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deserves some praise for the loan players he has brought in - they are quality improvements to the squad, especially when you look at the limited plyers actually available to us,  and should help us move up the table in the short term.

Well done NW - a good few days work.

However

Why does he seem to want to buy his way out of a problem rather than coach it?  Of the three areas of the team the season starts with the attack as the strongest, then defence and then midfield.

The attack suffers from confidence,arrogance, off field problems then injury and rather than use the talented youngsters ad squad to hand he rushes out and signs another striker (albeit one who willhave a positie impac for us) when he had yet to try Jarvis, zipper or hendo in the Ashton support role.  Zipper was superb and I am sure the other two would do equally as well - yet he ''panic'' loans a striker using up some of his transfer kitty. (Not a moan at Lisbie - the quality of the signing is beyond complaint.

Defence - has a set of experienced players who can comfortably face up to the strikers in this league IF only a set of four could have some leadership, organisation and discipline drilled into them.  All four are to blame but, no surprise to any of you I know, the captain and most experienced player at the back has to shoulder most responsibility for being repeatedly dragged out of position, failing to read the game, abdicating responsibility and losing his player to a colleague, all to willing to point the finger of blame when he should only be looking in the mirrior, being weak in the header and unable to marshall the 3 defenders around him.  But even with Flem and some N Ireland type discipline we should keep more clean sheets than not - but Worthy appears unable to coach the changes into his team - so he rushed out and signs a good defender as a replacement - but unless the fundamentalks change, the leadership and organisation get embedded nothing in the defencive performances will change.  Signing a defender when more than half of the central defensive pairings (including the most successful last season - charlie &  Flem - have yet to be tried this season seems profligate given our limited transfer budget.

Midfield - we still only have Jarrett, Hughes, Safri and Marney as recognised first team midfielders.  IMO only 1 has the necessary quality to cut it in this league yet Worthy continues to proclaim this are of the pitch is satisfactory - poppycock.   Unlike defence where we have the ability but not the ability to mould them into a defence this choice of midfielders will never be good enough totake us where we want to be in this league.  If we do get promoted it will be down to the strength of the defence and attacking options rather than the centre of the park.  A loan signing was and remains most desperately needed here, whatever eulogies Neil Adams was paid to print in last nights article - one mans hunting as a pack of three lions is a school teachers frustration at the kids chasing after a ball and failing to keep any shape...   

Good work Nige, you are now getting near a decent squad but the hard bit remains in convincing me you can actually coach in the changes needed to make us promotion contenders. 

Fingers crossed and heres hoping to a good result tonight.

OTBC 

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another quality post zipper, and sadly the theme of which you have written many times and most of us on here have endorsed, again many times

after my last dig at our manager i decided to go along to colney to see what actually went on up there, sadly had to go on a friday(when it appears they only do "light" training) and we arrived at the start or damn near it when the first team squad were doing one touch exercises (5 mins or thereabouts), they then went on to corner and defence work (about 10-15 mins) when worthy and livermore were constantly confering and the players looked around blankly for instructions

after that they played a game 20 mins or so each way and that was it!!

have to say it all looked very relaxed and no sign of losing the dressing room or anything like that but hardly a workout considering the work we think is needed - to those of you who think criticism of worthy is treason, no i don''t pretend to know everything about football, but in any line of work, indeed life, if something is not clicking or working then extra work has to be put in to compensate and to bring things into balance, in this case to effect a TEAM who work for each other, who know their role - granted it is not the players'' fault they are played out of position, or that they are not picked due to a worthy fave cemented in their preferred position

i am not convinced our team are being coached in the right way either zipper, and haven''t been convinced of this for a long, long time.  I don''t know what the answer is, it seems wasteful to keep getting short term fixes in to cover up the underlying problem - and if the new loan defender davenport is to replace shackell i dread to think what that will do to the youngster - he is not the problem, nor to a certain extent is fleming, nor hucks, nor anyone, it is coaching, or lack of it, that is holding us back

sorry, rant for september over!!

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Some people are never happy, are they Zipper!

