Delia Smith may become most hated owner in club history

[hogesar 9,658]

Komakino = f*cking moron.

[sonyc 5,515]

No running commentary wanted Ricardo but a quiet bit of leadership wouldn''t go amiss would it? McNally would provide it to fans when key moments arose. It''s plainly obvious that the board must know of fans'' disenchantment and whilst he isn''t going to say much about the manager''s position he could make some kind of comment ...to be so absent at this time is weird. The board will make comments on a whole range of things from time to time but I find it odd just now that it is so quiet. Delia Smith decided to get her message out via the Times article.

I do get the point that by no making no comment then it appears to be that they are sticking. But I don''t agree with this approach. When times get tough its useful to have the whole club, fans included trying to pull together. There appears (to my humble self anyway) that there is a big disconnect between boards and fans at the moment.

I leave running commentaries to those that have frequent and long things to say on this board!

[ricardo 7,385]

Sonyc. I had a lot of time for McNally but he made himself if anything, far too available to the fans. After all it was all that banter on Twitter that did for him in the end.

[whistleblower 0]

this thread has generated a lot of closely or loosely related discussions

- has she made money from the club/her investment

- is she a misunderstood superfan

- is she a fame obsessed egomaniac clinging to her last dying embers of celebrity status that being owner of NCFC confers

- is delia really a binner

- is she trying to build a legacy

- is she an autocratic control freak

All of them are interesting thoughts, however, my focus is one question only - is her number 1 goal to make Norwich as successful as is humanly possible? or is there a caveat to that objective which is "as long as Delia or her family are still in charge"?

Previous owners always wanted Norwich to achieve the best place in the footballing world it possibly could. The motivation for achieving this could be myriad - adding to their own personal wealth upon sale, fame, love for the club, community etc The point is their goal aligned with the fans

What i believe based upon many different data points is that we now have an owner who''s ultimate goal is to have her family remain in charge of Norwich City even if this is to the detriment of what the club could possibly achieve.

I don''t think any real "fan" of the club would put their interests before that of the club. To believe that the club is only "safe" in her hands displays an almost cult-like stance or ideology.

Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Delia has absolute power at Norwich City......

Personally I would take the utter failure of this season and next to generate the financial conditions that would force her hand once more to take up fresh investment that would demand changes in ownership & control. Delia Smith is wealthy but nowhere near wealthy enough to endure the size of losses coming our way once parachute payments have ended and we have the mammoth wage bill making our P&L look like the Titanic and players for whom we cannot recover their transfer fees when sold. (We have a number of players who did not have relegation clauses in their contracts on our books)

The other option is to underachieve for the next 10-15 years under the current regime - I don''t want that

Maybe there are other options - a local white knight with investment appears that will satisfy Delia Smith''s conditions.

Some other option not listed may also appear but if we want Norwich successful again I''m battening down the hatches for a long 18 months of underachievement and malevolent atmosphere at Carrow Road

[komakino 272]

An excellent and thoughtful post Whistleblower.

[nutty nigel 7,531]

He hasn''t dug you out of your hole though. You still have questions to answer. You protest you aren''t a binner but yet you continually post these bin related lies. Why?

[ricardo 7,385]

[quote user="whistleblower"]this thread has generated a lot of closely or loosely related discussions

- has she made money from the club/her investment

- is she a misunderstood superfan

- is she a fame obsessed egomaniac clinging to her last dying embers of celebrity status that being owner of NCFC confers

- is delia really a binner

- is she trying to build a legacy

- is she an autocratic control freak

All of them are interesting thoughts, however, my focus is one question only - is her number 1 goal to make Norwich as successful as is humanly possible? or is there a caveat to that objective which is "as long as Delia or her family are still in charge"?

Previous owners always wanted Norwich to achieve the best place in the footballing world it possibly could. The motivation for achieving this could be myriad - adding to their own personal wealth upon sale, fame, love for the club, community etc The point is their goal aligned with the fans

What i believe based upon many different data points is that we now have an owner who''s ultimate goal is to have her family remain in charge of Norwich City even if this is to the detriment of what the club could possibly achieve.

I don''t think any real "fan" of the club would put their interests before that of the club. To believe that the club is only "safe" in her hands displays an almost cult-like stance or ideology.

Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Delia has absolute power at Norwich City......

