes.

Spent far too much time out wide when he should have been in the 6yd box.

I''m all for arrogance and confidence when you''ve got the ability to back it up!

[Baldyboy 0]

[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="Hercules Parrot"]No. They merely fill the heads of the halfwitted with meaningless shyte.[/quote]You''re one to talk about meaningless shyte, with the amount of absolute horse$hit you''ve posted in the vast majority of your 15k posts![quote]There are almost NO ''facts'' about a game that are relevant to how a player, or a team, played - only an idiot with little grasp of the game would think they do.[/quote]I guess that every major football club in the world is packed with ''idiots with little grasp of the game then'', as statistics form a vital and integral part of player and performance analysis, and only an idiot with little grasp of modern football would think otherwise.[quote]If only on the basis that there is never ANY context in which those ''facts'' are put ie a shot off target that his row z is equivalent to one that just goes inches wide of the post[/quote]It doesn''t matter if it''s in Row Z, Row K, A foot over, or clips the outside of the post, they are ALL misses, and when assessing shooting accuracy, they are all just as bad as each other in terms of the end result.Similarly, a successful pass is a successful pass, it doesn''t matter if it''s 2 yards, 10 yards or 50 yards.What most are arguing about are the ''intangibles'', the work rate of a players, their on-pitch leadership, their reaction to bad tackles or poor refereeing, things that are much harder (if not virtually impossible at times) to quantify with statistics. I''m not trying to do that, I''m simply using the factual stats to illustrate provable points, thus if I say that Vrancic was highly accurate with his passing - he was, but it doesn''t mean that the majority of those passes weren''t short range and either sideways or backwards - but again, that''s not the argument I''m making...[/quote]

Indy, how many strikers do you see nowadays that don''t drift out wide during a game?

The days of a striker just being central have long gone!

[Rogue Baboon 0]

If we are basing this on heatmaps, and their relevance, lets also look at other teams.

Norwich v Burton:

https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1192366/Live/England-Championship-2017-2018-Norwich-Burton

Man Utd v Basel:

https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1238291/Live/Europe-UEFA-Champions-League-2017-2018-Manchester-United-FC-Basel-1893

Bayern Munich v Anderlecht:

https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1238302/Live/Europe-UEFA-Champions-League-2017-2018-Bayern-Munich-Anderlecht

Now look at Lukakus & Lewandowksis heat maps compared to Oliveiras. They also didn''t spend much time in the box either, & Oliveria had a lot more touches than either apparently...

[Keith Scott 243]

I''d argue the only stupidity shown is from the likes of you and Paul

who, as proven on other threads can''t wait to stick the knife in to

Nelson at the first possible opportunity. How is dropping your most

lethal striker, in superb goal scoring form, who probably has the best

goals per min ration in the league, who coincidentally started in all of

our biggest victories last season, against a team who were always going

to park the bus, anything other than pure, unadulterated, stupidity!? More of a game for Jerome? I recall Sunderland pretty much

sat back and played on the counter for 90 mins. I also recall Jerome

starting that game. How did that one work out Hogey? Did we break them down with Jerome on the pitch? As much as i like

Jerome, we nearly always look a more toothless prospect when he starts. It''s no coincidence that recently when Jerome has started we haven''t scored until he has been subbed with Nelson. Can''t believe people are critcising him for dropping deep to get involved and running the flanks last night (almost certainly just following instructions from the manager!) Desperate stuff. Honestly the first below par game he has and the likes of you and Paul can''t wait to jump all

over him. Strange behaviour from so called Norwich supporters.........

[Rogue Baboon 0]

Funny that the Sunderland game gets brought up as I checked Jerome''s heatmap (the overriding authority apparently) for that game and guess what...

https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1192344/Live/England-Championship-2017-2018-Norwich-Sunderland

Jerome was in the box less than Oliveria was on Tuesday...