Why do you say Lisbie is a ''panic buy''? I''m also of the opinion that Hendo/Jarvis should be given a chance, but obviously Worthy doesn''t agree. So he loans another striker with experience to cover our injuries - it seems thought out to me not a panic buy.

What Worthy''s thoughts about defence are I don''t know, Davenport has surprised me as I was expecting someone with more experience to challenge Fleming''s place. We do have experienced backup with Charlton and Doc, but he obviously doesn''t rate either for CB (I would agree re Charlton, too short, but would like to see more of the Doc myself). Do either actually challenge Fleming though? Don''t you need a right footer for his place, and aren''t Doc and Charlton left footers? I don''t know which foot Davenport prefers, it would be interesting to know.

As for midfield, I agree that this should be the priority area but think you are being harsh on who we have. I know you don''t rate Hughes at all, I thought (based on the Plymouth game) that he is easily good enough for us in the Championship. Marney also has his moments, but is young and will make mistakes. Brennan can cover as LM but it isn''t his natural position. JJ I am worried about. Hucks just shouldn''t be played as left midfield in a 4-4-2 I''m afraid. We need at least one CM, one RM and preferably one LM. Lots more work to do.

Re the tactics, I was happy with the way the midfield worked on Saturday in the first half. It seemed to me that Marney/Brennan pushed up wide when we had the ball, and tucked in nicely when we didn''t. The full backs also pushed up more than previously, maybe because they didn''t have to cover for Hucks... Defence sat too deep in the 2nd half, and I don''t know if this is Worthy''s coaching or Fleming''s confidence about his pace. Probably a bit of both.

I don''t believe Worthy is the strongest tactician, he has covered for this previously by building a good team (he is excellent on the transfer market) but for some reason he couldn''t do this over the summer. I still don''t understand why we letJonsonn go, we had too many players to replace and its really bitten us.

To summarise;

- I''m happy with the midfield we have, but we don''t have enough depth at all

- I don''t agree with signing Lisbie, but understand Worthy''s logic and think he has found a good player to fill the gap he saw

- I''m pleased we have got such an exciting young prospect in Davenport, but am surprised it isn''t someone with more experience

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Sorry Putney Canary, but I don''t see where you are coming from when you say

"- I don''t agree with signing Lisbie, but understand Worthy''s logic and think he has found a good player to fill the gap he saw"

I''m guessing you''d prefer to give Hendo or Jarvis a chance. But to be fair, Henderson has little first team experience, and with the crowd on his back, become a scapegoat. As for Jarvis, he only made his second outing for the reserves last night, and i''d doubt if he''d have lasted more than an hour in a first team game. Worthy didn''t know Mcveigh would play as well as he did, and with Hucks suspended, Leon injured, and Ashton looking like he can get injured at anytime, I feel Lisbie is the ideal signing.

He''s got experience, he''s quick and skillful, and i''d even say i''d prefer him to Jeffers (who is fastly over-rated based on one 1/2 season at Everton where he scored a few)

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I agree completely with the coaching criticism. It worries the hell out of me.

I also agree that quite often it seems the solution is already here (see McVeigh and Doherty now, and Safri last season) but Nigel would rather "import" than turn to the players he already has.

Seems sad.

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[quote]another quality post zipper, and sadly the theme of which you have written many times and most of us on here have endorsed, again many times after my last dig at our manager i decided to go along to ...[/quote]

Thanks for the insight into the prep for what was at the time a crucial game - hardly awe inspiring is it? 

It supports my view that NW finds it is easier to spend money on problems when the solution is one of no cost and within your own hands.  Perhaps he should call Boothroyd or Sanchez on how to get the players to defend as a unit!   But that would be admitting a problem of hisow making, rather than one of the players underperforming...

Without fundamental changes in coaching we could loan in John Terry or Rio Ferdinand and things will not improve at the back.

As you point out putney, watched individually the defenders look like they are having good games;  unfortunately defending is a team effort and it was, as you admit, woeful on sat, particularly in the second half.  This means that the players can not have played well.   Fortunately we were ''only'' playing plymouth so no harm was done but it does explain why no I am not happy.  It is not the signings I am unhappy with, far from it, just questioning a throw moneyat the problem approach rather than solve it from your own good resources.