Personally I would take the utter failure of this season and next to generate the financial conditions that would force her hand once more to take up fresh investment that would demand changes in ownership & control. Delia Smith is wealthy but nowhere near wealthy enough to endure the size of losses coming our way once parachute payments have ended and we have the mammoth wage bill making our P&L look like the Titanic and players for whom we cannot recover their transfer fees when sold. (We have a number of players who did not have relegation clauses in their contracts on our books)

The other option is to underachieve for the next 10-15 years under the current regime - I don''t want that

Maybe there are other options - a local white knight with investment appears that will satisfy Delia Smith''s conditions.

Some other option not listed may also appear but if we want Norwich successful again I''m battening down the hatches for a long 18 months of underachievement and malevolent atmosphere at Carrow Road[/quote]Just a couple of points1. The question was asked and answered at the AGM, ALL players have wage reduction written into their contracts while in the Championship.2. If I owned the club I would pass it on to whomsoever I trusted to run it in the way I had expressly wished. I would also not be canvassing any keyboard warriors as to what their thoughts might be.Football is cyclical and none of the medium sized clubs like us are going to be successful all of the time. We have no more natural right to Premier League football than Sheff Wed, Derby, Leeds etc etc etc. No owner or manager can guarantee consistent success, it comes and goes. Managers have a limited lifetime.

[A Load of Squit 5,161]

[quote user="komakino"]An excellent and thoughtful post Whistleblower.[/quote]Well you''re half right, it is full of thoughts, definitely not excellent.

[whistleblower 0]

[quote user="A Load of Squit"][quote user="komakino"]An excellent and thoughtful post Whistleblower.[/quote]Well you''re half right, it is full of thoughts, definitely not excellent.

[/quote]

I probably wasn''t expecting a balanced or positive response from a contributor with a pic/tagline of Delia as their Avatar lol (i''m not sure if the pic is her also - the image is so low quality)

[whistleblower 0]

[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="whistleblower"]this thread has generated a lot of closely or loosely related discussions

- has she made money from the club/her investment

- is she a misunderstood superfan

- is she a fame obsessed egomaniac clinging to her last dying embers of celebrity status that being owner of NCFC confers

- is delia really a binner

- is she trying to build a legacy

- is she an autocratic control freak

All of them are interesting thoughts, however, my focus is one question only - is her number 1 goal to make Norwich as successful as is humanly possible? or is there a caveat to that objective which is "as long as Delia or her family are still in charge"?

Previous owners always wanted Norwich to achieve the best place in the footballing world it possibly could. The motivation for achieving this could be myriad - adding to their own personal wealth upon sale, fame, love for the club, community etc The point is their goal aligned with the fans

What i believe based upon many different data points is that we now have an owner who''s ultimate goal is to have her family remain in charge of Norwich City even if this is to the detriment of what the club could possibly achieve.

I don''t think any real "fan" of the club would put their interests before that of the club. To believe that the club is only "safe" in her hands displays an almost cult-like stance or ideology.

Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Delia has absolute power at Norwich City......

Personally I would take the utter failure of this season and next to generate the financial conditions that would force her hand once more to take up fresh investment that would demand changes in ownership & control. Delia Smith is wealthy but nowhere near wealthy enough to endure the size of losses coming our way once parachute payments have ended and we have the mammoth wage bill making our P&L look like the Titanic and players for whom we cannot recover their transfer fees when sold. (We have a number of players who did not have relegation clauses in their contracts on our books)

The other option is to underachieve for the next 10-15 years under the current regime - I don''t want that

Maybe there are other options - a local white knight with investment appears that will satisfy Delia Smith''s conditions.

Some other option not listed may also appear but if we want Norwich successful again I''m battening down the hatches for a long 18 months of underachievement and malevolent atmosphere at Carrow Road[/quote]Just a couple of points1. The question was asked and answered at the AGM, ALL players have wage reduction written into their contracts while in the Championship.2. If I owned the club I would pass it on to whomsoever I trusted to run it in the way I had expressly wished. I would also not be canvassing any keyboard warriors as to what their thoughts might be.Football is cyclical and none of the medium sized clubs like us are going to be successful all of the time. We have no more natural right to Premier League football than Sheff Wed, Derby, Leeds etc etc etc. No owner or manager can guarantee consistent success, it comes and goes. Managers have a limited lifetime.

[/quote]

the problem with the contracts position is that neither the question at the AGM nor the answer given at the AGM is anywhere near detailed enough to give a picture as to whether the wage bill is being cut for each player as of the start of this season.

My understanding is there are very high earning players for whom the impact is nil or minimal - this itself has led to dressing room unhappiness

I''m not sure the point being made around transfer of ownership - the fact she can do something and is going to do it is a matter of fact and unarguable.