[hogesar 9,619]

[quote user="Keith Scott"]I''d argue the only stupidity shown is from the likes of you and Paul

who, as proven on other threads can''t wait to stick the knife in to

Nelson at the first possible opportunity. How is dropping your most

lethal striker, in superb goal scoring form, who probably has the best

goals per min ration in the league, who coincidentally started in all of

our biggest victories last season, against a team who were always going

to park the bus, anything other than pure, unadulterated, stupidity!? More of a game for Jerome? I recall Sunderland pretty much

sat back and played on the counter for 90 mins. I also recall Jerome

starting that game. How did that one work out Hogey? Did we break them down with Jerome on the pitch? As much as i like

Jerome, we nearly always look a more toothless prospect when he starts. It''s no coincidence that recently when Jerome has started we haven''t scored until he has been subbed with Nelson. Can''t believe people are critcising him for dropping deep to get involved and running the flanks last night (almost certainly just following instructions from the manager!) Desperate stuff. Honestly the first below par game he has and the likes of you and Paul can''t wait to jump all

over him. Strange behaviour from so called Norwich supporters.........[/quote]

See, you can post sensibly. Knew you had it in you, just needed the confidence. You can thank me later.

[westcoastcanary 173]

Yippee! Welcome to the LTSS Club, Rogue Baboon! (Let''s Take Stats Seriously)

[king canary 7,580]

I reckon he might be in the SAHBNC club (stats are helpful but need context) ;)

[Len 74]

Hopefully we can sell Oliveira in the new year window for around what was offered in the summer. The danger in hanging on to him is that his value decreases as we struggle to score goals.

[king canary 7,580]

As long as he keeps scoring goals his value will be fine and he''s scoring goals so far. I''d dread to think where we''d be if we had sold him.

[westcoastcanary 173]

[quote user="king canary"]I reckon he might be in the SAHBNC club (stats are helpful but need context) ;)[/quote] [:D]

[Len 74]

A good player to have no doubt, but we could buy several with £12m.We might be stuck with Jarvis, Naismith and possibly Klose, but we''ll potentially need to replace Hoolahan, Martin and Jerome within the next couple of seasons.We''ll need to buy another keeper or two in the near future too.

[Rogue Baboon 0]

SAUIWC club - Thats stats are utterly irrelevant without context. Heatmaps doesn''t tell us anything, doesn''t tell us anything. Actually witnessing the game has told me a lot more than any list of stats

[Keith Scott 243]

[quote user="hogesar"][quote user="Keith Scott"]I''d argue the only stupidity shown is from the likes of you and Paul

who, as proven on other threads can''t wait to stick the knife in to

Nelson at the first possible opportunity. How is dropping your most

lethal striker, in superb goal scoring form, who probably has the best

goals per min ration in the league, who coincidentally started in all of

our biggest victories last season, against a team who were always going

to park the bus, anything other than pure, unadulterated, stupidity!? More of a game for Jerome? I recall Sunderland pretty much

sat back and played on the counter for 90 mins. I also recall Jerome

starting that game. How did that one work out Hogey? Did we break them down with Jerome on the pitch? As much as i like

Jerome, we nearly always look a more toothless prospect when he starts. It''s no coincidence that recently when Jerome has started we haven''t scored until he has been subbed with Nelson. Can''t believe people are critcising him for dropping deep to get involved and running the flanks last night (almost certainly just following instructions from the manager!) Desperate stuff. Honestly the first below par game he has and the likes of you and Paul can''t wait to jump all

over him. Strange behaviour from so called Norwich supporters.........[/quote]

See, you can post sensibly. Knew you had it in you, just needed the confidence. You can thank me later.

[/quote]Yes yes yes Hogey. That''s all very good. But I notice you didn''t address why you are so desperate to jump on Oliveira''s back at every possible opportunity. Or how exactly we are better at breaking teams down with Jerome in the side when all the evidence suggests otherwise. Unless of course I have opened your eyes to the absolute guff you are spouting with this thread. In which case do feel free to return the gratitude....