As I have repeatedly said we should  be able to perm just about any 4 from the 8 defenders (incl Flem) on the books to produce a secure defence without the need to spend part of our transfer budget on another central defender. 

It is expecting an awful lot of a 22 year old to provide us with organisation and leadership at the back when playing alongside the club captain...

OTBC

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I have to laugh. Not having a dig at individual posters, but when you read across threads and several posters, you rather get an impression of one half saying "we need to sign some more quality NOW" and the other half saying "why has he signed these players... why not play the younger players we have".If he doesn''t do what someone wants, he''s ''lost the plot'' or ''hasn''t got a clue''. One half say ''we need experience'' while the other half say ''we need to bring the youngsters on''.The England cricket team''s success has been based on consistency, picking the same players on the basis that they are good enough, irrespective of their last performance. Sure enough, as a team, they have succeeded. The Aussies are past maters at it.If Worthy sticks with players he''s ''showing favouritism'' or ''can''t see that so-and-so isn''t good enough''. It''s the same with managers. Fans want consistency, but also to chop and change manager as soon as you have a run of bad results.If we get promoted this season, will the people who wanted him out still wish he''d gone after 6 games...?

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Putney: "I still don''t understand why we letJonsonn go", ok let me explain: he was a winger/forward who in a season failed to score or even provide an assist. Let''s put this in perspective, Hughes and Colin both already have assists to their names this term. What''s more Colin is a young full-back still learning the English game so let''s not use the "Jonson needed time to adjust to the English game" excuse.Secondly regarding the issue of training, Yes, we should train certain aspects of the game into the Players esp the youngsters, but in the case of Flemming - if your advancing years are losing you your pace and your leap no amount of training is going to help you regain that.

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amarillo

With reference to the England cricket team (wish we were so lucky as to have a team which played together with so much passion and belief!) - i don''t think any of our players are individually not up to the task, it is more a question of the mix of the team and the tactics employed by the coaches which worry me, and this has worried me for some time!

I am all for youth being given a chance, but the youngsters then need someone experienced on the pitch in a central position to guide them.  We at present have Fleming as captain who doesn''t possess those qualities, or if he does they are not obvious at the moment.  We have great individual players - Greeno, Hucks, Ashton etc, but they are not all playing to their true potential.  Granted we have had injuries (and a current suspension) which halts the flow and consistency of the make up of the team, but there is something not quite right and personally I put that down to coaching

As for favourites, Worthy is as guilty as the next man for this, however, we all realise that some players (especially last season) played and stayed in the team at the expense of better alternatives. Sadly, by the time this was addressed it was just a bit too late.  I don''t want Worthy sacked for the sake of it - I just want him to play the BEST eleven in their rightful position and get them all playing as a team.  Yes, it isn''t easy, but if Luton, Watford etc can do it on lesser resoures why can''t we?

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Sorry but I can''t read posters names against their posts so I can''t answer properly!

The chap on 470 posts - yes, I would rather we play our youth (especially Jarvis, I''m a fan) but understand Worthy''s reasonings (as you obviously do too!) and so won''t criticise getting a loan striker in. Lisbie should be great for us.

Amarillo - just so long as the ''criticism'' is constructive (as this thread is) then its fine. Its when it turns into a slagging match that I get a problem. You are right, Worthy can never please everyone, but some have been hysterical on these boards! Re the cricket, I agree that consistency is important, but can you see Bell retaining his place for the winter tour? I hope not! Sometimes you do need a change, and its healthy to have competition for places. At the moment Flem seems undroppable, its not good for the team, or his own game.

