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lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel)

The new signings are not good enough.

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If we dont get promoted i bet we have the same number of season tickets. There or there abouts. And the last 10 years suggests im more likely to be right than you are.

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Posted this elsewhere earlier:

I thought that the centre backs put in a performance that was on a par with Turner and Bennett when we got done 5-0 at Fulham in Houghtons first game.

That said, despite being collectively woeful at the back we twice dragged ourselves back into the game.

And THAT said, we''d have been long, long sunk if it hadn''t been for young Angus betwixt the stix.

We do have important players to come back but despite the poor showing of ze Germans yesterday, Husband is the one that currently worries me most. I''ve yet to see him demonstrate that he''s up to it BUT it''s way too soon to be writing anyone off.

Josh Murphy was excellent btw.

To add:

Essentially we''ve undertaken a massive overhaul and in the midst have lost Klose, Pritchard and Pinto. Thus we''ve been forced to play people sooner than we might have expected and others out of position.

I''d be very surprised if any accurate judgments can be made after 4 games but we''ve been pretty average and Ipswich have flown the blocks. That''s a dustbin lid sized pill for some to swallow but I''m still confident that it won''t be indicative of our respective positions come May.

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Husband is not being played out of position and from what I have seen of him so far he is one of the worst full backs ever to pull on a Norwich City shirt, weak, not good defensively and does not get forward either, I would put him in the same bracket as Otsemobor and Derveld.......

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So having re-watched the highlights past night, one of the things I was struck by was how bad Zimmerman looked. Constantly getting harried off the ball, losing headers and the way he turned his back for the third goal is schoolboy.

He seems to have been adopted as a bit of a cult figure but I''m not sure he''s actually any good.

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[quote user="king canary"]So having re-watched the highlights past night, one of the things I was struck by was how bad Zimmerman looked. Constantly getting harried off the ball, losing headers and the way he turned his back for the third goal is schoolboy.

He seems to have been adopted as a bit of a cult figure but I''m not sure he''s actually any good.[/quote]

A couple of back passes too, where he couldn''t even make clean contact with the ball and sold Gunn short.... He did the same on one occasion against QPR too. you can''t blame the need to settle in on fundamental technique errors like that.

I''m all for giving players a decent chance.... but some of the fundamental errors of so called pro players is alarming.

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Zimmerman has been up and down so far. Franke has generally looked ooor and so has Husband.

I support the structure and the way we are trying to play but for me that is the biggest concern. The players we have bought do not look up to it (yet) and all of our best performers so far this season are either loan players or were already at the club.

I expected us to spend decent money on at least a couple of defenders. I don''t think we have a single full back at the club who can defend adequately (possibly Lewis aside but have not seen him) and Zimmerman and Franke should be no more than backup.

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Most should be no more than back up at the minute, giving them time to integrate and adapt to the English game.

That''s what''s so frustrating. They''ve been bought to replace key players, and therefore have full on instant exposure at the potential cost of 10-15 games.

How is this acceptable? We didn''t need this much change.

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What do you suggest we do then? Would you rather see Klose (when fit) and Martin at CB? I agree that Husband has been awful, no pace, can''t beat his man when going forward and pretty poor defensively too. But people were bigging Zimmerman up just the other day, after our only win so far against QPR, saying he would be ''a huge player for us'' etc. etc. From the very first moment I watched him play (in fact, both of the CB''s) I thought that they were both too slow for this level. It''s disappointing, to be honest, that we''ve decided to do things on the cheap. We have signed Ragget but won''t see him until Jan and the fee was only £250,000 anyhow. We needed to find an experienced defender at this level (probably could have found someone around the 3 mil mark that would have been good) and, unfortunately, this will once again be our downfall this season. Our money situation must be incredibly dire.

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Sunderland caused us problems with crosses and Villa did it with pace. Doesn''t bode well but yes I agree that both neee CBs look slow. We simply needed to spend some money on this area of the team and we haven''t.

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In answer to your question Bob yes I think Klose has to come in and is be inclined to give Godfrey a go if we don''t have the funds to go out and make a proper signing in this area.

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Yeah, that could work Jim. I think Godfrey looks a good player, but maybe not at CB. He made a couple of awful mistakes in the friendlies in that position. I suspect the reason for us signing him is that he''s ''one for the future'' and also the fact he can play a few positions.

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If we can only add one more player it would be an experienced centre back at this level. Harlee Dean is someone I''ve seen discussed but there are others who probably wouldn''t break the bank. It feels to me that the back 4 have seriously lacked leadership of late and a strong presence in the backline can help elevate the performance of others.