The issue is whether she is betraying her claim to be a true Norwich fan by acting in a manner that benefits herself rather than the club

[nutty nigel 7,531]

[quote user="whistleblower"][quote user="ricardo"][quote user="whistleblower"]this thread has generated a lot of closely or loosely related discussions

- has she made money from the club/her investment

- is she a misunderstood superfan

- is she a fame obsessed egomaniac clinging to her last dying embers of celebrity status that being owner of NCFC confers

- is delia really a binner

- is she trying to build a legacy

- is she an autocratic control freak

All of them are interesting thoughts, however, my focus is one question only - is her number 1 goal to make Norwich as successful as is humanly possible? or is there a caveat to that objective which is "as long as Delia or her family are still in charge"?

Previous owners always wanted Norwich to achieve the best place in the footballing world it possibly could. The motivation for achieving this could be myriad - adding to their own personal wealth upon sale, fame, love for the club, community etc The point is their goal aligned with the fans

What i believe based upon many different data points is that we now have an owner who''s ultimate goal is to have her family remain in charge of Norwich City even if this is to the detriment of what the club could possibly achieve.

I don''t think any real "fan" of the club would put their interests before that of the club. To believe that the club is only "safe" in her hands displays an almost cult-like stance or ideology.

Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Delia has absolute power at Norwich City......

Personally I would take the utter failure of this season and next to generate the financial conditions that would force her hand once more to take up fresh investment that would demand changes in ownership & control. Delia Smith is wealthy but nowhere near wealthy enough to endure the size of losses coming our way once parachute payments have ended and we have the mammoth wage bill making our P&L look like the Titanic and players for whom we cannot recover their transfer fees when sold. (We have a number of players who did not have relegation clauses in their contracts on our books)

The other option is to underachieve for the next 10-15 years under the current regime - I don''t want that

Maybe there are other options - a local white knight with investment appears that will satisfy Delia Smith''s conditions.

Some other option not listed may also appear but if we want Norwich successful again I''m battening down the hatches for a long 18 months of underachievement and malevolent atmosphere at Carrow Road[/quote]Just a couple of points1. The question was asked and answered at the AGM, ALL players have wage reduction written into their contracts while in the Championship.2. If I owned the club I would pass it on to whomsoever I trusted to run it in the way I had expressly wished. I would also not be canvassing any keyboard warriors as to what their thoughts might be.Football is cyclical and none of the medium sized clubs like us are going to be successful all of the time. We have no more natural right to Premier League football than Sheff Wed, Derby, Leeds etc etc etc. No owner or manager can guarantee consistent success, it comes and goes. Managers have a limited lifetime.

[/quote]

the problem with the contracts position is that neither the question at the AGM nor the answer given at the AGM is anywhere near detailed enough to give a picture as to whether the wage bill is being cut for each player as of the start of this season.

My understanding is there are very high earning players for whom the impact is nil or minimal - this itself has led to dressing room unhappiness

I''m not sure the point being made around transfer of ownership - the fact she can do something and is going to do it is a matter of fact and unarguable.

The issue is whether she is betraying her claim to be a true Norwich fan by acting in a manner that benefits herself rather than the club[/quote]

If you know things beyond what we''re told at the AGM then why not share it? But then you knew we were getting malky mackay. That''s the thing about "in the know". We have to wait so long to find out ourselves...

[Bill 1,788]

"What i believe based upon many different data points"

yes, the ever reliable ''data points''   ...... whatever they might be

and young pizzel blower, might I point out that Delia is not the owneralong with her husband Micheal Wyn Jones they are majority shareholders, not the owners

but then as a City fan you knew that already, but just happened to forget it in this instance... or so it would seem

[JF 694]

So to summarise. They make no financial gain by being majority shareholders in NCFC and we the fans should be eternally grateful to them for saving our club, the club that they are just custodians of. In the time that they have been majority shareholders those shares would be worth how much now? Shall we say 20 times more, it''s purely a guess. So original investment of £1 million is now worth, guessing £20 million?

But what we don''t want is the club to fall into the hands of an outsider that isn''t a born and bred Norwich fan and would be looking to make money on their investment....

[nutty nigel 7,531]

If their aim is to make money why don''t they sell JF?

And if they''ve increased the value of the club 20 fold during their tenure why aren''t they given credit for such an achievement rather than hate.

So many contradictions...