Zipper - I understand what you are saying re the defence and to a large extent I agree. However, I think we need a proven, experienced leader at the back who can control the defence during games, and that Flem isn''t doing this well enough. Maybe without Flem in the team Shacks can do it, or maybe Worthy thinks that Davenport can do it, but they seem a bit young to me for this responsibility. We don''t have anyone else at the club who can do this, meaning who is realistically providing Fleming with competition for his place?;

- Doc is not confident enough (perhaps just not good enough full stop)

- Charlton can play CB but is too short and anyway better at LB, but not as good as Drury

- Colin can play CB but hasn''t for us yet, and is also young and inexperienced

As for the Colney report, thanks, its always interesting to hear about what goes on in training! However, isn''t it normal for any team to have a relatively light work out the day before a game? I wouldn''t read too much into that, and remember any proper tactical work would be done behind closed doors

I know I''m coming across as very defensive of Worthy, I do think he is a good manager and has been great for us, but I also see that there are shortcomings with his tactical nous. I would advocate getting in better coaching support for Nige, to augment (or replace?) Steve Foley. Worthy is an excellent man manager, is great at transfers, good with the press, great relationship with the board, but yes needs more help tactically.

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Gazza, the only qualities I can see you list ahead of saying Fleming doesn''t have any of them are "passion, belief, central position and experience". Which of those things doesn''t Fleming have?Any why have so many people spent the last month bemoaning our defence? I''m not saying we''re perfect, and correct me if I''ve mis-read the table or something, but on the stats we currently have the 13th best defence (conceded 8 in 7 games) but the 20th best attack (scored 6 in 7). Had we scored 2 goals per game we''d be up near the top by now....So to anyone who says ''can''t Worthy see what''s wrong with our defence'' I''d say: er, no, nor can I, it''s the strike force that seems to be under-performing. Witness not getting a hat-full against Plymouth when they really should have done.Last season, I grant you, defence was our problem. But not so far this season. Is Fleming the new Holt, the player everyone loves to demonise? Whyyyyyy?!

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ah some of you make me laugh. Yeah, thanks for the insight Gazza about the training, we now all know where it''s going wrong. Worthy talking to other coaching staff, working on set pieces, and as for having a 20 minute game of football, my god it''s outrageous. Get onto Delia does she know what''s happening?! Maybe they should have been doing 50 laps of the pitch, just to set them right for the next day! Unless of course you know something about football coaching in which case I apologise for doubting your views.

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Spat - if you think that not being able to find space, not being able to complete seemingly easy passes, not looking positionally aware and consistently conceding the same type of goal constitutes good coaching, then I suggest you leave GTG alone.

Whatever was seen or should have happened at Colney, it''s obvious that something somewhere is wrong.

And Amarillo, I am stunned. You are proving a point by using our "13th best defensive record in the league"??? Out of 24 teams?? Starting as promotion favourites?? Come on - you can do better than that.

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[quote]Gazza, the only qualities I can see you list ahead of saying Fleming doesn''t have any of them are "passion, belief, central position and experience". Which of those things doesn''t Fleming have?Any why...[/quote]

Maybe I''ll be accused of being one of the "Keep the Faith" brigade, or whatever, but I have to say I''ve been to a few home matches this season and Fleming has looked more than capable at this level, and certainly not glaringly bad by any stretch of the imagination.I think it is the case of Fleming being the "demon", or at least blamed for the entire team''s lack of performance (in some peoples'' eyes).

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[quote]ah some of you make me laugh. Yeah, thanks for the insight Gazza about the training, we now all know where it''s going wrong. Worthy talking to other coaching staff, working on set pieces, and as for h...[/quote]

Now that is some classic sarcasm! Well said SPat.

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[quote]Spat - if you think that not being able to find space, not being able to complete seemingly easy passes, not looking positionally aware and consistently conceding the same type of goal constitutes goo...[/quote]

There might be be some deficiencies in the coaching, however there were no evidence of them in GTG''s observations.

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I can see why 1st wiz left.

GTG posts some of the most intelligent comments on this board and unlike most, me included, has made the effort to see first hand what was going on at colney.  She provides us with a report on what she saw which is likely to be indicative of a friday training session yet she gets cheap shots and sarcasm (the lowest form of wit) as thanks simply becaue her commenst do not agree with what you want to hear?   I trust her experienced views far more than the newspeak provided by the local journos, neil adams or narrow minded posters who cannot accept that there is any other view than KTF or hope or believe every word the manager/club as it must be true.  There is an intelligent way but that seems to be beyond most posters on here at the moment. 