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I agree it shouldn''t be, but I can''t see us spending 2m+ on anyone at the moment. We are fishing in a different pool of players now.

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Well we need to. We can''t fill every position on the cheap, there has to be some targeted spending to blend some experience (and pace) with the untried German recruits.

I''m not saying I particularly want Harlee Dean but we need before the end of the window to add a more pacey, athletic option at the back there, particularly as it has become clear that Russell Martin is not really adequate in either position he is currently covering.

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You have to give players time to settle, I remember hearing Vrancic and certainly Zimmerman surprised by the physical nature and high tempo played here in England compared to what they are used to. It will take a few games to get up to scratch, we have to give them time.

If I remember rightly, Zim'' was bought as back-up - it is Klose''s injury which has kept him in the side. Generally he has done OK, but it was Franke that was more concerning on Sat, completely dominated by a 19 year old debutant, not really that great to see. I''m sure these guys will improve - a strong defense was a staple of Wagner and Farke''s culture and Dortmand II, and I''m sure it will be in time here too.

Steipermann is hard to judge on one game, like the others, will need to acclimatize, but certainly looked short of the quality that Wes and Maddison bring. Vrancic we''ve seen glimpses of quality, not quite there yet.

Husband I''m still not sure on, and certainly think Jamal Lewis looked a much better option in pre-season but sadly injuries will mean Husband is our only option, and therefore we have to back him.

As we have had radical changes to the system, and playing squad, it''s going to take everyone some time to gel, including long-serving players.

It is frustrating, yes, but give it some time.

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I appreciate that things look alarming, but we have completely new players to the Champs and each other having played a very few games together in different formations against arguably some of the strongest teams in the division. There is no way this can gel quickly, I think most felt that patience would be needed and so it is proving. I suspect it will be like this for a good portion of the season with good and bad sprinkled in, but with hopefully an upward trajectory.

There have been some things which have been good and show promise- Farke needs to harness those while ironing out the defensive uncertainty.

For me the issue was the scale of the change, and again I know that high earning players needed to be moved on but we seem to lurch from one mega gamble to another when sometimes a more subtle and nuanced evolution may be required.

As AJ wrote, this is indeed frustrating but in my opinion pretty much to be expected. We may not know who is working out and who is not until Autumn sets in properly.

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Surely it''s a bit too early to make such a sweeping dismissal of our new signings. To start with there are a lot of them and this is a team game. Preseason is ok for walk through but real matches are what is needed to forge a new group into a team. Secondly we have several players new to the Championship who are adjusting and some of them are quite young. Those who criticise Zimmerman for example are being particularly unfair. Centre Backs always get the harshest treatment by the critics. Villa wasn''t his best game but he''s shown talent and heart in his other outings. I think he''s a good signing and once he has learnt the dark arts of playing CB in this league he''ll be better still. We''re Turner, Bassong or Bennett so much better? No they were not.

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Just watching Leeds who have several new signings from all over the world. They haven''t had such a tough time settling.

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I was positive like many but I hope the manager learns quickly. Webber talks a good game and he will need to sack DF to save his own skin within 10 games or so if this does not change,

I can only assume where he has coached has had teams where playing football is more important than the result as in B teams like the one himself was manager of.

In the championship is a fight and you have to physically fight even harder for the right to play nice football.

The team today was always going to loose whee was the power or the pace? Maddison is not a bad player neither is Mario V or Hoolahan obv but the 3 of them? Additionally Reed is not that fast or that big either.

It would have been better to have the second half team from Charlton the other night out there with tetty and trybull.

Of the 3 creative players mentioned I would only play one at any time you need players to win the ball and give to them and b players with pace to run in behind to receive it.

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Well why aren''t we?

Why are their new signings settling in much quicker than ours?

Why is there manager getting his tactics and messages across so much better?

Why do they not leak goals like it is going out of fashion?

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Dont know, did Leeds just change manager and make a few signings with maybe 5 or 6 in their starting 11?

Or did they do what we did and rip up everything from the directing structure and management structure through to the sports science department, completely rebuild philosophies embedded within the club (Webbers words), how to play and how to train, suffer injuries meaning 8 or so of the new signings are starting, oh, and dont forget Leeds probably have more investment too.

Either way its not really comparable.

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How is it not comparable? They''ve made 13 new signings, bought in a new manager with no experience in this league.

I''d assume the new manager bought in his own coaches, his own training methods etc. That usually happens.

If ripping up all of the things you mention means it creates a team that looks like ours does then it suggests it maybe wasn''t a great idea.

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