[JF 694]

I never said it was their aim to make money. Many on here are saying they make no financial gain by being majority shareholders when very clearly they do. It''s up to them what they do with that but it''s a very lucrative investment for them

[nutty nigel 7,531]

But surely them not taking anything from the club is the reason it''s worth 20x more.

[JF 694]

Still a massive return on their investment if it''s left in or taken out. I''ve no problem with that at all, what I have a problem with is it seems fine it''s fine for them to make that return but we don''t want other owners that may be looking to turn a profit from their investment. All seems incredibly hypocritical as anyone would want that, fan or not

[nutty nigel 7,531]

It''s not a return to them though is it? It just shows that as custodians they''ve done a good job. If the critics are right and they drag the club into the abyss it would show that as custodians they did a bad job.

I don''t see what point you are trying to make?

[TIL 1010 4,738]

[quote user="JF"]So to summarise. They make no financial gain by being majority shareholders in NCFC and we the fans should be eternally grateful to them for saving our club, the club that they are just custodians of. In the time that they have been majority shareholders those shares would be worth how much now? Shall we say 20 times more, it''s purely a guess. So original investment of £1 million is now worth, guessing £20 million?

But what we don''t want is the club to fall into the hands of an outsider that isn''t a born and bred Norwich fan and would be looking to make money on their investment....[/quote]Have we just by pure chance stumbled on how much Watling actually walleted ? [:D]

[JF 694]

Have we just by pure chance stumbled on how much Watling actually walleted ? Big Smile [:D]

Delia says in her interview in the times that their original investment was £1 million. Her words were we were told if we stumped up £500,000 we could have a place on the board, so we asked what if we put in £1 million? May be putting 2 and 2 together but that''s what she says

[JF 694]

nutty nigel wrote the following post at 29/12/2016 10:34 AM:

It''s not a return to them though is it? It just shows that as custodians they''ve done a good job. If the critics are right and they drag the club into the abyss it would show that as custodians they did a bad job.

I don''t see what point you are trying to make?

Of cause it''s a return. It''s a return on their investment. It''s a sellable asset that would see them make an incredible profit if they chose to. Instead it looks as though it will eventually be the nephew that trousers it. The point is that a lot of people are saying they make nothing from this deal and it''s a one way street, all give by them and no take. In reality it''s very much a two way street where they have given the club a lot but the return is incredible profit on their investment for their relative

[nutty nigel 7,531]

There''s still only one person on here who knows Tilly. The rest of us are those who don''t....

The initial investment was the summer when Chase went. Watling held the shares for another 18 months or so.

[nutty nigel 7,531]

Its not a return on their investment. Its the club benefitting from their investment.

[JF 694]

nutty nigel wrote the following post at 29/12/2016 10:57 AM:

Its not a return on their investment. Its the club benefitting from their investment.

Ok let''s just stick to that opinion then. Delia Smith and her husband are the saviours of Norwich, they have put their money in and time to save the club and in return they have received nothing, neither them or any members of their family will ever benefit from their initial investment in any way financially...

[Indy 3,298]

I would imagine that they both have benefited very nicely over the past 20 years in not having to pay for attending matches, all the expensive food & drink not to mention entertainment. Then I''m pretty sure like other owners there will be some perks to owning a football club too.

So to suggest they don''t benefit in any way might be a little blinkered.

[norfolkngood 1,086]

if you put in 1 mil and your investment is now worth 20 mil you have benefited

but if they are so good and don''t want to be seen to benefit why don''t they give the fans their shares when they leave ??

because they want their nephew / family to benefit that''s why money hard cash is no good as it will be taxed and they have enough cash to see out their lives so why sell better to give your nephew a train set instead of a tax bill

[JF 694]

Norfolkngood gets it.

[Daz Sparks 1,152]

I don''t hold any enmity toward Delia and MWJ, but I do question their competence, which I believe rode into the sunset with McNally''s departure.

[nutty nigel 7,531]

So because you dont agree with what they do they are benefitting.

Why on earth would they just give the club to the fans. Which one of us would like to be the most hated owners ever? Imagine if the team lost 8/10 games and you got villified?

And how exactly does this tax avoidance work?

[hogesar 9,658]

Of course Delia etc will benefit, presuming the club stays in a similar position to it is now.

But then if they''ve overseen the promotions that led to the big Premier League money etc then it''s perfectly fair enough in my opinion.

Are they only in it for themselves? Obviously not, or they''d have really pushed to sell the club when we were in the Prem and they could get maximum money for the club.