As worthy commented earlier this week there is an open door policy at colney and no ''behind cosed doors sessions''.   The fact that defenders practicing corners and were confused comes as no surprise when you saw how many free headers plymouth had from set pieces on sat; but no I must not criticise the performance as its the result that counts.

The time when this board provided the most reasoned debate without the associated belittling of postsers found on more juvenile boards has now long gone.  

OTBC

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I can see why 1st wiz left.

GTG posts some of the most intelligent comments on this board and unlike most, me included, has made the effort to see first hand what was going on at colney.  She provides us with a report on what she saw which is likely to be indicative of a friday training session yet she gets cheap shots and sarcasm (the lowest form of wit) as thanks simply becaue her commenst do not agree with what you want to hear?   I trust her experienced views far more than the newspeak provided by the local journos, neil adams or narrow minded posters who cannot accept that there is any other view than KTF or hope or believe every word the manager/club as it must be true.  There is an intelligent way but that seems to be beyond most posters on here at the moment. 

As worthy commented earlier this week there is an open door policy at colney and no ''behind cosed doors sessions''.   The fact that defenders practicing corners and were confused comes as no surprise when you saw how many free headers plymouth had from set pieces on sat; but no I must not criticise the performance as its the result that counts.

The time when this board provided the most reasoned debate without the associated belittling of postsers found on more juvenile boards has now long gone.  

OTBC

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In my opinion both Zipper and Gazza generally make well thought out, reasoned posts. 

Just because you may not agree with the content it doesn''t alter the quality of the post.

At the end of the day it is all supposition as to just what is wrong - the only fact is that something is wrong as the Watford result (at halftime anyway) shows.

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Amarillo - being in such a  lowly position we are bound to have conceeded more goal than we have scored but to put the blame for our league position on the strikers totally misses the point of how the matches have actually panned out.

Yes Ashton could have had several more goals but the vast majority of those chances were self made by the strikers themselves.  However he still has 4 goals in 8 games despite being unfocused and not on opof his game - that is a good striker rate in anyones books, let alone one where the are so few chances being created.

The midfield and defence are a shambles.  The team cant pass to a collague on a regular enough basis for us to dominate a game, there is no discipline is keeping a shape (thanks for highlighting that Mr Adams) either in midfield or the defence, tackling is at best p*** poor and wholey ineffective and team work and structure has gone out of the window.  The midfield have created just about nothing all season while providing now back up to the defence.  When did a midfielder last score for city?  

City fans seem to have swallowed NWs work ethic and are impressed when players like hughes commendably put in huge amounts of effort and cover every blade of grass on the pitch, but to do it without the ball, making yourself available, providing a barrier, winning the ball back, passing to colleagues, reading the game, moving into space means we could employ any fit athlete such as Mark Lewis-Francis or Paula Radcliffe for the value they add to the team.

In defence it is all about structure and organisation rather than personnel and there is none.  I struggle to see how replacing one talented youngster with another will assist the problem when Flem, trying as hard as he can is not up to the task.   Both 5 live and Norfolk last night put the defeat down to our inability to cope with the pace of the watford strikers and their aerial ability.   Which of shacks & Flem is fastest and best in the air? Of course it is shacks - yet flem stays onthe pitch when Davenport makes his debut.  Read GTG summary again - despite being coached the players are lost and ineffective at tracking their own players at set pieces.  What came across from the commentary last night - Flem has lost that header, Flem was done for pace, flem was turned inside out, Flem has lost the ball from a long pass from carlisle and king has scored.   Longballs down the middle of thepark shouldbe meat and drink to central defenders yet flem loses the flight of the ball again and it costs us a goal.  It is this mayhem that GTG describes from last friday that was seen in both games since - how is that proving the coaches are doing their job.  Give the lady some respect and probably a deserved apology.

This is not flems fault - he is put on the pitch by the manager.  The same manager whose philosophy is never change a winning side.  The same manager who purred over the first half performance against plymouth but didnt rate the second.  The same manager who drops that games most influential player for not clear reason.   The same manager who has had 2 weeks to improve the defence at a nil cost option by developing his team through coaching.  The same coach who cannot coach.   Name me one player who has improved as a player since joining us?  That is what coaching is - taking players and making  them better - and I cant think of one player who is better now then when they joined us.

I am still prepared to give Worthy 10 games as promised - but the signs of a repeat of last seasons reliance on ground covering energy ahead of fooballing ability, sound tactics and team play until it is to late is all too clear.  

I dont know abou

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sorry guys, only just got back from watford so have taken ages going through all your comments

no, to whoever said it, can''t remember, i may not have a whole tracksuit full of coaching badges - but i do have eyes and they have served me pretty well for all of my many years - what i saw up at colney i gave to you as it was and no more

maybe as we were only playing plymouth the coaching staff didn''t think it was worth more than a gentle canter through formalities?

we beat plymouth but how many of you are convinced by that performance - i left disappointed we hadn''t taken complete control of the game and won by 5 or 6

to those of you who think i am having a go at fleming, maybe indirectly i am, it isn''t his fault he is getting on and has no pace, but he does have a mouth (and as captain should use it to encourage) and he does have feet to tackle (but doesn''t do that enough)

and yes, last night the first goal was his fault, period

having said that i don''t think still any player is to blame for where we are, it is the coaching. Where are the passes to men is space, where is the pass and movement required to get the ball from a to be?  Nowhere at present.  We have never been Brazil under Worthy but for god''s sake is it too much to ask to pass to someone with the same colour shirt?  We need to get back to basics and fast! 

We have no shape, no style and the lack of belief and confidence is beginning to show (shackell) - as zipper says we rely totally on hucks for our attacks or long balls to ashton, whatever happened to our midfield, where safri remains supreme in winning the ball - thank god for him!  If only we had someone else who could win back possession like he does, when the oppositon have the ball we just sit off them (sadly in defence all too often). 

No, i am not a man (so fully expect to be told i know nothing about football,) but i do know this is an appalling start to a season and that it is not all down to the players, I bet Warnock and Boothroyd would love to have Greeno, Ashton, Hucks etc in their side right now.  We have so many assets, but sadly our coaching staff are not realising their true potential and this more than anything is why we are not leading this division

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[quote]is that your team i see at the bottom of the pinkun telegraph fantasy football league? What else could ZLF stand for ? your credibility as a Worthington critic is in jeopardy !! (only joking.....)[/quote]

Hi FTFW - yes that is meis - just as I am very very low in the pink un prediction league and many others I enter!   Thiose are just a bit of fun, NCFC are far more serious and I know my club and what the issues are.

I am giving my squad the season to sort themselves out,my managerial approach being to cross my fingers, sticm, myhead in the sand and hope it comes right by May!  

I am quite happy for anyone to come back and tell where I am wrong without throwing my toys out of the pram.  

You have been very quiet lately FTFW - where do you sit on the quality of performance and management of the club after 8 games?

OTBC

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Zipper

Thanks for your support, and i too feel for Wiz and understand why he left the board, but I have no intention of doing so. In my understanding the purpose of this board is to debate our club, and sadly this sometimes gets a bit personal at times and I think that passions are running high.  If we were top of the league then i doubt anyone would be taking cheap digs at anyone else.

All i can say to those who don''t like what i have told them about Colney etc is why not go up there yourself and get your own ideas?  It is free, and no one stops you watching.  I hope to go up there on another weekday when work allows to see a full training session  LOL

 

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Gazza ... your a woman !  LOL   good round up of how it is   with  our team ,  IMO   our prob  is too many new faces in too short a time !  ergo .. we havent really got a TEAM  as yet  , it will come , but Nigel  has to make up his mind  , and soon,  what his best formation is !  at the present  he IS beginning to  look a bit like Sven Goram  , gawdelpus  !!

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Must admit I have been reading this thread with interest and there has been some good debate.

Couple of you are beginning to overstep the mark with personal remarks, as what happens on a lot of the other threads, so let''s put a stop to it RIGHT NOW!

I was at Colney with Gazza the Friday before the Plymouth game and I will say that everything she said was accurate.

So we beat Plymouth 2 nil big deal! As was proved last night, a better team than them scored two very easy goals against us, which could have been three by half time as they also hit the inside of the post, and Plymouth with a bit better finishing or luck would have scored a couple as well.

The coaching of the set pieces and corners was a bloody shambolic effort, no one knew what to do, you had youth and reserve team members trying to be Plymouth and our defence wandering about absolutely clueless. You had the coaching staff wandering about with a sheaf of papers (which looked like an empty fish and chip wrapper) in their hands trying to get messages across. I''ll tell you what though get Rossi Jarvis on to take the corners he was delivering them perfectly with either foot! How have they managed to coach that out of Marney in a few weeks beggars belief.

I chuckled when I read this quote from Worthy on the Pink Un this morning

"One man who will have taken joy in City''s anguish was Watford manager Aidy Boothroyd - and Worthington admitted he wasn''t surprised at the former Norwich Academy coach''s success at Vicarage Road.

“I worked with him and wish he was still at Norwich City,” said Worthington.

“He knows the game and he will get people working and playing his system.”

So why can''t you then Mr Worthington? If it''s that easy?

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It is refreshing to see Gazza the Great and Meeky having a constructive input; intuitive (female obviously) The symptoms of our once great team are being horribly exposed; up to the point of getting players in, on loan, free transfer or fee everything in the garden looks rosy.

However, Colney must stand for ABANDON HOPE ALL YE WHO ENTER HERE; because from Colney to Carra Rd; all has gone horribly wrong; Worthington, Folly and Liverless are taking us backwards; their inability to coach, coherse, manage, motivate etc. was clearly evident last season; comparison must be drawn with West Ham and Wigan in this season''s Premiership.

I believe the current Manager, Coaches and Sport Trick Cyclist have reached their Nadir; they are the weakest link - Goodbye!

Bring in Aidy Boothroyd; or promote David Williams from the Academy.

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i can assure you ZLF that I''m as p*ssed off as the most of you are.

It can be very tiring making the return journey to Braintree after watching the performances this season. I haven''t been to an away match this season yet.

I was astonished at the knee-jerk reaction to the Plymouth win. McVeigh 9/10, who needs Huckerby indeed !! But for Green (and a crunching block by your friend Craig) it could have been a different story.

I think the loss of Francis is pivotal. Sadly, I think we should have tried harder to keep him. I doubt whether the vitriol spouted on this board (and elsewhere, no doubt) helped his decision but who could blame him.

As for this season :-

Ashton looks as if he''s carrying an injury to me. MCKenzie has been woeful (his injury was a blessing) although we know from last season he could do better. The two of them were well below par vs leeds.

I think Hughes is better than you give him credit for but my 10 year old son (whose views I merit as much as any of the more "mature" on this forum) thinks he''s appalling. I agree he''s not an adequate replacement for Damien though.

Colin and MLJ are not as good as Edworthy would have been. Perhaps he should have been offered a better contract than gambling on a replacement (especially as it was inevitable that Helveg would go).

I agree that a replacement for Fleming is required. I didn''t go last night but I''m hoping Davenport is the candidate (its certainly not Doherty in my view). Shackell was Worthy''s scapegoat last night but as with Edworthy I think there''s more to his treatment than has been made public.

I''ve yet to make up my mind about Marney (except that he''s no worse than Jonson).

I was glad to see Brennan back in the team but he was the other scapegoat last night and he''ll obviously get the push in favour of Huckerby this Sunday.

My team for Sunday :-

Green

Colin Davenport Shackell Drury

Marney Safri Hughes Brennan

Ashton Huckerby

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ZLF :- Re "You have been very quiet lately FTFW - where do you sit on the quality of performance and management of the club after 8 games?" one of the reasons I post less is that having spent some time composing a post - as I did in response to your comment - I find that in the current climate that it gets overtaken by a deluge of subsequent posts and i''m on Page 3 (not THE Page 3 you''ll be glad to know) in record time and I''ve wasted my time. Maybe we should have a seperate forums for match comment and Worthington heckling?

Bottom of the league at Portman Rd ?

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